Skeptical2013 said:

Yes, and that offense had Anquan Boldin doing the heavy lifting. What were his playoff stats? Smith and Jone will not have the opposing defenses paying attention to the monster that was Boldin. They will have to stand on their own. Maybe they can, maybe they can't.

Speed alone doesn't make a great receiver.....see Boldin, not the fastest guy.

David Heyward-Bey would be the shit if that were so.

And Ronaldo Nehemiah would not have been a bust.

I am not saying that Smith and Jones won't be good....just that they will be much more tested....and will have to pass that test against much more difficult odds.

(one of those being the vast improved Cleveland Browns defensive backfield

@the-gipper said:

In the 2012 playoffs, Smith had 11 catches for a 21.2 average and caught 49 during the regular season good for 8TDs. in 2011,

he had 50 catches and 7 TDs. He'll have a good season in 2013. Smith is a little faster than Gordon.

Skeptical2013 said:

It is always a question with these guys: how good are these #2 WR guys when the #1 guy leaves.

The Ravens lost Anquan Boldin...the heart and soul of that WR corps. How good will Smith and Jones be now that they have to step up.

Ask Steeler fans.....after Hines Ward retired it is their claim that Mike Wallace definitely shrank in stature and productivity. And several of them who post here say they were not sorry to see him go to greener pastures.

Smith and Jones can look good when they are not the focus of the defense....but what about now?

Sure, on paper it seems like they ought to become the team's star.....but that is paper.

Skeptical2013 said:

Josh Gordon 40 time prior to the Supplemental Draft: 4.52

Torey Smith 40 yard time athe Combine: 4.43.

Now, Gordon is probably better than 4.52 but he is not as fast as Smith. Lack of top line speed may hurt Gordon's ability to become a big time receiver. We'll see.

@runyon27 said:

Jacoby Jones made the pro bowl squad last year and became the first player in SB history to both run back a kick for a TD and to catch a receiving TD. That's quite an accomplishment in the Big Game as the guy showed he can get it done with the most on the line. Does Josh Gordon have this kind of accomplishment on his resume? Ah, no. Right now Jones is the better receiver. Maybe in a year or two Gordon will be better, but Gordon needs to run patterns better and work on his separation from DBs. Gordon lacks elite speed. That hurts him.

@shep said:

That 12 formation sounds like a wonderful idea for Nelson. Terry Pluto said Bess looked fanatstic at practice. Over time, the Browns will have to find a way to get Chris Faulk in the lineup on the OL, maybe at guard.

@unsympathetic said:

Yes, players look great out there in their shorts this time of the year -- no contact, nothing rally on the line. I do hope Sheard makes it. He's got some game in my view.

@unsympathetic said:

uh, yeah....what???

your opinions are valid and you are a browns fan.....i think?!?

so how are you a troll???

Bademosi is now at FS behind Gipson.. but Horton's quote about that "It’s athletic men playing. We are trying to let athletic men find a place to play" makes more sense. The best 4 DB's will play = that's awesome

I'm glad to hear that Sheard is doing great at OLB in Horton's scheme.

1. John Greco was the "secret superstar" of the Browns, 5th rated run blocking guard in the league, per Football Outsiders. That's why he's getting a good look at RG.

2. Watch for some "12" formations (like New England) with David Nelson as the other slot TE opposite Jordan Cameron (Little and Gordon outside). Serious matchup nightmares.

3. Davone Bess was a simply brilliant pickup. The dependable slot receiver is a staple of a lot of terrific teams. I swear, if he were white and played at Texas Tech, he'd be a very rich man right now!!

4. That predictable, old school WCO was really ugly. Eager to see two great offensive minds come together as CHORV. Should be fun, if nothing else. We will be chucking the rock.

Skeptical2013 said:

Well I could care less about making a player list. Its fun to talk about but not necessarily accurate. For example, Jones has been in the league a long time and played against most teams and played for the SB champ. Gordon is a rookie, by most accounts the best rookie WR last yr and played on a bad team. Yet his rookie year is better than anything Jacoby Jones has put up in his career for the most part. So not accurate. I agree the Green and Smith are better, they also have an extra yr under their belt. Green is already one of the top WRs in the NFL so not sure Gordon will match that, but he should improve this season. Jacoby Jones isn't better than Gordon.

@unsympathetic said:

I have my opinions, but enjoy reading others, too. Gordon is not as good as Torey Smith of Baltimore right now, in my opinion, and the players, according to the NFL network top 100, rate Jacoby Jones one of the best in pro football (ranked #83 best NFL player according to the vote by the players). So far they have unveiled players 60-100 on the top 100 so we will see if Gordon makes the list. I doubt it at this point. Chance for Smith to make it.

Gordon has potential but as we enter the 2013 season I see Green, Smith and Jones ahead of him and Sanders and Brown in Pittsburgh are about even with him. Maybe he can achieve some separation from them (pun intended) in 2013! It would help Gordon if his QB improves!

@unsympathetic said:

My prediction: Little's dropsy problem will re-surface more than people think in 2013.

@unsympathetic said:

Fair enough, I'll go with that. Less than 6 and we can call it a day on the drops count. Just make sure they're not touchdown-missing, game-losing drops, eh, Josh?

@gftchris said:

Set realistic expectations.. that's neither possible nor probable because not every stat will have a baseline of zero. Gordon had 5 last year even with limited playing time the first 6 wks of the year, Torrey Smith had 4 for the ratbirds. I'd say 4,5 for Little would be reasonable.

I don't want to see Marecic with 4 dropped passes again.. he should have 0 because he shouldn't get playing time.

@unsympathetic said:

OK good, that's what I thought. Almost had to crack some metaphorical internet based skulls.

Although I'm not convinced Little's drops are behind him - a whole season of only dropping 2-3 passes and maybe we're beyond it, but for now it's difficult to say 100% it's dealt with.

But f*** me, I'm excited to see this team this year - a winning record isn't out of reach. Then Playoffs in 2014, and Superbowl winners by about 2017! Woo!

Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.

Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.

*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.

Skeptical2013 said:

Sorry - what Browns fans exactly are down on Richardson? OK, his YPC wasn't exactly electric last season, but the guy still scored 12 touchdowns. Who else on our team got near that?

@thenew23 said:

Very good point. Interesting that while some Browns fans are down on Richardson, his peers the players named him the 71st best player in the NFL for 2013 -- they see his outstanding potential if he can be healthy.

@lavachebeadsman said:

Well written piece, Davis. But as you see my name is "Skeptical" and I am skeptical about some of your assumptions.

To begin, I'm not sold on Cameron as an every down starting TE in the NFL. As I have noted, the Browns made a serious strategic mistake not adding a quality TE (no, I don't think TE FA adds Davis and Bandridge are quality players) in the FA market or through the draft. If the Browns had made that alleged deal with the Rams and moved down in round 1 while addingmore draft picks, TE would have been a priority for me in rounds 1 through 3. I think a quality TE would help Weeden immeasurably, but he won't have that luxury in 2013, in my opinion, and that inhibits his potential.

Re Weeden, you did note in your article that Turner and Chud have had some dud years mixed with good years. I think the answer in Cleveland this year will be somewhere in the middle -- Browns will see improvement on offense but not as much as one would hope for. I do think Weeden can be more accurate and better overall in 2013, but the new offense puts an even greater premium on accuracy due to the greater difficulty of the throws. Is Weeden up to that task? That's a big question mark, but it's possible he may pass the test. But then, again, maybe not.

One thing for sure: the play calling will be much, much better. Shurmur was flat out terrible. I'm still perplexed by Chip Kelly's decision to hire him as offensive coordinator Good luck with that! The key question re the play calling is not the play selection itself, but can the Browns players execute. The receivers are still learning (we forget how few games Little and Gordon played in college) , the TE situation is mediocre, the QB's ability to diagnose and respond quickly and throw accuratelyremains a big question mark, and I'm also worried about the guard play.

At receiver, I expect Gordon and Little to make progress this coming season. But both need to learn how to run routes better. Overall, I'm not sure Little has the kind of separation ability to take him to a higher plateau and make him a top NFL receiver. I also worry that we may see Little have another bout of the dropsies at some juncture this coming season. I think Gordon has a lot of talent, but I worry that he lacks the top line speed to become one of the best in the NFL. Jury still out on that one. Nelson and Bess are fine additons, though, and I hope Nelson can get healthy and contribute. That will really help Weeden.

Overall, from a fantasy standpoint, Browns offense is a high risk-high reward kind of pick.

You didn't talk defense, but while a lot of people think the Browns defense is going to be a lot better -- and the front 7 is better via the pass, but not run -- I fear the weak secondary will collapse and snatch defeat from the jaws of victory on many a Sunday. I just read one article that noted McFadden had a lot of difficulty covering big receivers in college. Well, there are a lot of good, big #2 receivers in the NFL. Could be a long season for McFadden. Browns also missed a big opportunity via the draft to add quality depth in the secondary. The one guy they picked up -- Owens -- is a stiff, in my view. Another CB they picked up in FA, Barnes, has already been released.

With the defense on its heels a lot, there will be more pressure on Weeden and that offense to score and, thus, they will throw away plans for a balanced offense and that spells disaster for Weeden. I see 5-11 for Cleveland and hope they are positioned to take a top qualty QB, top receiver and TE in the 2014 draft (or add somebody good in FA).

What about Trent Richardson????

How can you write a fantasy FB article about the Browns' offense without mentioning its best player?