@solon16 said:

I don't disagree with that thinking. But that QB on D (MLB) doesn't always have to be a beast or a thumper. Anymore, the FS is starting to look like that huge key piece on D in the NFL.

@solon16 said:

I think you see my point though. You don't have to have that "dominant" ILB in the 3-4. To be honest, there is probably all of 3 dominant ILB/MLB in the NFL today any way. As you said elsewhere, CLE hasn't had a MLB/ILB really hold his weight since Holmes. I'd take a guy who can do what he did, and that can be found in FA.

@solon16 said:

Also to JD....English is a LATE first rounder and may even make it to second round after being beaten by Oher most of the senior Bowl....no way on God's green earth is he a top 10ner IMO>

we say it's easier to get an ILB than a pass rusher because there's been one instance of a dominant pass rusher hitting the market in the prime of his career and that's reggie white. it doesn't help that there's an absolute dearth of pass rushing talent available this year.

i included english and sintim in the event that the FO is planning a trade down and targeting them with the idea of getting a pass rusher and also stockpiling picks, not with the idea that we'd take either at five.

@earl34 said:

That's an understatement. He was horrible (though he looked better in other games that I watched).

Masters said:

Man I wish Mays was coming out of USC this year While not a LB, he will be a force like Troy P and Reed in the NFL

as to Pitt Farrior and foote are KA together Not a singletary, but together are the best in football. Mayo and Bruchi are very close...I don't follow the chargers but as I recall they got Gashed inside on the run all year...jets have Harris whom I wanted badly...Miami is a mystery to me!

Also to JD....English is a LATE first rounder and may even make it to second round after being beaten by Oher most of the senior Bowl....no way on God's green earth is he a top 10ner IMO>

@solon16 said:

Last year you made the call on Mayo and from the combine until draft day his value really jumped. I would imagine that once we see the combine workouts and the pro days our opinions may very well change. Our needs may also depend on what happens in FA.

I still say that if Curry and Crabtree are gone we will have suiters for a trade because Sanchez will rock their socks at the combine and at his pro day. I am not a draft for need type guy, but I say it may be easier to fill the ILB position in FA then find a pass rusher.

I also believe that Everette Brown and Raji's stock will skyrocket after the combine and their pro days.

If we don't get a Crowder or Scott in FA then it just might be Curry or how far do you trade down. This is a very deep LB draft and an additional 2nd rounder may be better then a reach in the first round.

scott will want to prove himself. he might be ed hartwell, but he might also have actual talent. it's a crapshoot at best. there's also channing crowder from miami who could start for us.

however, there's likely to be no pass rushing threat available in free agency, something that the FO will consider when putting together their draft board. there's no way suggs gets out of baltimore, and, as much as i'd like julius peppers, it's possible he'd be a bad fit in the 3-4 (i personally don't think so) or that he's just using wanting tot leave as a ploy to make more money. therefore, with ILBs available in FA but no pass rushers, i think the FO will look heavily at everette brown, orakpo, larry english and clint sintim as possibilities for us in the first in addition to rey and curry, with OLB being a likelier pick because there are fewer options for us to pick up free agents at the position.

@solon16 said:

I'd still say who is the dominant ILB for PIT, NE, SD, Jets, or MIA (with PIT being #1 against the run)? They all do not have a guy I'd call dominant.

Man I wish Mays was coming out of USC this year While not a LB, he will be a force like Troy P and Reed in the NFL

@solon16 said:

I'd find Jenkins value more, if he could convert to saftey. Especially if CLE loses Jones, which I think they will

@ytownbrownsbacker said:

I would rather try to grab the best LB I could get through FA and then take the best player available.

I agree with those above that think Rey is a reach with the #5 pick as is every other defensive player except Curry, at this point before the combine and pro days anyway.

If Curry is gone then we will be kicking ourselves that we didn't go hard after a Bart Scott or Crowder.

IMO once you get past Curry then the best defensive players are Jenkins, Everette Brown and Raji. And, they are all need reaches at #5.

Fill your needs in FA and take the best players available in the draft.

AS you say...all are reaches at 5. We have to stop the RUN...we have a dominant NT....give me a dominant ILB behind him and we stop the run!!!

@solon16 said:

P.S. Rey M will be and is a three down Linebacker.

I didn't miss it. Strictly value, Troy P was worth better. Rey still isn't. Five years from now it may come to fruition that he was worth better than where he was picked. But I sure won't count on that. If we want to go by that, I can find you guys every year who were drafted much higher than what their value ended up. The only things Troy and Rey have in comon now is the Samoan thing and USC.

Funny, scouts all over seem to disagree with you on that. Not to mention that in just about every 3-4, the guy playing SILB is the one that goes to the sidelines in Nickle and dime packages.

I would rather try to grab the best LB I could get through FA and then take the best player available.

I agree with those above that think Rey is a reach with the #5 pick as is every other defensive player except Curry, at this point before the combine and pro days anyway.

If Curry is gone then we will be kicking ourselves that we didn't go hard after a Bart Scott or Crowder.

IMO once you get past Curry then the best defensive players are Jenkins, Everette Brown and Raji. And, they are all need reaches at #5.

Fill your needs in FA and take the best players available in the draft.

Masters said:

Comparing Troy P to Rey is not apples to apples. We are talking two different positions, including one where the player is there 3 downs and one where the other guy will likely be 2 downs. Then throw in trying to to talk about hindsight about a player w/ success in the NFL vs. a guy who hasn't played a down in the NFL. You are comparing apples and bananas here.

I'd love to see CLE have a dominant ILB as much as the next guy. But not to the point of throwing caution to the wind to go after a guy just cause I'd want that dream, and have to cross my fingers that he's that. Especially since one of the scouting knocks on Rey is that he misses easy tackles and gets himself out of position trying to just hit. I'd be just as happy having ILB that perform like Foote and Farrior of PIT, Mayo and Bruschi of NE, Cooper and Dobbins of SD, or Harris and Barton of the Jets all performed this season.

Guess you missed the last sentence......Strickly a value arguement....

P.S. Rey M will be and is a three down Linebacker.

@solon16 said:

Well, I'd actually say he was the 2nd best LB on USC corps. He is better than Clay Jr. But I don't think better than Cushing.

Comparing Troy P to Rey is not apples to apples. We are talking two different positions, including one where the player is there 3 downs and one where the other guy will likely be 2 downs. Then throw in trying to to talk about hindsight about a player w/ success in the NFL vs. a guy who hasn't played a down in the NFL. You are comparing apples and bananas here.

I'd love to see CLE have a dominant ILB as much as the next guy. But not to the point of throwing caution to the wind to go after a guy just cause I'd want that dream, and have to cross my fingers that he's that. Especially since one of the scouting knocks on Rey is that he misses easy tackles and gets himself out of position trying to just hit. I'd be just as happy having ILB that perform like Foote and Farrior of PIT, Mayo and Bruschi of NE, Cooper and Dobbins of SD, or Harris and Barton of the Jets all performed this season.

Masters said:

You've made it abundantly clear that you think rey is third best LB on USC's corp. I disagree. And revert back to the Browns not having any better than good ILb's in my lifetime. Value is relative...for example looking back at Troy palamalu....his value ended up being #16 or so in the draft....if you had hindsight then....do you think his Value would be top 5 material? Strickly a value arguement....

@solon16 said:

I just can't see the value of Rey at #5 in the 1st round. I also just don't believe he was the best LB or defensive player for USC. Which makes taking a guy like him at #5 even more scary to me.

Masters said:

Chances are, if CLE takes Curry, they'd move him to ILB, where he has been projected to play in a 3-4 by a few experts.

If you get Curry awesome but if he is Gone....I pray they get Rey!

Chances are, if CLE takes Curry, they'd move him to ILB, where he has been projected to play in a 3-4 by a few experts.