Zombo said:

No, unfortunately they are real..

Rich is the effeminate one. Ghoolie is the "bear".

Zombo

Ghoolie is the bear?

All this time I was worried someone here might actually be bigger than me, so I've been watching what I say. Now I can speak freely!

(In case you missed it, Rich...I wasn't being serious.)

@brownsfan said:

Well then, you might want to correct Rich on his statement of "hell we drafted four centers with top three picks" then. Because CLE hasn't done that. They have drafted 2 centers in the first round, both of which were at pick 21.

Oh, and Quinn wasn't in the top 20 either, he was pick 22 (not sure what Quinn has to do with OL guys though).

I guess my only question is: Why are not QBs also not considered a "Dime a Dozen". I mean, the Browns could draft 2 QBs a year perhaps and still not get a decent one, fair to say?

I mean, since 1999 they have drafted Tim Couch, Spergon Wynn, Luke McCown, Charlie Frye, Brady Quinn, Colt McCoy

....and have taken on FAs like Trent Dilfer, Jeff Garcia, Derek Anderson, Kelly Holcomb, Doug Pederson, Jake Delhomme, Ty Detmer, Ken Dorsey, Bruce Gradkowski.

There is a Baker's Dozen plus two....and who is going to give you a dime for their performances with this team? DA made the Pro Bowl 1 time and that is it for the accolades of any of these guys.

I mean, the Browns have had limited success getting Pro Bowl caliber players, especially out of their skill positions. Here is the list of Browns Pro Bowlers under the Lerner regime:

Joe Thomas 5 times

Josh Cribbs 2 times

Ryan Pontbriand 2 times

Jamir Miller 1 time

Derek Anderson 1 time

Braylon Edwards 1 time

Alex Mack 1 time

Shaun Rogers 1 time

Kellen Winslow Jr. 1 time

At the point that it was thought that this team had some skill players going for it, with DA at QB, Braylon at WR, and K2 at TE it was thought that the Browns were really doing well with their skill player choices.....but that all fell apart. Why? Why did that 2007 team with offensive firepower with the likes of young players like DA at QB, K2 at TE, Braylon at WR, Jamal Lewis at RB, Vickers at FB.

Why did that all tank so quickly? You also had both JT and Steinbach on the OL that year, doing well.

@dawginit said:

Wrong!!!!!!! You build a team from the inside out. OL and DL. Offensive lineman will get experience and get better regardless of the team they are playing for because all they have to do is block on every play. Skill players like quarterbacks, runningbacks, and receivers have to RELY ON the lineman to do their jobs. You can't tell me that a runningback won't get better quicker if he's got good blocking ahead of him opposed to being stuffed on every play or that a quarterback can't become better faster if he has more time to throw. A lineman is going to get his chance to block and get experience regardless of whether the quarterback can throw, the runningback takes the hand off, or if the the receivers catch the ball.

Fear not, Ghoolie thinks ONLY first rounders are "premium picks". Stretching the definition to fit his argument. In the real world, the Giants have 4 out of 5 of their o-line as "premium picks" sorry Tom, go back to class, the first three rounds are ALL premium picks.

@king-ghoolie-lives said:

Larry, Round 2 is NOT a premium pick. Round 1, debate whether it is the first 5, 10 15 or 20, but for sure by 20, you get a lot of shit, like Quinn.

Round 1 OL are the mark of one of two things.............

#1 - the team is solid at QB, RB and WR. THAT kind of a team can afford to "waste" a premium pick for an OL.

#2 - an asshole did the drafting.

In the case of Joe Thomas for instance. The guy that drafted him was............. AN ASSHOLE because the Joe Thomas pick was perhaps as dumb as trading Warfield for Phipps. It isn't that JT isn't a good, B - rated LT, the point is, when you have a shit offense with a shit QB, protecting the blind side is idiotic. Joe Thomas could die and the Browns will STILL be a 4 win team. JT has neen, by far, the worst 1st round pick in a long, long time of bad picks for the Browns.

Again, Rich is CORRECTAMUNDO. The majority of SB winning teams had an OL that was played mostly by lower draft picks, walk ons and late, late round draft picks. That's just how it is, and how it always has been.

Again, Paul Brown had JIB and what peole here say was a GREAT OL. Still, head to head, Jim Taylor used both Paul and Jim to wipe stink off of his nutsack.

Taking Joe Thomas was akin to spending $200,000 on a building lot, and only having $20,000 to build a house.

Thomas is at that age where OL start getting hurt and I guarantee that Joe Thomas will likewise get hurt and miss most of the 2012 season. He is, by OL standards, long in the teeth and has been very lucky. He will be replaced by a nobody, and AMAZINGLY, we may actually see improvement.

ONly assholes use premium picks on lardass OL men.

Wins provided by Thomas.................................. 0

Wrong!!!!!!! You build a team from the inside out. OL and DL. Offensive lineman will get experience and get better regardless of the team they are playing for because all they have to do is block on every play. Skill players like quarterbacks, runningbacks, and receivers have to RELY ON the lineman to do their jobs. You can't tell me that a runningback won't get better quicker if he's got good blocking ahead of him opposed to being stuffed on every play or that a quarterback can't become better faster if he has more time to throw. A lineman is going to get his chance to block and get experience regardless of whether the quarterback can throw, the runningback takes the hand off, or if the the receivers catch the ball.

Zombo said:

I can drink with and put my arms around any one of yas.

But if you post stupid, I'm calling it stupid.

Zombo

i still can't get over the fact that rich and ghoulie's posts are almost always the same. not topic-wise but the grammar and spelling (all caps in some spots and teh mispelling of certain words on purpose).

are we sure one of them isn't just a phantom poster made up by the other?

Zombo said:

Rich isn't fat. Otherwise ... you nailed it.

Zombo

Zombo said:

Can someone De-Rich this for me and tell me what the debate is about?

Zombo

@rich4eagle said:

Stick your head back upurass and send more hate posts to prove what you are a football IDIOT......seems everyone but you understood it.......the debate dumbass is about why waste top picks on dime a dozen OL guys and the Giants proved that once again................but you stay stupid and spend all day trying to piss on Rich

aren't you the same two guys that were arm in arm at the big tailgate party in cleveland last year doing shots together? (i've searched the forum but i can't find the flippin photos...)

funny how distance and the lack of booze (or vice versa) can turn friends into enemies. it's great to watch/read the in-fighting amongst us fellow browns fans. it's like thanksgiving without the bad green bean casserole.

@king-ghoolie-lives said:

It isn't that JT isn't a good, B - rated LT, JT has neen, by far, the worst 1st round pick in a long, long time of bad picks for the Browns.

See this is exactly the kinda RE-RE shit that you spew that gives you no credibility. Let me get this straight, Joe T. Is a good B-rated LT? Ask any expert (no not a self proclaimed expert such as rich or yourself) if they agree, and they most likely will die of laughter.

Thomas is at that age where OL start getting hurt and I guarantee that Joe Thomas will likewise get hurt and miss most of the 2012 season. He is, by OL standards, long in the teeth and has been very lucky. He will be replaced by a nobody, and AMAZINGLY, we may actually see improvement.

AGAIN.......RE-RE! the dude is going into his SIXTH season!! He's probably not even to the halfway point in his career.

I'm afraid if i keep reading your posts it will eventually erode my brain.

@king-ghoolie-lives said:

Larry, Round 2 is NOT a premium pick. Round 1, debate whether it is the first 5, 10 15 or 20, but for sure by 20, you get a lot of shit, like Quinn.

Well then, you might want to correct Rich on his statement of "hell we drafted four centers with top three picks" then. Because CLE hasn't done that. They have drafted 2 centers in the first round, both of which were at pick 21.

Oh, and Quinn wasn't in the top 20 either, he was pick 22 (not sure what Quinn has to do with OL guys though).

@king-ghoolie-lives said:

Larry, Round 2 is NOT a premium pick. Round 1, debate whether it is the first 5, 10 15 or 20, but for sure by 20, you get a lot of shit, like Quinn.

Round 1 OL are the mark of one of two things.............

#1 - the team is solid at QB, RB and WR. THAT kind of a team can afford to "waste" a premium pick for an OL.

#2 - an asshole did the drafting.

In the case of Joe Thomas for instance. The guy that drafted him was............. AN ASSHOLE because the Joe Thomas pick was perhaps as dumb as trading Warfield for Phipps. It isn't that JT isn't a good, B - rated LT, the point is, when you have a shit offense with a shit QB, protecting the blind side is idiotic. Joe Thomas could die and the Browns will STILL be a 4 win team. JT has neen, by far, the worst 1st round pick in a long, long time of bad picks for the Browns.

Again, Rich is CORRECTAMUNDO. The majority of SB winning teams had an OL that was played mostly by lower draft picks, walk ons and late, late round draft picks. That's just how it is, and how it always has been.

Again, Paul Brown had JIB and what peole here say was a GREAT OL. Still, head to head, Jim Taylor used both Paul and Jim to wipe stink off of his nutsack.

Taking Joe Thomas was akin to spending $200,000 on a building lot, and only having $20,000 to build a house.

Thomas is at that age where OL start getting hurt and I guarantee that Joe Thomas will likewise get hurt and miss most of the 2012 season. He is, by OL standards, long in the teeth and has been very lucky. He will be replaced by a nobody, and AMAZINGLY, we may actually see improvement.

ONly assholes use premium picks on lardass OL men.

Wins provided by Thomas.................................. 0

Again...Another Retarded post...I remember a few years ago...cant remember who it was but a poster here used your own ammunition against you and showed you how many premium picks PB made taking Oline in the 1st round.

@calfoxwc said:

Rich? Research? Rich don't need no stinikin research !

Actually, we should make Rich work real hard and tell us the last time someone won a Super Bowl without a "premium pick" on o-line. And dear Ritchie poo, the standard definition of that is round 1,2,3.

And Ritchie- it was pointed out one of the Giants o-line signed up to the tune of $37 million. If that's your idea of "dime a dozen" where do I sign up to pull down that kind of dime?

Nope, the Giants have 4 second rounders on their o-line- the Patriots have a couple firsts. Give it up already Rich. Sure, you can occasionally find an undrafted FA o-line goober that makes the Pro Bowl- about as often as you find a Marquis Colston in the seventh round, or a Tom Brady in the sixth.

@rich4eagle said:

Stick your head back upurass and send more hate posts to prove what you are a football IDIOT......seems everyone but you understood it.......the debate dumbass is about why waste top picks on dime a dozen OL guys and the Giants proved that once again................but you stay stupid and spend all day trying to piss on Rich

What is your definition of a top draft pick? Only top ten? Only 1st rounders? The Giants had 4/5 of their line from the second round. Those are top picks in my book. I think you posted before researching.

@rich4eagle said:

Stick your head back upurass and send more hate posts to prove what you are a football IDIOT......seems everyone but you understood it.......the debate dumbass is about why waste top picks on dime a dozen OL guys and the Giants proved that once again................but you stay stupid and spend all day trying to piss on Rich

Who, specifically, especially among your fellow posters on the browns board want an olineman with the #4 pick, rich? Who are the geniuses?

Touche.

@speedyd900rr said:

Is it true that people who think they are right all the time have a Narcisstic Personality Disorder?

I noticed that in every thread Rich and Ghoolie start they always say "once again im right and everyone else is wrong" but I just assumed they got online and told everyone that because they were insecure about being old and fat.

Good thinking and what is your basis for this assessment since we have been correctomundo exacto for 12 years and everyone opposite has been exacto mundo dead ass wrong for twelve years and YOU A FREAKING SAGE KNOWING ALL HAS THE GALL TO SAY WHAT YOU DID..........WHERE DID YOU GET SUCH SAGE WISDOM GENIUS.........OUT OF YOUR ASS ........YOU BETCHA

Zombo said:

I don't get this thread. Don't get good blockers because the Giants won the Super Bowl?

So ... the Giants don't block well and still won the Super Bowl? ... OR ... the Giants didn't spend resources on their offensive line?

Both of those premises are wrong ... so I think I'm missing something.

Can someone De-Rich this for me and tell me what the debate is about?

Zombo

Stick your head back upurass and send more hate posts to prove what you are a football IDIOT......seems everyone but you understood it.......the debate dumbass is about why waste top picks on dime a dozen OL guys and the Giants proved that once again................but you stay stupid and spend all day trying to piss on Rich

@king-ghoolie-lives said:

Totally false. The Steelers had the Curtain AFTER Bradshaw left, and they had it when Bradshaw was injured and didn't play. THey won NOTHING without him.

Cowher had blitzburgh for a long time............ best D in the NFL................ once he added a QB? VOILA! SB.

Defenses don't win shit. Never have, never will. They serve only to get the ball to the offense, specifically, the QB.

BINgo

@jason-j said:

Rich has been banging this drum for about a decade now. His full frontal attack on "traditional" draft priorities (and his all out war on the English language), is well documented.

The trouble is, it's not without merit. Outside of the Left Tackle which requires some unique skill, there's not a lot separating the quality linemen from the average ones. Indeed concert is a much better recipe for success than replacing with more talented players - meaning if you have 5 guys who work well together, you don't need 5 great players.

Increase the talent in the backfield and on the edges, and it's remarkable how much better your offensive line looks.

It's not at all far fetched.

-jj

So you finally got it the real premise and the reality, and thanks for that, but too bad you had to insult me about the english language which I can kick anyone's ass of anyone here as well............BUT I DO ACCEPT YOU AS BEING the first to accept reality on the this the dumbest ideology of a board about football in America, duh we need OLINE guys, and I say that from years of dealing with what it is

and oh yeah now that pulling guards are not obsolete anymore give me some kudos about that as well

@bringbackbrownie2 said:

Haha Mr. Broken Record is at it again.. The Browns have only used three top picks on offensive lineman since 1999 - which is less than most other teams. No one is saying the Browns should spend a high draft pick on a RT but it clearly needs to be addressed this offseason if any quarterback wants time to throw..

And speaking of Kool-Aid, How does Ghoolie's taste?

a

That shows how dumb you are we rebuilt the OLINE five times since 99 and paid huge at all times in the draft and Free Agency to get an OLINE that got us NO WINS

hell we drafted four centers with top three picks

@unsympathetic said:

These are the contracts of the NYG OL who played in the super bowl along with when they were signed:

Bass, five-year, $27.5 million contract

Boothe, LG: 2012: $1.5 million

Diehl, LT: 2008: six-year, $31 million contract.

Snee, RG: 2008: six-year, $41.25 million contract.

McKenzie, RT: 2011 7 yr/$37.5 million contract

That is quite a few dimes for less than a dozen

Bass, five-year, $27.5 million contract

Boothe, LG: 2012: $1.5 million

Diehl, LT: 2008: six-year, $31 million contract.

Snee, RG: 2008: six-year, $41.25 million contract.

McKenzie, RT: 2011 7 yr/$37.5 million contract

You couldn't be more wrong with this thread. The entire philosophy of both NYG and NE has been: Pay the OL and DL and QB, and fill in everywhere else.

I noticed that in every thread Rich and Ghoolie start they always say "once again im right and everyone else is wrong" but I just assumed they got online and told everyone that because they were insecure about being old and fat.

@king-ghoolie-lives said:

Totally false. The Steelers had the Curtain AFTER Bradshaw left, and they had it when Bradshaw was injured and didn't play. THey won NOTHING without him.

Cowher had blitzburgh for a long time............ best D in the NFL................ once he added a QB? VOILA! SB.

Defenses don't win shit. Never have, never will. They serve only to get the ball to the offense, specifically, the QB.

You just said it yourself. If there's not a good defense to get the ball the to the offense then they won't win. I'm not saying a great defense will win you Super Bowls alone but Ben Roethlisberger doesn't win shit without that defense.

@king-ghoolie-lives said:

Again, when you have an offense that puts points on the board and can stress out the opposing defense, it makes YOUR defense great. It causes them to spend less time on the field, stay rested, fresh and uninjured.

Defense had nothing to do with the Giants win. Offense had EVERYTHING to do with it. Manninghams catch and a 26 yard pass interference call, coupled with Welker missing a pass he could have caught, is what determined the outcome of the SB.

Defense had jack shit to do with either of those plays.

PLAYMAKERS................ not fat ass Joe Thomas linement. THAT's WHO WINS FOOTBALL GAMES.

Great Big Ben Pass and spectacular catch in the corner of the endzone..............Montana scrambles and CLarke pulls one down from the sky, Manning to Manningham.................... on and on it goes. PLAYMAKERS.

QBS, RB, WRs......................... No OL or DL as MVPS................. DUH! ! ! !

Without consistent time from Joe Thomas and other great lineman, Tom Brady/Eli Manning doesn't have time to be a PLAYMAKER or throw the ball to PLAYMAKERS nor do PLAYMAKERS like LeSean McCoy or Adrian Peterson have running lanes.