But I agree that if this is their personal property then they can do with it as they will.

Hell some fans will dig through trash left behind by athletes. Should we sanction that as well?

@feartheroo said:

They aren't allowed to sell them back. From what I heard Akron's former QB Chris Jacquemain got kicked off the team for this.

You heard wrong.

If the awards have value, then isn't the NCAA guilty of awarding and benefitting the players for their accomplishments?

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

Athletes have to return their books at the end of the semester.

I assume that is because unlike all other students they don't pay for their books?

But here again, it seems different because what you are telling me is that they actually own their own books. Yet they do "own" the trinkets that are given to them.

@the-gipper said:

I agree with this much: If the players are not allowed to sell these trinkets that they receive... their jock straps?

um...

@the-gipper said:

I agree with this much: If the players are not allowed to sell these trinkets that they receive...which become their personal property...then why the eff do you give them to them? If they are not theirs to do with what they want, don't award them.

Here is a question: what if they sold their books? Are they allowed to sell their books that are bought for them with their scholarship? Every college student resells their used books. Are athletes not allowed to do that?

What about anything else they own? Their shoes, their sweaters, their T-shirts, their jock straps?

They aren't allowed to sell them back. From what I heard Akron's former QB Chris Jacquemain got kicked off the team for this.

Here is a question: what if they sold their books? Are they allowed to sell their books that are bought for them with their scholarship? Every college student resells their used books. Are athletes not allowed to do that?

What about anything else they own? Their shoes, their sweaters, their T-shirts, their jock straps?

If this were happening at Michigan OSU fans would be celebrating in the streets.

Spare me.

@kosar_for_president said:

Bullshit. Boo hoo, they come from a poor family, then that should be all the more reason they should understand the value of that scholarship and free room and board. Quit your whining and get to studying.

Well, my son had a free ride in college. That doesn't mean he didn't need money aside from that for food. If a kid has a car, it needs maintenance and fuel and insurance. If he doesn't have a car, there are transportation costs. If a kid wants to go home now and then, there may be high transportation costs if he's not in school near home. How about if we send all of you guys back to college and tell you that you can't date. A kid doesn't "need" a tatoo but haircuts aren't free. To contend that these scholar-athletes don't need money other than that provided by the scholarship is shortsighted. No matter how much pocket money they are given, some of these athletes will abuse the system and want more. That doesn't mean most of them couldn't use a little help to make their budgets more realistic.

The other thing to remember is that these are kids with undeveloped frontal lobes. Their judgment and impulse control are not well developed. Neither they nor their coaches or atheletic directors should be on the chopping block for relatively minor infractions that are the result of immature behavior. They ARE immature.

mikeyP72 said:

Actually, Ballpeen, that's exactly what it means.

The system IS flawed and Jim Tressel DID make a critical error.

Sorry Mike...I just don't buy the flawed argument in this context.

Can it, should it be changed...that is a valid topic, but using the flaw as a defense isn't germane.

mikeyP72 said:

Can a kid that goes straight to Arena League or UFL, enter the NFL at a certain point?

As I said earlier, it is 3 years out of high school.

http://www.ehow.com/about_4778601_nfl-draft-eligibility-rules.html

Player Eligibility

Football players who have been out of high school for at least three years are eligible for the NFL draft. The rules do not state that a player must attend college, but virtually all of the players selected in the NFL draft played college football. A year as a "redshirt" player in college counts toward eligibility even though the player was not allowed to participate in games during that year. Therefore players who have completed their redshirt sophomore year can enter the NFL draft. A few players are also selected from other football leagues like the Arena Football League or the Canadian Football League.

mikeyP72 said:

How so Rif, how is it different?

Why do people HAVE to go to these colleges in order to go to the pros?

Minor league baseball prepares kids for the majors. NBA D-League. Etc.

Why not allow high school kids to transition right into a NFL prep league for a year minimum before they make it to the NFL proper?

Oh, that's right. The NCAA is a money racket. Forgot.

Well, besides the NCAA being a money racket (I forget how many billions CBS forks over to the NCAA for the privilege of televising March Madness). Why would the NFL want to change the status quo? They have a built in farm system that they don't have to pay a nickel for (unlike MLB).

Agreed that the worst violators of NCAA rules tend to be the guys who KNOW they have an excellent chance of playing on the next level. Easy to get a fat head and think the rules don't apply to you when you've been told you're God's gift to sports since you were 10 years old.

BTW, the NCAA is at least doing minimal stuff to try and weed out the really shall we say "academically challenged" kids that can't spell cat if you spot them the C and T. Those kids will have no chance of playing in the NFL anyway- being a supreme athlete isn't good enough- you need at least some rudimentary intelligence to play in today's NFL.

Oh, and there are semi- pro football teams out there and arena league stuff for guys that don't want to go to college. But why bust your butt for 12k a year, when you can live in the lap of luxury at a D1 school?

If going to college is absolutely that terrible for them, that is what they can do. It is never going to be legal, NCAA or not, to allow kids fresh out of HS to play in a man's league like the NFL. This is not baseball, basketball or any other related sport.

@riffer-x said:

These same kids are not ready to play pro football when they are 18 years old, it is documented and would be inhumane even if they could stick on a team. Hence, the reason for the three year rule before they can come out. Another words, college ball is their only ticket to the pros.

This is the point. If only some minor sports program could be set up with a pay scale and everything that would help develop players for the "majors". I'm sure something like this is unheard of and would never work though.

@diehardbrownsfan said:

Not the same in any way or means. They get a free college education just for playing a game they love to begin with. If they actually decide to use the education and learn something and get an actual DEGREE, then they have a future regardless of whether they make the pros or not. So boo fukcing hooo.

Some of these guys can barely read. Do you really think that getting a degree is an option? Obviously, a lot of the players go on to get degrees and use it for their careers. Those are not the athletes that I am referring to. I'm referring to the guys that wouldn't step foot on a college campus if it weren't for football. The ones that the college tweaks it's admission policy for, the one that takes a scholarship that could be used for a kid that would actually use it. It is a joke that there is no other realistic way for these guys to get into the NFL other than to have these colleges make millions off of them while giving them the "privilege" to attend their university like they are doing them a huge favor.

@pizzadeliveryguy said:

The bolded is the problem. You are correct, they are not entitled to make a living because there really isn't a secondary way to get into the NFL except for going through the monopoly of the NCAA in which they aren't compensated. If you don't think that this system is broke then you should probably pull your head out of your sphincter.

It would be like someone telling you that you couldn't be a bricklayer until you performed 3-4 years of bricklaying services for them in which you would get a lovely education in basket-weaving for your troubles. It is bullshit.

Not the same in any way or means. They get a free college education just for playing a game they love to begin with. If they actually decide to use the education and learn something and get an actual DEGREE, then they have a future regardless of whether they make the pros or not. So boo fukcing hooo.

mikeyP72 said:

Steve Spurrier submits signatures in support of plan to pay college student-athletes:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6616618

I guess it's not just people like us that think this is ridiculous.

No doubt. I have long thought it wouldn't hurt to pay players a stipend for living expenses.

But that doesn't mean the system is flawed. It is what it is and still doesn't deflect the choices Tressel made.

Say you pay the players a few hundred extra a month....you are still going to have the Pryor's of the world who want the car, or more than a few hundred.

Human nature dictates no matter what you have, you will always want more.

They have an opportunity for a free education and all the amenities, including room and board, food, perks, BJs from hot cheerleaders and overall adulation to play a game. These same kids are not ready to play pro football when they are 18 years old, it is documented and would be inhumane even if they could stick on a team. Hence, the reason for the three year rule before they can come out. Another words, college ball is their only ticket to the pros.

Let's get real here, these kids do have spending money, even the ones without parental help. They get cash that supersedes what most living quarters they choose actually cost over the course of a semester or quarter. They are also supplied a pretty nice wardrobe of sporting gear to wear, and most of them do.

Now I am not saying the system can't be tweaked, especially for the smaller scholarship sports, but let's not pretend these kids are starving or living on the streets. Face it, most of the money they get by illegal means (as in the case of OSU), is used for non-essential items---ie tats, weed, booze, fancy cars, swag, bling and a bunch of other bullshit.

Many college students have no cars, very few clothes, live in dumps with little food and have to pay back enormous student loans. Beyond that, they generally are the same people supporting the superstar athletes with affection because they play for their school.

I'm getting a little tired of the poor scholarship athlete BS going around in this country, it is simply not true. Sure the system needs tweaked, but if these kids are not doing a bunch of extra curricular crap with money, they could live just fine, get an education and set themselves up for what's ahead in life. I'm about as tired of this as I am the poor NFL player shit they are trying to sell.

@diehardbrownsfan said:

Exactly. The athletes got what they were promised in their scholarship, free education, room and board, etc. They are not entitled to make a living. These athletes should be banned from sports for life in my opinion greedy cock-------er's.

The bolded is the problem. You are correct, they are not entitled to make a living because there really isn't a secondary way to get into the NFL except for going through the monopoly of the NCAA in which they aren't compensated. If you don't think that this system is broke then you should probably pull your head out of your sphincter.

It would be like someone telling you that you couldn't be a bricklayer until you performed 3-4 years of bricklaying services for them in which you would get a lovely education in basket-weaving for your troubles. It is bullshit.

@kosar_for_president said:

It's seems me and Die Hard are agreeing on everything lately. I think I am getting old.

It's inevitable.

Anyways it's too bad the guy that puts him out has to be a huge douche like Pryor...but you get what you recruit i suppose.

Because it actually comes down to who gives a flying xxxx..they should have the right to sell some signatures on the back end. ( the fact they don't is a whole other mess)

All coaches have to go to bat for their players, they live and die by them anyways so what the xxxx is the point of snitching?

@mr.-t said:

And who said Pryor has a high IQ?

Tressel.