@ghoolie-always-ghoolie said:

Wasn't comparing Chubb to Barkely although given a choice I would take Barkley.

One can however, improve the chances of draft success. Mayfield was as much of an obvious bad pick as Manziel was. 

Nobody in their right mind would have taken him. Carolina sure got the shit end of the deal.

Here's the thing, the year before that in 2017 - Cleveland drafted 1st overall coming off 1-15 football and drafted Myles Garrett over (which got them an elite pass rusher).  That said, he impacted winning so much that the Browns actually got worse and lost all 16 games his rookie year. 

Patrick Mahomes or DeShaun Watson (whom the Browns are now giving up THREE 1st round draft picks to acquire well as 230 million $ worth of cap space) could have been drafted by Cleveland.  Wouldn't it have been nice to have just spent the 1st overall pick on either Watson or Mahomes back in 2017 under the rookie salary cap structure?  

The last QB Cleveland got right in the draft was way back in the 85 Supplemental Draft to get Bernie Kosar.  That sure explains a lot of the losing....

What is really hurting this team are some of these picks…

Grant Delpit 2

Greedy Williams 2

Anthony Schwartz 3

Jacob Phillips 3

Jordan Elliot 3

Sione Takataki 3

0 for 6!!! You need to find contributing starters in this range.  If anyone in this group is a starter next year God help us.  Maybe a new coordinator/scheme helps a couple of these guys. 
 

@orion said:

We're actually a little better at it now.  The draft is a crapshoot for every team.

They passed on Josh Allen to take  Baker Mayfield. I don't know what the scouts were looking at to miss that. 

@ghoolie-always-ghoolie said:

Wasn't comparing Chubb to Barkely although given a choice I would take Barkley.

One can however, improve the chances of draft success. Mayfield was as much of an obvious bad pick as Manziel was. 

Nobody in their right mind would have taken him. Carolina sure got the shit end of the deal.

Barkley is too injury prone... No thanx...

@ghoolie-always-ghoolie said:

The Mayfield pick for sure was crap.

Let me try to find a positive to hang my hat on.  Okay why does this feel like playing pin the tail on the donkey while drinking MD 20/20?  No luck there.

Here's a little blind squirrel finds nut. In that 2018 draft where Mayfield was drafted 1st and Saquon Barkley went 2nd, the Browns drafted RB Nick Chubb in the 2nd round at #35 overall. If you compare the yards per carry for their NFL careers, Chubb is at 5.4 ypc with 44 rushing TDs while Barkley is at 4.6 ypc with 23 rushing TDs.  The pick the Browns and the Giants both missed on was Josh Allen.  Having said that, the Giants now have the guy who developed Allen (Brian Daboll) as their Head Coach with a 6-1 record to show for it.  In the process, their previously maligned 4th year QB (Daniel Jones) is happily wondering where the majority of his critics have gone.

Before we appreciate the value of the Nick Chubb selection, the Browns also did an epic reach for OL Austin Corbett at #33 overall (1st pick of round 2) a couple slots before Chubb.  Make sense?  It shouldn't.  Anyway, Corbett is already on his 3rd of 4th team - but he did start at RG for the Super Bowl Champions in LA. It just wouldn't be the Browns without something like that.  They'd rather put Brut cologne on body odor than take a shower.

@orion said:

We're actually a little better at it now.  The draft is a crapshoot for every team.

I would say the FO rolled snake eyes on Anthony Schwartz.

Time for someone there to admit he is a waste of a roster spot.

@ghoolie-always-ghoolie said:

Yes, because we are so good at drafting.

We're actually a little better at it now.  The draft is a crapshoot for every team.

@dutch-oven said:

This team continues to lack strong leadership, and despite some of the biggest fuckups to cause losses, nothing ever changes. 

A strong statement needs to be made from the top. A message needs to be sent to the whole organization that this nonsense will not be tolerated. 

it's not that i  disagree with you but we are not in the locker room so it is just speculation but from the outside it sure doe's feel that way

@syd said:

a fractured locker room they say  wasn't that part of the reason we let mayfield go because of that whole obj mess   and supposedly it's still going on now

This team continues to lack strong leadership, and despite some of the biggest fuckups to cause losses, nothing ever changes. 

A strong statement needs to be made from the top. A message needs to be sent to the whole organization that this nonsense will not be tolerated. 

The team is pissed off with all the losing.  

But, yup pre-season starts in early December.  - I thought we were done with looking towards the draft in October.....but apparently we're there again....except this time we don't have a pick.

So now we lost Phillips for the season...that's our #1 & #2 MLB's.  Fortunately Berry traded for one.  But Njoku is now hurt and out.  He was one of our weak passing attack's best weapons.  Ugh.  -  I think Monday night I'll sit outside, eat and hand out candy to the Trick-or-Treaters.

@dutch-oven said:

a fractured locker room they say  wasn't that part of the reason we let mayfield go because of that whole obj mess   and supposedly it's still going on now

@canton-dawg said:

I’m sure there will be a lot of Bengal fans dressed up like hillbillies! 

They all have that "Far away" look in their eyes too lol

@mddawg said:

As if we needed reminding of how badly coached this team is, the awful Bears showed how to welcome a rookie, third string QB to the NFL on MNF.

? or ? - either works.  I hear ya!

@flugel said:

I'm sure you already know that's Halloween; so if you have any outrageous photos you can share the next day or so - it would be a great way to get our minds off what unfolded on the field Monday Night if need be...

I’m sure there will be a lot of Bengal fans dressed up like hillbillies! 

@dutch-oven said:

Wow!  I hope a lot people watch this video and see the replay of Johnson's "business decision" to refrain from trying to make a tackle that could have stopped a TD.  He's already checked out - so why is he still here?  Let me guess, the FO brought him here so they're pulling rank on the Coaching staff that wants him gone.  

@flugel said:

Everything starts at the top.  I explained that in the post you replied to.  The problem is bigger than the current symptom giving you a headache.  It's the owner that doesn't know what he's doing.  For example, he hired Stefanski 2 weeks before he hired the GM.  That arranged work marriage doesn't set up like if there's a divorce - it becomes when there's a divorce.  In other words?  Even with this team making the playoffs at the end of their 1st season together, the same GM that said he didn't draft Baker also can say he wasn't a part of hiring Stefanski.  When Berry doesn't want the Head Coach and Coordinators cutting his draft picks guess what starts colliding?   Philosophies that should have been part of the interview.  One problem.  The owner hired the Head Coach before he hired the GM.  Are you understanding Haslam doesn't know what he is doing yet?  If not you're always going to blaming the symptoms instead of the cancer killing this team.  

Yes Tom, I've been saying this since he purchased the team... I didn't like him... Or any of his hires since then...

@nickers said:

Haslam isnt building much of one either...

Everything starts at the top.  I explained that in the post you replied to.  The problem is bigger than the current symptom giving you a headache.  It's the owner that doesn't know what he's doing.  For example, he hired Stefanski 2 weeks before he hired the GM.  That arranged work marriage doesn't set up like if there's a divorce - it becomes when there's a divorce.  In other words?  Even with this team making the playoffs at the end of their 1st season together, the same GM that said he didn't draft Baker also can say he wasn't a part of hiring Stefanski.  When Berry doesn't want the Head Coach and Coordinators cutting his draft picks guess what starts colliding?   Philosophies that should have been part of the interview.  One problem.  The owner hired the Head Coach before he hired the GM.  Are you understanding Haslam doesn't know what he is doing yet?  If not you're always going to blaming the symptoms instead of the cancer killing this team.  

@flugel said:

I was talking about the owner so you're damn right you're gonna wait...

Haslam isnt building much of one either...

@nickers said:

Please tell us what foundation Kevvy is building?... I'll wait...

I was talking about the owner so you're damn right you're gonna wait...

@flugel said:

This a good spot to do that.  Thanks Dutch! 

Can we trade our owner for Robert Kraft?  His last 2 Head Coaches (and maybe only 2 Head Coaches) are Bill Parcells and Bill Belichick.  In other words,  if any one of the 3 Coordinators in charge of their phase of the game wasn't/isn't doing their job - they got/will get their fanny lit right on the spot (quite often in front of the players or along the sideline on game day). It starts at the top - not at the Coordinators.  In NE, young guys that prove their work ethics get promoted into Coordinator positions that they cherish there.  The saying for players and coaching staff there is this simple "DO YOUR JOB!"  

When an owner actually has a clue as to what he needs and identifies what he is looking for; then he needs to have an organized hiring criteria.  If not, he's always going to be the AFC version of the Detroit Lions with a backup QB like George Plimpton (The Paper Lion) or poor JaQB Sneak Brissett... Firing Head Coaches and Coordinators every 2-3 years removes foundations.  Then there's usually GM that has to be hired.  If so, it's usually a good idea to get him or her first so they are involved in the hiring of the next Head Coach.  Pittsburgh started up 70s dynasty on a philosophy before a very compatible Chuck Noll (former messenger Guard that played for Paul Brown in Cleveland).  The Rooneys DO like their Head Coaches that played for the Cleveland Browns (Noll and Cowher).  The sad thing thing is Jimmy was very small minority owner of the Steelers; and the guy didn't learn a freakin about how to run a GREAT football program with continuity instead of constant start overs.   

Rant over - sorry.

@flugel said:

This a good spot to do that.  Thanks Dutch! 

Can we trade our owner for Robert Kraft?  His last 2 Head Coaches (and maybe only 2 Head Coaches) are Bill Parcells and Bill Belichick.  In other words,  if any one of the 3 Coordinators in charge of their phase of the game wasn't/isn't doing their job - they got/will get their fanny lit right on the spot (quite often in front of the players or along the sideline on game day). It starts at the top - not at the Coordinators.  In NE, young guys that prove their work ethics get promoted into Coordinator positions that they cherish there.  The saying for players and coaching staff there is this simple "DO YOUR JOB!"  

When an owner actually has a clue as to what he needs and identifies what he is looking for; then he needs to have an organized hiring criteria.  If not, he's always going to be the AFC version of the Detroit Lions with a backup QB like George Plimpton (The Paper Lion) or poor JaQB Sneak Brissett... Firing Head Coaches and Coordinators every 2-3 years removes foundations.  Then there's usually GM that has to be hired.  If so, it's usually a good idea to get him or her first so they are involved in the hiring of the next Head Coach.  Pittsburgh started up 70s dynasty on a philosophy before a very compatible Chuck Noll (former messenger Guard that played for Paul Brown in Cleveland).  The Rooneys DO like their Head Coaches that played for the Cleveland Browns (Noll and Cowher).  The sad thing thing is Jimmy was very small minority owner of the Steelers; and the guy didn't learn a freakin about how to run a GREAT football program with continuity instead of constant start overs.   

Rant over - sorry.

Please tell us what foundation Kevvy is building?... I'll wait...