@tour2ma said:

I agree. He has the athleticism to be a very dangerous quarterback, but he just needed a larger pool of work to draw examples from.

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

I like Tannehill a lot. He is far from a polished QB prospect, however. I don't think I would have taken the risk on him, to be honest, not if I were in Miami's position.

I know I would not have taken him at #8 overall... and I also thought Ryan had a good chance to be a better than average starter. He still does. His resume was just too thin for me to have pulled the trigger.

@tour2ma said:

Kinda like building an NFL team thru UFAs?

Thanks for the reply...

Yes, Sumlin's approach at A&M has just been an extension of his at U of H. Some is due to talent, but some is due to emphasis. Not sure how much more JM would/ could have shown under Sherman... but it's an interesting "what-if".

And don't sell Ryan short... he's a 1-1/2 year wonder with a little over 1.5 seasons at QB under Sherman after playing WR the first half of his Jr. year. He actually had a slightly higher completion percentage and rating his Jr. year with roughly the same TD/INT ratio.

I like Tannehill a lot. He is far from a polished QB prospect, however. I don't think I would have taken the risk on him, to be honest, not if I were in Miami's position.

Thanks for the reply...

Yes, Sumlin's approach at A&M has just been an extension of his at U of H. Some is due to talent, but some is due to emphasis. Not sure how much more JM would/ could have shown under Sherman... but it's an interesting "what-if".

And don't sell Ryan short... he's a 1-1/2 year wonder with a little over 1.5 seasons at QB under Sherman after playing WR the first half of his Jr. year. He actually had a slightly higher completion percentage and rating his Jr. year with roughly the same TD/INT ratio.

@tour2ma said:

The systems are very different, I'll agree. Even in this past season, which was Spurrier's most "Fun and Gun"-like system over the past five or so seasons, Shaw still didn't throw nearly as much as Manziel did. S.Car had a much, much, much stronger defense and Spurrier tried to play the traditional, ball-control game that experienced coaches play. Sumlin, of course, didn't have the luxury of relying on the A&M defense and had to open up the flood gates on offense.

Excluding the highest and lowest outliers, Manziel averaged 34.4 attempts per game in 2013. In comparison, Shaw averaged only 23 attempts per game.

Thinking about Manziel's potential in a Mike Sherman offense is a bit scary. I mean, that offense turned Ryan Tannehill into starting NFL quarterback in only one year...

Same goes for Manziel in a Chip Kelly offense. For as many knocks as people have against Manziel, Sumlin still ran a semblance of a legitimate transferable offense. He was hardly a "three yards and cloud of dust", Pro-style playcaller, but he also didn't run a gimmick-based offense that relied solely on capitalizing on Manziel's athleticism and the speed differential of his players.

Off-topic:

Mike Sherman paved the way for Manziel's success by stocking A&M with talent during his tenure. I'm not going to check to see if this is true, but I do believe that A&M's recruiting class rank continually climbed every season under Sherman, and has continued to climb under Sumlin. Recruiting isn't all about landing a handful of five star prospects, it's also building a strong base of solid backups to provide legitimate talent and breed a culture of competition. Sherman did that for A&M. It may not have translated to wins on the field, but his efforts are being measured years down the line.

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

Manziel threw more TD passes in his freshman year than Shaw did in any year, including his senior. Manziel threw more TD passes last year than Shaw did in his first three years.

How much would you attribute to system differences? Surely Sumlin's is more wide open than Spurier's... yes?

Which also begs the question of what JM's numbers would have looked like under Sherman...

@gftchris said:

Shaw mentioned somewhere in a local interview that they had some zone read in the playbook. It was pretty vague, but he and Johnny are perfect for that style, even if it isn't the bread and butter offense. Hope he latches on.

Manziel has better college accoloades.

Manziel has more invested by the Cleveland Browns

that's why he gets the nod over Shaw.

Shaw was a good college QB and has potential to be a good NFL QB. But Manziel will get the first shot at it, between the two.

@d-bone said:

Well, I guess I was reading...........

Which lead me to believe that you were implying that Johnny Tiny Canadian Pussy Douche will be better than Shaw because of all the neat stats you listed. At the end of the above quote you say, "Manziel is a better QB", which followed all of the listed stats, and since neither play NCAA football any longer, and both currently are trying to play in the NFL, I assumed that you were using stats to say the Johnny Tiny Canadian Pussy Douche is the superior QB.

I must have read it wrong.

My response was to someone who said "Johnny Manziel gets the nod over Shaw because he's a bigger media magnet" or something of that ilk.

As neither of them have played a down in the NFL yet, nor have either taken snaps with the same offensive players, I listed things Manziel had accomplished that Shaw had not against similar competition, in this case being the SEC.

I didn't say Manziel would be a better NFL QB, only that he was a better college QB and that's why he gets the nod over Shaw- not because he's a media magnet.

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

Well, I guess I was reading...........

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

And his Heisman. And his 63 TD passes in 2 years. And his 172.1 QB rating last season, which was higher than Shaw's 162.9 rating. And his 5 TD's against Alabama. And his 70% completion percentage against SEC defenses. Those all probably help him get the nod, too.

Manziel threw more TD passes in his freshman year than Shaw did in any year, including his senior. Manziel threw more TD passes last year than Shaw did in his first three years. Shaw is a solid QB. Manziel is a better QB.

Which lead me to believe that you were implying that Johnny Tiny Canadian Pussy Douche will be better than Shaw because of all the neat stats you listed. At the end of the above quote you say, "Manziel is a better QB", which followed all of the listed stats, and since neither play NCAA football any longer, and both currently are trying to play in the NFL, I assumed that you were using stats to say the Johnny Tiny Canadian Pussy Douche is the superior QB.

I must have read it wrong.

@d-bone said:

My bad, I was just reading:

I'm still waiting for you to point out where that says anything about the NFL.

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

My bad, I was just reading:

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

And his Heisman. And his 63 TD passes in 2 years. And his 172.1 QB rating last season, which was higher than Shaw's 162.9 rating. And his 5 TD's against Alabama. And his 70% completion percentage against SEC defenses. Those all probably help him get the nod, too.

Manziel threw more TD passes in his freshman year than Shaw did in any year, including his senior. Manziel threw more TD passes last year than Shaw did in his first three years. Shaw is a solid QB. Manziel is a better QB.

@d-bone said:

Probably. But thanks for confirming that college stats guarantee success in the NFL. Oh, wait............

Nobody ever said they did. In fact, I think you'll find that I've always said the opposite.

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

Probably. But thanks for confirming that college stats guarantee success in the NFL. Oh, wait............

@d-bone said:

Those are some very impressive stats. Hey, wasn't Colt McCoy "the winningest QB in NCAA history"? That's a very impressive stat too.

Yes he was. And he, too, would probably beat out Connor Shaw on the depth chart.

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

Those are some very impressive stats. Hey, wasn't Colt McCoy "the winningest QB in NCAA history"? That's a very impressive stat too.

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

No need. That has been a given around here for quite some while.

Go ahead, run wild.

@diehardbrownsfan said:

Do you call the African Americans 'black boys'?

Uh, actually, ,,,,,

WSS

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

really? i think WRRebel could hit that one out of the park.

@gamecock-frog said:

And his Heisman. And his 63 TD passes in 2 years. And his 172.1 QB rating last season, which was higher than Shaw's 162.9 rating. And his 5 TD's against Alabama. And his 70% completion percentage against SEC defenses. Those all probably help him get the nod, too.

Manziel threw more TD passes in his freshman year than Shaw did in any year, including his senior. Manziel threw more TD passes last year than Shaw did in his first three years. Shaw is a solid QB. Manziel is a better QB.

By the way, I'm a Gamecock fan.

@gamecock-frog said:

Well, there is that "he beat Alabama" thing, which Connor Shaw never did.

@d-bone said:

I've seen all of Shaw's games and the majority of JFFs and couldn't agree more. Of course, that'll be discredited since I'm an obvious homer. JFF's flash gets him the nod, that's it - nothing else.