BTW, it's "corps" not "core". Sorry. Couldn't help it.

@choco said:

Jhuh.....absolutely right. Forgot about the bum knee last year....

Hopper....keep being the apologist....its amusing. Rules are rules, whether u agree with them or not. Such an upstanding citizen like tressel, who preached honesty and integrity, looked the other wat to keep his players on the field. That sir....is a hypocrite.

I do NOT believe this was an issue of "honesty and integrity". As a Magistrate I deal with issues of honesty and integrity all the time, and I alsow know the difference between that and something that is just against the rules.

Tressels violations were NOT matter of Malum per se; they were NOT actions that violated the principles of natural or moral laws; they were merely malum prohibitum. Like violating a speed limit. His act was NOT immoral, but is only wrong because it was prohibited by some rule

And here is another Latin phrase for you: Malu Usus Abolendus est which means "A bad or invalid custom ought to be abolished.

All that being said, I never proclaimed that Tressel et al should not be punished or reprimanded for their failure to abide by the rules.

Indeed, more often or not I am assessing punishment against people who merely violate a "rule". And sometimes those charges are ones that I believe are "bad customs".

Example: I have been getting these charges come before me where some kids have marijuana on them. They are being charged A. with a minor misdemeanor for the possession or the joint of marijuana, and B. with a 4th degree Misd. for possession of drug paraphenalia. What is the drug paraphenalia? Not a bong, not a pipe, not a tweezer.....it is the papers that the joint is rolled in.

I have an issue with that because it just seems like it is a method of piling on that was not contemplated by the statute. Nevertheless, it is legit, and I enforce it.

So to analogize it, what we have in the OSU case is the possession of the improper benefit....and the piling on of the drug paraphenalia charge.

I seem to remember when Carroll an USC got hit that most here were laughing, poking fun, and slamming them for their cheating. Now that the shoes on the other foot, its the NCAA fault. That sir....makes u a hypocrite.

What's this mean? The higher standard u thought was Isuzu was just a farce....ur no better than the cheaters that get caught and punished accordingly. Deal with it....ur the big tens Miami.

Well, we can analogize it back to the drug thing. OSU got caught with a joint of dope and some papers (selling some of their own trinkets for tattoos).

What USC and Miami got caught with are a barge full of cocaine and a meth lab.

Cars, guns, probably millions of dollars of cash, houses, hookers, abortions.

So, proportionately, OSU should get their $250.00 fine and costs.

These other schools should be facing 10-25.

Hopper....keep being the apologist....its amusing. Rules are rules, whether u agree with them or not. Such an upstanding citizen like tressel, who preached honesty and integrity, looked the other wat to keep his players on the field. That sir....is a hypocrite.

I seem to remember when Carroll an USC got hit that most here were laughing, poking fun, and slamming them for their cheating. Now that the shoes on the other foot, its the NCAA fault. That sir....makes u a hypocrite.

What's this mean? The higher standard u thought was Isuzu was just a farce....ur no better than the cheaters that get caught and punished accordingly. Deal with it....ur the big tens Miami.

@choco said:

lol....touchy touchy. youre holier-than-thou ex-coach shames the entire school and yall still hold him up on a pedestal....

quite humorous actually...u should be honored to be mentioned in the same breath as usc and miami...

OK, let's be clear about what Tressel did, or did not do. He learned that a few of his players sold their own belongings...which were gifts to them by the school, for cash or tatoos

...and he didn't rat them out.

That's it. He did not play the rat.

Is that inherently wrong? Absolutely not.

Was that against an arcane NCAA rule. Yes. Yes, NCAA rule require that coaches be snitches on their players if they learn that they receive "improper benefits".

What is a "improper benefit"? Whatever the NCAA arbitrarily determines to be improper.

Shouldn't it be an improper benefit for a player to receive an article of value from the school for their performance?

If a player were to receive $200.00 in cash from the school, that is improper. But if he receives a set of gold pants with a value of $200.00 that is perfectly acceptable? Why? And though, apparently it is acceptable for the player to have received that item of value, it is not acceptable for him to dispose of that item of value?

What if a kid "wins" a pair of gold pants, then turns around and gives those gold pants to his dad. Then lets say the dad goes and sells them for a couple of hundred bucks and pockets that money. Then lets say the Dad a week or two later gives his son $200.00 in cash.

It is not an NCAA violation for the son to give the trinket to his dad.

It is not an NCAA violation for the dad to sell the trinket once he owns it.

It is not an NCAA violation for a dad to give his son $200.00

So the real problem was not that the kid got money for the trinket. The problem was that he was not coached properly in getting around the arcane NCAA rules violation

If Tressel knew that one of his players gave his dad his trinket, and that the dad sold the trinket, and that the dad gave his kid $200.00, he would not have been obligated to report it.

There would have been NO violations anywhere at all in this scenario.

@choco said:

because maybe the browns do have some talent at the position....

at least our brass thinks so...so forgive me for not taking the opinions of armchair GMs that think everyone on our team sucks seriously.

if avery was that good, he'd have been claimed off waivers....yet he wasn't....not even by his last OC. ever stop to consider why that is? huh? no? exactly. why does everyone else's shitty players get the benefit of the doubt that they're awesome from you people, but our shitty players don't? cause he produced a bit in a pass friendly offense with a pretty good rookie QB?

its the same shit every year with you people...sorry if im a bit tired of the same old talking points and same bs about vet free agents and the lack of patience with developing players. in all honesty, most of you...most....don't have an eyeball test....cant evaluate other than using stats....expect perfection from rookies....or otherwise just plain don't know that the xxxx you're looking at.

thats my opinion tho....

He actually did not produce in a pass heavy O with a rookie QB. He was hurt all season. He produced a little in a terrible O with terrible QBs.

Still I would be skeptical as well. If we brought him in I would be fine with it ... but I am also fine with passing on him.

at least our brass thinks so...so forgive me for not taking the opinions of armchair GMs that think everyone on our team sucks seriously.

if avery was that good, he'd have been claimed off waivers....yet he wasn't....not even by his last OC. ever stop to consider why that is? huh? no? exactly. why does everyone else's shitty players get the benefit of the doubt that they're awesome from you people, but our shitty players don't? cause he produced a bit in a pass friendly offense with a pretty good rookie QB?

its the same shit every year with you people...sorry if im a bit tired of the same old talking points and same bs about vet free agents and the lack of patience with developing players. in all honesty, most of you...most....don't have an eyeball test....cant evaluate other than using stats....expect perfection from rookies....or otherwise just plain don't know that the xxxx you're looking at.

thats my opinion tho....

If MoMas and Robo don't produce this year then its all on them... I think we finally have a QB who can deliver the ball.. We'll see pretty soon if our receiving corps is NFL ready...

As far as bringing in Avery, I'll defer to Shurmur on that one...

Peace

T.Dawg

@cantonlegend said:

not at all. i was suggesting that its really not appropriate to rip on a terrible team and the players they cut when that terrible team was actually better than the browns were.

good players get cut all the time. players get cut for all sorts of reasons and its not always because they are bad.

avery had a good season so he obviously is capable of doing it. and for a team with really no talent at that position, why wouldnt the browns bring him in for a look

well i don't know how you can say the rams were better last year considering they missed the playoffs too and were in the weakest division in football. They didn't have to play the ravens and steelers twice. If Shurmur doesn't want Avery, don't you think that is reason enough not to get him?!

@bringbackbrownie2 said:

Are you suggesting the rams won two more games because of Donnie Avery? We are talking about a WR cut from another NFL team here- not a big time playmaker. I would like to think Shurmur would know best if Avery was worth signing considering he knew everyone on the rams offense. If Shurmur doesn't want Avery- I don't want Avery. It's as simple as that..

not at all. i was suggesting that its really not appropriate to rip on a terrible team and the players they cut when that terrible team was actually better than the browns were.

good players get cut all the time. players get cut for all sorts of reasons and its not always because they are bad.

avery had a good season so he obviously is capable of doing it. and for a team with really no talent at that position, why wouldnt the browns bring him in for a look

@choco said:

^^^^^^ thank you...beat me to the same point. almost made it to the playoffs...at 7-9....lmao. holy shit avery must be....the shit!

seriously, if he cleared waivers and shurmur didn't even look his way, exactly what does that say about said player? and what does that sau about those that think he's head and shoulders better than what we have....

at a minimum, he could be injured or simply be an asshole. we are not privy to all the relevant info...

We don't have all of the information but we do know that he had two pretty good seasons in 08 and 09 in a pretty bad offense that was trying to find an identity. He then missed all of 2010 with an injury. So no he did not contribute to the 7-9 season last year. But if he hadn't been injured he would have been a starter and maybe the Rams win a couple more games. Who knows. If he can return to his prevoius form coming off of the injury I would be willing to bet that he is a better receiver option than Cribbs, Robo, or MoMass! The question is can he return to his previous form and stay healthy. I am sure Shurmur will vet this.

sanze seemed to do alright. its not always blind love....familiarity more likely the culprit. paxson was a pretty solid player at PSU (my alma mater), but i aint gonna shed a tear if we can upgrade the position.

just want whats better for the team, and considering where one grew up or played ball has no bearing on the decision imo.

@choco said:

sure there should be some fans.....

however, the homerism is strong with them. every OSU grad that gets cut must be brought in. how many gholston threads we have here?

Gholston? Damn, I want Ross Homan picked up now!!! We're thin at LB, he played at OSU, he's a great kid, my boss knows his mom,

and so what if he's too small to play LB in the NFL???

And how 'bout that Brandon Saine kid? Ran track in HS, But no field vision and a stiff breeze can knock him off his feet. :lol:

however, the homerism is strong with them. every OSU grad that gets cut must be brought in. how many gholston threads we have here?

Homotron said:

Pittsburgh kept Sweed around a long time. Granted he was injured all the time but they still kept him around and he was drafted in the second round.

whoa there nilly....

our resident phd says the sweed analogy isnt valid cause its not the browns. if rookies dont produce their first year, they suck and should be cut in lieu of 30+ vets thats couldnt keep their jobs with their prior team.

@choco said:

lol....touchy touchy. youre holier-than-thou ex-coach shames the entire school and yall still hold him up on a pedestal....

quite humorous actually...u should be honored to be mentioned in the same breath as usc and miami...

c'mon, lighten up. i really could care less about the college game. but why chomp on osu? i thought this was the browns board? you know the CLEVELAND browns? last time i heard cleveland was in ohio, hence the fact that there might be a few fans of theirs on this board. i guess u could go on the lions board and diss michigan. same thing.

@wrrebel said:

We are the only team that keeps wrs based on where they were drafted. Robo shouldn't even be on our roster, he blowss

Pittsburgh kept Sweed around a long time. Granted he was injured all the time but they still kept him around and he was drafted in the second round.

quite humorous actually...u should be honored to be mentioned in the same breath as usc and miami...

@bigbrownsfan said:

Word!

And you meant O$U

move to michigan bitches. come out of the closet cowboy fan.

@feartheroo said:

Yeah but he's from OSU which makes him the greatest WR to ever step on an NFL field.

Word!

And you meant O$U

@feartheroo said:

Yeah but he's from OSU which makes him the greatest WR to ever step on an NFL field.

you mean ohio state? the same team that just kicked the livin' shit out of your team? that ohio state?

hater in da house.

@choco said:

^^^^^^ thank you...beat me to the same point. almost made it to the playoffs...at 7-9....lmao. holy shit avery must be....the shit!

and we hired the great OC from that same 7-9 team!! he must be the second coming of vince lombardi! :lol:

holmgren's a genius. fat ass.

seriously, if he cleared waivers and shurmur didn't even look his way, exactly what does that say about said player? and what does that sau about those that think he's head and shoulders better than what we have....

at a minimum, he could be injured or simply be an asshole. we are not privy to all the relevant info...

@cantonlegend said:

lmao that same rams team that won 2 more games than the browns did and almost made the playoffs...yea those rams

the browns need wideouts. hed come here and start

Are you suggesting the rams won two more games because of Donnie Avery? We are talking about a WR cut from another NFL team here- not a big time playmaker. I would like to think Shurmur would know best if Avery was worth signing considering he knew everyone on the rams offense. If Shurmur doesn't want Avery- I don't want Avery. It's as simple as that..