@the-gipper said:

The Cowboys have won one single playoff game in like the last 20 years (since their last SB title). The Browns have done that well. Until this year, the Niners hadn't even made the playoffs for a decade.

Until Peyton Manning arrived the Colts had been garbage for 25 years.

A lot of it has to do with the coach. (see Pats under BB), or QB (Colts with Manning), or both (Pats again)

Some of it is indeed "system", "front office" "ownership"....those are the ones that maintain. Steelers, yes. Giants, Packers perhaps.

Likewise the "bad teams" could be attributed to ownership. The Lions under William Clay Ford. The Cardinals under Bidwill. The Colts under Irsay Sr.

...and yes, the Steelers under Art Rooney Sr. It wasn't until Dan Rooney took over as the effective owner of the team in the 60s/70s that the Steelers began winning.

Randy Lerner certainly isn't off to a good start with his ownership. But, things can and do turn around.

I agree....... I really thought Holmgren would have had this team turned around very quickly. Maybe I'm puting too much on Holmgren but, it just seems like his influence hasn't showed up as much as I expected. I think this season should be a stepping stone towards the right direction for the Browns.

@gafreleets said:

kiss my rings turd.

How can you call them your rings when you just recently replaced all that Dallas Cowboy merchandise with Steeler crap?

Are all newely acquired pissburgh fans as arrogant as you or is it just the ones that dont live anywhere near Pittsburgh such as yourself?

@gafreleets said:

yeah?

how'd that work out for us?

kiss my rings turd.

Really ? Bruce Arians is the reason u guys won so many ? I thought it was Dick LeBeau and the defense + BR. And if he did help u win so many why push him out of the organization.

Sometime it is not enought just to yell "I'm a Steeler fan ! I'm a Steeler fan". You need to make some effort to learn the teams history too. Be a good boy and go do your homework

@gafreleets said:

sucks for you guys that Pittsburgh is now in the hunt for an OC.

you DO know we'll get first pick of any candidate don't you?

whoever it is, enjoy our leftovers. HA!

Are you guys planning on implementing the WCO ? If yes then please hire the OC we hope to hire, that we will actually be forced to look elsewhere and might actually hire somebody good.

@batman said:

pittsburgh has had some pretty good luck with ohio people. chuck Noll, jack lambert, big ben to name a few. there are a lot of great ones from pa too. jim kelly, joe montana, dan marino, tony dorsett, the head coach to green bay, bill cowher to name several.

it must start with ownership because it seems like it's always the same teams making the playoffs or super bowls or at least they keep coming back after a decade or half a decade or so.

steelers

niners

giants

ravens

patriots*

cowboys

packers

colts

probably the best of the best are the steelers, cowboys, 9rs, packers because they seem to have a lot of history with winning. I really don't know if you could include the ravens or colts because they only won once and twice for the colts. possibly not even the 9rs, they had their decade and then not too much. i'm just saying over years and years it seems like the cream keeps rising to the top.

The Cowboys have won one single playoff game in like the last 20 years (since their last SB title). The Browns have done that well. Until this year, the Niners hadn't even made the playoffs for a decade.

Until Peyton Manning arrived the Colts had been garbage for 25 years.

A lot of it has to do with the coach. (see Pats under BB), or QB (Colts with Manning), or both (Pats again)

Some of it is indeed "system", "front office" "ownership"....those are the ones that maintain. Steelers, yes. Giants, Packers perhaps.

Likewise the "bad teams" could be attributed to ownership. The Lions under William Clay Ford. The Cardinals under Bidwill. The Colts under Irsay Sr.

...and yes, the Steelers under Art Rooney Sr. It wasn't until Dan Rooney took over as the effective owner of the team in the 60s/70s that the Steelers began winning.

Randy Lerner certainly isn't off to a good start with his ownership. But, things can and do turn around.

it must start with ownership because it seems like it's always the same teams making the playoffs or super bowls or at least they keep coming back after a decade or half a decade or so.

steelers

niners

giants

ravens

patriots*

cowboys

packers

colts

probably the best of the best are the steelers, cowboys, 9rs, packers because they seem to have a lot of history with winning. I really don't know if you could include the ravens or colts because they only won once and twice for the colts. possibly not even the 9rs, they had their decade and then not too much. i'm just saying over years and years it seems like the cream keeps rising to the top.

@bringbackbrownie2 said:

Actually you took our leftovers before (Bruce Arians). I don't see why this year would be any different..

yeah?

how'd that work out for us?

kiss my rings turd.

@gafreleets said:

sucks for you guys that Pittsburgh is now in the hunt for an OC.

you DO know we'll get first pick of any candidate don't you?

whoever it is, enjoy our leftovers. HA!

Actually you took our leftovers before (Bruce Arians). I don't see why this year would be any different..

you DO know we'll get first pick of any candidate don't you?

whoever it is, enjoy our leftovers. HA!

To change the subject, I thought we would see Holmgrens influence on the Browns team so far but, maybe I'm missing something. I guess they didn't build Rome in a year as the saying goes.

@nickers said:

Yes...I thought he did well with what was available to work with.

most everyone in pittsburgh, except ben himself, disagrees.

@batman said:

Rumor has it that, Bruce Arians is on his way out in Pittsburgh, would anyone like to see him return to Cleveland ?

Yes...I thought he did well with what was available to work with.

@batman said:

Rumor has it that, Bruce Arians is on his way out in Pittsburgh, would anyone like to see him return to Cleveland ?

More importantly for them, it appears that Dick LeBeau is going to continue as DC:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/11/dick-lebeau-will-return-as-steelers-defensive-coordinator/

@nw220 said:

if it werent for Heckert i believe we would be in serious trouble..He is the only one i truly have any faith in

agree 100%.

@nw220 said:

Makes me wonder if Sherman dosent land the TB job is he more than likely the OC?? Also if we do get Sherman does that make Tannehill a more likely pick for us???

@the-gipper said:

I would think that if Sherman comes here that it would certainly increase the likelihood of Tannehill coming here.

I will agree that it will get Tannehill some more looks, but Tannehill really started not because he was overly good, but because he was just the best they had. The final decision on any QB draft pick comes down to Holmgren and I think we only see Tannehill in a Brown's uniform if he falls to the 3rd... but he will go way before that.

@the-gipper said:

The key is that he is the team Prez, not the GM. The biggest job of a GM, and the biggest area of success or failure....is in talent evaluation. Thankfully, we have someone else here doing that whom I believe to be very competent at that (more competent than Holmgren) in Heckert.

But, yes, clearly he is still loyal to people. Time will tell eventually if that is a good or a bad thing.

Thats what i was going to say Gip, if it werent for Heckert i believe we would be in serious trouble..He is the only one i truly have any faith in

@miktoxic said:

where did i say i was talking about holmgren as a coach??

here's a great quote i found about mike holmgren's tenure as their GM:

Holmgren's tenure as Seahawks GM was very forgettable. Maybe he could point to the flawed relationship between himself and Whitsitt during his years as GM. Whatever the reason, he was removed from his GM position because he did not get the job done during the four years he had his shot. No doubt that another team will give him the reigns of an organization again. I seriously doubt that the outcome will be any different than his time as GM with the Seahawks. Mike Holmgren's over-loyalty to certain coaches and players, his inability to properly evaluate talent, and his stubbornness will lead - in my estimation - to another failed GM tenure.

not for nothing if he doesn't learn how to bend a little bit here and there with this WCO and his loyalty to it, maybe adapt here and there.....i see a lot of what i bolded becoming true. as a matter of fact it's pretty dead on so far except of course now he's a team president. ughh.

The key is that he is the team Prez, not the GM. The biggest job of a GM, and the biggest area of success or failure....is in talent evaluation. Thankfully, we have someone else here doing that whom I believe to be very competent at that (more competent than Holmgren) in Heckert.

But, yes, clearly he is still loyal to people. Time will tell eventually if that is a good or a bad thing.

The hire so far seems like hiring pals who know the system. We shall see the product they put on the field and then decide.

here's a great quote i found about mike holmgren's tenure as their GM:

Holmgren's tenure as Seahawks GM was very forgettable. Maybe he could point to the flawed relationship between himself and Whitsitt during his years as GM. Whatever the reason, he was removed from his GM position because he did not get the job done during the four years he had his shot. No doubt that another team will give him the reigns of an organization again. I seriously doubt that the outcome will be any different than his time as GM with the Seahawks. Mike Holmgren's over-loyalty to certain coaches and players, his inability to properly evaluate talent, and his stubbornness will lead - in my estimation - to another failed GM tenure.

not for nothing if he doesn't learn how to bend a little bit here and there with this WCO and his loyalty to it, maybe adapt here and there.....i see a lot of what i bolded becoming true. as a matter of fact it's pretty dead on so far except of course now he's a team president. ughh.