@jiggins7919 said:

That's the same stance I've been sharing all week, and I'm as frustrated as anyone on the planet regarding our team's performance. Even being frustrated, annoyed, and plain let down...I still believe there's enough ability on this team to beat an opponent with uncertainty at the QB position. 

Here's the fear that several local media members are sharing:  The problem is our coach, and he's looking more and more overwhelmed. If our coach is making in-game personnel errors, you can bet the players know way more than we do, and if he loses the respect of the players, it's a bad situation. 

The funny thing is, winning cures all, and while our coach has made some questionable calls and time management decisions, winning will make that all go away. At this point, it won't even MATTER if we win an ugly game 6-3, we just need the freakin W. Ultimately the games come down to the players, and we all know our coach isn't the one fumbling the ball, throwing inaccurate passes, not securing the ball in the rain, or clanging the ball off his hands directly to the defender. Coaches don't turn it over, we have to PLAY better. 

And I think we will. But know this, the heartbeat of our offense is NOT Nick Chubb, it's Baker Mayfield. We simply MUST find a way to get Baker comfortable with throwing the ball to the intermediate areas of the damn field. Yes, I'd love to see more bombs, but those are low percentage plays. We need Baker getting a feel and nailing down his accuracy on the intermediate level of the field because those passes aren't there near as much as last year.

We're seeing way too many "bubble screens" that never seem to work, and those bubble screens are just RIPE for penalty opportunities because you can have a WR holding, blocking too early, an OL down the field, a pick, or whatever. We are NOT disciplined enough to run pick plays and that's unfortunate because so many other teams run them just fine. 

We need to get Baker comfortable, and maybe that's easier said than done, but Nick Chubb is GOING to be there, what we NEED is Baker getting in a groove and making precision passes that are longer than 4 yards. 

I'll make one last point and then mercifully stop writing. We need our defensive line to show OUT tomorrow. I mean just DOMINATE. Myles Garrett is my favorite player and he's having a terrific season so far. As I've said before, I want MORE from him. I want to see Garrett completely wreck a game and make life miserable for this new QB. We also need way more from the interior of the line, and we need Vernon to make a game-changing play. Vernon is coming off his two best games, and we need a strip sack, a 3rd down sack, or something BIG. We have to have our defense make life miserable for the Broncos and maybe even SCORE a TD to help out the offense. 

Steve Wilks MUST resist sending too much pressure. Tom Brady's biggest pass play came on 3rd and 10, right after we pulled within 17-10. It was a very simple screen pass to White, who took the 4 yard toss and jaunted 55 yards...effectively ending the game. These are the kind of throws the inexperienced Brandon Allen can easily make, so we'll have to resist sending too much pressure because we've been devastated by several long screens at KEY moments this season. 

i still say try and make a deal to get this kid from ohio state....get rid of hunt....we get this young kid to play with garrett, look out....garrett can't do it alone...it was nice to hear vernon's name mentioned last week....but he is not what i expected.from him so far...we need to get this kid.....we don't need hunt...just another skill position player...we don't need anymore skilled position players on offense...

@jiggins7919 said:

I couldn't watch much of the game live, but I re-watched it afterwards. Did the announcers say this? Everything I heard from podcasts said nothing about Callaway outplaying anyone, but that his playing time was the result of Higgins being in the doghouse with Kitchens due publicly stating he was healthy and he didn't know why the coach didn't play him (this info contradicted Kitchens' statement and made us look us look foolish). 

Even if the announcers DID say this, or even if our coaches provided this, I don't believe it. The ugly game was obviously 3 games ago, but Callaway didn't show much against Seattle or New England. 

Maybe he has practiced well, but I don't trust him at all. I trust Rashard to be in the right place at the right time, and so does Baker. I don't mind Callaway having a package of plays, but he better not be playing more than Higgins because he is providing basically nothing. 

I feel NOT having Higgins available was very damaging to our offense. Now that he's back, IMHO he MUST play a much larger part than Callaway. Higgins works very well with Baker & has his trust. He also CATCHES the damn ball when it comes his way.

Mike

@jiggins7919 said:

Some of the board members laughed at me (nothing new, hehe) but I firmly believe the loss of Duke Johnson really hurt us. Duke was quite adept at operating in the middle of the field

As you stated earlier Baker isn't throwing the check down. Its not that Hilliard and chubb aren't capable of catching checkdown passes. They both are. Remember all the way back to the first preseason game very first drive where the browns offense gave us a glimpse of what they could do and every one got excited.  4 out the 6 passes were of the checkdown variety. For whatever reason baker is not throwing them.  It would not matter if duke were on the team he also wouldn't be getting thrown checkdown passes. It's not personnel related other than one person won't throw it.

@clevelandwantsplayoffs said:

If you watched the Patriots game you would’ve known that Callaway has been outplaying Higgins in practice and worked his way up the depth chart to the 3. That abysmal 49ers game was 2 losses ago.
Callaway has AB type quickness. We just need to get the ball in his hands.

I couldn't watch much of the game live, but I re-watched it afterwards. Did the announcers say this? Everything I heard from podcasts said nothing about Callaway outplaying anyone, but that his playing time was the result of Higgins being in the doghouse with Kitchens due publicly stating he was healthy and he didn't know why the coach didn't play him (this info contradicted Kitchens' statement and made us look us look foolish). 

Even if the announcers DID say this, or even if our coaches provided this, I don't believe it. The ugly game was obviously 3 games ago, but Callaway didn't show much against Seattle or New England. 

Maybe he has practiced well, but I don't trust him at all. I trust Rashard to be in the right place at the right time, and so does Baker. I don't mind Callaway having a package of plays, but he better not be playing more than Higgins because he is providing basically nothing. 

@jiggins7919 said:

You really going to dock me for the spelling? Cmon bro. ? That's my autocorrect. 

Callaway wasn't just lost, either. He was completely abysmal. The dropped TD-INT? Not knowing where to go on the reverse? 

That being said, I think the situation has resolved itself and we'll be seeing Higgins more and more. We might have a package of plays for him because of the deep ability, but Higgins will be primary. 

Nah it just looks ugly and doesn’t help when you’re trying to make a point..

If you watched the Patriots game you would’ve known that Callaway has been outplaying Higgins in practice and worked his way up the depth chart to the 3. That abysmal 49ers game was 2 losses ago.
Callaway has AB type quickness. We just need to get the ball in his hands.

 Don’t get me wrong, I like Higgins and he’s a great/tough player but he’s not the same type of weapon that AC is.

You really going to dock me for the spelling? Cmon bro. ? That's my autocorrect. 

Spell Callahan  "Callohan": 

@calfoxwc said:

Anyways, one other problem - it seems, and a few defensive players have alleged it, that there are "tells" on the Browns offense.

Excellent observation, and I mentioned this a while ago in one of my long, semi-coherent posts. For example, remember that interception Baker had in the endzone against Seattle? The defender Griffin said he knew it was coming and that we were predictable. He went on to say that he was calling out our plays throughout the game. 

I'm not totally sure I believe this for a couple of reasons. First, the interception in talking about was the result of a terrible throw. Landry was actually open, and a good toss low and inside would have yielded a score. So I don't think he knew it was coming, he just got lucky Baker made a bad throw and the pass got popped up. Additionally, we scored 28 points that game and should have had more. If he truly knew what we were doing, he didn't do much to stop it. We (of course) stopped ourselves (*sigh*). 

   Anyways, one other problem - it seems, and a few defensive players have alleged it, that there are "tells" on the Browns offense.

They tend to know what the Browns have called by the setup, situation, whatever.  It's usually the offensive line. The linemen seem to have their weight forward in their set = straight ahead run -.... or tend to have their weight a bit offset, to their left side or right, ...

weight backwards, probably a pocket setup for a pass.

Just my imagination maybe. But in defending Kitchens - it's easier to look like a genius play caller when your oline can effectively block any play you call.

Just thinkin something goofy out loud, I reckon.

@hoorta said:

Hunt  shows  up next  week against the  Bills. No lie Jimmy operates  out of a clean pocket  most of the time

He does, very true, but I will say he's pretty good at getting rid of it, too. JG doesn't do a lot patting the ball and dicking around, but yeah...clean pocket totally helps with that! 

And yes, I'm very excited about Hunt, and I actually think he's going to have an immediate impact. I want to see some two back formations with our different RBs, maybe even the wishbone again. Hunt is one of the rare talents that can take 1 yard passes and make them first downs. We NEED stuff like that in the worst way. 

@clevelandwantsplayoffs said:

And the guy who beat Higgins for the 3rd spot name is spelled “Callaway”.. he was lost in his first game action of the year? Big surprise there... 

You really going to dock me for the spelling? Cmon bro. ? That's my autocorrect. 

Callaway wasn't just lost, either. He was completely abysmal. The dropped TD-INT? Not knowing where to go on the reverse? The wrong routes? I realize he wasn't practicing because of the suspension and high ankle sprain, but I would really have liked to see him more mentally with it. It's inexcusable. After the 49's game, it was Kitchens who messed up by not playing Higgins more instead of Callaway. 

That being said, I think the situation has resolved itself and we'll be seeing Higgins more and more. I'm actually waiting for us to part ways with Callaway. I want to be SO wrong about this, but I have that nagging feeling like the kid can't get out of his own way and make good decisions. He really should've had a better handle on the playbook, regardless if he was running the Z or the Y. I mean, Callaway had a pretty damn good rookie year. Many of us hoped/expected for him to build off that, but as the case with basically everyone on our offense, he's having difficulty...majorly...and I would not expect to see him much at all tomorrow. We might have a package of plays for him because of the deep ability, but Higgins will be primary. 

@hoorta said:

Von Miller was  hoping Allen can duplicate  Minshew  magic, I hope he plays like George the Gardiner. 

I expected Brownies to beat the Jets, but there was a teeny part of my brain that thought, "Oh crap. This no-name QB is about to beat us on national tv."  Obviously we trounced them, mostly due to the defense, and I believe we're going to have a very similar performance tomorrow. 

@clevelandwantsplayoffs said:

Duke Johnson was a weapon.. that we got a nice 3rd rounder for. It was no surprise what we lost. Kareem Hunt suits up soon..

And the guy who beat Higgins for the 3rd spot name is spelled “Callaway”.. he was lost in his first game action of the year? Big surprise there... 

Brady is the GOAT and Jimmy G is the GOATs disciple who also has a beast OLine and can see the field via a clean pocket. That is all.

Hunt  shows  up next  week against the  Bills. No lie Jimmy operates  out of a clean pocket  most of the time.

@calfoxwc said:

it doesn't help the broncs that this happened: (btw, I hope the tv shows John Elway with a migraine during the game)

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001072003/article/broncos-place-qb-joe-flacco-neck-on-injured-reserve

"Brandon Allen, who has never taken a regular-season snap, gets the start Sunday for the Broncos against Myles Garrett and the Cleveland Browns. Denver promoted Brett Rypien off the practice squad to serve as the backup.

Allen, a former sixth-round pick by the Jacksonville Jaguars, appears in line to get several starts as the Broncos wait for second-round rookie Drew Lock to come off IR. Denver is tentatively expected to have Lock begin practicing after the team's Week 10 bye."

I had to look  it up Cal. Of course the Broncos  wouldn't go into a game with just one qb- their  backup (5th string guy) is Brett Rypien. Also  zero  game experience. Did his dad play  for the Browns sometime? (looked  it up, sure did)They get little  sympathy from  this corner, we've been  down that road too. 

Von Miller was  hoping Allen can duplicate  Minshew  magic, I hope he plays like George the Gardiner. 

@jiggins7919 said:

Some of the board members laughed at me (nothing new, hehe) but I firmly believe the loss of Duke Johnson really hurt us. Duke was quite adept at operating in the middle of the field, and this is where JG and Brady do the bulk of their damage. We also HAVE to bench Calloway until he masters the playbook. Higgins has to be in over Calloway until he is ready. 

Duke Johnson was a weapon.. that we got a nice 3rd rounder for. It was no surprise what we lost. Kareem Hunt suits up soon..

And the guy who beat Higgins for the 3rd spot name is spelled “Callaway”.. he was lost in his first game action of the year? Big surprise there... 

Brady is the GOAT and Jimmy G is the GOATs disciple who also has a beast OLine and can see the field via a clean pocket. That is all.

@the-gipper said:

All fair points.    But beyond that it seems that this offense is not designed to  even have the chance to have a checkdown pass, or an outlet pass.  But I don't see us EVER doing that.

I have memories of Joe Montana running the WCO, and I have visions of Baker being able to things very similarly.  But I don't see how this offensive design really facilitates his skills all that much.

So, you're actually making another good point, and that's our offense contained too many down field routes and not enough short, quick ones to account for impending blitzes. This has somewhat changed in latter games, but it was especially noticeable in early games, including the awful Titans debacle. 

To me, it seems like we're really struggling to find a balance between throwing short and going a bit down the field. We still don't feature true "bombs" very often, ever notice that? In fact, I can only think of a handful of times Baker chucked it down the field, and most of those were at the end of games and weren't even close. We had a pretty long shot to OBJ against the Pats that resulted in a great catch, but again, game was over. 

Let's get some of those beautiful completions earlier, ya know? ?

@jiggins7919 said:

Some of the board members laughed at me (nothing new, hehe) but I firmly believe the loss of Duke Johnson really hurt us. Duke was quite adept at operating in the middle of the field, and this is where JG and Brady do the bulk of their damage. We also don't have a dominant TE who owns the middle, and this further hurts us. Njoku isn't dominant, but we definitely miss him in the red zone and down the seam. 

When you watch our passing attack, you notice that everything looks so LABORED. We don't seem to have a bread and butter route or a go-to play. I detest our "bunch formation" and all that does is crowd parts of the field. We also HAVE to bench Calloway until he masters the playbook. He was totally lost against the 49's and he hurt us further afterward. Higgins has to be in over Calloway until he is ready. 

All fair points.    But beyond that it seems that this offense is not designed to  even have the chance to have a checkdown pass, or an outlet pass.  But I don't see us EVER doing that.

I have memories of Joe Montana running the WCO, and I have visions of Baker being able to things very similarly.  But I don't see how this offensive design really facilitates his skills all that much.

@texasag1969 said:

EDIT: It would help if we practiced with the intent of those receivers actually being the primary targets while staring the defenses into thinking otherwise. Brady is a master at it. I think JG at SF does the same thing quite often. Steal the stuff that works on the great teams and use it wisely.

Some of the board members laughed at me (nothing new, hehe) but I firmly believe the loss of Duke Johnson really hurt us. Duke was quite adept at operating in the middle of the field, and this is where JG and Brady do the bulk of their damage. We also don't have a dominant TE who owns the middle, and this further hurts us. Njoku isn't dominant, but we definitely miss him in the red zone and down the seam. 

When you watch our passing attack, you notice that everything looks so LABORED. We don't seem to have a bread and butter route or a go-to play. I detest our "bunch formation" and all that does is crowd parts of the field. We also HAVE to bench Calloway until he masters the playbook. He was totally lost against the 49's and he hurt us further afterward. Higgins has to be in over Calloway until he is ready. 

@jiggins7919 said:

Man, this is such a great point, I can't believe I missed it. It's especially noticeable when you go back and watch the games a second time. You'll see Hilliard or Chubb leaking out or standing in the flat as the outlet, but Baker rarely finds them! Sometimes it would only be for 3-4 yards, but that 4 yards can often be the difference in getting a first or punting it away. Maybe this is just inexperience, or Baker wanting to push it down field, but dang! Take the 3-4 yards...you never know when your guy will break a tackle, or if that will sustain a drive. 

The Pats are always loaded with fast, quick little fleas that leave LBs in the dust to get open in those areas. We just have not learned that yet. However, hope is on the way starting game #9 with Hunt added in the packaging. Opportunities abound then. He's great at it.

EDIT: It would help if we practiced with the intent of those receivers actually being the primary targets while staring the defenses into thinking otherwise. Brady is a master at it. I think JG at SF does the same thing quite often. Steal the stuff that works on the great teams and use it wisely.

@texasag1969 said:

And placing/finding check down receivers way more often in that short/intermediate area.?

EDIT: Ever see a play where Brady doesn't have one? Me neither.

Man, this is such a great point, I can't believe I missed it. It's especially noticeable when you go back and watch the games a second time. You'll see Hilliard or Chubb leaking out or standing in the flat as the outlet, but Baker rarely finds them! Sometimes it would only be for 3-4 yards, but that 4 yards can often be the difference in getting a first or punting it away. Maybe this is just inexperience, or Baker wanting to push it down field, but dang! Take the 3-4 yards...you never know when your guy will break a tackle, or if that will sustain a drive. 

@jiggins7919 said:

We need to get Baker comfortable, and maybe that's easier said than done, but Nick Chubb is GOING to be there, what we NEED is Baker getting in a groove and making precision passes that are longer than 4 yards. 

And placing/finding check down receivers way more often in that short/intermediate area.?

EDIT: Ever see a play where Brady doesn't have one? Me neither.

@texasag1969 said:

This is one of those times I think you are really on to something. I've been looking at that was well. I said elsewhere we win in the neighborhood of 31-9. I'll stick with that. I also said the D would be a major part of giving the O many more opportunities, thus the 31 points.

It's time for us to look like the team the nation expected to see.

That's the same stance I've been sharing all week, and I'm as frustrated as anyone on the planet regarding our team's performance. Even being frustrated, annoyed, and plain let down...I still believe there's enough ability on this team to beat an opponent with uncertainty at the QB position. 

Here's the fear that several local media members are sharing:  The problem is our coach, and he's looking more and more overwhelmed. If our coach is making in-game personnel errors, you can bet the players know way more than we do, and if he loses the respect of the players, it's a bad situation. 

The funny thing is, winning cures all, and while our coach has made some questionable calls and time management decisions, winning will make that all go away. At this point, it won't even MATTER if we win an ugly game 6-3, we just need the freakin W. Ultimately the games come down to the players, and we all know our coach isn't the one fumbling the ball, throwing inaccurate passes, not securing the ball in the rain, or clanging the ball off his hands directly to the defender. Coaches don't turn it over, we have to PLAY better. 

And I think we will. But know this, the heartbeat of our offense is NOT Nick Chubb, it's Baker Mayfield. We simply MUST find a way to get Baker comfortable with throwing the ball to the intermediate areas of the damn field. Yes, I'd love to see more bombs, but those are low percentage plays. We need Baker getting a feel and nailing down his accuracy on the intermediate level of the field because those passes aren't there near as much as last year.

We're seeing way too many "bubble screens" that never seem to work, and those bubble screens are just RIPE for penalty opportunities because you can have a WR holding, blocking too early, an OL down the field, a pick, or whatever. We are NOT disciplined enough to run pick plays and that's unfortunate because so many other teams run them just fine. 

We need to get Baker comfortable, and maybe that's easier said than done, but Nick Chubb is GOING to be there, what we NEED is Baker getting in a groove and making precision passes that are longer than 4 yards. 

I'll make one last point and then mercifully stop writing. We need our defensive line to show OUT tomorrow. I mean just DOMINATE. Myles Garrett is my favorite player and he's having a terrific season so far. As I've said before, I want MORE from him. I want to see Garrett completely wreck a game and make life miserable for this new QB. We also need way more from the interior of the line, and we need Vernon to make a game-changing play. Vernon is coming off his two best games, and we need a strip sack, a 3rd down sack, or something BIG. We have to have our defense make life miserable for the Broncos and maybe even SCORE a TD to help out the offense. 

Steve Wilks MUST resist sending too much pressure. Tom Brady's biggest pass play came on 3rd and 10, right after we pulled within 17-10. It was a very simple screen pass to White, who took the 4 yard toss and jaunted 55 yards...effectively ending the game. These are the kind of throws the inexperienced Brandon Allen can easily make, so we'll have to resist sending too much pressure because we've been devastated by several long screens at KEY moments this season. 

 Denver? Were on top of a hilltop alright      

It's time for us to look like the team the nation expected to see.