Thanks for the reply man. Part of me wants to downvote Manziel because he's small and his arm isn't spectacular but he just keeps proving people wrong. We'll see how he does this year but I'm sure some team is going to fall in love with him. As far as your west coast QBs, I'm not a fan of the UCLA kid, I don't think his arm is big enough. Who else were you thinking of?

And if you are wrong, you must change your screen name to turd swallower (or maybe Z should just do it for you now) Open wide.

LOL! I think Haden is a good player. Ward is an athlete who is a hard hitter but can't cover anybody. McFadden is really going to struggle as a rookie and against big receivers, Te free safety is just OK, and not the difference maker threat like Ed Reed in his prime you'd like to see back there. But the biggest problem of all is lack of depth. If anybody gets hurt --and they will -- there is nothing, and I mean nothing of quality to back them up. It's like an army whose front line troops get depleted and the reserves are old men and women incapable of holding the line. Some games will reall ybe ugly again for the Browns and their fans as the opposition hits on big plays and wins games as a result. Despite a better pas rush, it'll be more of the same.

The point is: the opposition offensive coordinator knows Horton will be aggresive with the pass rush. Other offensive coordinators are not dumb -- they will counter that with their own moves, taking advantage of Browns weaknesses in the secondary and against the run. Game, set, match.

Hopefully, after all this happens, they will use the 2014 draft and FA period to add QUALITY depth in the secondary and at the ILB position, too.

How do you feel about the Browns secondary?

Zombo

--we're not quite sure

Meanwhile, the QBs and receivers of other teams will destroy the Browns and their weak secondary, maybe the worst in the NFL.

Won't be picking anywhere near top ten next year, Probably around 20. I'm changing my preseason prediction from 7-9 to 9-7. Weeden pulls head out of ass, and with an outstanding O line, Richardson Little and Gordon destroy defenses

if weeden fails this year you better believe we take a QB.

and it will be the do or die pick of mike lombardi's 2nd tenure in cleveland.

If you think Gipson has stronger skills and athleticism than Vaccaro and Elam then, truly, you spend most of your day intaking some very strong substances. Gipson was the 21st rated safety in the 2012 draft. He's not a bad player, would make a nice backup player, but not a top flight starter on a team that wants to have an elite defense

Again, you are just going by somebodies ranking...and not by performance of production. Based on his performance/production this past season, if he has been put back into the 2013 draft, he very well may have been a 2d or 3rd round draft pick.

ALL you are looking at is the fact that he was a UDFA the year before. THAT is your complete basis for your opinion.

Might Elam and Vaccaro turn out better than Gipson? Sure.

But where did Elam and Vaccaro even come into this conversation? Those guys were first round picks. The Browns had already taken Mingo....and by the time their next turn came up...in the third round....or the 4th/5th rounders that were traded Elam and Vaccaro were long off the board.

Your real question should be: Is Gipson as good or better than someone the Browns could have taken in the 4th or 5th round....and the answer very well may be YES.

Is Gipson better than Shamarko Thomas or Baccari Rambo...again, that answer very well may be YES

Browns just got two top line LBs? Many say Kruger and Mingo are both highly overrated. I think the answer is in the middle between them and your overblown euphoria. Neither is going to make the big impact in 2013 that you expect, although both should have some quality moments. .

The point is, the Browns HAVE invested heavily now in the LB corps.....so logic dictates that that position will probably NOT be a high priority for them in next year's draft. Though, I suspect that logic never comes into the conversations you have with yourself.

Also, Josh Gordon is no Jerry Rice,

Well, who is? Nevertheless, Gordon could be a fine Pro Bowl caliber WR for a long time. The potential is there. If you don't see that, you are a fool.

Brandon Weeden is no Brett Favre

No, but he could also possibly end up being of Pro Bowl caliber. You have NO clue about that any more than I do. Sniffing celebrity jocks doesn't give you any insight into talent.

and McFadden is no Revis.

No one knew that Revis was going to be Revis til he played a few years. And Revis is no longer Revis after his surgeries. That doesn't mean McFadden may not be a find. (besides...I said he could be Defensive rookie of the year candidate...not Darrell Revis.

There is reality and then there is your view of the Cleveland Browns.

More like: there is reality, and then their is my view of the Cleveland Browns and then there is your view of the Cleveland Browns. If Earth is reality, then maybe I am on Mars, but you are on Pluto.

The facts are that the Browns will be an improved team in 2013 but Lombardi really blew it in this draft letting their competition in the tough AFC Central put more distance between themselves and the Browns by taking advantage of a strong lower round talent pool they perceived in the draft while Lombadi's opinion of the talent pool was totally opposite his counterparts at Pittsburgh, Cincy and Baltimore.

Maybe true, maybe not. That all remains to be seen. And unless your name if fucking Nostradamus you have no clue what the future will be or how this move will turn out.

Now I wonder who has the better track record in evaluating talent? Lombardi or the GMs at Pitts., Cincy and Baltimore.

The only intelligent thing you have said in a month. Yea, the track record for those others is far better than Lombardi's, no argument.

But, there is always hope.

I live in reality. Clearly you live in a Turman Show like world with Mr. Lombardi and his belief that hoarding those two draft picks is going to get him a shot at Terry Bridgewater. It's all science ficiton!!!.

You live in the land of celebrity jock sniffing...and the land of what YOU want and what YOU think....and no one cares to visit you there.

And what I believe that Lombardi wanted was the chance to allow HIS people to be involved in the selecting of those future draft choices because he didn't want to leave those choices to his predecessor's crew.

It was an ego thing really. And yes, it can be viewed as untrustworthy. I doubt it had anything to do with Bridgewater

I don't think the Browns take a QB

Skeptical2013 said:

Right on target. Browns need to substantially upgrade the talent level in the secondary. Gipson is a throwaway safety and it would have been nice to have made that trade with te Rams and then select a top drawer free safety like Elam. Vaccaro sure would have looked good in the secondary. If the Browns can solidify that secondary they could have one of the best defenses in pro football.

You are just being a big name jock sniffer. Gipson very possibly may turn out to be a better FS than either of the "names" you mention. He played well after being put in there, and there is great room for improvement.

You are just looking for a name to root for....not a player who can perform.

Incredibly stupid and puzzling they gave away those 4th and 5th round picks.

Browns fans are tired of these long range plans and I guess a fan blastedLombardi about that the other night in Canton where he spoke.

No, not Browns fans....just YOU, idjit. They didn't give them away, they improved them.

I expect Clowney to be the #1 pick if he is healthy and has a good 2013 college season because he's one of the best players I've ever seen at the college level, a man among boys in the SEC, and all the pro teams know he is going to be a huge force in the NFL. Browns big needs in the next draft: QB, FS, CB, WR, LB. I think the OL will be pretty set. I hope Weeden pans out because maybe they'll go get Lee from USC who I think is going to be a star. Browns don't really have a star game-breaker at WR.

I can only conclude that you are A. not paying any attention or B. stuck in a time warp.

Weeden may be All Pro and throw for 40 TDs, Gipson may make the Pro Bowl, McFadden could be defensive rookie of the year. Josh Gordon may become the next best thing to Jerry Rice. We just got 2 top line LBs.

You really need to see the Wizard to get yourself a brain. Why don't we wait until they actually play this season until we start talking about what they need in next years draft.

I think Manziel caught a lot of people by surprise last and he put on some of the greatest performances I've ever seen by a college QB. But this year might be different as teams now know what he can do and will be better prepeared when they face him. My gut tellls me Manziel won't be as good this year because his supporting cast won't be as good.

Right on target. Browns need to substantially upgrade the talent level in the secondary. Gipson is a throwaway safety and it would have been nice to have made that trade with te Rams and then select a top drawer free safety like Elam. Vaccaro sure would have looked good in the secondary. If the Browns can solidify that secondary they could have one of the best defenses in pro football.

You are just being a big name jock sniffer. Gipson very possibly may turn out to be a better FS than either of the "names" you mention. He played well after being put in there, and there is great room for improvement.

You are just looking for a name to root for....not a player who can perform.

Incredibly stupid and puzzling they gave away those 4th and 5th round picks.

Browns fans are tired of these long range plans and I guess a fan blastedLombardi about that the other night in Canton where he spoke.

No, not Browns fans....just YOU, idjit. They didn't give them away, they improved them.

I expect Clowney to be the #1 pick if he is healthy and has a good 2013 college season because he's one of the best players I've ever seen at the college level, a man among boys in the SEC, and all the pro teams know he is going to be a huge force in the NFL. Browns big needs in the next draft: QB, FS, CB, WR, LB. I think the OL will be pretty set. I hope Weeden pans out because maybe they'll go get Lee from USC who I think is going to be a star. Browns don't really have a star game-breaker at WR.

I can only conclude that you are A. not paying any attention or B. stuck in a time warp.

Weeden may be All Pro and throw for 40 TDs, Gipson may make the Pro Bowl, McFadden could be defensive rookie of the year. Josh Gordon may become the next best thing to Jerry Rice. We just got 2 top line LBs.

You really need to see the Wizard to get yourself a brain. Why don't we wait until they actually play this season until we start talking about what they need in next years draft.

yeah let's see how johnny football does this season now that every D coordinator out there will know how to scheme against him. he's a hybrid jeff garcia/colt mccoy. no thanks.

clowney might be some monster beast DE/LB but we just spent this whole off season and the draft (this year) taking care of those positions.

when are we going to pull the trigger on a balls to the wall CB or S with our first pick, which is what we've needed to address the last 3 years?

Thanks for the reply man. Part of me wants to downvote Manziel because he's small and his arm isn't spectacular but he just keeps proving people wrong. We'll see how he does this year but I'm sure some team is going to fall in love with him. As far as your west coast QBs, I'm not a fan of the UCLA kid, I don't think his arm is big enough. Who else were you thinking of?

I've seen a lot of Boyd's games -- very erratic for awhile but pretty good QB now that he has gained more experience and he is an intelligent and determined guy, too. Good leader from what I have seen and heard. Might be worth a shot . I would stay away from Manziel. I don't think he'll be a great pro QB. Bridgewater, on the other hand, has a chance to be a really good one. But there are some other QBs -- two from the west coast in particular -- who may be first round worthy that the Browns may be interested in.

Bottom line: the top two QBs will be gone by the time the Browns draft. and Lombardi will be seen distraught in the draft room because he'll still have those two extra draft picks that should have been cashed in for the 2013 season.

But the best player in the 2014 draft -- by far -- is Clowney, who reminds me a lot of the kind of once in a generation talent that Lawrence Taylor was. If he stays healthy, he's a sure fire future HOFer in my opinion.

Browns need to figure out how to get a quality free safety and tight end in the draft next year. And I'd sure love to see a premier receiver like Lee in that lineup.