@king-ghoolie-lives said:

Dude,

I don't think this is lame at all. There are two issues for me.

I think many of us older fans remember the cardiac kids and how a lot of no name guys and reused veterans came together to do some wonderful things. Those memories I think keep hope alive and in my estimation prevent fans from seeing the Browns as they really are.

If we get a healthy RB compliment to Hillis, we may have a decent running game again. Additionally, if this WCO talk results in a truly high paced, offense and our passing game can present a lot of options with the ball.. then defenses will be left guessing and like the old Kids, the team could be an exciting 10 game winner.

I have no faith that this will happen.

For one thing, Lerner ownership has made the Browns one of the most unemotional, lackadaisical, uninventive and unproductive teams in the NFL.This is by far the worst era in Browns football in my lifetime.

There is a cameraderie, intensity and passion among players on other teams. The Steelers in particular have an internal drive that completely overwhemls teams, especially the Browns. Whatever this factor is, regardless of hooping it up for Hillis, the Browns simply don't have that energy.

Now, you can spit out all the X and O bullshit that you want, but it is still that. Its bullshit. All 32 teams have teh same basic playbook. Now, some teams have courage and don't call plays that are obvious for the defense, but for the most part, plays are all the same.

What Browns players lack is sprit de corps, emotion, tru grit. Palmer's team didn't have it, Butch's team didn't have it, and God knows, this team doesn't have it.

Without an emotional component to ANY performance, the end product will always be, at best average, and more typically the 5 - 11 horseshit that Lerner ownership has brought.

That said the 2011 - 12 Browns will be much like the 2010 - 2011 version.

5 -11, 6 -10, even 7 - 9, the team is a shit team and will deliver shit results.

I don't think you could be more wrong about the browns having "No emotion" and no heart and whatever else you claimed ...

I think that this team finally does have that. Hillis, Colt, TJ Ward, Haden,Fujita and Cribbs just to name a few. All those guys wear there heart on there sleeve and all those guys come from a winning background in college/past pro teams and want to win in the pro's (Except Cribbs w/ the college)

I honestly am not getting my hopes up going into the season, but I wouldn't be shocked to see us be a pretty decent team. It is to early to sit here and rank anything, but I have been saying it for a while and will continue to say it ... our season rides on Colts shoulders. If Colt succeeds we do as well. If he fails so do we. It is simple and pretty cut and dry to me.

@represent said:

I think i'm pretty spot on with what i said either way i don't need to see them play 1 6 or 16 games to give them a ranking before the season starts

Fact the browns are ranked 19th already and not one game has been played don't try and say it's not possible to rank any team before a season starts

Yes, it's possible but it's meaningless, as Gipper pointed out. At this point it's nothing more than a beauty contest, and everyone's going ooohhh- aaahhhh on how nice the Eagles look. Don't want it to happen, but serious injuries happen- I'm betting Hodges is already done for the year. The Eagles wouldn't look anywhere near as pretty if Vick and Asomuga got hurt, no?

@represent said:

I think i'm pretty spot on with what i said either way i don't need to see them play 1 6 or 16 games to give them a ranking before the season starts

Fact the browns are ranked 19th already and not one game has been played don't try and say it's not possible to rank any team before a season starts

Yes, you are a newbie here, so you haven't heard my rant against these so called "power rankings". My position is that power rankings don't mean doodly squat. You want to see the "rankings" that are the ulimate in legitimacy? Here they are:

2010 Standings

Week 21 Standings AFC W L SRS

East

Patriots 14 2

Jets 11 5

Dolphins 7 9

Bills 4 12

North

Steelers 12 4

Ravens 12 4

Browns 5 11

Bengals 4 12

South

Colts 10 6

Jaguars 8 8

Titans 6 10

Texans 6 10

West

Chiefs 10 6

Chargers 9 7

Raiders 8 8

Broncos 4 12

NFC W L SRS

East

Eagles 10 6

Giants 10 6

Cowboys 6 10

Redskins 6 10

North

Bears 11 5

Packers 10 6

Lions 6 10

Vikings 6 10

South

Falcons 13 3

Saints 11 5

Buccaneers 10 6

Panthers 2 14

West

Seahawks 7 9

Rams 7 9

49ers 6 10

Cardinals 5 11

They are called "The standings". Everything you need to know about where a team stands vis a vis other teams is contained here. The standing tell you how many games a team has won and how many they have lost and whether they are in line for a playoff spot. What else really matters bottom line? Might it be entertaining to engage in listing "power rankings"? Perhaps, if that is what you are into. I personally find them pedantic.

Don't get me wrong, at some point I do think it is valuable to do an analysis af the team's strengths and weaknesses...and perhaps scaling those on a 1-10 level. I just don't think that "power ranking" the various teams is useful, when we have the standings to look at. Usually starting about halfway through the season I will do a weekly thread entitled "If the playoffs started today" where I list who would in and who would be out at each week of the season to that point.

mikeyP72 said:

Minor league? Well, their minor league butts sure kicked the Aints asses last year. Thanks for stopping by though Canton.

taking shots at me doesnt make the browns any better. i root for the brownies too but im not some dumbass homer thats going to pretend like the browns have accomplished anything from last year to this year. congrats on beating my favorite team but that didnt stop mangini from getting fired or having another draft pick in the top 10.

its good to build through the draft but if you dont have a solid foundation, young unproven talent really cant reach its full potential

@represent said:

I think i'm pretty spot on with what i said either way i don't need to see them play 1 6 or 16 games to give them a ranking before the season starts

Fact the browns are ranked 19th already and not one game has been played don't try and say it's not possible to rank any team before a season starts

@represent said:

I think i'm pretty spot on with what i said either way i don't need to see them play 1 6 or 16 games to give them a ranking before the season starts

Fact the browns are ranked 19th already and not one game has been played don't try and say it's not possible to rank any team before a season starts

I'd say that's more of a estimation as opposed to a true rank. My guess would be right at about 15-18.

Quit telling people what to do.

@cantonlegend said:

you could say this every year. every year the team has a huge makeover with a plethora of new young unproven players. every couple years there is a new coach and new GM. every couple weeks there is a new starting QB. truth is that you can rank the browns...but nobody is going to want to read the rankings because none of them are going to be any good if ppl are honest about it.

its unfortunate but its how the browns operate. they are the minor league of the NFL

From a Saints fan on a Browns board????????????????????

Fact the browns are ranked 19th already and not one game has been played don't try and say it's not possible to rank any team before a season starts

@the-gipper said:

I appreciate what you are trying to do here, but, for me, it is completely a futile effort at this point to try to do this ranking. There are just too many unknown variables. Too many new faces, new systems, jobs yet to be decided, injuries,etc. etc.

Perhaps bring this question back up in say Week 6 of the regular season and I might be able to have a firmer handle on the subject.

you could say this every year. every year the team has a huge makeover with a plethora of new young unproven players. every couple years there is a new coach and new GM. every couple weeks there is a new starting QB. truth is that you can rank the browns...but nobody is going to want to read the rankings because none of them are going to be any good if ppl are honest about it.

its unfortunate but its how the browns operate. they are the minor league of the NFL

Perhaps bring this question back up in say Week 6 of the regular season and I might be able to have a firmer handle on the subject.