@thenew23 said:

Hmmm... Dallas??? Chicago??? Pittsburgh??? Carolina??? Sacrificed trench players over the year to focus on playmakers. Now, their only talent is the guys who touch the ball, and where are they??

On the other side of the coin, SanFran? Cincy? Minnesota? Built strong o-lines and front 7s on D. Where are they??

You can't just have weapons, you have to have players in the trenches... duh

It's not enough to just draft "weapons" you have to draft "weapons" that can actually play NFL football at a high level for years.

Let's see- for the Browns- Couch, Smokin' Willie Green, "It's a sin if they draft" Quinn- yeah Ritchie poo I nailed that one. , Win-slow, Hands of Stone Edwards, Slow-biski, Glassaquoi. That's off the top of my head. It's not like the Browns haven't TRIED to draft weapons- they drafted the wrong ones.

Matt Millen did about nothing but draft major bust "weapons" starting with Joey Harrington, and a raft of suck wrs. OTOH, using the Lions as an example, even if you have major "weapons"- like a qb that threw for damn near 5,000 yards, and arguably the best wr in football- Megatron, it doesn't mean squat if the rest of your team sucks. Those "weapons" netted the Lions one less win than the Browns.

and history proves me true and that's the facts ladies and gentleman

Well that has happened because our O-line and defense has sucked for most of those years.

@rich4eagle said:

I have heard here for a decade or more about how winning starts in the trenches and defense wins championships! WELL NEITHER IS TRUE! Winning starts with guys who touch the ball on offense and that is just what it is. Impact players who touch the ball. We passed on Roethlisberger for braindead Winslow. We passed on Adrian Peterson for why could we have been so dumb Joe Thomas. We passed on both A.J. Green and Julio Jones for Phil Traylor are u kidding me??????????????//

I hope Haslem and team understands what wins games.......because the management and ownership and fandom have been missing it for two decades at least

Score points it wins games and starts with a qb and players who touch the ball and score touchdowns.........otherwise you are just what we been for twenty years toast

and history proves me true and that's the facts ladies and gentleman

Since I rarely post anymore because these fundamental principles of winning have been peed on by our less than astute fandom over and over.........I just watch the futility of losers bent on redoing losing

Hopefully, Haslem gets it because our fans surely do not

Hmmm... Dallas??? Chicago??? Pittsburgh??? Carolina??? Sacrificed trench players over the year to focus on playmakers. Now, their only talent is the guys who touch the ball, and where are they??

On the other side of the coin, SanFran? Cincy? Minnesota? Built strong o-lines and front 7s on D. Where are they??

You can't just have weapons, you have to have players in the trenches... duh

@rich4eagle said:

I have heard here for a decade or more about how winning starts in the trenches and defense wins championships! WELL NEITHER IS TRUE! Winning starts with guys who touch the ball on offense and that is just what it is. Impact players who touch the ball. We passed on Roethlisberger for braindead Winslow. We passed on Adrian Peterson for why could we have been so dumb Joe Thomas. We passed on both A.J. Green and Julio Jones for Phil Traylor are u kidding me??????????????//

I hope Haslem and team understands what wins games.......because the management and ownership and fandom have been missing it for two decades at least

Score points it wins games and starts with a qb and players who touch the ball and score touchdowns.........otherwise you are just what we been for twenty years toast

and history proves me true and that's the facts ladies and gentleman

Since I rarely post anymore because these fundamental principles of winning have been peed on by our less than astute fandom over and over.........I just watch the futility of losers bent on redoing losing

Hopefully, Haslem gets it because our fans surely do not

Sure Rich I get it- I get why the Steelers missed the playoffs. BECAUSE THEIR OFFENSIVE LINE BLEW DEAD WORMS, AND GOT ROTLISBOOGER SHELVED WHEN THEY COULDN'T BLOCK YOUR GRANDMOTHER.

Incidentally, why did Peterson damn near break the rushing record? You want to tell me it wasn't in part because the Vikings drafted a stud LT?

Listen Rich- it doesn't matter how great a RB you have- if the OL can't open the holes, he's going to SUCK. You may not remember Kevin Mack having to help his OL along because they were getting stood up at the LOS, but I sure as hell do. Also doesn't matter how great a qb you have, he can't do diddly lying flat on his back, or running for his life. I haven't forgotten the Giants and LT made Joe Montana look like Joe Blow in a playoff game with a relentless pass rush.

If you don't think Manning loves having Clady protect his immobile blindside every game, you're still full of s**t. And it's still true- most of the very best OL get drafted high- and there's a reason for that. Sure, you can go dumpster diving for OL and occasionally get lucky- same can be said for running backs too. Like the Texans Arian Foster (undrafted) or Washington's Alfred Morris (6th round).

most sundays you'll find him at a stooler's sports bar sucking cock in the back room for draft beers.

@rich4eagle said:

I have heard here for a decade or more about how winning starts in the trenches and defense wins championships! WELL NEITHER IS TRUE! Winning starts with guys who touch the ball on offense and that is just what it is. Impact players who touch the ball. We passed on Roethlisberger for braindead Winslow. We passed on Adrian Peterson for why could we have been so dumb Joe Thomas. We passed on both A.J. Green and Julio Jones for Phil Traylor are u kidding me??????????????//

They didn't pass on Green. He was drafted before it was the Browns turn...and they probably would have taken him and not made the trade with ATL if he were there for them.

Also, they didn't just get Phil Taylor....they also got Greg Little AND Brandon Weeden. So they DID get the skill players out of that trade that you wanted. If it was just Phil Taylor they got...you would be right. But it wasn't.

I hope Haslem and team understands what wins games.......because the management and ownership and fandom have been missing it for two decades at least

Score points it wins games and starts with a qb and players who touch the ball and score touchdowns.........otherwise you are just what we been for twenty years toast

and history proves me true and that's the facts ladies and gentleman

Since I rarely post anymore because these fundamental principles of winning have been peed on by our less than astute fandom over and over.........I just watch the futility of losers bent on redoing losing

Hopefully, Haslem gets it because our fans surely do not

@rich4eagle said:

I have heard here for a decade or more about how winning starts in the trenches and defense wins championships! WELL NEITHER IS TRUE! Winning starts with guys who touch the ball on offense and that is just what it is. Impact players who touch the ball. We passed on Roethlisberger for braindead Winslow. We passed on Adrian Peterson for why could we have been so dumb Joe Thomas. We passed on both A.J. Green and Julio Jones for Phil Traylor are u kidding me??????????????//

I hope Haslem and team understands what wins games.......because the management and ownership and fandom have been missing it for two decades at least

Score points it wins games and starts with a qb and players who touch the ball and score touchdowns.........otherwise you are just what we been for twenty years toast

and history proves me true and that's the facts ladies and gentleman

Since I rarely post anymore because these fundamental principles of winning have been peed on by our less than astute fandom over and over.........I just watch the futility of losers bent on redoing losing

Hopefully, Haslem gets it because our fans surely do not

I'll ignore most of your rant. But you have been reminded about 1,000 times now that the Browns clearly didn't pass on AJ Green as he was drafted by the Bengals BEFORE the Browns had a chance to make a pick. And hindsight is always 20/20. There are just as many offensive players picked early on that sucked a big one.

Archie Manning was an outstanding qb. But, he didn't have the surrounding cast. And he got his ass kicked, chased, smashed,

and pretty much had a tough career. Which led to him adamantly wanting Eli to not go to the wrong team.

Your big stupid ben, had he gone with to the Browns, would have had his career shortened with injuries,

But, alas, Big Stupid Ugly Ben went to a winning program with a solid offense, and more solid defense.

The Redskins won their game after RGIII was hurt toward the end of the game.

The backup came in, and the rolling offense still rolled.

Bradshaw was a great qb, too. Except he and the squeelers were terrible, and Bradshaw felt he was

booed nearly right out of town.

But you know that. You just want to show up to brag about your steelers.

bah humbug.