Nice style match, but no thanks.

@jiggins7919 said:

You don't? Lamar might not have the same absurd "top end" speed that Vick once did, but he definitely looks like the fastest guy on the field to me. And what Lamar DOES have is the acceleration that virtually nobody else on the planet can match. He can go from standing still to blazing speed in about one step, which makes him a danger to explode forward at any time. Any small crease, any designed run, any time he sees man coverage and the field is open....he goes. Also, he's a very skilled runner, and adept at avoiding big hits. He's especially devastating around the goal line. 

Now, obviously there's more to playing QB than running the ball. Lamar will definitely have to work hard to become a good "pocket thrower", but he's a guy KNOWN to work hard and also very humble. In other words, I wouldn't bet against him. I'm not sure I want him on our team, but I might if we somehow signed someone like Alex Smith who could take the immediate pressure off of him. I'm not in love with Sam Darnold, and Rosen might not want to play for us anyway. Additionally, I think I heard Rosen had a shoulder injury and a concussion history (I could be wrong). Not sure about the status of the shoulder, it could be nothing, but it's worth looking into. 

So if it's not Darnold, Lamar, or Rosen...the only guy is Baker Mayfield? I don't see the Oklahoma State guy being a high enough draft pick, sooooooo....what do we do? The more I think about it, the more I think we're in deep trouble. Darnold isn't coming out after that game, is he? I guess he'll still be a top 10 pick, so maybe he will enter the draft. At any rate, I don't want him. The more I think about it, the more I'm to the point of, "It's a veteran QB or bust" in 2018. 

Case Keenum, Sam Bradford, Alex Smith, Tyrod Taylor (least favorite), Teddy Twatwater (after thorough physical obviously), Jay Cutler, and probably another I'm forgetting about are the most probable choices. Some will be free agents, some might be released, others might require a trade. Whatever the case, we can make it happen. And we better because I personally don't see ANY QBs in the 2018 draft that will come in and stabilize our nightmare. Oh, and I seriously doubt that Keenum will be available because the Vikings aren't dumb and they'll sign him. Our best shot remains Alex Smith, and while I doubt we'll win 11 or 12 games like the Chiefs did when he first arrived, I don't think a 5-7 win increase is out of the question. 

Edit:  7 wins with Alex Smith depends solely on the return of Josh Gordon, which we all know probably won't happen (going by historical evidence). Additionally, we need someone opposite Josh who can reliably get down the field and make plays. Sorry Corey, that ain't you (not yet anyway). 

I'm not as down on Mayfield as you are. The other guys- sure, and Baker has his detractors. Let's watch playoffs, and then we can talk.   

@logicisforsquares said:

Going back and watching highlights of Vick, I forgot how much faster he was than everyone else. I don’t see that with Jackson.

You don't? Lamar might not have the same absurd "top end" speed that Vick once did, but he definitely looks like the fastest guy on the field to me. And what Lamar DOES have is the acceleration that virtually nobody else on the planet can match. He can go from standing still to blazing speed in about one step, which makes him a danger to explode forward at any time. Any small crease, any designed run, any time he sees man coverage and the field is open....he goes. Also, he's a very skilled runner, and adept at avoiding big hits. He's especially devastating around the goal line. 

Now, obviously there's more to playing QB than running the ball. Lamar will definitely have to work hard to become a good "pocket thrower", but he's a guy KNOWN to work hard and also very humble. In other words, I wouldn't bet against him. I'm not sure I want him on our team, but I might if we somehow signed someone like Alex Smith who could take the immediate pressure off of him. I'm not in love with Sam Darnold, and Rosen might not want to play for us anyway. Additionally, I think I heard Rosen had a shoulder injury and a concussion history (I could be wrong). Not sure about the status of the shoulder, it could be nothing, but it's worth looking into. 

So if it's not Darnold, Lamar, or Rosen...the only guy is Baker Mayfield? I don't see the Oklahoma State guy being a high enough draft pick, sooooooo....what do we do? The more I think about it, the more I think we're in deep trouble. Darnold isn't coming out after that game, is he? I guess he'll still be a top 10 pick, so maybe he will enter the draft. At any rate, I don't want him. The more I think about it, the more I'm to the point of, "It's a veteran QB or bust" in 2018. 

Case Keenum, Sam Bradford, Alex Smith, Tyrod Taylor (least favorite), Teddy Twatwater (after thorough physical obviously), Jay Cutler, and probably another I'm forgetting about are the most probable choices. Some will be free agents, some might be released, others might require a trade. Whatever the case, we can make it happen. And we better because I personally don't see ANY QBs in the 2018 draft that will come in and stabilize our nightmare. Oh, and I seriously doubt that Keenum will be available because the Vikings aren't dumb and they'll sign him. Our best shot remains Alex Smith, and while I doubt we'll win 11 or 12 games like the Chiefs did when he first arrived, I don't think a 5-7 win increase is out of the question. 

Edit:  7 wins with Alex Smith depends solely on the return of Josh Gordon, which we all know probably won't happen (going by historical evidence). Additionally, we need someone opposite Josh who can reliably get down the field and make plays. Sorry Corey, that ain't you (not yet anyway). 

@hoorta said:

I'm worried about his performance in 2018-20 Woody- and I have around 4-6 quarterbacks I'd draft in April before I'd even consider taking Lamar. In fact- I don't even have him on my board- period. Let someone else take a chance on this guy- I'm not going to. I rate him lower than Josh Allen, and if you've been following my war of words with Cal- I don't like Allen at all. I don't give a crap about what the pundits and draft geeks say- I have Lamar as a 4th round talent. 

If you want to start a Camp Jackson, be my guest. I'm not joining.

+1

@hoorta said:

He's no Michael Vick- not even close... There are no old running qbs in the NFL, and Jackson's pocket skills leave a lot to be desired.... 

Jackson is a 1 read than run QB.  50% completion rate doesn’t work   we have one of those and it’s not working 

@mld-woody said:

I don't think we're anywhere near the point of worrying about a QB's performance 10 years down the road

I'm worried about his performance in 2018-20 Woody- and I have around 4-6 quarterbacks I'd draft in April before I'd even consider taking Lamar. In fact- I don't even have him on my board- period. Let someone else take a chance on this guy- I'm not going to. I rate him lower than Josh Allen, and if you've been following my war of words with Cal- I don't like Allen at all. I don't give a crap about what the pundits and draft geeks say- I have Lamar as a 4th round talent. 

If you want to start a Camp Jackson, be my guest. I'm not joining.

@mld-woody said:

Vick did it

He's no Michael Vick- not even close... There are no old running qbs in the NFL, and Jackson's pocket skills leave a lot to be desired.... 

@mld-woody said:

Vick did it

Mike was THE best athlete on the field.   A QB with a rocket arm, quick release and ran a 4.3 with WR acceleration.

... that's not Lamar. 

@mld-woody said:

Vick did it

If Jackson could potentially be Mike Vick, I would be on board. Had the guy not had a penchant for fighting dogs, he would have had a much bigger career.

@hoorta said:

Lamar will make a fine running back\ kick returner in the pros. His qb game translates zero to a pro offense, & running around it's a quick trip to IR. 

Vick did it

@mld-woody said:

The football scouting expert has spoken. So it shall be

Lamar will make a fine running back\ kick returner in the pros. His qb game translates zero to a pro offense, & running around it's a quick trip to IR. 

@dutch-oven said:

 There's a definite portion of the Browns fanbase who is not down with that, ever. 

i never will understand that

@mld-woody said:

Correct, but we didn't really put him in a position to pick the ball off much. He was mainly setting the edge, blitzing, etc. In what we asked him to do, and how we wanted him to disrupt offensive gameplans, he was very effective

I guess the problem many people had with the Browns taking him in the first round was that he was a real "projection over production" type of guy.

But let's not dismiss the fact that he played at TTUN. There's a definite portion of the Browns fanbase who is not down with that, ever. I just want quality players, regardless of where they played college ball.

@dutch-oven said:

That's true, to a point. TTUN's coaching staff did him no favors pertaining to his future pro aspirations.

That being said, defensively, he really wasn't that productive. He produced next to no turnovers, correct?

Correct, but we didn't really put him in a position to pick the ball off much. He was mainly setting the edge, blitzing, etc. In what we asked him to do, and how we wanted him to disrupt offensive gameplans, he was very effective

@mld-woody said:

Well that wasn't on him in college. We moved him all around because he was our best player at 6 spots. He put the team first and hurt his draft stock. 

That's true, to a point. TTUN's coaching staff did him no favors pertaining to his future pro aspirations.

That being said, defensively, he really wasn't that productive. He produced next to no turnovers, correct?

@tiamat63 said:

There's no apology tour needed.   He's still a decent kid with physical gifts but the mental makeup is everything.   The goods news is that there's an off season to improve.   

Do I expect it? Sure.      To the extent that would warrant how high Peppers was drafted in relation to the impact he 'should' have on this defense....?  Not so much.  

What impact "should" someone have playing in a different zip code each play?

And of course he'll get better. As much as the athleticism is what you saw on the field, the coaches at Michigan loved his football IQ.

@dutch-oven said:

I'm just joking around...

Let's get him in the strong safety spot where he belongs, then we'll see.

But I'll be honest, I wanted nothing to do with the Browns taking him that high, he just screamed: "Jack of All Trades, Master of None" to me. A guy whose athletic ability allows him to do many things in college, but doesn't have a specific skill set to allow him to thrive in the pros.

Well that wasn't on him in college. We moved him all around because he was our best player at 6 spots. He put the team first and hurt his draft stock. 

@tiamat63 said:

There's no apology tour needed.   He's still a decent kid with physical gifts but the mental makeup is everything.   The goods news is that there's an off season to improve.   

Do I expect it? Sure.      To the extent that would warrant how high Peppers was drafted in relation to the impact he 'should' have on this defense....?  Not so much.  

I'm just joking around...

Let's get him in the strong safety spot where he belongs, then we'll see.

But I'll be honest, I wanted nothing to do with the Browns taking him that high, he just screamed: "Jack of All Trades, Master of None" to me. A guy whose athletic ability allows him to do many things in college, but doesn't have a specific skill set to allow him to thrive in the pros.

@dutch-oven said:

And Woody's 2017 Peppers Apology Tour rambles on toward 2018 with no let up!

There's no apology tour needed.   He's still a decent kid with physical gifts but the mental makeup is everything.   The goods news is that there's an off season to improve.   

Do I expect it? Sure.      To the extent that would warrant how high Peppers was drafted in relation to the impact he 'should' have on this defense....?  Not so much.