@vagitron said:

Well, that is what I heard as well, but then I heard others contradict that. So the "experts can't agree", so how can we layman tell?

Answer: we don't have to. We just sit back and figure it out a few years later.

And one teams "deep draft" may be another teams piece of garbage draft.

Take for instance the 1974 draft. A real suck job of a draft, right? Yes, if you were a Browns fan. You got the privilege of seeing these names called:

Billy Corbett, Mark Ilgenfritz, Billy Pritchett, Bob Herrick, Gerry Sullivan, Don Scott, Mike Peustow, Tom Gooden, Ron McNeil, Mike Seifert, Bob Hunt, Ransom Terrell, Preston Anderson, Carlton Buchanan.

A bunch of freaking household names? Hardly.

But, if you were a Steeler fan, lets see, you got to hear the names of Lynn Swann, Jack Lambert, John Stallworth, Mike Webster.

Ya follow my point? One guys deep draft is another guys deep pile of shit.

@vagitron said:

Then your a fucking idiot to believe that there are actually two scouts on your board.

@the-gipper said:

It was a deep draft and there are at least two scouts on my primary steeler board that preached it all offseason.

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

The nightmare all of us will have in the coming months is Shamarko Thomas, the tough S the Steelers took in the trade with the Browns, intercepting a Weeden pass in the final minute as the Browns drive for the winning TD. You just know it's going to happen!

@harry-buffalo said:

I think it is impossible for a layman to say "this draft is really deep with talent, or that draft is top heavy in the first round but light in talent after that, or like this year they have said "this draft does not have a lot of up front talent but is deep in the later round".

I mean, who the hell really knows

Sometimes you cannot tell until years and years later.

If you saw that ESPN show on the "Elway to Marino" draft, 1983 had like 6-8 Hall of Famers just in that first round.

Next years draft is going to be much better talent wise, I think we wisely taded those picks. I undestand people have a different opinion on the matter, but I would ather have those picks to either use as ammo to move up in a draft with much more talent, or to take a player with better skill or potential one whole round sooner where we would have used them this year.

Skeptical2013 said:

A number of experts said that after the first round this was one of the deepest drafts in years. And I agree.

As do I. I think we'll see a number of third and even fourth round guys start at some point this season.

@harry-buffalo said:

A number of experts said that after the first round this was one of the deepest drafts in years. And I agree.

@gftchris said:

Yep, that's the interesting thing, and how we will ultimately judge this draft. If we end up with pro bowlers from the third/fourth rounds here that we passed on then yes we can criticise Lombardi. But on the other hand if we get pro bowlers out of next year's picks, or even bundle them up to move up for a Teddy Twatwater or someone then yes, we can say he did well.

What you said in your last sentence is IMO the exact reason they made those two trades. If they don't like the progression that Weeden makes in year two, they will have two more picks that they can package together to try and move up ( possibly all the way up to the #1pick) and get THEIR QB. And if that's not what happens, well we get a 3rd from a 4th and a 4th from a 5th......WIN WIN either way for us. Most people are just disappointed that we didn't try and fill every hole or need this year with a 4th and 5th round guys. Its a no brainer for me.....I dig it

Skeptical2013 said:

If you watch Jones on the field he is anything but slow. Ignore that 40 time at the combine. What's bad about Jones is that he was AWOL in a number of Georgia games and he's not going to be able to block effectively due to his build.

Its probably a good thing that a DE/OLB doesn't ever have to block lol

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

A brief recap of this argument, as its being played out in multiple threads:

Tim Couch Pulls Out: This draft sucked, we could have done better. Mingo is Vernon Gholston 2.0 and our best pick was a 3rd round CB who we could have gotten in the 4th or maybe even 5th. We could have traded back, still got Mingo, added a second round pick, and added a FS or G that would instantly start for us. Way to fuck up, Lombardi.

Everyone else: YOU ARE WRONG AND SO ARE THE ANALYSTS. YOU'LL SEE, YOU'LL ALL SEE. MINGO PLAYED IN THE SEC, DUH. PEOPLE JUST HATE THE BROWNS BECAUSE THEY AREN'T THE STEELERS IT'S NOT FAIR

Miktoxic: While this draft wasn't all bad, it could have been better. I think some of our draft picks have upside, but we'll see.

Everyone else: FUCK YOU, WHO DID YOU WANT GENO SMITH?! YOU DON'T KNOW SHIT ABOUT DICK! SEC FOOTBALL RULZ AND MINGO HAS THE WORD BARK IN HIS NAME I ALREADY ORDERED HIS JERSEY

BSipeBomber: Here is an article that explains how the Browns fumbled a trade back scenario that could have improved their draft.

Everybody else: THE BROWNS ARE GENIUSES FUCK YOU WE HAD THE BEST DRAFT OF HISTORY

PoeticG: Trent Richardson

Gipper: I'm sorry but you are wrong and here is why- I don't agree with you.

PoeticG: Honey Badger

Everybody else: FUCK TYRANN MATHIEU PUR 7th ROUND PICK WILL BE AN ALL PRO

That was some good shit right there TCPO LMAO!!........

The thing that put it over the top was PoG Trent Richardson

Skeptical2013 said:

I think this year was a record low for trading for future draft picks, not because teams didn't want to give up their picks this year for pick next year, but because teams we not willing to give next years picks in order to pick again this year. This year was a historically TERRBLE draft class. Light on the first round, deep in the 2nd and 3rd, and then dropped way off in the 4th-7th. Why pick the guys we did in the 6th and 7th then? Well for one we were lucky to trade for the picks that we did get. Secondly we grabbed a guy with 2nd/3rd round value (the actual good talent value section of this years draft) who fell because of injury, then we pick two boom or bust Div II prospects. So we actually managed to make good value on our last three picks.

This whole Lombardi sceeming to make himself look better shit is old. He's good, he's not good. Fuck it. Won't know until we see what the guys can do on the field. I would be listening to the same shit if he (and by he I mean him and fucking Banner cause no one seems to remember he holds equal share in making decisions) had traded down in the 1st and didn't trade our 4th and 5th round picks. Everyone would be bitching about how he let their personal favorite 1st round slip away, and how he picks who they didn't want in the 2nd, 4th, and 5th.

Skeptical2013 said:

Yep, that's the interesting thing, and how we will ultimately judge this draft. If we end up with pro bowlers from the third/fourth rounds here that we passed on then yes we can criticise Lombardi. But on the other hand if we get pro bowlers out of next year's picks, or even bundle them up to move up for a Teddy Twatwater or someone then yes, we can say he did well.

@gftchris said:

It's interesting that Lombardi's "long term view" and belief this draft wasn't so hot is an opinion not shared by most of the good teams inthe league, such as the Steelers, Ravens, Begnals and 49ers. I guess Lombardi thinks he is smarter than all the GMs of those top franchises. Not! All that happened to the Browns this off season is that their talent level fell even further behind the top teams in the league. It's quite sad.

@86collins said:

Milliner is going to be a good NFL player. We are unsure about Mingo Wingo. But are stats always a key factor? Maybe not. Tehre are several top quality NFL DEs who didn't put up big stats in college and the reverse is true, too. Jarvis Jones led the nation in sacks last year, but I predict he won't turn out to be a first round quality player in the NFL.

Zombo said:

As if any more incentive was needed

Zombo

@the-gipper said:

The optimist in me says if you can get a higher round pick for a lower round pick, then obviously do it. Trading the 14th pick in the 4th round (after bess trade) for the steelers' 3rd rounder next year, which will most likely be middling again, plus then a 5th rounder for the colts' 4th rounder next year, we're basically turning a 5th rounder in to a 3rd rounder.

The cynic in me is saying that Banner/Lombardi are basically going to say 'don't judge us until after next season when we have 10+ of our guys in the team' - basically taking advantage of the eternal optimism and loyalty of browns fans everywhere in order to get a free year.

It's basically impossible to judge them on talent evaluation this year; unless Mingo is a complete bust, everything will more or less work out as expected. McFadden will be solid if unspectacular and maybe one or two of the 6/7 round guys will contribute. If McFadden plays at pro bowl level, or the late picks actually contribute, like Billy Winn, we can have cause for optimism. Until then, it's just too early to comment.

Booms-Why in the fourth round did you not take one of the players you had in for a visit?
Lombardi-Just because we have them in for a visit doesn't mean we deem the value of that player at a pick. 
Booms-Well why do you have them in come in for a meeting then? 
Lombardi- To see if they are a pick, look we are not a college here trying to recruit guys to our team.

I'm not a Lombardi fan in the slightest, but he sure handled himself well in front of these two clowns.

Well.....maybe. Maybe you can get something better a year from now than what you can get now. Maybe the "right fit" was not there. Maybe you are taking the long term view. Maybe you are just bullshitting us and yourselve with those arguments...which sound disingenuous.

@badnewsbrowns said:

Kelce and maybe Commings the only two I'm OK with. J. Jones and Mathieu will be underwhelming on defense (Tyrann may be a good punt returner) and B. Jones will be mediocre. Kelce is a guy the Browns should have gone after -- he's going to be a good one.

@the-gipper said:

I was on board with taking Barret Jones when it was the Browns turn....but, they traded the pick. Again, why these trades? So that Lombardi could have his own hand picked staff work on these and not the guys he inherited?

(If that is the case, that simply tells me that he himself is NOT up to par on the talent that was out there available in this draft....that he didn't trust his current scouting staff with any picks other than 6th/7th rounders and that he did NO work beyond the first round or three to acquaint himself with the available talent.

Then WTF has he been doing since he was hired....and the years before that when his media job was to evaluate talent? Sipping Maitais on a beach? Likely.

Exactly right.

Lombardi delegates his job to his scouting team and does nothing himself. He's a talking head and nothing more.

While I hate the trades, I am kind of happy they decided to put their faith in next years scouts rather than in Lombardi's scouting.

@badnewsbrowns said:

I was on board with taking Barret Jones when it was the Browns turn....but, they traded the pick. Again, why these trades? So that Lombardi could have his own hand picked staff work on these and not the guys he inherited?

(If that is the case, that simply tells me that he himself is NOT up to par on the talent that was out there available in this draft....that he didn't trust his current scouting staff with any picks other than 6th/7th rounders and that he did NO work beyond the first round or three to acquaint himself with the available talent.

Then WTF has he been doing since he was hired....and the years before that when his media job was to evaluate talent? Sipping Maitais on a beach? Likely.