@unsympathetic said:

Nothing more fun than seeing Vea and the newly drafted Walker drop into zone and.. not be a vulnerability.  Walker of course is ridiculous enough at 280# to be able to shut down slot receivers.  Just like all the DT's at Cleveland..

The frustrating part is that all the FA DI who are capable of shutting down the run & be more than nonexistent against the pass.. were ignored by the FO.  Examples are Akiem Hicks, DJ Jones, Joseph-Day.  Instead we have a collection who are capable of neither rushing the passer nor stopping the run.  

Exactly!  A lot of people don't realize this about Vita Vea; but he was a very good RB in high school.  I bring that up because he's pretty quick/fast for a guy his size.  I just looked at a you tube video of him running off tackle and outrunning some decent pursuit angles guys had on him.  

The frustrating part is that all the FA DI who are capable of shutting down the run & be more than nonexistent against the pass.. were ignored by the FO.  Examples are Akiem Hicks, DJ Jones, Joseph-Day.  Instead we have a collection who are capable of neither rushing the passer nor stopping the run.  

@flugel said:

Totally agree, which was why I worded it "here and there."  Great stuff in the 2nd paragraph. The rest of my reply is just piggybacking on points you've made here and previously that are applicable.

Anything we do is going to have to be varied; because the reality is the FO neglected this group where weaknesses will be easy to find and target.  Consequently, this FO is getting exactly what they paid for or didn't for IDL.  Blue collar isn't football sexy (ie: NT Bob Golic); but man did he get the job done enabling the Defense to rank #1 against the run in 1986.  When you can shut down the run that well - it helps take out a lot of the guess work on the opponents' tendencies.  

We can try other things upfront like slants to strength or wide-side or just the opposite with our backers scraping in the opposite direction of the slant.  We can even attempt some X-stunt blitzes to generate some inside pressure.  One of your previous points about what 1 team was doing in dropping a Dlineman into a hook zone/adjacent gray area is another wrinkle that could work well IMO.  Is David Copperfield busy the rest of the year?

It seems strange that a FO that values paying their 2 OGs really good money for their roles inside; thinks just the opposite about DTs.  The last time Tampa won a SB, they had 1st round pick Vita Vea at 1 DT and Ndamukong Suh at another with William Gholston, and Jason Pierre-Paul.  They also had OLB Shaquille Barrett adding 19.5 sacks (pretty damn good considering he was Von Miller's back-up that didn't have a lot of playing time out in Denver before that). Tampa had enough front 7 talent to where they could vary their fronts where they could kick Vea inside to NT, pushing Suh out to DE with Gholston at the other DE moving Pierre-Paul OLB in a 2 point.  Personally, I think Pierre-Paul is more explosive out of a 3 point stance so I didn't think Suh at DE was their best option (although it was enough of a wrinkle for teams to prepare for).  

DTs are very valuable.  Chris Jones is usually a long day for opponents. Buffalo drafted Ed Oliver in round 1, Fletcher Cox has been a bad ass in Philly since he arrived; Now Philly added a freakin Continent (DT Jordan Davis) that somehow squeezed into the state of Georgia long enough to help them win a national championship.  These types of guys command the attention that allows their LBers to giddy-up and get after it.  In some cases, these guys can also suffocate the run by themselves.  

This may only be a coincidence; but the year the FO went after Sheldon Richardson - we won 11 regular season games and a playoff game.  Then we lost the next week to Chris Jones and the Chiefs.  

- You can slant your defensive line.  I've pointed out CFB D-coords who have found varying degree's of success.  The reason you don't see it more at the pro level is the lineman and the RB's are just too good.  

- This front office put a priority on interior pocket integrity.  Bito, Teller and Pocic.  The reason being that our future QB requires this offense placing that priority on pass pro right up the middle, the most difficult place to deal with pressure and the worst kind your QB can face. 

- IDL IS very valuable, when you find transcendent talent that makes the pick worth it.  Otherwise you'll be looking at rotating in, as coaches call it 'swarms' of bodies with specific skills.    Aaron Donald went high because of his ability to disrupt gaps and rush the passer.   Jordan Davis was drafted because of his flexibility as a big man and the ability to help the Eagles stay in their nickel and dime sets, even against 21 and 22 personnel.

- It is a bit of a coincidence, the Richardson, playoffs and Chiefs thing.    Chris Jones is still a bit one dimensional in his play.  That kid hates getting dirty in the running game, and the Chiefs would likely be without a superbowl ring if it wasn't for the emergence of Derrick Nnadi.  

- If there is one thing I can promise, if the future of this defense, and NFL defenses for the next 10 years, is to return to 2 high shells and builds off of those looks, that removed body from the box run fit will place additional emphasis on the state of your defensive line come draft time.  

(I forgot who the #99 kid was for LSU, but he jumped out last season when I was watching Ferrall.  I'm sure I'll be starting there in the next few weeks)

@tiamat63 said:

 Both Myles and Clowney have seen looks at times on the interior in various subpackages.   Against CAR at least they did, because their IOL sucked something awful.   But just parking them IDL in any other situation takes a weak line and makes it worse.  Because our greatest strength, the edge, will now be cut in half while the return on the interior won't be proportionate to the ability we've lost by moving them.  

 It's a damned if you do type situation and about the greatest warning to any front office - you can't have one position group so damn good and the other so bad that the functionality of your defense (or offense) is so imbalanced.    The Chiefs have a great young QB and great skill position players, but we saw what happened against Tampa in the Superbowl when their Oline was depleted.   All those skills position accounted for nothing.    That's really no different here, just on the other side of the ball.

Totally agree, which was why I worded it "here and there."  Great stuff in the 2nd paragraph. The rest of my reply is just piggybacking on points you've made here and previously that are applicable.

Anything we do is going to have to be varied; because the reality is the FO neglected this group where weaknesses will be easy to find and target.  Consequently, this FO is getting exactly what they paid for or didn't for IDL.  Blue collar isn't football sexy (ie: NT Bob Golic); but man did he get the job done enabling the Defense to rank #1 against the run in 1986.  When you can shut down the run that well - it helps take out a lot of the guess work on the opponents' tendencies.  

We can try other things upfront like slants to strength or wide-side or just the opposite with our backers scraping in the opposite direction of the slant.  We can even attempt some X-stunt blitzes to generate some inside pressure.  One of your previous points about what 1 team was doing in dropping a Dlineman into a hook zone/adjacent gray area is another wrinkle that could work well IMO.  Is David Copperfield busy the rest of the year?

It seems strange that a FO that values paying their 2 OGs really good money for their roles inside; thinks just the opposite about DTs.  The last time Tampa won a SB, they had 1st round pick Vita Vea at 1 DT and Ndamukong Suh at another with William Gholston, and Jason Pierre-Paul.  They also had OLB Shaquille Barrett adding 19.5 sacks (pretty damn good considering he was Von Miller's back-up that didn't have a lot of playing time out in Denver before that). Tampa had enough front 7 talent to where they could vary their fronts where they could kick Vea inside to NT, pushing Suh out to DE with Gholston at the other DE moving Pierre-Paul OLB in a 2 point.  Personally, I think Pierre-Paul is more explosive out of a 3 point stance so I didn't think Suh at DE was their best option (although it was enough of a wrinkle for teams to prepare for).  

DTs are very valuable.  Chris Jones is usually a long day for opponents. Buffalo drafted Ed Oliver in round 1, Fletcher Cox has been a bad ass in Philly since he arrived; Now Philly added a freakin Continent (DT Jordan Davis) that somehow squeezed into the state of Georgia long enough to help them win a national championship.  These types of guys command the attention that allows their LBers to giddy-up and get after it.  In some cases, these guys can also suffocate the run by themselves.  

This may only be a coincidence; but the year the FO went after Sheldon Richardson - we won 11 regular season games and a playoff game.  Then we lost the next week to Chris Jones and the Chiefs.  

@tiamat63 said:

 Both Myles and Clowney have seen looks at times on the interior in various subpackages.   Against CAR at least they did, because their IOL sucked something awful.   But just parking them IDL in any other situation takes a weak line and makes it worse.  Because our greatest strength, the edge, will now be cut in half while the return on the interior won't be proportionate to the ability we've lost by moving them.  

 It's a damned if you do type situation and about the greatest warning to any front office - you can't have one position group so damn good and the other so bad that the functionality of your defense (or offense) is so imbalanced.    The Chiefs have a great young QB and great skill position players, but we saw what happened against Tampa in the Superbowl when their Oline was depleted.   All those skills position accounted for nothing.    That's really no different here, just on the other side of the ball.

I hear you but I’d take a SB visit 

@flugel said:

Okay, you and SdBacker convinced me.  His progress is very impressive at RT.  As for the IDL?  Maybe we can move Myles and/or Clowney around here and there once they're healthy again.

 Both Myles and Clowney have seen looks at times on the interior in various subpackages.   Against CAR at least they did, because their IOL sucked something awful.   But just parking them IDL in any other situation takes a weak line and makes it worse.  Because our greatest strength, the edge, will now be cut in half while the return on the interior won't be proportionate to the ability we've lost by moving them.  

 It's a damned if you do type situation and about the greatest warning to any front office - you can't have one position group so damn good and the other so bad that the functionality of your defense (or offense) is so imbalanced.    The Chiefs have a great young QB and great skill position players, but we saw what happened against Tampa in the Superbowl when their Oline was depleted.   All those skills position accounted for nothing.    That's really no different here, just on the other side of the ball.

@tiamat63 said:

Admirable idea and I like you're out-of-the-box type thinking, but not practical and not going to happen.

Hudson hasn't taken Dline snaps since his freshman year at UC, and even then it was midseason.  

- No DLine technique to have worked on.

- No meetings, no filmroom.

- I doubt he's versed in our defensive calls, checks and verbiage.

- His progression as a RT has given the FO the impression that Conklin could be a money casualty in the near future.

 Taking a guy who hasn't seen reps at a spot in 5 years and tossing him in the mix likely means he wouldn't be anymore effective than Elliot or TT.   And if you weren't good enough to stay on the Dline under Fickel, chances are you aren't going to amount to much in the NFL.    Barring trade or some of our guys taking some of that stuff which created the Hulk, there's no real solution on roster and very few ways you can design things to limit the weakness.   It is what it is, at the moment.

Okay, you and SdBacker convinced me.  His progress is very impressive at RT.  As for the IDL?  Maybe we can move Myles and/or Clowney around here and there once they're healthy again.

we could use a good DT, a more instinctive SAM and a better centerfielder.  Can’t be weak in Baseball or football right up the middle.

the Guards/Tribe today are rolling out a very good defensive CF, elite 2nd, very good catcher, and a good SS (this year at least)- makes up for the fact that don’t dig the long ball like other teams.

@sdbacker80 said:

In hindsight Baker had a perfect setup at OKLA too.

Lincoln Riley scheming up wide open WRs that included Mark Andrews, Marquise Brown and CeeDee Lamb against Big12 defenses 

Not exactly a good metric to use.

Josh Allen played at the University of Wyoming….not really top level competition in the Mountain West Conference.

@flugel said:

Yeah, I agree with you about the progress Hudson has made at RT.  It's been impressive.  Having said that, my idea for him to get some reps at DT while Conklin is back starting at RT - addresses a desperate situation on the DL for the time being.  I don't even know how good he was at DT - I just know our group is totally unacceptable.  When Belichick used to take his starting OLB Mike Vrable and also bring him in to play TE in various goal line packages (despite already having Gronk as an ideal target/blocker) - it worked extremely well.  1 year they took starting Troy Brown and used him as an extra corner when depth got low near and during the playoffs.  Winners think outside of the box in desperate times - losers just say we're going to worker harder this week square pegging round holes.  IMO, I would at least take a look at him to patch one of the holes threatening to sink this ship.  Not forever, just now...  

There will be a lot of people that will disagree with my thinking and there's nothing wrong with that.  Atlanta watched film of our 1st half vrs Pittsburgh when they gashed us running the ball and took a 14-13 lead into halftime.  It's almost like the advantage Nick Chubb gives us gets Santa Claus'd right back to our opponent with the forfeit our IDL is giving up.  Suh already played for the Detroit Lions for too many years to be interested in joining the AFC version of them IMO.

Admirable idea and I like you're out-of-the-box type thinking, but not practical and not going to happen.

Hudson hasn't taken Dline snaps since his freshman year at UC, and even then it was midseason.  

- No DLine technique to have worked on.

- No meetings, no filmroom.

- I doubt he's versed in our defensive calls, checks and verbiage.

- His progression as a RT has given the FO the impression that Conklin could be a money casualty in the near future.

 Taking a guy who hasn't seen reps at a spot in 5 years and tossing him in the mix likely means he wouldn't be anymore effective than Elliot or TT.   And if you weren't good enough to stay on the Dline under Fickel, chances are you aren't going to amount to much in the NFL.    Barring trade or some of our guys taking some of that stuff which created the Hulk, there's no real solution on roster and very few ways you can design things to limit the weakness.   It is what it is, at the moment.

@sdbacker80 said:

I agree with you 90% of the time.

Hudson back to Dline where he played sparingly at TSUN.  No.  He’s playing great now at Tackle and will hold that spot next season likely as a starter.  I’m not doing it no way.

Regarding the secondary and where I’ve highlighted the talent…All I’m saying…where there is talent in the secondary…it has to perform it can’t be the reason you lose.

Yeah, I agree with you about the progress Hudson has made at RT.  It's been impressive.  Having said that, my idea for him to get some reps at DT while Conklin is back starting at RT - addresses a desperate situation on the DL for the time being.  I don't even know how good he was at DT - I just know our group is totally unacceptable.  When Belichick used to take his starting OLB Mike Vrable and also bring him in to play TE in various goal line packages (despite already having Gronk as an ideal target/blocker) - it worked extremely well.  1 year they took starting Troy Brown and used him as an extra corner when depth got low near and during the playoffs.  Winners think outside of the box in desperate times - losers just say we're going to worker harder this week square pegging round holes.  IMO, I would at least take a look at him to patch one of the holes threatening to sink this ship.  Not forever, just now...  

There will be a lot of people that will disagree with my thinking and there's nothing wrong with that.  Atlanta watched film of our 1st half vrs Pittsburgh when they gashed us running the ball and took a 14-13 lead into halftime.  It's almost like the advantage Nick Chubb gives us gets Santa Claus'd right back to our opponent with the forfeit our IDL is giving up.  Suh already played for the Detroit Lions for too many years to be interested in joining the AFC version of them IMO.

@flugel said:

The secondary played good against Pittsburgh; but Trubisky helped them a lot.

I get what you're saying about 1st round draft picks in our secondary; but that doesn't guarantee us anything.  Have you see how often they tackle way too high?  Johnson got lit up by Najee Harris.  Last week Delpit was trying to tackle  ball carriers around the shoulder pads.

While this is the era to try to defend the pass - you can't go pedal to the metal with it at the expense of using junior varsity and freshman caliber DTs.  The Falcons exposed Berry's planning or complete lack thereof.  If there's nothing up there physics are going to get all our high round DBs/crash test dummies hurt anyway.  

This desperate situation might want to have us look at James Hudson III as a DT (since he played Defense once upon a time).  

I agree with you 90% of the time.

Hudson back to Dline where he played sparingly at TSUN.  No.  He’s playing great now at Tackle and will hold that spot next season likely as a starter.  I’m not doing it no way.

Regarding the secondary and where I’ve highlighted the talent…All I’m saying…where there is talent in the secondary…it has to perform it can’t be the reason you lose.

@sdbacker80 said:

Let me say, I believe DT is a problem and I was a believer at that point but prior to that Falcons game the secondary nearly lost us a game and then the very next week lost the Jets game.  The FO commitment to that group was huge…You have a couple first round picks back there, a high dollar free agent, a second and third round pick.   The secondary has to be on point this year we have all these other groups playing with built in excuses for instance we are playing a backup QB, a backup a center, we had 4th tackle start two games, we have very little depth at WR…these positions and groups aren’t going to be consistent week to week.  
 

The secondary played good against Pittsburgh; but Trubisky helped them a lot.

I get what you're saying about 1st round draft picks in our secondary; but that doesn't guarantee us anything.  Have you see how often they tackle way too high?  Johnson got lit up by Najee Harris.  Last week Delpit was trying to tackle  ball carriers around the shoulder pads.

While this is the era to try to defend the pass - you can't go pedal to the metal with it at the expense of using junior varsity and freshman caliber DTs.  The Falcons exposed Berry's planning or complete lack thereof.  If there's nothing up there physics are going to get all our high round DBs/crash test dummies hurt anyway.  

This desperate situation might want to have us look at James Hudson III as a DT (since he played Defense once upon a time).  

@flugel said:

Per the bolded line above, this was my concern during and after the Pittsburgh game.  Our next opponent in Atlanta saw the golden opportunity to run on us.  They ran the ball 14 straight plays for 174 yards.  If our FO didn't think DT was an important position, we better hope they do now.  You can't win very many chess matches attacking with pawns.  

Let me say, I believe DT is a problem and I was a believer at that point but prior to that Falcons game the secondary nearly lost us a game and then the very next week lost the Jets game.  The FO commitment to that group was huge…You have a couple first round picks back there, a high dollar free agent, a second and third round pick.   The secondary has to be on point this year we have all these other groups playing with built in excuses for instance we are playing a backup QB, a backup a center, we had 4th tackle start two games, we have very little depth at WR…these positions and groups aren’t going to be consistent week to week.  
 

@flugel said:

Nice job with that Jiggs!   

I was reviewing all the ST blunders with someone online and I can't believe I forgot to mention the 12 men on the field. That really speaks volumes about my attention to detail these days.  Man, the blocked punt and another missed extra point?   We didn't spend a draft pick on York for him to be the next Steve Cox (only trusted for long FGs and putting kickoffs out of the end zone).  We drafted York wanting him to be the next Phil Dawson (accurate from everywhere).  I think he'll get that ironed out; but we need that now,,,

After JOK and Walker got injured - I thought Phillips, Fields and Takitaki played well for us.

A potential concern, our defense got gashed against the run in the 1st half.  I'm guessing our next opponent will test this next week.  

All that aside, I'm very happy this team began the week with a very necessary player's only meeting. It translated into a victory on the field for us to enjoy!

Per the bolded line above, this was my concern during and after the Pittsburgh game.  Our next opponent in Atlanta saw the golden opportunity to run on us.  They ran the ball 14 straight plays for 174 yards.  If our FO didn't think DT was an important position, we better hope they do now.  You can't win very many chess matches attacking with pawns.  

@nickers said:

All I'm saying Tom.. Is even with a full cupboard... Joe Woods continues to under utilize the talent available to him...   He's a dud... Although to his credit... He finally started calling more man coverage last week.. So that's a positive... Zone defenses are a great QB's best friend next to blitzes. I get it... Guys are hurt... You are forced into other adjustments... I'm sick and tired of seeing average QB's get away with murder in the 2nd half of games. Someone here said Joe Woods also came here as a secondary Specialist... Since he's been here... Our secondary has played like S H I T!

Fair enough Nicks.  We'll find out soon enough either way...

@sdbacker80 said:

We will when we get four Pro Bowlers upfront.  I will not hold my breath in the salary cap era for that 

Let's see what happens Sunday... Clowney on one leg and Garrett playing with one arm are better than 1\2 the DL in the NFL...  

I wasn't going to start a specific thread, but the injury bug is working in the Browns favor the next several weeks... If we can eke one out against the Falcons... The Chargers are a MASH unit, their LT is out for the year, Herbert has bum ribs, and they just put Bosa on IR.  Then we get to face the Patriots with our old pal Hoyer the Destroyer subbing for the out of commission Mac Jones.  

Lincoln Riley scheming up wide open WRs that included Mark Andrews, Marquise Brown and CeeDee Lamb against Big12 defenses 

@flugel said:

Great question!   I'd hate to think they would have been as dumb as your buddy Flugel.  My QB resume should have me forbidden to project superstar QBs.  

You and me both. I've had a few good predictions on QBs, but have missed spectacularily on some too. The humorous thing about the infamous 2018 QB Battle Royale of Debate is that I remember talking to my buddy (the guy I went to the Steelers game with last Thursday night) right before the draft and admitting that on the eve of the selection, I had talked myself out of ALL the QBs available. ? Baker was 'meh' to me, a good floor, low ceiling type of guy. Darnold should have gone back to USC for another year. Rosen - my early favorite - didn't seem to even like playing football. Allen had fantastic tools and was built like what a prototypical AFC North QB should be, but couldn't hit water from a row boat and played crap competition. I never even considered Lamar Jackson, and hell, I still might be underestimating him. It seems like he's starting to get comfortable throwing from the pocket, which is a horrifying thing to contemplate as a Browns fan.

Then we have Oklahoma QBs (Mayfield and Murray) that constantly threw to wide open guys (with plenty of time to do so) not finding NFL life nearly that easy. 

Completion percentage in college can be such a misleading stat. Baker, for example, I think (top of my head) completed something like 66% of his college passes, but I would not consider him a particularily accurate NFL QB. You know who completed passes at an even higher percentage in college? 

Brandon Weeden.  

@flugel said:

So who are the Superstar Pass Rushers taking advantage of all the attention Myles Garrett is getting Nicks?  Did Clowney play last week?  What Superstars inside is Joe Woods failing to understand here?  Give me a name.  Just 1.  You're bitching just to bitch.

Bill Parcels once said if you're gonna ask me to cook the meal - then you should let me buy the groceries.  If Garrett and Clowney don't play this week, we're pretty much attacking with pawns whether some of you guys want to pretend otherwise or not.  YES, we've invested heavily in the DBs at the back end; and we have 2 great edge rushers when/if healthy.  We also lost 2 starting LBers last week right?  When that happens during the game - the replacements have enough to think about let alone adding a zone blitz coverage adjustment to that.  Buffalo added Von Miller so they don't have worry about zone blitz coverage adjustments. Teams are turning to that because like Bob806 mentioned offenses are already challenging the numbers at the back end with multiple Receivers.   Think of the Lindy Infante mentality (multiple receivers spread) when he knew teams wanted to blitz our cement shoe'd hero Bernie.  "Wanna blitz us?  Welcome to Hell!"   

All I'm saying Tom.. Is even with a full cupboard... Joe Woods continues to under utilize the talent available to him...   He's a dud... Although to his credit... He finally started calling more man coverage last week.. So that's a positive... Zone defenses are a great QB's best friend next to blitzes. I get it... Guys are hurt... You are forced into other adjustments... I'm sick and tired of seeing average QB's get away with murder in the 2nd half of games. Someone here said Joe Woods also came here as a secondary Specialist... Since he's been here... Our secondary has played like S H I T!

@flugel said:

You weren't here yet; but I didn't want Josh Allen either.  I've mentioned it numerous times. Do you know what you, me and Tia have in common?  None of us are being paid to work in an NFL FO regardless of how passionate and educated we are about the Browns and football.   Buffalo didn't draft the rear view mirror. They looked at flaws they felt they could change to go in tandem with the sum of strengths that intrigued them.  More specifically, they planned on committing to their investment like the Chiefs did with Mahomes, who didn't start as a rookie.   The only time this franchise drafted a QB capable of consistently leading us deep into the playoffs was when they drafted Bernie Kosar in the Supplemental Draft way back in 1985.

All true.  I supported the Watson trade based on some of these points you make. We haven’t shown the capability to be patient with a drafted QB nor have we had the foresight to pick them well.  

The price wasn’t too high.

And above everything else you need an elite QB.  Not an average QB with a great line and running game and good supporting cast. 
 

^^^thats what we had and folks are/were okay with .500 football most years here with a playoff appearance every year or so. 

@flugel said:

You did a nice job with that!  Speaking of pressure, both Clowney and Garrett have injuries that will effect/limit their availability.  When healthy, that's 2 former 1st overall picks edge rush talents I'm guessing Joe wants to rely on for the QB pressures so it doesn't mess with the numbers he likes to have at the back end.  You just mentioned giant and talented targets like London and Pitts while Mariota has some mobility to worry about. If the Browns blitz somebody that doesn't get to the QB - they've just made those 2 guys even tougher to defend.  Our guys gotta be communicating from the pre-snap formation on. 

Not to give you the heebee geebees but now that there's an inevitable injury volume on our defense - this is where I want to see what Joe Woods is made of. 

On the flipside, you disrupt a happy feet QB like Mariota with pressure. We have a tendency to sit back and drop 7 and give journeyman QBs time to process coverage and look good.

And if your front 4 can’t get to the QB you need to bring an extra guy or two…I don’t see that adjustment enough with this defense. If you are dropping seven or eight I gotta see more contested throws in the secondary.  And my goodness if you are going bend all game you cannot get beat deep like we have.

This is a really tough game.  Patterson is great at picking his spots in zone runs.  I mentioned the matchup problems with Pitts and London becomes a huge problem in the redzone.  Drake London was the best WR last year in CFB before he got hurt with a bad QB.  The Falcons had problems protecting slow footed Ryan last year. This year they are running the ball well and Mariota is making just enough plays with his feet and arm.  Going way back…He’s historically been a QB that wilts under pressure. The Falcons are gonna run the ball and scheme up plays for their two big playmakers and then don’t forget they have their undersized slot guy who is dangerous.  This is our toughest game to date. 

@nickers said:

With Joe Woods running the D... I don't see this becoming a Pass Rushing team anytime soon.... This is more like Bill Arnsparger on steroids prevent D. I'm so sick of everything being "Nickel" "Nickel" "Nickel"

So who are the Superstar Pass Rushers taking advantage of all the attention Myles Garrett is getting Nicks?  Did Clowney play last week?  What Superstars inside is Joe Woods failing to understand here?  Give me a name.  Just 1.  You're bitching just to bitch.

Bill Parcels once said if you're gonna ask me to cook the meal - then you should let me buy the groceries.  If Garrett and Clowney don't play this week, we're pretty much attacking with pawns whether some of you guys want to pretend otherwise or not.  YES, we've invested heavily in the DBs at the back end; and we have 2 great edge rushers when/if healthy.  We also lost 2 starting LBers last week right?  When that happens during the game - the replacements have enough to think about let alone adding a zone blitz coverage adjustment to that.  Buffalo added Von Miller so they don't have worry about zone blitz coverage adjustments. Teams are turning to that because like Bob806 mentioned offenses are already challenging the numbers at the back end with multiple Receivers.   Think of the Lindy Infante mentality (multiple receivers spread) when he knew teams wanted to blitz our cement shoe'd hero Bernie.  "Wanna blitz us?  Welcome to Hell!"   

@flugel said:

Well said Bob!  Yes, you need speed but you can't have guys with hollow-domes back there.  If they're not smart enough to ask their coaches about things they're confused about during the week of preparation or communicate with teammates on game day, I'm not gonna pretend the only problem is Joe Woods.  We won a playoff game with him as our DC on the same day our OC actually called the plays.  The Defense produced multiple turnovers that day while the Browns scored 48 points.

Yes & yes.

I'm not a huge Woods guy either, BUT he did make adjustments last year, the year before even with COVID depleted rosters ( like many DCs I suppose).  I think we all broke our TVs after the Chargers game, then they played well the rest of the year in 2021.

I'm confident our NFL staff can patch this up. Probably 7 or 8 out of 10. Woods has been around.