These guys have sucked all on their own without any input from the fans. All the fans have ever asked is to have a winning team. How they have tried to do that....and failed, they did all on their own.

The upcoming "restart" quite simply is because the Browns have had a new change of ownership. That sort of thing doesn't happen often.

The Browns started in 1946 with Mickey McBride. Then sometime mid-late 50s David Jones became majority owner. Then in 1961 Art Modell. Then in 1998 Al Lerner, then his son in 2002. Now we have Jimmy Haslam.

Jimmy Haslam's "restart" wouldn't be perceived as all that bad if the Lerner's had not had at least 5 "restarts" in their 13 years of ownership.

So, we have to give him one.....but can the next one be like another 10 years down the line after the Browns have had some serious winning teams?

Again, that is all we ask...give us a winner. Otherwise we could care less. Many people here hold the likes of Bernie Kosar and Brian Sipe dear because they were winners. Fewer hold dear the Otto Graham's and Frank Ryan's who were bigger winners than Sipe/Kosar....but that is a function of time.

Just give us a winner...and we don't care if the names are Brandon Weeden/Colt McCoy/Trent Richardson/Jackson Brown/John Smith/Joe Blow/Jack Spratt/Bob Dobalito/Humbo Nooney/Papa Hoomaumau/Carmine Ragusa/Jeff Schlitz/Bob Blatz/Paul Pabst/Bill Busch/Sammy Stroh's or Harry Heineken.

@king-ghoolie-lives said:

You know Gip.

one of the things I personally believe has kept the Browns in the shitter is the influence tha fans and local media/ex players have had on management, even going back to Modell. Most likely starting with asshole Paul Brown trading away Bobby Mitchell without telling Modell and Model correctly firing his ass.

When I hear the media ask the brand new owner, of all the idiotic fucking things to ask a new owner........... "have you talked to Bernie Kosar yet about a position with the team"? I realize just how fucked up Cleveland are fans are.

Doug Dieken has been a cancer in the ear of management as well. We have spent more draft picks and money on offensive linemen than one can imagine. Talent that one can easily come by.

There are ass-clowns on this board who still think shit like Cribbs, Hillis, Vickers, and McCoy can be an important part of a SB caliber team.

Are owners influenced by assholes? Yeh, in Cleveland football, I believe they are. I have never believed Browns fans, as a whole to be very well educated because they are to a large degree driven by emotion and not practicality.

Case in point, Steeler players or not, guys like Big Ben, Ward, Bettis, Harrison and Polamalu are so far above and out of the range of any 10 players we have combined, yet posters come in and talk about how bad these players are.

I would bet my huge cock against a bag of donuts that in Lerner's case, many of his decisions were based on giving the "paying" savages what they are crying out for.

One has to ask, How can FO after FO be that bad? How can so many men with proven talent come to Cleveland and without exception, fail?

How can it be that with the lowest level of talent combined for the last 13 years NOT ONE TOP FA playmaker has been signed or has even entertained playing for Cleveland?

If Haslam is going to build a successful Browns team, he really has to offend fans and ignore the Cleveland media and former players. Dieken, Kosar and Brown collectively know less about NFL success than Perez Hilton.

If cleaning house doesn't involve 80% of the team, including Cribbs and McCoy, If it doesn't include adding 3 or 4 proven Veteran play makers, if it doens't focus on bringing in explosive offensive players, it will forever remain Groundhog day in CBS.

Haslam needs to turn a deaf ear to Cleveland.

I agree with you in the fact that the impatient fans and the fans who worship marginal to bad players or players past their prime and the schizophrenic media and radio hosts need to wake up. I would have traded Cribbs two years ago for a tight end when his value was overinflated. Granted, no one knew the kickoff rules were going to change then, but you still could have gotten more than market value for him at that time. The Browns need to be shrewder and pay less attention to the fans for sure. NFL players agree too. Look at the midseason poll and the first quote from a Cleveland native wideout:

Worst Franchise

I disagree with you on changing 80% of the roster though. I think that changes are needed, but not as drastic as you would like. I especially would not trade are sole pro bowl and future hall of fame left tackle (one of the most valuable positions on the field). We would be left with a huge void on the offensive line and in the locker room. Thomas is a true professional (unlike Cribbs who is a loud mouth with the media). I think that if we grab an OG, TE, CB, this year and look for LBs and a DE next year we will be a pretty tough team. In my opinion, if this regime would have been give the five years that they needed to remake the roster, we would be doing alright. I am not saying the change or potential change will derail us, but consistency is best. Anyways, Holmgren was meddling in the draft and overpaid, but Heckert has brought in a lot of talent in only three years. I admit that it all isn't top notch, but considering he has used three drafts to make a NFL roster that has been competitive all year, he deserves more credit. People are quick to forget that we have been missing two of our three starting LBs from last year, Haden for five games, Phil Taylor for half of the season and that half of our offense is rookies. Which brings me to my next point. Regardless of what game time mistakes that Pat has made along the way, he and his staff have done a good job of developing the players. Little and Gordon look like a great tandem for the future, Schwartz has faced some very tough defensive lines this year and played surprisingly well, Richardson will be at worst a very solid RB, and Weeden has put over 3400 yards in his rookie season. He will be a good QB in my opinion. I would like to see him throwing for more TDs, but part of the problem, I believe, is the ultra conservative and predictable playcalling in the redzone. Go Browns!

@browns149 said:

The trolls all got off the highway here:

Haha! I hope that we beat the bricks off of those hill jacks Sunday.