@go-losers said:

That is right....the Browns did go on hiatus and came back and made the playoffs.

That is why I say that people that think Tim Couch was a bust are fools. He is the guy that took the team from a paper franchise to the playoffs.

But injuries hit and that was his career.

And also, think about it: he married the Playboy Playmate of the year. Not bad for a hick.

@miktoxic said:

Fair enough, but I don't need to remind you that the Browns died, rose back from the dead, had winning seasons and playoff appearances all in the time of my Pirates 20 year futility of NO winning seasons Uuuuuugh!

Okay. . . I promise I won't turn this in to a pity party LOL

@dste-ace said:

He bid the most money...and that is all the NFL cared about. There was another group bidding in which Don Shula was a part of. Wonder how things may have been different if that group had put more on the table.

(I think it was Charles Dolan who was the lead money in that bid.

@go-losers said:

A. While Buffalo per se is not a large market, I do think that the NFL takes into consideration the Toronto area when dealing with the Bills, which would make it a vast market area. I just don't know what kind of viewership the Bills get in Canada. Perhaps there is some website that shows a measurement of that.

B. While Buffalo may be declining in population, it is really doing no worse in that regard than Chicago/Pittsburgh/Cleveland/Detroit.

C. I thought there were plans for a new stadium for the Bills? If so, I do not think that there would be a chance in Hell that the Bills would be going anywhere.

@miktoxic said:

And, BTW, fuck Al Lerner. He basically drove the getaway car for Modell. Lerner flew

Modell to Baltimore on his private plane, and then the NFL further broke it off in

Cleveland's ass by naming him the new owner.

@go-losers said:

hell you don't have to look any further than this board. al lerner to randy lerner was a disaster.

@the-gipper said:

Good question...

Fan support and market strength are two different issues. A team can have rabid fans but they could also be in a city that has any one of the following...

A.) broadcast to a weak media market

B.) team based in an area of decline - i.e. Detroit, unfortunately

C.) play in a crumbling stadium/poor facilities, most compelling example is Oakland, CA

The bad news for Bills fans in Western NY is that Buffalo is currently experiencing all three of these symptoms in one degree or another. But there is also good news as the state is making a huge push with tax incentives to bring more businesses back to the region.

@the-cysko-kid said:

He probably had sources that would have told him what the Adams family plan was after Bud's demise.

But, figure this out: it is good for Jimmah to have bought the Browns when he did, for if he had waited, and the whole rebate issue/FBI investigation had occurred before he was approved as an owner, he may never have been given approval. I doubt the NFL would give a team to a guy facing potential federal indictment.

@the-gipper said:

Aren't the Titans up for sale? (or did we cover that?)

Edit: whether we did or didn't cover it, here is the situation:

Adams 2 Daughters Susan Adams Smith and Amy Adams Hunt are co-chair of the teams board. Bud's grandson by his deceased son will join the board Kenneth Adams IV.

Tommy Smith, husband of Susan Adams Smith is named CEO and is in day to day control of the team, representing it at owners meetings etc.

So, the Titans stay in the Adams Family. And they have a lease in their stadium until 2028.

If the titans were for sale Jimmy haslem would be pulling his hair out.

@go-losers said:

Well, actually, the Steelers and the Titans were more apt.....as when those owners died there were like 5 people wanting to take over the Throne....just like in GOT.

The Steelers settled on one. (hell Jeoffrey could look a little like a young Dan Rooney). The Titans seemed to have worked it out.

So, maybe, yes, it may be the Bills situation that most like GOT. (The question is: which of the bidders for the Bills has dragons?)

Edit: Well, there is this:

@pumpkin-eater said:

Yes, in fact they began existance as the LA Chargers...but for just one year til they moved to SD.

@billsfan5885 said:

Either way, I'm really glad to see so much support from the Browns' fanbase. You guys rock.

You'd probably get a similar response in Seattle too. Losing a beloved franchise leaves a bit of a bad taste in the fanbases collective mouths.

@the-gipper said:

On the stadium issue: There are only like 10 stadiums in the NFL that are older than the Browns "new" stadium:

Green Bay Lambeau Field...but which has had renovations

Kansas City Arrowhead...not sure if renovated

Miami...whatever its currently called

New Orleans Superdome...undergond renovations after Katrina

Buffalo...renovations/new stadium proposed

Atlanta....Georgia Dome was new in 1992 and they are already talking about replacing

Oakland...Oco.com or whatever...definitely needs work....I believe it is the only dual baseball/football field left

Jacksonville....rebuilt/renovated Gator Bowl in 1995

St. Louis...Edward Jones Dome opened 1995

San Diego...Qualcomm Stad. needs work.

Minnesota....new stadium already under construction. Temporary Stadium at Un. of Minn. is only 5 years old.

So, yea, you see it is the teams with the older stadiums that need work that are being threatened to be moved. I personally would wager that if any team went to LA it would be the Raiders or Chargers....both of which at one time were located there. The league would not have to mess around with the division setup if they moved. Both would stay in AFCWest.

I agree that the NFL should say fuck a bunch of Bon Jovi....if it is his proposal to move the team to LA. Hell, go ahead and give it to Trump....he certainly has the wherewithal to build a new stadium.....but what about that "no casino ownership" rule? He could brag that he owns the only NFL team that plays in New York State.

Jax? I don't think that is the team that the NFL wants in LA...though they could change their name to the Los Angeles Leopards and retain pretty much the same logo. That animal they use looks more like a leopard than a Jaguar to me.

London Calling? I think that idea clashes with reality.

BOA stadium in Carolina still one of the best NFL stadiums despite its "age"

@billsfan5885 said:

That sucks, I'm a Pirates fan that knew all too well about owners kids inheriting a team they had no interest in.

Why does this feel 'Game of Thrones' where the king (Wilson) died without an heir to take the team over.

@miktoxic said:

Well played, sir! I like your style.

Green Bay Lambeau Field...but which has had renovations

Kansas City Arrowhead...not sure if renovated

Miami...whatever its currently called

New Orleans Superdome...undergond renovations after Katrina

Buffalo...renovations/new stadium proposed

Atlanta....Georgia Dome was new in 1992 and they are already talking about replacing

Oakland...Oco.com or whatever...definitely needs work....I believe it is the only dual baseball/football field left

Jacksonville....rebuilt/renovated Gator Bowl in 1995

St. Louis...Edward Jones Dome opened 1995

San Diego...Qualcomm Stad. needs work.

Minnesota....new stadium already under construction. Temporary Stadium at Un. of Minn. is only 5 years old.

So, yea, you see it is the teams with the older stadiums that need work that are being threatened to be moved. I personally would wager that if any team went to LA it would be the Raiders or Chargers....both of which at one time were located there. The league would not have to mess around with the division setup if they moved. Both would stay in AFCWest.

I agree that the NFL should say fuck a bunch of Bon Jovi....if it is his proposal to move the team to LA. Hell, go ahead and give it to Trump....he certainly has the wherewithal to build a new stadium.....but what about that "no casino ownership" rule? He could brag that he owns the only NFL team that plays in New York State.

Jax? I don't think that is the team that the NFL wants in LA...though they could change their name to the Los Angeles Leopards and retain pretty much the same logo. That animal they use looks more like a leopard than a Jaguar to me.

London Calling? I think that idea clashes with reality.

This is fallout from Modell moving the team and the other owners (Wilson & Rooney being the exceptions)

allowing it to happen.

One of the reasons (maybe the main reason) Baltiwhore was the destination of Modell was because they agreed to build him a new stadium.

And the other owners realized that allowing him to move would give them a huge bargaining chip--one which we've

seen many of them use over the past 19 years. "Build me a new stadium or I'll move the team to a city that will."

How many new stadiums have been built since 1995 with owners using moving the team as a threat? A very effective threat, because

if they can take Cleveland's team away, a city with one of the most rabid fan bases in sports, then they can certainly move a Jacksonville

or Seattle.

Keep the Bills in Buffalo.

Ralph probably would have passed ownership to his daughter Linda who loved the Bills and was actively involved in the franchise, but unfortunately she passed away in 2009.

@billsfan5885 said:

Aren't the Titans up for sale? (or did we cover that?)

Edit: whether we did or didn't cover it, here is the situation:

Adams 2 Daughters Susan Adams Smith and Amy Adams Hunt are co-chair of the teams board. Bud's grandson by his deceased son will join the board Kenneth Adams IV.

Tommy Smith, husband of Susan Adams Smith is named CEO and is in day to day control of the team, representing it at owners meetings etc.

So, the Titans stay in the Adams Family. And they have a lease in their stadium until 2028.

@go-losers said:

That's because the Steelers haven't been put up for sale. The sole reason there's any relocation talk about the Bills is because Ralph Wilson died and his children don't want to keep the franchise.

Nobody has any doubt about the support of the Bills in and around Buffalo. It's simply a matter of greedy businessmen knowing that they could buy the Bills and move them to a bigger city and make more money. But the same could be said about 90% of the teams in the league. It just so happens that the rest of that 90% of the league isn't up for sale. If they were we'd be having the same relocation discussions about them.

@jrb12711 said:

If the NFL wants to move into those markets then just fucking expand to like 36 teams. Plain, simple, easy. I honestly don't think Toronto wants the Bills. They are happy to have them in Buffalo if they want to see them. Maybe the Buffalonians or the Torontonians if any here can tell us what the situation is with the broadcast of games of the Bills into Toronto. But that is all the NFL should be concerned about: getting TV eyeballs on NFL games.

And the one or two London games? Again, a novelty. Having a full time team in that city may not be that big of a deal. Would people really give that big of a crap if New York City were granted a Premier League team? Ridiculous, and a logistics nightmare.

Mexico City/Monterrey may make a little more sense....but, does the NFL want to delve into the morass of corruption and crime that is Mexico? Really?