@texasag1969 said:

Usually there will be an article or two coming out soon on which teams take a rest in week 17. I think Pitt will be one that has no need to win. We shall see.

No.  We have gone over this numerous times.  They have to win and hope Buff. loses a game so they can get the #2 spot.  Plus 2 home playoff games potentially. 

@nickers said:

I think they play them to try and get a better seeding I think...

Usually there will be an article or two coming out soon on which teams take a rest in week 17. I think Pitt will be one that has no need to win. We shall see.

@icecube said:

I see an easy win, I don't think Pitt is even playing most starters, are they?

I think they play them to try and get a better seeding I think...

@calfoxwc said:

  The offensive line is the engine that runs the car. and vs the jets, the car had bad tires on the front of the car.....(wr's) , two cylinders misfiring and backfiring -

of course the steering wheel and gas pedal aren't going to win the race and be excellent. The offensive line was overrun. The Jets have more roughing the passer penalites than any team in the NFL? I think that was what they said. He couldn't have confidence in his oline - well, I watched Peyton Manning's oline have a terrible game - Peyton threw three interceptions in one half. If the oline can't block well or great on plays - the plays don't work - doesn't matter who is the qb. Being a great runner helps at times....

I see the Browns winning the last game if they get their players back.

I see an easy win, I don't think Pitt is even playing most starters, are they?

@baconhound said:

Lol.  Don’t hate anybody.  Baker is a fantastic cheerleader and at times a very good QB.  He isn’t consistent and is prone to making poor decisions.  I saw this at OU.  When the team is firing on all cylinders he is very good.  When they aren’t he is terrible.

  The offensive line is the engine that runs the car. and vs the jets, the car had bad tires on the front of the car.....(wr's) , two cylinders misfiring and backfiring -

of course the steering wheel and gas pedal aren't going to win the race and be excellent. The offensive line was overrun. The Jets have more roughing the passer penalites than any team in the NFL? I think that was what they said. He couldn't have confidence in his oline - well, I watched Peyton Manning's oline have a terrible game - Peyton threw three interceptions in one half. If the oline can't block well or great on plays - the plays don't work - doesn't matter who is the qb. Being a great runner helps at times....

I see the Browns winning the last game if they get their players back.

@baconhound said:

Lol.  Don’t hate anybody.  Baker is a fantastic cheerleader and at times a very good QB.  He isn’t consistent and is prone to making poor decisions.  I saw this at OU.  When the team is firing on all cylinders he is very good.  When they aren’t he is terrible.

Baker had a terrible game at the worst possible time. It's not all on him, the supporting cast was decimated. Just get Landry on the field, and we may well have won.    

@nickers said:

Just admit it... You hate the man...

Lol.  Don’t hate anybody.  Baker is a fantastic cheerleader and at times a very good QB.  He isn’t consistent and is prone to making poor decisions.  I saw this at OU.  When the team is firing on all cylinders he is very good.  When they aren’t he is terrible.

@d-bone said:

Tough scale to grade on. Take away the little league QB sneak fumble, and Baker did the best he could given the weapons he had.

Point fingers at the defense, it was they who needed to win the game today, and as usual, they were the achilles heal of the team. 

Almost had that TD. 

@falcon7 said:

Back to average at best today...

Tough scale to grade on. Take away the little league QB sneak fumble, and Baker did the best he could given the weapons he had.

Point fingers at the defense, it was they who needed to win the game today, and as usual, they were the achilles heal of the team. 

Today wasn't a great day for him, but his attitude/competitiveness is infectious. I've said it before, and I'll say it again....I wanted Josh Allen but glad Mayfield is our QB now. 

Today was on the Browns D. Something that can be fixed in the off season. 

@baconhound said:

If Baker is the answer we are in trouble 

Well he is not the answer on the QB sneak play. He has no idea how to use both fn hands.

@baconhound said:

If Baker is the answer we are in trouble 

Just admit it... You hate the man...

@the-gipper said:

Yes, Brian played in only 1 postseason game.   Bernie played in  7 with the Browns....plus another 2 for the Cowboys and one for the Dolphins as a backup I believe.  

And two things both out of the quarterbacks control cost chances to move on for additional playoff appearances.  And who knows what happens after tha it changed the BROWNS history.

But such is team sports with one key leader either Sipe or Kosar.

@nickers said:

I love Brian Sipe... But he only has 'one' playoff appearance.. Kosar has 5 I believe...

And I love Bernie Kosar.  Now, can we get back to the context of discussion?  If so, the ONLY Cleveland QB I've seen earn an NFL MVP honor in my lifetime as a fan was Brian Sipe.  

If not, Sipe and Kosar are easily my 2 favorite QBs in my lifetime as a fan of this team.  One guy started the Kardiac Kids excitement at the onset of the 80s with all the comeback victories and the other brought it back.   They were my golden era; and Bernie did play on more good teams here.

@nickers said:

I love Brian Sipe... But he only has 'one' playoff appearance.. Kosar has 5 I believe...

Yes, Brian played in only 1 postseason game.   Bernie played in  7 with the Browns....plus another 2 for the Cowboys and one for the Dolphins as a backup I believe.  

@flugel said:

Me too!  Brian Sipe is the only NFL MVP I've seen play QB for the Browns in my lifetime. Sipe was a QB nobody predicted success for especially in a Great Lake climate for the arm talent of a 13th round pick.  All he did was  throw for over 4000 yards AND win 11 regular season when that was virtually unheard of East of Dan Fouts - especially in Cleveland. Aside from that, he didn't have Jim Brown to hand off to like Frank Ryan had. Here's the guys that caught the ball from Sipe and let me know when you see the superstar receiving  numbers of a Jerry Rice, Marshall Faulk/Roger Craig or Rob Gronkowski/Shannon Sharpe. 

RBs: Mike Pruitt 63 rec 471 yds 0 TD, Charles White 17 rec 153 yds 1 TD, Greg Pruitt 50 rec 444 yds 5 TD, Cleo Miller 2 rec 8 yds 0 TD, Calvin Hill (33 yrs old) 27 rec 383 yds 6 TD

TE: Ozzie Newsome 51 rec 594 yds 3 TD

WRs: Willis Adams 8 rec 165 yds 0 TD, Reggie Rucker 52 rec 768 yds 4 TD, Dave Logan 51 rec 822 yds 4 TD, Ricky Feacher 10 rec 244 yds 4 TD, McDonald Oden 3 rec 18 yds 0 TD, Keith Wright 3 rec 62 yds 3 TD.

Passing

I love Brian Sipe... But he only has 'one' playoff appearance.. Kosar has 5 I believe...

@the-cysko-kid said:

I'm ready to go with baker as the franchise QB. I am not sure what more some of you guys want here. 

He will have a chance in the next two weeks to get the BROWNS into the playoffs, maybe win the division and move on.

Now to win one must win game give me ether a hot Sipe or better yet a true BROWNS fan Bernie Kosar he has the QB mentality and the guts to hang in there.......oh and include two 1000 yard RBs, an established line and some good/great receivers, just in case.

Baker can earn his stripes this year.

Holy cow, those are some dreadful career numbers. 

He's also part of arguably the worst AND the best trades in Browns history. (Unlike Rocky Colavito for the Tribe, who was involved in two bad trades for the Indians) 

Everyone knows Phipps was traded to the Browns for arguably one of the best WRs in NFL history, Paul Warfield. What a lot of Browns fans forget is that years later the Browns somehow got a first rounder (and a 4th!) out of the Chicago Bears in the trade to rid themselves of Phipps. That first rounder ended up being.... Ozzie Newsome!

So Phipps cost the Browns HOF WR Paul Warfield, but ended up getting HOF TE Ozzie Newsome out of him.  

@brownsfan4evr said:

Easy answer for me....Brian Sipe.

Me too!  Brian Sipe is the only NFL MVP I've seen play QB for the Browns in my lifetime. Sipe was a QB nobody predicted success for especially in a Great Lake climate for the arm talent of a 13th round pick.  All he did was  throw for over 4000 yards AND win 11 regular season games when that was virtually unheard of East of Dan Fouts - especially in Cleveland. Aside from that, he didn't have Jim Brown to hand off to like Frank Ryan had. Here's the guys that caught the ball from Sipe and let me know when you see the superstar receiving  numbers of a Jerry Rice, Marshall Faulk/Roger Craig or Rob Gronkowski/Shannon Sharpe. 

RBs: Mike Pruitt 63 rec 471 yds 0 TD, Charles White 17 rec 153 yds 1 TD, Greg Pruitt 50 rec 444 yds 5 TD, Cleo Miller 2 rec 8 yds 0 TD, Calvin Hill (33 yrs old) 27 rec 383 yds 6 TD

TE: Ozzie Newsome 51 rec 594 yds 3 TD

WRs: Willis Adams 8 rec 165 yds 0 TD, Reggie Rucker 52 rec 768 yds 4 TD, Dave Logan 51 rec 822 yds 4 TD, Ricky Feacher 10 rec 244 yds 4 TD, McDonald Oden 3 rec 18 yds 0 TD, Keith Wright 3 rec 62 yds 3 TD.

Passing

@tour2ma said:

Brian had the guts of a burglar, but for me.... of those I saw I have to go with Dr. Frank Ryan. He was a whipsaw smart QB with a very good arm and great mechanics.

Folks would know a lot more about Dr. Frank (PhD Mathematics) had Gino Marcetti not friggin' mugged him in a fucking Pro-Bowl game. (Shades of Ray Fosse!)

Excerpt below from a very good read...

Gino Marchetti was not a man you wanted to get mad.

He was a machine gunner in the Battle of the Bulge, and then played for perhaps the best college football team no one ever heard of - the 1951 University of San Francisco Dons. (Look up that team and who was on it or involved in the program, it's pretty amazing). He and a black player walked into a bar where people of the darker hue weren't appreciated, and the bartender pulled a shotgun on them. Marchetti told the bartender he better shoot him dead, or he'd beat him to death with it. That '51 Dons team went undefeated, but when they invited to play in the Orange Bowl, they were told that their black teammates could not play. As a team they refused to play the game. 

Sacks were not an official stat back when he played, but Colts officials said that in one 12 game season, they "unofficially" counted 43 sacks by Marchetti.