@tour2ma said:

At this point in time they need a special prosecutor, because what they have collectively done to the Browns is damn near criminal.

@mddawg said:

Not exactly, Haslam was set up by the NFL with Banner who then hired Lombardi. Haslam should've appointed someone to replace Joe Banner rather than assuming that role himself. The absence of someone to impose a team/organizational philosophy is why there's antagonism between coaching and front office.

True enough... problem was Banner's position created a 1 to 1 reporting relationship which is a business no-no.

A special advisor would work.

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

even with all my debating....I agree with you that he is probably gone......

I just know that firing him aint fixin anything.......

And when we still suck......Ill be here to remind you all that you got what you asked for....Coach #9......

@mudfly said:

If these three quotes don't spell the end of the Mike Pettine era in Cleveland, then I don't know what does.

Pettine is gone, gone, gone and Farmer is probably here for a while.

@the-gipper said:

Agreed....but up to this point, Jimmy has not brought in any experience at any position.....and has fired the few experienced guys that he did have....

So....maybe he doesn't like having people around who might second guess his decisions or actually know more than he does....

That is a common issue with big egos......

@mudfly said:

That is a mess. I have heard on the radio the suggestion that Jimmy should bring in former 49ers owner Eddie DeBartolo Jr. as a consultant to advise him on how to be a proper and successful NFL owner. And it does seem that a lot of owners need training on how to be good owners. And as I understand it, many people from Joe Montana to George Seifert to Jerry Rice and others said that Eddie Jr. was THE key man in the 49ers dynasty.

So...I don't see how it could hurt if Jimmy tapped into a resource like that.

@the-gipper said:

But....word is that this is exactly whats happening with Schiener......sources have been saying that...

Scheiner as getting increasingly involved with the football side of things. Haslam is compared unfavorably to Dallas Cowboys owner Jerry Jones, and Browns headquarters are painted as a disorganized mess.

@mddawg said:

I understood that he did appoint Alec Scheiner to essentially be Banner's replacement....to run the business end. Banner's problem was that he wanted to get involved in the football end as well....and was not really qualified to do so.

@tour2ma said:

Not exactly, Haslam was set up by the NFL with Banner who then hired Lombardi. Haslam should've appointed someone to replace Joe Banner rather than assuming that role himself. The absence of someone to impose a team/organizational philosophy is why there's antagonism between coaching and front office.

@flyingfooldoug said:

I am sure there is a bit of luck involved.....I mean....if anyone knew that Brady would be this good would they have allowed him to slip to #199?

What if the Browns had taken Brady just a few picks earlier rather than Spergon Wynn? If the Pats took Spergon Wynn do you think he would have been as good as Brady and Brady as bad as Wynn? Not likely. So, BB got lucky....but also got his sympatico player to go along with him.

And look at Bart Starr.....#200 draft pick.....5 Championships with Lombardi. Another coach/QB combo.

#199? #200....yea, sometimes it seems like a lottery. Joe Montana #82?

And look at the Browns: Paul Brown/Otto Graham....combined 7 titles.......Browns have only one other besides.

@flyingfooldoug said:

I completely agree about the hc qb combo is what leads to lots of wins...plus balance of course. My question has to be... Do you try to grow this combo, or is it more akin to picking lottery numbers and hoping you hit it?

@the-gipper said:

Having the right coach/QB combination is what I see has been at play there. Its just that the Browns have to get that right combo.

(and FYI....I don't think the other leagues ratios are really any better than what you point out for the NFL).

I completely agree about the hc qb combo is what leads to lots of wins...plus balance of course. My question has to be... Do you try to grow this combo, or is it more akin to picking lottery numbers and hoping you hit it?

@the-gipper said:

LOL, just go look at the history of the NBA- the Celtics put the Patriots to shame- won 10 titles in 12 years. Then the Lakers took over. It's only been recently that a semblance of parity has taken over.

I'm against interference from the league. Free enterprises and free markets usually correct themselves. Goodell is a jerk and I don't trust him.

Haslam needs to get his head out of the sand and do something! Quit letting players leave through free agency! He didn't even try and negotiate with TJ Ward or D'Quell Jackson. The Browns were developing the defense and had chemistry before Sheard, Skrine, Rubin, Ward etc were left to walk. TJ Ward wanted to stay in Cleveland too.

What good is putting in time, money and effort if they're never going to pay their players. and the ones they do pay they end up overpaying.

@richiswhere said:

He may be including some teams that were expansion since that time:

Teams that HAVE gone 40 years with not title:

San Diego Chargers

Arizona Cardinals

Minnesota Vikings

Kansas City Chiefs

Detroit Lions

Cleveland Browns

Cincinnati Bengals

Tenn Titans (fka Hou. Oilers)

Atlanta Falcons

Miami Dolphins

Philadelphia Eagles

Buffalo Bills

That is 12.

If you add the Panthers, Texans, Jaguars....though not waiting 40 years, they do bring the count up to 15 teams current teams that have not won a title in 40+ years....even though those few are younger than 40.

So....if he was just guessing , which I suspect....his guess was not far off.

@mudfly said:

If the NFL is gonna tamper.....there are lots of teams in need.....

Only 16 teams have won a SB over the last 40 years......16.......

Which means that 16 teams have gone 40 years or more without a Championship.....and 5 teams have won 22 out of the last 40...

Call it feast or famine....but its not parity....

@mudfly said:

Having the right coach/QB combination is what I see has been at play there. Its just that the Browns have to get that right combo.

(and FYI....I don't think the other leagues ratios are really any better than what you point out for the NFL).

@gmp said:

I am not sure that the NFL should force somebody on the Browns....the way the NBA apparently forced Jerry Colangelo on to the 76ers (which is what I assume you are referencing).....but your premise is what my POFO thread was all about. Jimmy Haslam needs to hire a POFO that knows how to operate a team.......at least he should bring in a consultant......like Accorsi or Polian or Wolf or some of these other names we have discussed. Voluntarily.

Being called the laughingstock of the league should get Jimmah's brain around to that way of thinking.

Only 16 teams have won a SB over the last 40 years......16.......

Which means that 16 teams have gone 40 years or more without a Championship.....and 5 teams have won 22 out of the last 40...

Call it feast or famine....but its not parity....

How'd that work out?

Browns need fan intervention, stop watching it and stop paying for it, maybe then he might care.