Another thing working in Hue's favor is the fact that he's attached himself and his job to a rookie QB. So he gets one "mulligan" year where development of this potential franchise QB trumps the win total. As long as Jimmy sees potential with Kizer, Hue should be safe.

But I'm still guessing Hue needs at least 4 wins.

My personal prediction is a strong defense and running game, paired with a talented but green QB, leads us to a 5-11 record with a lot of picks leading up to next year.

I think Hue will stay.

@texasag1969 said:

That was my main concern with our guy Dak last year too, but then............................................

Ah....  but Dak was surveying the field post-snap from the get-go as a 'Boy. He made that leap between his Jr and Sr years at MSU. That's what clinched him being my 2016 darkhorse.

Once the switch is flipped, then it's a matter of the pace at which proficiency is gained.

@tour2ma said:

SB? SB is the least of my worries... you should know that, Ag. You also should know I am well aware of Kess' limitations and never subscribed to the whole arm strengthening thing. That said his last pass Week 2 was a 15 yd out that had enough zip on it.

My concern is Kizer's development. He's not ready to start. He's not even looking to read the Defense post snap. Reading a D is a light switch. Once you are close to it, then it can flip to "on" at anytime. However, if you don't at least know the general area where the switch is, then there's no chance of flipping it.

Kizer has a chance to be good, but I think forcing him to start the season is a recipe for fucking him up.

That was my main concern with our guy Dak last year too, but then............................................

@texasag1969 said:

Kessler has shown nothing in preseason in terms of the supposed arm strengthening. His game considerably shortens the field for defenders. I'd rather have a rookie who can get them on their heels to open up the shorter passes and extend runs that get through the 2nd level. Draws and screen will be helped as well. Who really cares about him taking us to the SB this year? I want to see him get experience and learn the game while this D proves we can be a contender with anyone as we build this team the next couple of years.

SB? SB is the least of my worries... you should know that, Ag. You also should know I am well aware of Kess' limitations and never subscribed to the whole arm strengthening thing. That said his last pass Week 2 was a 15 yd out that had enough zip on it.

My concern is Kizer's development. He's not ready to start. He's not even looking to read the Defense post snap. Reading a D is a light switch. Once you are close to it, then it can flip to "on" at anytime. However, if you don't at least know the general area where the switch is, then there's no chance of flipping it.

Kizer has a chance to be good, but I think forcing him to start the season is a recipe for fucking him up.

@westside-steve said:

Quarterbacks always get drafted higher then they probably should. Even in a weak class.

Once in a while a prospect pops up that teams would actually sandbag in order to draft. By no means is that a guarantee but your odds are a little better. Disagree if you must.

WSS

I just think that several of these QBs are going to turn out quite well in the NFL....contrary to reports that is was a "weak" QB draft class.  If 2-3 of them become solid starters, that is what it will take to counter the negativity.  And I think that will happen.

@tour2ma said:

I've been steadily in Kess' Kamp to start the season for us.

Kessler has shown nothing in preseason in terms of the supposed arm strengthening. His game considerably shortens the field for defenders. I'd rather have a rookie who can get them on their heels to open up the shorter passes and extend runs that get through the 2nd level. Draws and screen will be helped as well. Who really cares about him taking us to the SB this year? I want to see him get experience and learn the game while this D proves we can be a contender with anyone as we build this team the next couple of years.

Not sure if Jackson is really that guy -- he has similar accuracy issues to Kizer [56% last season] and less of an arm. And Rosen has negative leadership ability. He has Nick Fitzgerald and Chase Litton and Jarrett Stidham all ahead of Falk and Rudolph..

@wargograw said:

Who do you want?

I've been steadily in Kess' Kamp to start the season for us.

@tour2ma said:

We're a young team. Young teams commit penalties, stupid or otherwise. But I will go along with pre-snap penalty reduction. Those, particularly on Offense, are preparation penalties.

I don't see the issue with pre-snap shifts by the Offense. They are integral to Hue's O. Rather than dumb them down for a QB who is not yet ready, perhaps we should start another QB...

Who do you want?

@the-gipper said:

And that is when the pundits could easily get fooled.  Last you, you say, it was believed to be a weak QB class.....yet, what? 3 went in the Top 10-12.....And I have the suspicion that of the 4 taken in rounds 1 and 2, that likely 3 of them will turn out to be pretty darn good....ergo rating it a very good QB class.

Quarterbacks always get drafted higher then they probably should. Even in a weak class.

Once in a while a prospect pops up that teams would actually sandbag in order to draft. By no means is that a guarantee but your odds are a little better. Disagree if you must.

WSS

I don't see the issue with pre-snap shifts by the Offense. They are integral to Hue's O. Rather than dumb them down for a QB who is not yet ready, perhaps we should start another QB...

@tour2ma said:

On Hue keeping his job...

For me it's really a matter of us showing improvement beyond that the simple addition of talent that most of us agree has arrived... and the measure of that is way beyond a win total. IMO to say "he's done at 3-13, but safe at 5-11" is beyond overly simplistic.

Hue's Offense has to show improvement that demonstrates that it's performance exceeds the sum of its parts... and his fingerprints have to be all over that improvement via his personnel utilization and play calling... including judicious use of the read option.

Additionally he has to show a game management capacity beyond that he showed last season. If he's smart, then he has an assistant set to help him here.

Hue is already starting on the plus side of the ledger. His hiring of Gregg Williams and his growing relationship with Gregg have piled up early points. Now he has but to incorporate Gregg's D without overcontrolling it. As he does so points will continue to accumulate.

Similarly he'll get credit for ST success... another unit whose performance looks poised to improve.

Then be prepared for the worst thing because we won't know this after one season. We might know if he's not franchise caliber, but no way can we know that he is. Best we can do is better assess his potential.

I'll chip in what Ghoolie has said about Hue- I want to see a serious reduction in dumb penalties while we're at it.   

@mudfly said:

Hues offense bites....hate to say it, but it's true....

He needs to dump all the silly alignments and stupid(time wasting) shifts.....and come up with a creative offensive scheme....instead of stupid "trickery", which doesnt work....

We need a real OC.....so if Hue wants to keep his job, he needs to hire a good offensive mind and step away from the play calling.....

Offensive genius???......puleeze

^^^ Yup, the Chinese Fire Drill shifts are screwing up & confusing the offense, don't need that crap if it's going to be Kizer.... Time to dumb it down the same way the Steelers did for Ben in his rookie year. 

@westside-steve said:

I'm not talking about somebody being considered a possible first round pick. All four of the possible first round picks last year war considered by the pundits to be a part of one of the weakest quarterback drafts in a long time. They are talking about Sam darnold like he's special. Of course he could fall on his ass, every quarterback runs that risk. I'm just talking odds. With four winss we won't be in position to draft a blue-chip quarterback.

Every year there is a football ritual of posting the successful guys we could have drafted but didn't. Let's hope that other teams will be doing the same thing about DeShone Kizer.

WSS

And that is when the pundits could easily get fooled.  Last you, you say, it was believed to be a weak QB class.....yet, what? 3 went in the Top 10-12.....And I have the suspicion that of the 4 taken in rounds 1 and 2, that likely 3 of them will turn out to be pretty darn good....ergo rating it a very good QB class.

Darnold/Rudolph/Rosen/Falk/Jackson 

In that order

@cainedesoulis said:

Luke falk,Josh rosen,Allen,Rudolph,Mayfield,Jackson,Darnold all could be in competition for heisman and or #1 overall

Every listing I've seen puts a big drop-off after Sam.

WSS

@tim-couch-pulls-out said:

I'm sure I'll have to eat crow at some point - but not right now. I'm holding out hope for the guy.

We all have our crosses to bear... mine is named "Goff".

@westside-steve said:

With four winss we won't be in position to draft a blue-chip quarterback.

@dutch-oven said:

Sam Darnold is not the only potential high first round QB prospect in next year's draft.

With four wins we will not land THE consensus Blue-chipper, if there is one. That QB is likely going to be a Jet.

However, if there's at least one more that is close, e.g., a Mariotta to the Jets' Winston, then we have a shot.

@texasag1969 said:

I have not forgotten that following the 2015 season Kizer was a co-frontrunner for #1 overall along with Myles. But Kelly is a shit coach.

Kelly was like watching Kizer go get the play from Bill O'Brian ..Hue seems to be trying to re-light the lamp of Kizer again.."With these vets you got to show the leadership quality's but with also some emotions of a leader" Watching this should be a good test of Hue's QB background.. From protecting the football to what Kizer can absorb at sight of LOS to fitting Hues play call may determine if Kizer starts week 1?      

@gumby73 said:

it almost seems easier to give up the farm from where Phiily & Rams were..Or we just become the next Bears..the number of QB's that declare vs the number of teams that declare a QB need..It's not going to be cheap.. Go Kizer!!

I have not forgotten that following the 2015 season Kizer was a co-frontrunner for #1 overall along with Myles. But Kelly is a shit coach.

@texasag1969 said:

Which one? JM's college teammates liked him. Mike Evans is still one of his best friends.

I believe the comparison was of Rosen's douchey frat-boy personality and Manziel's.