@the-gipper said:

OK, but we didn't draft them.  Would that have made a difference?

No....

@tour2ma said:

Looking forward to Wilson as well...

As for Taylor... had a bad game. Probably a matchup issue... but by all means forget everything good he did last year and this season for two weeks so you can be the first to throw him under the nearest convenient bus.

Who had the bad game against A. Brown?  While Taylor may have had a bad game....I think it was more the scheme or plan that has been the issue.  It could NOT be as simple as switching to put McCourty on him, could it?

As for Taylor... had a bad game. Probably a matchup issue... but by all means forget everything good he did last year and this season for two weeks so you can be the first to throw him under the nearest convenient bus.

@texasag1969 said:

If he is just starting to run in Oct., then we won't see him this year.

Paging Dr. Kwan Williams..not a single report on Wilson since May 18th..12-16 weeks per Shefner after suppose'it good news..9-18-17 was 16 weeks..My hope is we see Wilson around London

@gumby73 said:

PUP..last report has him beginning running in October..

If he is just starting to run in Oct., then we won't see him this year.

@gumby73 said:

Starting to see maybe why Fins traded Taylor to us to move up in 7th round? In 2016 we traded back a 7th (223) to 250 & grabbed S.Wright & J.Taylor came along from Fins..Taylor wanted paid as a #1 CB but simply I think were starting to see that..Taylor's not a bad CB to pick-up in 7th, but not paying Taylor 1st corner money neither..You were correct on we did move McCourtny to TY in 2nd half..Did shut TY down but Taylor moved to Moncrief which Taylor could not cover him either..Hope for CB Howard Wilson to get back soon..we got to take a good look. I like McCoutny & Wilson both being 6'1"corners..AJ Green comes to town at 6'4",I like McCourtny as a better match-up on Green than Taylor...  

Isn't Wilson on permanent IR list?

@the-gipper said:

Taylor was terrible.  Browns definitely need to draft a cover corner very high......or get one as a FA....and not a bargain basement guy either.\

(and no, I don't think that Haden could have done any better at all)

Starting to see maybe why Fins traded Taylor to us to move up in 7th round? In 2016 we traded back a 7th (223) to 250 & grabbed S.Wright & J.Taylor came along from Fins..Taylor wanted paid as a #1 CB but simply I think were starting to see that..Taylor's not a bad CB to pick-up in 7th, but not paying Taylor 1st corner money neither..You were correct on we did move McCourtny to TY in 2nd half..Did shut TY down but Taylor moved to Moncrief which Taylor could not cover him either..Hope for CB Howard Wilson to get back soon..we got to take a good look. I like McCoutny & Wilson both being 6'1"corners..AJ Green comes to town at 6'4",I like McCourtny as a better match-up on Green than Taylor...  

@gumby73 said:

What really stuck out to me (all game) was Jamar Taylor may have played a even worse game than Peppers? I think we are talking about the same play? Talk about poor tackling angles? Watch as "Rickie Bobby" J.Taylor does a half victory lap around TY on sidelines..AJ Green may put 200 yards on J.Taylor if he plays that kind of game again? 

Taylor was terrible.  Browns definitely need to draft a cover corner very high......or get one as a FA....and not a bargain basement guy either.\

(and no, I don't think that Haden could have done any better at all)

@tiamat63 said:

That's true, TY is a shifty mofo.     However the move near the sidelines is just something that really sticks out to me.   Target the runners infield shoulder and don't run sideways.    Quite literally Peppers did the opposite hauling ass to get over there.  

What really stuck out to me (all game) was Jamar Taylor may have played a even worse game than Peppers? I think we are talking about the same play? Talk about poor tackling angles? Watch as "Rickie Bobby" J.Taylor does a half victory lap around TY on sidelines..AJ Green may put 200 yards on J.Taylor if he plays that kind of game again? 

@the-gipper said:

Well,  kickoffs have become ridiculous in the NFL.  How many are returned?  I know they want to avoid injuries, but sorry, they took out one of the most exciting elements of the game.

And the ST coach was just powdering his tush.   He should have tried  to return it.  He had plenty of room to run.  He can make up for it Sunday by doing a Metcalf double take:

Here's hoping the Bengals punter out kicks his coverage unit twice

But a disciplined return? Yeah... he had some room to get started and if he simply takes what is in front of him, it was worth a shot since the clock stops at the end of the return.

@mld-woody said:

He was above average with the returns he got in the preseason. Now teams are avoiding giving him opportunities. What you'd expect.

Also, our ST coach told Peppers he made the right decision on that fair catch (according to Peppers last interview), though Peppers feels he should have attempted something. 

(He also said he didn't sleep for two days after the game)

Well,  kickoffs have become ridiculous in the NFL.  How many are returned?  I know they want to avoid injuries, but sorry, they took out one of the most exciting elements of the game.

And the ST coach was just powdering his tush.   He should have tried  to return it.  He had plenty of room to run.  He can make up for it Sunday by doing a Metcalf double take:

@the-gipper said:

Well, one point about Peppers is that, even though he is only 3 games into his career....you have to ask if he is being used properly....or is Williams still experimenting with his skill set.

As I said earlier, one of the main things that was hoping for at least here in his rookie season was for him to really give us something in the return game.  So far, nada.   Not all his fault because almost every kickoff these days is a touchback, and they have been punting the ball out of bounds on him.  But he really had a chance in that last minute of the Colts game....and he cacked up a furball....and he knew it. 

He was above average with the returns he got in the preseason. Now teams are avoiding giving him opportunities. What you'd expect.

Also, our ST coach told Peppers he made the right decision on that fair catch (according to Peppers last interview), though Peppers feels he should have attempted something. 

(He also said he didn't sleep for two days after the game)

@tour2ma said:

Yup... and in fairness... TY Hilton in space and at speed is not a target on who I'd want to see any FS have to close a great distance.

That's true, TY is a shifty mofo.     However the move near the sidelines is just something that really sticks out to me.   Target the runners infield shoulder and don't run sideways.    Quite literally Peppers did the opposite hauling ass to get over there.  

@tiamat63 said:

Honestly at this point I'm having a hard time trying to pinpoint what his coverage responsibility is.   As far as I can tell its "every stays in front, secure the tackle".   Fundamental stuff. 

Yup... and in fairness... TY Hilton in space and at speed is not a target on who I'd want to see any FS have to close a great distance.

@tiamat63 said:

I preached against Manziel to anyone that would listen predraft and when those issues carried over into the pro's I made sure to highlight that.   Must have been because I hate A&M, huh?

Unlike Johnny I'm more willing to give Jabrill the benefit of the doubt.  Because he has the physical gifts, the work ethic and he's not an insufferable party douche. 

I'm pulling for him because, god damn do we need it.   I'm also on record as saying - it's not a pick I would have made. 

Well, one point about Peppers is that, even though he is only 3 games into his career....you have to ask if he is being used properly....or is Williams still experimenting with his skill set.

As I said earlier, one of the main things that was hoping for at least here in his rookie season was for him to really give us something in the return game.  So far, nada.   Not all his fault because almost every kickoff these days is a touchback, and they have been punting the ball out of bounds on him.  But he really had a chance in that last minute of the Colts game....and he cacked up a furball....and he knew it. 

Unlike Johnny I'm more willing to give Jabrill the benefit of the doubt.  Because he has the physical gifts, the work ethic and he's not an insufferable party douche. 

I'm pulling for him because, god damn do we need it.   I'm also on record as saying - it's not a pick I would have made. 

@mld-woody said:

Pretty much. Yeah

No.....we already corrected that record. 

@cainedesoulis said:

im not really sure where the hate is coming from on peppers he's made a couple rookie mistakes but has otherwise been okay. its because he played for michigan right?

Pretty much. Yeah

@tiamat63 said:

... angles aren't as much of an issue when you're as close to the line with a singular assignment like Jabrill was for the better part of two years. 

Exactly what I was getting at with my "space" comment.

On Peppers' tackling... I remember his highlight package including a number of considerably less than "form tackles". In fact I am hard pressed to remember a form tackle let alone a "big hit". I can remember a couple times when he bypassed opportunities to thump.

While the former can be dismissed by the fact he got them on the ground, it might have been a harbinger of the "space problem" we saw Sunday. The latter? Does Peppers have a taste for contact?

Woody? My bad memory? I know it's not my Big Blue bias...

@hoorta said:

From my viewpoint, the coverage was a lot tighter on Hilton in the second half. They should have done it a lot earlier....   

Is that all there was to it?  Just play tighter on him?   Were they giving him like 5-7 yards of space off the line of scrimmage?

To quote Sherlock Holmes:  Can it be just that absurdly simple?

@mudfly said:

We just cut a couple OSU players and I didnt hear a peep....both Hartline and Whitner were OSU stars that were just here recently.....

We also signed and cut an OSU DB this past year....cant remember his name though.....

OK, but we didn't draft them.  Would that have made a difference?