Here are 4 QB trade options for Bears to move past Mitchell Trubisky

@jiggins7919 said:

Ability to read defenses and throw with anticipation are so key. It's why I like the kid out of LSU so much, and why I'd take him over Tua. 

In his family I think he grew up reading plays before he read books.??

@flugel said:

I like him too Jigs!   I'm hearing and reading a lot of good stuff about his leadership intangibles.  Did you know the same LSU QB you speak of transferred out of Ohio State when Haskins beat him out last year?  

Speaking of the college QBs with limited starting experience - looks like Haskins should have stayed in school another year...

I had no idea. Dang! 

@tour2ma said:

lol... thanks phor the Dobler memory....

...but I don't remember anyone pimping Trubs harder than Gipper prior to the 2017 drapht...

... oph course that was then...

Gotta unstick this "ph" key....

Except that Ghoolie pimped him more than I did. (and don't forget his Paxton Lynch pimping).   As did Stan....he just didn't want to commit to him being a top draft pick. 

But, no, the ph key is the perfect key for you.   Ph as in phony.   You yabber about me maybe getting something wrong on a matter of talent evaluation (which is still completely up in the air....yet you are too craven to put yourself on the line with a matter of talent evaluation).

@mjp28 said:

Wrong again.  Someone else brought it up I was replying on the dangers of any quarterback coming in green out of college and trying to run an NFL team. (they were right)

Maybe someone else brought him up....but you have perpetuated it. 

The Kizer and Trubisky situations are similar, I personally think that Trubisky is better.

That is a complete no brainer.

NFL quarterback the hardest job in team sports.

Well...that is an opinion...that I am not sure about.  Maybe, maybe not.

I thought you were better than that try reading the thread again.    

I have read all I need to of you apparently defending Kizer as merely a guy that was just thrown to the wolves too early.  Kizer was prey to the wolves because he is the QB equivalent of a muskox. There was nothing in his nature that said he was ever going to be anything but fodder for the predators of the NFL.

@tour2ma said:

lol... thanks phor the Dobler memory....

...but I don't remember anyone pimping Trubs harder than Gipper prior to the 2017 drapht...

... oph course that was then...

Gotta unstick this "ph" key....

You're welcome!  And, you are correct about who his #1 fan was. 

I'll give a funny Conrad Dobler story that took place when he was allegedly winding down his career to the best of my recollection.  There was a Buffalo Bill that was on a radio show after Conrad Dobler finished playing there.  If memory serves me right it was OT Joe Devlin. And he was asked what it was like to be his teammate.  He said "I'll give you an idea of how crazy and fun the guy was.   He got me and a couple other guys to sneak out of training camp at night to the nightlife.  Conrad would drink funnels with the kids at the bar, he would drink out of people's shoes and 1 cute girl got him to drink beer through her toes.  He kept us out til the place closed; but he still woke ready up ready to practice early the next day."  Then he was asked?  Does he really bite people's fingers in piles?  "That was only done to guys dumb enough to put their hands/fingers inside his helmet - where Conrad deemed it time to protect his eyes. Pretty smart when you think about it..."

@flugel said:

Glad I finished my beverage before I got to that last part.   And who woulda thunk I'd stick up more for Trubisky in this thread than Hoorta...  

lol... thanks phor the Dobler memory....

...but I don't remember anyone pimping Trubs harder than Gipper prior to the 2017 drapht...

... oph course that was then...

Gotta unstick this "ph" key....

@jiggins7919 said:

Ability to read defenses and throw with anticipation are so key. It's why I like the kid out of LSU so much, and why I'd take him over Tua. 

I am so with you on that...

@mjp28 said:

Before we put the Kizer vs Trubisky debate to bed hopefully forever I noticed one minor but kind of important thing.

Ages,. Kizer 21, 22 Trubisky 23, 24, 25 DeShone was gone before Trubisky started in the NFL.

As a general rule age can be an important factor before you throw a kid into the fire of NFL life.  Experience is also important I think it rare when a college kid is ready to run an NFL attack with professional defensive players trying to kill you they're all better than just a few good ones in college.

You don't often find a Bernie Kosar with good college experience a NC ring in the supplemental draft who wants to play for his hometown team.

So all of you kids out there stay in school and study..... damnit.

Oh Gump I did put this thing to bed until you just brought it back up.

@the-gipper said:

You are the one that is way behind.  You are the one bringing up fucking DeShone Kizer with your caveman thinking.  Let that stinking corpse rot.   

Wrong again.  Someone else brought it up I was replying on the dangers of any quarterback coming in green out of college and trying to run an NFL team. (they were right)

The Kizer and Trubisky situations are similar, I personally think that Trubisky is better.

NFL quarterback the hardest job in team sports.

I thought you were better than that try reading the thread again.    

@tour2ma said:

Here's the thing... you cannot take a QB prospect early with no video evidence as to what is between his ears... and that is what the Bears (and Gipper) did with Mitch.

Glad I finished my beverage before I got to that last part.   And who woulda thunk I'd stick up more for Trubisky in this thread than Hoorta...  

@mjp28 said:

Nostalgic?    0-16 wasn't nostalgic is was freaking painful, this is/was more like an autopsy of the deceased trying to put together what happened and why.

Kizer was asked to be a rookie savior and was just not ready to walk on water yet.  Hopefully this chapter of BROWNS football is dead and buried......with the corpse.

Try and keep up Gip.

You are the one that is way behind.  You are the one bringing up fucking DeShone Kizer with your caveman thinking.  Let that stinking corpse rot. 

@the-gipper said:

I said he would be Top Ten draft pick.  The Bears, a professional NFL organization with well paid scouts and GMs, agreed.  If the Bears had not taken him in the Top Ten.....someone else also with paid scouts and GMs  would have.  The Bears traded up to #2 to get him because they knew that other teams would have taken him before they had the chance.

AND on top of that now they have no first round picks in 2020.  They rolled the dice and came up craps...... apparently, we'll see if he pulls out of this chapter.

I've seen some Chicago articles on who would be a good second round pick for quarterback.  Then you"waste" another pick for a project quarterback instead of filling another need.  (sounds like the old BROWNS FO tactics)

@jiggins7919 said:

Ability to read defenses and throw with anticipation are so key. It's why I like the kid out of LSU so much, and why I'd take him over Tua. 

I like him too Jigs!   I'm hearing and reading a lot of good stuff about his leadership intangibles.  Did you know the same LSU QB you speak of transferred out of Ohio State when Haskins beat him out last year?  

Speaking of the college QBs with limited starting experience - looks like Haskins should have stayed in school another year...

@the-gipper said:

It is idiocy to wax nostalgic for DeShone Kizer....or to believe that he was ever any good....or will ever be any good.

XFL may be in his future, maybe.

Nostalgic?    0-16 wasn't nostalgic is was freaking painful, this is/was more like an autopsy of the deceased trying to put together what happened and why.

Kizer was asked to be a rookie savior and was just not ready to walk on water yet.  Hopefully this chapter of BROWNS football is dead and buried......with the corpse.

Try and keep up Gip.

@tour2ma said:

Here's the thing... you cannot take a QB prospect early with no video evidence as to what is between his ears... and that is what the Bears (and Gipper) did with Mitch.

I said he would be Top Ten draft pick.  The Bears, a professional NFL organization with well paid scouts and GMs, agreed.  If the Bears had not taken him in the Top Ten.....someone else also with paid scouts and GMs  would have.  The Bears traded up to #2 to get him because they knew that other teams would have taken him before they had the chance.

And it still remains to be seen how well he will turn out.  And the fact is, there is NO video evidence of what is between the ears of any QB that is drafted anywhere. Or if there is, it is very, very rare....you can count on one hand those QBs that came out in the last 40 years that were considered to be that. (Elway, Manning, Luck...and that's about it).  Look at what has happened to other highly touted, highly drafted QBs who have been drafted that high:   Wentz, Mariota, Winston, Stafford, Bortles, Darnold, even Cam somewhat, even Baker....a whole list of them. All having struggles  If you can have video evidence of what is between a players ears....then why did Russel Wilson have to wait for the third round.....Montana until the third round.  Favre until the end of Round 2.  Rodgers went like #24, ....not to even speak of ole #199. 

A guy like Favre even had to be traded to be put in the right situation for him to shine. Kurt Warner, HOF....not even drafted.  Predicting who will and will not become an outstanding QB is a crap shoot, and a lot of guys a lot smarter than you....and even me, have made mistakes in that area. 

@mjp28 said:

On that oh-16 team he really didn't have much of a chance to show what he could do. Could he have benefited from another full year at ND definitely.

Should he have got a school paid $1M+ insurance policy and spent a year improving his draft status and a better deal,  Absolutely.

DeShone Kizer signed a 4 year, $4,948,416 contract with the Cleveland Browns, including a $1,738,848 signing bonus, $2,428,776 guaranteed, and an average annual salary of $1,237,104. In 2019, Kizer will earn a base salary of $914,856, while carrying a cap hit of $914,856.

Would he have done better on a better team his rookie year..... we'll never really know, he didn't do much at GB either.

The brief career of DeShone Kizer:

And Mitchell Trubisky:

It is idiocy to wax nostalgic for DeShone Kizer....or to believe that he was ever any good....or will ever be any good.

XFL may be in his future, maybe.

@tour2ma said:

 you cannot take a QB prospect early with no video evidence as to what is between his ears... and that is what the Bears (and Gipper) did with Mitch.

Mitch's between the ears, played all of, 2 pro style defenses in 2016 at college 1) Virginia Tech at UNC= 13 of 33 with 2 picks in loss.. 2) Bowl game loss to Stanford= 23 of 39 with 2 picks.. Mitch still fails to read disguised coverages.. Just as Bake & Josh Allen & Darnold are just seeing it from the pro defensive tape monsters.. 

Ages,. Kizer 21, 22 Trubisky 23, 24, 25 DeShone was gone before Trubisky started in the NFL.

As a general rule age can be an important factor before you throw a kid into the fire of NFL life.  Experience is also important I think it rare when a college kid is ready to run an NFL attack with professional defensive players trying to kill you they're all better than just a few good ones in college.

You don't often find a Bernie Kosar with good college experience a NC ring in the supplemental draft who wants to play for his hometown team.

So all of you kids out there stay in school and study..... damnit.

@jiggins7919 said:

almost impossible to get on track against this defense...at Foxboro...in the rain. 

Oh shit. The jinx is never f'n ending!?

@texasag1969 said:

It's deja vu all over again!?

EDIT: Don't you guys have any local witches who can ward off the evil spell on the Browns???

I'm trying everything I know! Lol. 

I simply didn't see this happening to Baker. I honestly thought we wouldn't see the days of struggling qb's for another 15 years. Now, that might still be true, but it's almost impossible to get on track against this defense...at Foxboro...in the rain. 

@hoorta said:

If you're comparing Kizer and Trubisky's college  careers, there's no  comparison. I scouted both of them  a bunch, and I was on record  Kizer totally  sucked at  Notre  Dame, and had bust written  all over  him. Not so  with Mitch.

I did think the  Bears made a  mistake trading  up that high for Trubisky. 

I'll  agree with  jiggins  that currently Maxfield  is showing  some distressing  Deshone tendencies, but Kizer never  came close to  stringing together a  series of  good  games  like  Baker did last year.

It looks like Baker had more of a Heisman Trophy-type Banquet circuit after his rookie year than he did the off-season leading up to the draft.  He had to stay in shape, put football 1st in the off=season for the draft, and then he had to compete to start throughout training camp... After setting the rookie record for TD passes despite only 13 starts - Baker seemed to feel like he proved what he set out to prove.

What came next?   The volume of commercials NO Cleveland Brown ever has. Can we go a college football Saturday or NFL Sunday without seeing Baker in a commercial?  He also got married this off-season.  Last but not least, we landed OBJ which probably had him feeling Easy Street ahead.  He also lost the continuity of the position coach that had him far more fundamentally sound than I've seen this year throwing off the  backward hops while running around in the pocket holding onto the ball way too long (complete opposite of the guy that got rid of the ball quickly and accurately in 2018).

He is NOT DeShone Kizer.  Kizer's college coach said Kizer wasn't ready for the NFL Game.  Baker's college coach said he was the ideal 1st round QB.  As much as Colon Cowhyde's REAL Franchise QB Sam Darnold epitomized flawless passing despite watching The 13 Ghosts on every play Monday Night - Baker will find his way back to what has worked over the mental errors and evils of holding onto the ball too long. 

Trubisky led the Bears to what should have been the go ahead points in the playoffs before Parkey's foot parkey'd the Bears into hibernation. This year, his offensive line has been horrible while some of his favorite targets have missed games to injury. He's not a miracle worker; but I've seen evidence the Bears can win with him as recently as last year. 

Hey, I predicted Lamar Jackson would suck!  How am I doing on that one?  We can keep excusing every win they have - but once upon a time this guy won a Heisman Trophy regardless of the style of QB he played making Louisville far more relevant than you see them today.  The same Seattle team that forced 4 turnovers on us - had ZERO solutions for him.  Last year they were 4-5 with Joey Bottaflacco and they surged to playoffs after he took over at QB with the exact same teammates on offense and defense - hate it or not. They weren't keeping drives alive at all until the QB change, which got them all the way up to #2 in the NFL in rushing (which relieved tired tired legs on their defense to the extent both sides played better).  YES, I know it wasn't passing but the change at 1 position cpr'd 4-5 football into 10-6 football. This year they're 5-2 even after the "wait til they play Seattle AT SEATTLE."   While his style is high risk and reckless in every way - nobody ever gets a clean shot on him much like Russell Wilson behind a much better offensive line than Wilson usually has.  If this was still the same NFL I grew up watching, I would be more inclined to agree with all those thinking he won't last - but it isn't... Good news?   We kicked HIS asss into what I thought he'd be with multiple turnovers and horrible passing stats.

@nickers said:

theyre all dead!!

I could swear some of you claim to be married to one.??