@bob806 said:

Well according the the QB rating gobbeldy- gook (which I'm not really a fan of) they had Elway at 60th all time through 2014. Elway is obviously way better than 60th on the eye test, and I'd put him in my top 10.

BUT....I maintain Elway vs Williams wasn't a good combo match-up in the Super Bowl. 

 https://www.profootballhof.com/all-time-passer-rating-2014/

Passer rating IS a bogus  statistic.  I mean that link you gave would have Chad Pennington, Jeff Garcia, David Garrard and Trent Green in the top 20 QBs all time.

And Starrr, Tarkenton, Unitas, Graham, Elway, Bradshaw...and others wouldn't even be in the Top 50.

And while Elway/Williams may not be on the top of the heap as far as SB starting QBs go.....it is far, far from the worst.  If you divided all SB games into Quartiles...it would probably be in the third quartile somewhere.

@the-gipper said:

I was talking about the combination of both qbs  and yes if your opinion is that Elway was not on the best quarterbacks of all time then yes your opinion is objectively wrong....as much as it pains me to say so 

Well according the the QB rating gobbeldy- gook (which I'm not really a fan of) they had Elway at 60th all time through 2014. Elway is obviously way better than 60th on the eye test, and I'd put him in my top 10.

BUT....I maintain Elway vs Williams wasn't a good combo match-up in the Super Bowl. 

 https://www.profootballhof.com/all-time-passer-rating-2014/

@bob806 said:

Hey now, you scolded me for not giving an opinion, now I give one, and it's wrong?

Remember, as great as Elway was, his SB wins came with Terrell Davis and a great rushing attack. Without that, they were AFC Kings and in Marty's head. 

Additionally, Doug Williams wasn't a top-tier guy, he just happened to have a great playoff run with the Redskins. 

I was talking about the combination of both qbs  and yes if your opinion is that Elway was not on the best quarterbacks of all time then yes your opinion is objectively wrong....as much as it pains me to say so 

@the-gipper said:

Elway  maybe one of the top 5 to 7 quarterbacks of all time so no that wouldn’t be one of the choices 

Hey now, you scolded me for not giving an opinion, now I give one, and it's wrong?

Remember, as great as Elway was, his SB wins came with Terrell Davis and a great rushing attack. Without that, they were AFC Kings and in Marty's head. 

Additionally, Doug Williams wasn't a top-tier guy, he just happened to have a great playoff run with the Redskins. 

@bob806 said:

Well if I had to pick one, I guess I'd say McMahon vs Eason. I happened to like McMahon, but obviously the Bears defense was the show. IMHO, the 1985 Bears was the best defense ever (for a single season). 

Tony Eason got hot at the right time, and that Patriots team was the 1st ever to win 3 road playoff games if I recall. 

The Theismann-Woodley matchup was the strike-shortened season, but that's a close 2nd I suppose.

Elway vs Doug Williams is honorable mention, but not on your list. 

Elway  maybe one of the top 5 to 7 quarterbacks of all time so no that wouldn’t be one of the choices 

@the-gipper said:

So what DO you consider the worst QB matchup to ever take place in a Super Bowl?  the following are the ONLY SB matchups where neither of the QBs have made the HOF..(or did not include the likes of  Peyton, Brady, BR, Rodgers,  Brees..future HOFers)

Brad Johnson/Rich Gannon    (Bucs vs Raiders)

Trent Dilfer/Kerry Collins  (Ravens vs. Giants)

Jim Plunkett vs. Ron Jaworski  (Raiders vs. Eagles)

Jim McMahon vs. Tony Eason  (Bears vs. Pats)

Joe Theisman vs. David Woodley (Redskins/Dolphins)

Joe Theisman vs. Jim Plunkett (Redskins/Raiders)

Joe Flacco vs. Colin Kaepernick  (Ravens/49ers)

so...what was the worst QB matchup?

Well if I had to pick one, I guess I'd say McMahon vs Eason. I happened to like McMahon, but obviously the Bears defense was the show. IMHO, the 1985 Bears was the best defense ever (for a single season). 

Tony Eason got hot at the right time, and that Patriots team was the 1st ever to win 3 road playoff games if I recall. 

The Theismann-Woodley matchup was the strike-shortened season, but that's a close 2nd I suppose.

Elway vs Doug Williams is honorable mention, but not on your list. 

@bob806 said:

No way Jose. Jim Plunkett was a winner, and Jaworski wasn't a slouch.  That should have been Sipe vs Jaworski, but....

Jaws was a good QB he was a freshman when I was a Sophomore at YSU he was part of the early turnaround of YSU football.

YSU was a D-II school back then but was a rare D-II invite to the Senior Bowl and was named the game MVP and impressed the NFL scouts  Just FYI.

@bob806 said:

No way Jose. Jim Plunkett was a winner, and Jaworski wasn't a slouch.  That should have been Sipe vs Jaworski, but....

So what DO you consider the worst QB matchup to ever take place in a Super Bowl?  the following are the ONLY SB matchups where neither of the QBs have made the HOF..(or did not include the likes of  Peyton, Brady, BR, Rodgers,  Brees..future HOFers)

Brad Johnson/Rich Gannon    (Bucs vs Raiders)

Trent Dilfer/Kerry Collins  (Ravens vs. Giants)

Jim Plunkett vs. Ron Jaworski  (Raiders vs. Eagles)

Jim McMahon vs. Tony Eason  (Bears vs. Pats)

Joe Theisman vs. David Woodley (Redskins/Dolphins)

Joe Theisman vs. Jim Plunkett (Redskins/Raiders)

Joe Flacco vs. Colin Kaepernick  (Ravens/49ers)

so...what was the worst QB matchup?

@the-gipper said:

What is, perhaps the Super Bowl that matched up the two "worst" QBs?

Jim Plunkett vs. Ron Jaworski  (Raiders vs. Eagles)

No way Jose. Jim Plunkett was a winner, and Jaworski wasn't a slouch.  That should have been Sipe vs Jaworski, but....

Brad Johnson/Rich Gannon    (Bucs vs Raiders)

Trent Dilfer/Kerry Collins  (Ravens vs. Giants)

Jim Plunkett vs. Ron Jaworski  (Raiders vs. Eagles)

Jim McMahon vs. Tony Eason  (Bears vs. Pats)

My opinion is that likely the worst two QBs to ever take a team to the Super Bowl were David Woodley and Rex Grossman.

Fair to say?

@hoorta said:

Yeah Gip I know we're talking QBs, but my memory of those Super Bowls is pretty foggy....   

One word:  Prevagen

@texasag1969 said:

jiggins-report this morning is that Green has an excellent chance of playing this Sunday.

@jiggins7919 said:

Bah....oh well. A good challenge for Denzel Ward! 

Speaking of receivers, does anybody find it odd that we don't throw it to Devalve more often? Man, I really thought he'd be a major factor this year. And Baker completed passes to like 9 different guys last week and Devalve still didn't get a ball. Weird right? I know Devalve was hurt early, but geez. 

Yeah Gip I know we're talking QBs, but my memory of those Super Bowls is pretty foggy....   

But regarding the Bengals, Green dressed for the Ravens game, and was on the sideline, so little surprise he's likely to play Sunday. 

PS Ward would be giving up a lot of height to the 6'4" Green, so don't be surprised at all if the Browns use the same tactic they used against Julio Jones, double him with taller defensive backs...  

@the-gipper said:

These are Super Bowls that pitted potential Hall of Fame matchups.  Potential because they are more recent and some of these guys will  or may get in, but it is just too early.

Which was the best matchup?:

SB44 Brees  vs. Peyton

SB 45 Rodgers vs.  Ben R.

SB 51 Brady vs. Ryan

SB 42/46  Eli vs. Brady

SB 49  Brady vs. Wilson

SB36  Warner (in)  vs. Brady

SB 50  Peyton vs. Cam Newton

SB 39  Brady vs.  McNabb

Warner vs. BR

This era of QB matchups gave us many more hotly contested games than the previous era  (Super Bowl) of my earlier post. Both Brady/Eli games,  Warner v. BR,   Brady v. Wilson, Warner v. Brady.   All games decided in the last minute. Ryan/Brady too...only OT SB.

@the-gipper said:

These are the Super Bowls that pitted  Hall of Fame QB vs. Hall of Fame QB......which matchup do you think was the best:

SB19   Montana vs.  Marino

SB 24  Montana vs. Elway

SB1.  Starr vs.  Dawson

SB 14  Stabler vs. Tarkenton

SB 32 Favre vs. Elway

SB 27/28  Aikman vs. Kelly

SB 6  Griese vs. Staubach

SB 9 Bradshaw vs. Tarkenton

SB 3  Namath vs. Unitas  (though Morrall started the game, Unitas finished)

SBs 10/13  Staubach vs. Bradshaw

Of these, the most competitive games between them were the two  Bradshaw/Staubach matchups.  Both  4 point games that went down to the wire.

Elway vs. Favre also competitive...one score game....Elway's helicopter move.  Some of the others ended up being pretty much blowout games.

@the-gipper said:

These are the Super Bowls that pitted  Hall of Fame QB vs. Hall of Fame QB......which matchup do you think was the best:

SB19   Montana vs.  Marino

SB 24  Montana vs. Elway

SB1.  Starr vs.  Dawson

SB 14  Stabler vs. Tarkenton

SB 32 Favre vs. Elway

SB 27/28  Aikman vs. Kelly

SB 6  Griese vs. Staubach

SB 9 Bradshaw vs. Tarkenton

SB 3  Namath vs. Unitas  (though Morrall started the game, Unitas finished)

SBs 10/13  Staubach vs. Bradshaw

Montana/Marino felt like a heavyweight fight. Joe already had one ring and was Mr. Efficient ... jab. jab, jab ... never made a mistake. Don was the young brash power puncher who was knocking everyone out in the first round.

Clearly two best QBs, 2 best offenses, 2 great coaches. 15-1 versus 14-2.

Most folks thought Danny Boy was going to knock out Smoking Joe ...

But in the end, it is a team game, and SF had the superior defense and a superior running game (Craig) and Joe was flawless and they won handily.

But a lot of hype leading up to that one ...

Zombo

Sid Luckman vs. Sammy Baugh  (the Peyton v. Brady of its day)

Sammy Baugh  vs.  Bob Waterfield  .....1945...won by Waterfield's Cleveland team

Otto Graham vs. Bob Waterfield....1950

Otto Graham vs.  Norm Van Brocklin

Otto Graham vs. Bobby Layne

Y.A. Tittle vs. Bart Starr

Y.A. Tittle vs. Johnny Unitas

Johnny Unitas vs. Bart Starr

Bart Starr vs. Norm Van Brocklin

@jiggins7919 said:

Bah....oh well. A good challenge for Denzel Ward! 

Speaking of receivers, does anybody find it odd that we don't throw it to Devalve more often? Man, I really thought he'd be a major factor this year. And Baker completed passes to like 9 different guys last week and Devalve still didn't get a ball. Weird right? I know Devalve was hurt early, but geez. 

We were not speaking of receivers in this thread, we were speaking about QB rivalries.

@texasag1969 said:

jiggins-report this morning is that Green has an excellent chance of playing this Sunday.

Bah....oh well. A good challenge for Denzel Ward! 

Speaking of receivers, does anybody find it odd that we don't throw it to Devalve more often? Man, I really thought he'd be a major factor this year. And Baker completed passes to like 9 different guys last week and Devalve still didn't get a ball. Weird right? I know Devalve was hurt early, but geez. 

Which was the best matchup?:

SB44 Brees  vs. Peyton

SB 45 Rodgers vs.  Ben R.

SB 51 Brady vs. Ryan

SB 42/46  Eli vs. Brady

SB 49  Brady vs. Wilson

SB36  Warner (in)  vs. Brady

SB 50  Peyton vs. Cam Newton

SB 39  Brady vs.  McNabb

Warner vs. BR

SB19   Montana vs.  Marino

SB 24  Montana vs. Elway

SB1.  Starr vs.  Dawson

SB 14  Stabler vs. Tarkenton

SB 32 Favre vs. Elway

SB 27/28  Aikman vs. Kelly

SB 6  Griese vs. Staubach

SB 9 Bradshaw vs. Tarkenton

SB 3  Namath vs. Unitas  (though Morrall started the game, Unitas finished)

SBs 10/13  Staubach vs. Bradshaw

@hoorta said:

Since you brought it up Gipper. I got a bad feeling about this. Shades of Cleveland Ghosts of the past. My POV is Mahomes is looking more and more like a young John Elway. Or you forget those AFC Championship games where the only thing in the way of Kosar and a Browns Super Bowl trip was the Broncos?  

Or switching sports to the NBA Championship, the Cavs of Daugherty, Nance, and Price had this guy from the Bulls standing in the way.....  

Baker will have to elevate to the Drew Brees potential I saw in him when I was on the draft this guy wagon earlier. And he's going to need a lot more offensive firepower before we can go toe to toe with KC.   

But Mahomes pretty well swallowed a cat on Monday night in  crunchtime, throwing 2 int's.  

So, I don't know.  Maybe what we have in Mayfield is the new Joe Montana.....and Mahomes...and these other young QBs are like Marino, Elway,  Anderson, Esiason,  etc.    All chasing him, never catching him.  He beat each of those guys in a Super Bowl.

@jiggins7919 said:

Some of the throws Goff and Mahomes were making the other night were just insane.  One of Goff's first TD's literally hit the receiver in the chest from about 25 yards away.  The WR had a step or two on the DB, running towards the side of the end zone, and BANG. A perfect out pattern that couldn't be executed any better.  This kind of play is what gets me excited about Baker Mayfield.  Why?  Because plays like that require silly accuracy.  A touch behind?  It's probably picked.  Too much in front?  Incomplete.  Not hard enough?  Picked again.  You get the point, and plays like this were just one of the reasons I wanted to draft Baker.  He, above the other candidates, has the ability to place the ball with NFL accuracy........

Yeah like "are these guys are really that young"? Wow, wow, wow.......

Those were not the hit one miss 6 throws. Amazing. And I put Goff ahead of Rodgers on my one FL team.