@vagitron said:

Well, bottom line: we are happy to have given him to you so that he could be partially responsible for blowing that game for you. (or we can thank Minnesota...who cut him after we did)

@vagitron said:

OK, Flacco is not better than BR......he is just playing better. I know that there is a subtle difference.

And sure, the Steelers are young.....in their 2d stringers and special teamers. But many of their main cogs/starters are quite old and ready for the rocker:

Start with most of your Defensive backfield:

Taylor 12 years in

Polamalu 12 years in

Will Allen 11 years in

the puppy is William Gay 8 years in

Keisel 13 years....put on IR

Harrison 36 years old, already retired once

Heath Miller.....not completely over the hill, but long past peak

BR....11 years in.....which is probably still at the edge of prime

Plus they have 2 more 10+ year players on their roster, one of which is their kicker so that doesn't count. Kickers can go into their 40s. Vinatieri is one of the best kickers in the game still....and he is the oldest person still playing. The other is the long snapper....and they too can be older but still be in their prime.

Where in comparison, the Browns had only 4 players with 10+ years in the league:

Jim Leonhard, a backup safety who has already annouced his retirement....but the guy he backed up was 3 year man Pro Bowler Tashaun Gipson

Paul McQuistan.....a non factor backup OL

Dansby 10 years

Whitner 10 years

the above two are both prime time starters, for which replacements will have to be groomed. I am an advocate of getting a LB with one of the Browns 2 first round picks. And a DB for the other would not be out of the question at all.

@the-gipper said:

He had a 3 or 4 carries and then he had the ball stripped. The tipped pass later in the game was something different and an interception rather than a fumble.

@the-gipper said:

The best based on what? No he's not the best QB in the division and he won't be until Ben retires or his play really starts to regress and I expect him to retire before that really happens. Flacco had a short field several times. The average age of the Steelers is 26.26 the average age of the Browns is 25.69. The Steelers are not old.

@vagitron said:

Are you talking about the play where Suggs intercepted the tipped pass? Or was there another fumble that Tate gave up?

@vagitron said:

You ignored my main question: Do you think Flacco is now the best QB in this division, over BR?

And the Steelers are not young. They are quite old. They may be much younger next year when a ton of these old guys retire this offseason....or the Steelers cut them.

@gftchris said:

Have the steelers cut Tate yet? Or is he going to go in to next year as the backup to Bell?

I thought he looked great until the fumble. I would like for him to be the backup. I don't believe he's been released.

@the-gipper said:

So? Are you saying that this loss was on him then?

Like I said, what I saw was Flacco doing all the things that BR usually does. Move around in the pocket, shed would be tacklers, throw accurately on the run. What's up with that?

Ben didn't have a great game, he's on record saying as much. We had some bad breaks that changed the course of the game in a hurry. The Ben Tate drop that lead to the suggs leg interception for example. Bottom line not having bell in the game capped our offense because the ravens were able to pin their ears back and blitz their asses off. I'm not going to blame this game on Tate but just using that play as an example. If he grabs that first down the entire game could have been different. Instead it flopped off his hands and became a turnover. The ravens played well, they deserved the win but the steelers weren't thoroughly outplayed.

The steelers by all intents and purposes are a very young team, a team that is going to continue to improve. I'm okay with the record and the division. I'm rooting for the ravens this week because I hate the patriots. I then want the ratbirds to lose.

@vagitron said:

So? Are you saying that this loss was on him then?

Like I said, what I saw was Flacco doing all the things that BR usually does. Move around in the pocket, shed would be tacklers, throw accurately on the run. What's up with that?

@tour2ma said:

68 yards rushing + 5 sacks = not suck?

Who was in our backfield keeping suggs and dumerville honest? You can't be serious right now. Just signed Ben Tate, unddrafted josh Harris and archer? I like all those guys but none put fear in a defense so no 5 sacks with the ravens blitzing a lot was not bad. Ben got sacked that many times last time they played. The difference...he threw 6 TDs.

@vagitron said:

If the Browns had things go their way in a number of games this year....dropped balls, missed opportunities, they probably would have been like 13-3. Every loss but like 2-3 by less than a TD.

And where do you get that the Steelers are young? In their 2d/3rd stringers? They may be young next year as they will probably have 4-5 retirements on their defense alone: Polamalu/Taylor/Keisel/McClendon/Harrison. Plus BR and Heath Miller are no spring chickens. And Dick LeBeau will be 78 at the start of next season if he sticks around.

(that said, both Haley and Munchak did great jobs as asst.s this year).

@vagitron said:

@miktoxic said:

My thoughts too. Sucks hard when an elite key player is lost. Entirely different outcome if Mack hadn't gone down when he did...or if Bell had sooner.

This type of thinking makes me want September here already.

@vagitron said:

Our offensive line did not suck...

68 yards rushing + 5 sacks = not suck?

@bringbackbrownie2 said:

Hahah what the hell does this even mean? Your statement reeks of hypothetical bullshit. The steelers were thoroughly outplayed. Your oline sucked donkey balls. You're lucky the ravens fumbled or it would have been an even bigger laugher.. Kinda like the browns 30-10 win earlier this year..

Dropped balls, missed opportunities. Our offensive line did not suck and there were two fumbles. Ben was off his game, we didn't have bell and we lost. Refresh my memory high and mighty, where did the browns finish? Where did the majority of you think the steelers were going to finish. The steelers are a young team, they are only going to get better.

@vagitron said:

The steelers were a few big plays away from winning that game. Plays that were called, not hypothetical.

Hahah what the hell does this even mean? Your statement reeks of hypothetical bullshit. The steelers were thoroughly outplayed. Your oline sucked donkey balls. You're lucky the ravens fumbled or it would have been an even bigger laugher.. Kinda like the browns 30-10 win earlier this year..

@tour2ma said:

I was more referring to your O-line, which got owned in case you did not notice.

I do agree that Bell would have made a difference, but not sure winning the game was in the cards. The multiplier effect of a better run game on the pass attack cannot be ignored tho...

Ben was cleared to return, so if he was rushed in, then your team broke protocol. The throw was bad, but there was an opening deeper into the corner, so the decision was fine.

Ike did not look happy to be inactive. Troy played as if he was already retired. Hard to recall a more lackluster effort on his part.

Oh well... there's always next year.

I'm a josh Harris fan but he was undrafted, DRI archer had ten carries on the season. I also thought Tate looked awesome until the fumble and he put himself in the dog house, the dropped pass for an interception would have been caught by bell. Fact of the matter is the steelers didn't do enough to win. They created a lot to build on next season. Oh and to say Ben isn't athletic is hilarious. He's 6'5 250 pounds. How is he supposed to look running *rolls eyes* like Russell Wilson? Lol

Edit: last game taylor played it was him that took himself out. He's a competitior of course he'd like to be out there. The steelers were a few big plays away from winning that game. Plays that were called, not hypothetical. Bell gone was the biggest blow. Ben had a career year because of him. All I know is a lot of you try to make something out of nothing. Steelers finished 11-5, won the division. The consensus here was last place. I hate one and done more than anything but I'm okay with 11-5 and the division.

their running game looked as bad as ours w/o bell when we had no center.

@browns149 said:

Ben looked old last night.

Had to clean coffee spew off my screen this AM after Tom Jackson called Ben "athletic". That late run by Ben was a vision of gracelessness.

But it needed a good cleaning...

That is one I didn't see coming, I was excited about his offseason signing. But we are better off with the young guys.

He's not done, he'll backup somewhere next year.

Zombo