@ballpeen said:

Just a note....I remember when Dawson was young people wanted to cut him because they thought he had a weak leg.   LOL

I am good with Joseph at this point.  I think many include Gonzo missed kicks and attribute them to Joseph.  Look up Joseph's stats.  He didn't kick poorly.

An off-season and good coaching should help a lot. If he can start making consistent contact with the football, could be a good kicker. Sometimes the ball comes off squirrelly, makes him look worse than he is. That kick against the rats to win it was all power. How that went in is beyond me. ?

I am good with Joseph at this point.  I think many include Gonzo missed kicks and attribute them to Joseph.  Look up Joseph's stats.  He didn't kick poorly.

@darren15 said:

Thread for cuts by teams and possible players we should look at

Falcons released kicker Matt Bryant ....one of the most accurate and consistent kickers around ......make your move Dorsey

He's 43 years old.  I think I would rather stick with who we have, or at least go with someone who can play another 10 years.

@gumby73 said:

or Zona's next Scooby Wright to play ST's..Tanner is listed as the 3rd Sam LB behind Haason Reddick.so am not seeing him starting there, but Zona certainly needs LB talent, and Zona,Jets,NYG,Cinn,Minn & LAC's all put a bid in also..While i got you, who was the Mich.St DE/LB that motored up against the Buckeyes last season? Did he come out for this draft? EDit--BTW Scooby Wright is now playing for the Arizona Hotshots in new AAF league starting up this weekend.. 

I forget his name but didn't he break his leg in the bowl game? I still think that kid is going to be legit. I think he was big 10 dpoty. In my humble opinion he's going to be better than TJ Watt. He's as strong as TJ but has far better hips for dipping and bending around OL. And he's strong enough to hold up at the point against OL that dwarfed him in size. Amazingly strong kid for 260lbs. 

@hoorta said:

Regarding Collins... I still think it's mighty likely Collins either gets traded or cut. We only take a $2.5 million cap hit to release him. We sure aren't paying him $12 million his contract calls for this year for below average production... Now if he's willing to take a substantial pay cut- different story....  

i dont think that 12m is any consideration at all...i agree its steep (plenty of cap room), but his play is hardly below average.  started slow coming off an injury that ended his '17 campaign, but looked to be rounding into form as the season wore on.  at this moment, he is the most physical linebacker the browns have (not saying much, i know), but you cannot simply cut collins until we have a replacement level player.  This is the last year the browns can operate without cap constraints, so unless the browns absolutely need that extra 10m from colllins, makes no sense to jettison him just yet.   

seems to me, that opinions on him are very similar to mitchel schwartz.  kid got killed by fans until he left, then everyone started bitching about the crap RT play we got after.  looks like folks are expecting a lil too much, simply by saying he makes too much...if this is a valid logical point, then we should also be paying player out-performing their contracts?  

i get it...spend judiciously.  if/when dorsey gets an equal talent (even if this offseason) for less cost, great.  till then, can't let arguably the best player at the weakest position group on the team go.

ETA: 2014 collins had his best year, '18 was statistically his second best season.  

@hoorta said:

Regarding Vallejo- The Cards are a talentless mess... You know you're improving as a team when your cuts start getting picked up by the bottom feeders... 

Regarding Collins... I still think it's mighty likely Collins either gets traded or cut. We only take a $2.5 million cap hit to release him. We sure aren't paying him $12 million his contract calls for this year for below average production... Now if he's willing to take a substantial pay cut- different story....  

Yeah Collins is far too inconsistent for the amount the Browns are paying him.. it's about time to replace him anyhow....

@hoorta said:

Dawson is even older....

If we hired people based on how young they are we may as well of kept Zane Gonzales

@clevfan4life said:

Letting vallejo go was a mistake imo, but it prob points to collins and kirk going nowhere. There's a reason he got picked up instantaneously by the cards, he'll prob be a starting ilb'er for them next year as i think they're going back to the 34 following wilks departure

Regarding Vallejo- The Cards are a talentless mess... You know you're improving as a team when your cuts start getting picked up by the bottom feeders... 

Regarding Collins... I still think it's mighty likely Collins either gets traded or cut. We only take a $2.5 million cap hit to release him. We sure aren't paying him $12 million his contract calls for this year for below average production... Now if he's willing to take a substantial pay cut- different story....  

@hoorta said:

NAY!!! The NFL has changed the rules, as players have gotten better. Not so the NBA. They should have raised the basket height to at least 11' long ago. Some guys can about dunk without even having to jump.

Can't move the goal posts back any farther (us oldsters remember when they were on the goal line) so make 'em Arena League wide instead. Think that might make more teams go for two after a touchdown instead?

Larry, I LOL at the memory of receivers crashing into the goalposts. It took brass balls to run a post pattern!...Gary Collins' signature play!!

Mike

@dutch-oven said:

Then cross him off the list then! ?

........from the grestest sports movie of all time.

@clevfan4life said:

Theres a reason he got picked up instantaneously by the cards, he'll prob be a starting ilb'er for them next year as i think they're going back to the 34 following wilks departure

or Zona's next Scooby Wright to play ST's..Tanner is listed as the 3rd Sam LB behind Haason Reddick.so am not seeing him starting there, but Zona certainly needs LB talent, and Zona,Jets,NYG,Cinn,Minn & LAC's all put a bid in also..While i got you, who was the Mich.St DE/LB that motored up against the Buckeyes last season? Did he come out for this draft? EDit--BTW Scooby Wright is now playing for the Arizona Hotshots in new AAF league starting up this weekend.. 

@hoorta said:

so make 'em Arena League wide instead. Think that might make more teams go for two after a touchdown instead?

I thought they might have done that, but instead they moved the extra point back farther.  -  It would also make you go for the first down in windy conditions.  

@orion said:

IMO they should do away with field goals completely.  You have one guy that does the punts and kickoffs.  Extra points are from scrimmage.  1 point from the 1 yard line.  2 points is from the 5 yard line.

OR

If you must have FG's, then you cannot attempt one unless you reach the 30 yard line.  No more 50+ yard FG's.

All in favor say Aye.   All opposed remain quiet.  -  The Ayes have it.

NAY!!! The NFL has changed the rules, as players have gotten better. Not so the NBA. They should have raised the basket height to at least 11' long ago. Some guys can about dunk without even having to jump.

Can't move the goal posts back any farther (us oldsters remember when they were on the goal line) so make 'em Arena League wide instead. Think that might make more teams go for two after a touchdown instead?

@darren15 said:

Doesn't some guy called Phil Dawson have a contract expiring soon also ?

Dawson is even older....

@nickers said:

I'd rather go with a young kid with upside... I'm tired of paying end of the road vets who perform like Devon Bess , Dwayne Bowe and Kenny Shitt..

I agree with you with the exception of kickers.  I think I'd rather pay for someone reliable then hoping that the young kid gets better.  

OR

If you must have FG's, then you cannot attempt one unless you reach the 30 yard line.  No more 50+ yard FG's.

All in favor say Aye.   All opposed remain quiet.  -  The Ayes have it.

@runyon27 said:

Bryant is a top notch kicker, even at 44. He is an upgrade over Joseph, every time Joseph kicks I have serious doubts he will make it. That said he obviously would only be a short term solution. But he is an upgrade over Joseph.

Joseph was a soccer player that's trying to be an NFL kicker...he can, in theory get better. Has a huge leg,hasn't learned to control it yet. In my estimation, I hope it's due to kicking a sphere vs kicking a football his entire life. I'm willing to give him a shot to figure out that difference.

Bryant knows how to kick a football for sure. But he's on the wrong side of age, spoiled with good weather, and already shown significant decline in leg strength.

I don't think its time to start bringing in declining FAs, regardless of position. A declining pass rusher in a playoff push, sure. Now? 

As we've seen this season, there's no such thing as an automatic kicker anymore. They moved back the XP, people lose their minds missing an "XP".  Hell, stools paid Boswell for last year, and he was one of the worst kickers this year. But they paid him, couldn't cut him.

Bring in competition. Best kicker wins, don't care about the Jersey #

@the-gipper said:

Lou Groza is not...due to death....I believe.

Then cross him off the list then! ?

Bring a young guy in to push & compete with Joseph.

Mike