@mjp28 said:

OK, yes....it is OUR tragedy....not his. We, the fans of Cleveland perhaps are the "good person". We are the ones that perhaps deserve sympathy or pity. Not Modell. Though I don't see how we all made the fatal error in judgment. Plus, I don't know what insight we gained that brought to a better place.

We had no choice in the matter of who owns this team. We had a bad owner, and you could say "our insight is to learn the lesson to not have a bad owner again." But, again, we had no choice or say in who would own the Browns subsequent to Modell. We have continued to have bad owners.

Maybe if we did have some say? No, never happen. Greedy/rich owners want other greedy/rich people as part of their club. They will not do what is in the best interests of the fans...only what is in their own best interests as greedy rich people.

(About the only solace we have is that on rare occasion these NFL owners will exile someone who is not rich enough for them....and who puts their business on precarious financial footing...see Victor Kiam/Art Modell...and kick them out.)

But present day scholars like The Gipper has no doubt in Aristotle's view on the subject and is an avid reader of Aristotle and his blogs.

I still like to go with the most widely held present day Cleveland view on the subject that A. Modell was a piss poor millionaire (we think he was?) and lousy businessman and owner of the Cleveland Browns.... which turns out that it is our tragedy also.

@mjp28 said:

Greek Tragedy? No. Here are the elements of a Greek Tragedy:

According to Aristotle, depicts the downfall of a basically good person through some fatal error or misjudgment, producing suffering and insight on the part of the protagonist and arousing pity and fear on the part of the audience.

Where in the Modell story do we find a basically good person. Maybe at one point you had that in Art, but his venality and greed dismissed the element of "good" in this equation. Now, perhaps he did make a "fatal error or misjudgement" by refusing to sell the Browns rather than "move" them, but I think that is something else (hubris).

Of course, some may say that he did not make an error in judgment because he ultimately did make a lot of money on the sale of his franchise. But....is that the measure of success?

The other thing is where is the element of pity for these two (Art and David) ? I think Browns fans would say that they are pitiful people, not pitiable people.

Also, while the Modell's may have suffered some at the hands of Browns fans....I am not sure they felt that. They likely surrounded themselves with Baltimore area sychophants that propped them up any time they felt any pressure. And, ergo, based on that recent interview that David Modell gave for Believeland....he certainly did NOT gain any insight...( WE however gained insight into his continued conceit)

conceit)

@the-gipper said:

So, that is what it is? All that cigar chomping got him.

Looks that way.

@the-gipper said:

Oh, well. Not sure what that has to do with David Modell.

My only comment on it is that I will defer to the NFL......they kicked him out of the league.

The terrible irony of all ironies part of old man Modell's plan in moving the team out and getting the sweetheart $$$$ deal was for tax and other purposes to pass the team on to his heirs.

This is like some strange sick Greek tragedy only in real life.

@the-cysko-kid said:

So, that is what it is? All that cigar chomping got him.

Zombo said:

Oh, well. Not sure what that has to do with David Modell.

My only comment on it is that I will defer to the NFL......they kicked him out of the league.

@the-gipper said:

Oh. Did it get that nasty?

And who is the "living" that was spoken ill of? (besides...just the Cleveland Browns and 17 years we have wandered in the desert?

Ghoolie was slurping some dead Modell dick, so it had to go.

Zombo

And who is the "living" that was spoken ill of? (besides...just the Cleveland Browns and 17 years we have wandered in the desert?

@the-gipper said:

It was deleted.

I assume he is still dead.

Zombo

Zombo said:

I did not see a thread on it. I saw something about somebody's dog dieing on Friday. I assume that was not it.

@the-gipper said:

Oh, It was posted.

We spoke ill of living and dead.

Zombo