@ballpeen said:

yep...that probably has something to do with it.

No, no, I included him on that list. I think it just a case of, notwithstanding how much of a disappointment Cousineau was, we have had far too many others who were bigger disappointments.

@the-gipper said:

Maybe because he wasn't picked by us???

yep...that probably has something to do with it.

@ballpeen said:

Funny how being wrong actually strengthens my position.

Hmm, I don't know. See my survey on Browns #1 picks. Almost no one puts him in the top 10 worst first round draft picks in Browns history so much as NFL history. Perhaps now I will extrapolate the survey to include #1 NFL picks.

Ahhh.....my bad.

Funny how being wrong actually strengthens my position.

@rich4eagle said:

That bio was from wiki

@diehardbrownsfan said:

During Cousineau's four seasons with the Browns, he led the team in tackles for three seasons and was a two time All-NFL but never made the Pro Bowl in his career. Cousineau signed with the San Francisco 49ers as a free agent after the 1985 season where he played two years as a reserve before retiring in 1987.

Cousineau finished his NFL career with ten interceptions and 6.5 career sacks and currently stays at home with his wife, Lisa, and two daughters, Kyle and Kacey, and renovates houses.

thanks diehard.........that was very good............on the resume of Cousineau.........never lived up to the great hype............OK LB in the NFL

@ballpeen said:

No, I don't think so. Go back and check. Few of the guys on that list you gave were #1 overall picks. Really, check it out.

No matter where on the list he falls, I doubt his name is on any list as being a good 1st round pick. We are just splitting hairs as to where on the list he falls.

Fair enough. I wasn't defending him as being a superstar or anything. But, for a while, he was "serviceable" if disappointing based on draft rank.

IMO it is safe to say he falls much closer to the worst pick ever made v the best pick ever made, so when you consider the total number of players who would fall on both lists and the in between list, you now gain the context of how I say he is pretty high on the bust list.

Possibly. It might be entertaining to do an analysis of that.

@the-gipper said:

Courtney Browns

Ki-Jana Carter

Aundray Bruce

Ricky Bell

Terry Baker

Ernie Davis

Randy Duncan

King Hill

Brian Bosworth

Akili Smith

Andre Ware

Lawrence Phillips

Steve Emtman

Rae Carruth

Curtis Enis

Charles Rogers

Tony Mandarich

Todd Marinovich

Jamarcus Russell

even Archie Griffin

plus I may be able to go on. Again, I am not saying that Cousineau lived up to expectations. He didn't. But he was by no means the worst that has come down the line. I know that some of the above had careers cut short by injuries. But that is part of the bargain as well, isn't it?

My list was of #1 overall picks.

No matter where on the list he falls, I doubt his name is on any list as being a good 1st round pick. We are just splitting hairs as to where on the list he falls.

IMO it is safe to say he falls much closer to the worst pick ever made v the best pick ever made, so when you consider the total number of players who would fall on both lists and the in between list, you now gain the context of how I say he is pretty high on the bust list.

@ballpeen said:

Here he is listed as the 11th worst #1 pick.

Well that is just one guys opinion. I have a whole host of people ahead of Cousineau. Cousineau was functional and productive for a number of years. The following were really not:

Courtney Browns

Ki-Jana Carter

Aundray Bruce

Ricky Bell

Terry Baker

Ernie Davis

Randy Duncan

King Hill

Brian Bosworth

Akili Smith

Andre Ware

Lawrence Phillips

Steve Emtman

Rae Carruth

Curtis Enis

Charles Rogers

Tony Mandarich

Todd Marinovich

Jamarcus Russell

even Archie Griffin

plus I may be able to go on. Again, I am not saying that Cousineau lived up to expectations. He didn't. But he was by no means the worst that has come down the line. I know that some of the above had careers cut short by injuries. But that is part of the bargain as well, isn't it?

@the-gipper said:

Did he live up to his draft position? No.

Was he one of the worst all time #1 picks taken? By no means. Below average, certainly, but by no means the worst.

http://www.madduxsports.com/nflpicks.html

Here he is listed as the 11th worst #1 pick.

@ballpeen said:

He did have a decent career, but on a comparative basis he wasn't as good a player for his draft position as Gerrard Warren was....or certainly no better.

I disagree with that. While TC was not a raging success, he was not as unproductive as Warren...or Courtney Brown.

Did he live up to his draft position? No.

Was he one of the worst all time #1 picks taken? By no means. Below average, certainly, but by no means the worst.

@theclevelandsound said:

It is....that's cool man.

We aren't picking you apart....just old timers talking Browns stuff since there isn't much to talk about this time of year.

He did have a decent career, but on a comparative basis he wasn't as good a player for his draft position as Gerrard Warren was....or certainly no better.

@ballpeen said:

OK

Yea, great in college maybe. Serviceable in the NFL. Was really too slight to be a superior MLB in the NFL for that time. The game had changed a great deal even since the 70s. The O-linemen were significantly larger by the 80s. I would say on the average of 30-40 pounds larger than even 10 years earlier (steroids?). He didn't have the bulk to bang sufficiently hard with the larger dudes of that era.

During Cousineau's four seasons with the Browns, he led the team in tackles for three seasons and was a two time All-NFL but never made the Pro Bowl in his career. Cousineau signed with the San Francisco 49ers as a free agent after the 1985 season where he played two years as a reserve before retiring in 1987.

Cousineau finished his NFL career with ten interceptions and 6.5 career sacks and currently stays at home with his wife, Lisa, and two daughters, Kyle and Kacey, and renovates houses.

OK