@syd said:

they have the money so hopefully it's on their dime

I think the article does state that there's been no real talks about monies.  Just some conjecture of where some might come from.  

If a roofed stadium does get built I'm going to take credit for it's inspiration because of this thread.  And I'll want a plaque with my name on it.  I can see it now, Orion's Mens Room.   Awwww  Beautiful!

@syd said:

they have the money so hopefully it's on their dime

The amount of money the Haslams just dropped for a 25% stake of the Milwaukee Bucks would have paid for a good portion of a new stadium. 

@dutch-oven said:

The Browns appear to be going balls to the wall for a new stadium. 

they have the money so hopefully it's on their dime

The study was conducted by HKS Architects, which also designed the Minnesota Vikings’ $1 billion enclosed US Bank Stadium in 2016. Prendergast previously reported that any new stadium for the Browns could include a dome or retractable roof.

The Browns organization funded a study on the long-term viability of First Energy Stadium... Highlights? The study paints the picture of First Energy as a poorly-designed, poorly-built stadium that isn't worth the money to renovate when the lease in 2028 ends.

The Browns appear to be going balls to the wall for a new stadium. 

Zombo said:

Of course he did. He's heterosexual. 

Z

it also just shows that are kids here are not fuck up's 

Zombo said:

Correct.

Mem weren't meant to grapple indoors.

Wrestling, dome football : Gay.

Outdoors: Sport

Z

when my son played for the rugby team he loved playing in the rain and on a muddy field

@syd said:

fuck a roof unless it's on your fucking house

I wouldn't fuck either.?

@syd said:

hey what the hell was wrong with the UFO D forgot which coach ran that wacky shit cause it sure as hell didnt work for us

 Anchor points along the defensive line against checked run calls was/is a huge problem.  

3rd and 3 becomes far more inviting to run the ball against a defense where you're almost guaranteed to fire off the ball with superior pad level.  At that point, 3 yards isn't much. 

@orion said:

... but that's just me.      luv ya Flugel

Backatchya my lovin spoonful

@flugel said:

As you know, I get very tunnel vision to my opinions and ideas. -  As we all do.

That's the reason I enjoy interacting with you in here.  When we disagree, you do a good of making a knucklehead (never ever thought of you as a knucklehead) like me see your angle on it. Sometimes you'll even add in a perfect blend of smartass.

... but that's just me.      luv ya Flugel

@orion said:

And I don't like designed runs for Josh Allen either.  Let's make it simple, I don't like designed runs for QB's unless it's a QB sneak.  Even then I didn't want Mayfield QB sneaking because he was useless at it....and probably fumbled half the time. 

It's bad enough a QB gets hurt playing from the pocket sometimes.  

Too much money is invested in the QB.  Too much of your team's success depends on that guy.  I don't want my QB trying to gain yards with his legs....unless the seas part in front of him (like Burrow did in the championship game), or unless he has to get out of the pocket and then finds some room to run.  I need his arm and I don't want to have to need his legs.

That's just me.   And it's always going to be me.

I'd be disappointed if it wasn't you. Wouldn't want it any other way.  You did a great job explaining why and where you are coming from.  As you know, I get very tunnel vision to my opinions and ideas. That's the reason I enjoy interacting with you in here.  When we disagree, you do a good of making a knucklehead like me see your angle on it. Sometimes you'll even add in a perfect blend of smartass.

Beside Schwartz, the other thing we did see eye to eye on is that we have a lot of money/cap space/future invested in Watson.  I can't fault you for not wanting us to turn Watson into a wreckless QB like Lamar Jackson or using the type of choices a Josh Allen makes when he runs the ball.  I don't want that either. I was just trying to think of what originally made Watson an attractive draft choice and the efficient QB the Browns wanted; so I could project what type of current system would match what he does best. As I said, it doesn't have to be one that uses a lot of RPO read behind 2 Pro Bowl Guards. I'm open to other ideas Watson could flourish in. I think there's a lot of fans worrying if the Browns will have the right offensive design/system fit for what he does best.   

This wasn't good at the time per say; but on the worst possible weather conditions to throw vrs the Saints - he had 3 passes that hit the hands of his targets in the end zone (showing people that were concerned if this QB who grew up/played in the South could be accurate, clutch and poised in the bitter cold up north too). We'll see what happens moving forward...

@syd said:

hey what the hell was wrong with the UFO D forgot which coach ran that wacky shit cause it sure as hell didnt work for us

?  It was the 15-20 yard cushions that surrendered the right for our Cornerbacks to compete or at least attempt to do so. It looks like Nicks gave you the correct answer of who the DC was back then. 

And then there's Ray Horton, who had some very unique ghost-town zone coverages here leaving a third of the field wide open to exploit.  It seemed like every time a RB/Receiver caught a pass - pursuit couldn't reach him for another 25-30 yards. We didn't just hire him once.  Oh no, we had to hire him again as if the owner and FO asked themselves "are we sure he REALLY sucked the first time?"  Even worse, the answer was "No, we're not sure.  Bring him back. If we're wrong we'll get a higher draft pick."   You don't say...

@syd said:

the UFO D forgot

Romeo.

@syd said:

hey what the hell was wrong with the UFO D forgot which coach ran that wacky shit cause it sure as hell didnt work for us

Bob Slowik... Yeah It was weird......

@nickers said:

It will be nice to see the Browns playing a "NORMAL" defense for once

hey what the hell was wrong with the UFO D forgot which coach ran that wacky shit cause it sure as hell didnt work for us

@flugel said:

Where did I say I wanted Lamar Jackson? 

Did you have to say his name in order for me to mention him?  

And I don't like designed runs for Josh Allen either.  Let's make it simple, I don't like designed runs for QB's unless it's a QB sneak.  Even then I didn't want Mayfield QB sneaking because he was useless at it....and probably fumbled half the time. 

It's bad enough a QB gets hurt playing from the pocket sometimes.  

Too much money is invested in the QB.  Too much of your team's success depends on that guy.  I don't want my QB trying to gain yards with his legs....unless the seas part in front of him (like Burrow did in the championship game), or unless he has to get out of the pocket and then finds some room to run.  I need his arm and I don't want to have to need his legs.

That's just me.   And it's always going to be me.

I'll never forget one time when Baker rolled out and ran, and then took a defensive player on and got smashed into the sideline.  One of our TE's ran up to him and Baker said "Shut up."  Because he knew what the TE was going to say.  But the TE said it to him anyway, "Don't do that.  We need you."  (this came from a Hard Knocks episode)  And I remember thinking, that TE should become a coach someday.  What was his name now?   Felder?  No, that's an Eagles guitar player.......

@orion said:

Tom Brady.  

Yes, I know QB's can get hurt without running RPO's.  Look at the 9'ers Championship game.  But I like the way Cincy uses Joe Burrow.  I'd prefer to see Watson used like John Elway.  

I don't think Elways was used that way.  It just happened.

I don't think we will run many deigned QB runs.  Maybe 2-3 a game....not counting QB sneaks.  I do think he will not be discouraged from tucking  and running.

No doubt we want him being smart.  take what you can get then slide in to 2nd base.

@flugel said:

I'll start where we agree.  Schwartz and his volume of experience will be a great thing for our defense.  And he does like HIS front line guys not to be confused with the IDL we've been counting on here the last 2 years or so.  The difference between Schwartz and the guy calling our offensive plays is that Stefanski's entire NFL experience prior to Cleveland was with 1 team only since 2006 that played in a climate controlled dome indoors.  Schwartz's wealth of experience on different teams exposed him to working in different defenses/systems; so the ability to adjust to an opponent seems to come easier to him than Stefanski.  How many early leads did the Browns lose last year?

Where did I say I wanted Lamar Jackson?  That's you bringing up an extreme example of a QB whose team designed and called running plays for him to the extent he exceeded 1000 yards rushing in 2019 and 2020. We have Nick Chubb and Kareen Hunt very well paid to take care of majority of our rushing stats.   Excessive wear and tear to the QB isn't required in an RPO.   That said, the only injury he had last year was an elbow injury when he got hit throwing the ball in the pocket.  It's up to his coaching staff and himself at how safe and smart he wants to be when he does run.  

Isn't it possible to like a QB that is very accurate and talented at passing that can also RUN the ball?  Doesn't Josh Allen do this?  Watson isn't built to try to take on LBers like Josh tries to do at times so I doubt we'll see him pretending he's Larry Csonka.  That said, the only injury Allen had last year was an elbow injury when he got hit throwing the ball in the pocket.  It's up to him and his coaching staff at how safe and smart he wants to be when he does run.    Another QB that was great at throwing the ball even though he never had a great Offensive Line was Russell Wilson; so he extended drives with his legs as often as he needed to.  The ONLY serious injury he had was about 2 or 3 years ago IN THE POCKET when he dislocated/fractured the fingers on his throwing hand.  I've never seen the same guy since that happened; and neither have the 2 teams that employed him.  

And your other extreme of preferring a Tom Brady when Jimmy Haslam is our owner (not to be confused with Robert Kraft) would give the cement shoe'd QB you desire a Jedrick Wills responsible for his blind side.  Good luck with that one.  The last time I saw Brady play against the Browns he had a LT looking/playing like Wills. It wasn't a very good day for the GOAT.

Rather than rewiring the QB the Browns did sign, how about using all of his football assets so success is possible?  I keep forgetting this franchise isn't owned by Robert Kraft in this conversation too. That said, it doesn't have to be an RPO.  That's just 1 idea. I like it because we have a Pro Bowl Guard on either side of Center where the first inside read takes place and a Pro Bowl RB that should limit the frequency of how often Watson needs to keep the ball (especially when he can throw the ball as one of the options when he doesn't hand it to Chubb).  I'm open to other ideas that don't pretend it's easy to see the next Tom Brady playing for the Browns.  If we're gonna go back to previous eras of QBs and dream - why not hope we have the next Otto Graham that can run or throw based on what the defense is giving him?  

It will be nice to see the Browns playing a "NORMAL" defense for once

@orion said:

Thanks.  But actually I was saying that 'they', the Browns, wanted us to be more like Philly.  Especially on the D, and with the hiring of Schwartz...who likes his front line guys.

In reality however, I've never been a big fan of putting my QB's in position to get hurt.  I don't like them running the ball.  I need them for passing the ball....all season long...every season.  How helpful has Llamar Jackson been to his team the last two years?  

I don't mind them running when the play disintegrates, but if there's no real running room then just throw it away.  And if ya do run, get down before contact.  Give me the Tom Brady type.   Too much is invested in the QB position (we're a point in case) and they're too important to the success of a team.  Now, if Watson isn't great at being the Brady type and his strength is being the Jackson type, then that's what ya gotta do.  You can't keep trying to mash the guy into the round hole.  But I keep going back to DePodesta's wanting to hire Stef when Dorsey insisted on the Bill-Hilly.  I'm assuming DePo liked what Stef was doing.  And I'm wondering if we will now be mashing Stef into a round hole....and if he's malleable enough.

I'll start where we agree.  Schwartz and his volume of experience will be a great thing for our defense.  And he does like HIS front line guys not to be confused with the IDL we've been counting on here the last 2 years or so.  The difference between Schwartz and the guy calling our offensive plays is that Stefanski's entire NFL experience prior to Cleveland was with 1 team only since 2006 that played in a climate controlled dome indoors.  Schwartz's wealth of experience on different teams exposed him to working in different defenses/systems; so the ability to adjust to an opponent seems to come easier to him than Stefanski.  How many early leads did the Browns lose last year?

Where did I say I wanted Lamar Jackson?  That's you bringing up an extreme example of a QB whose team designed and called running plays for him to the extent he exceeded 1000 yards rushing in 2019 and 2020. We have Nick Chubb and Kareen Hunt very well paid to take care of majority of our rushing stats.   Excessive wear and tear to the QB isn't required in an RPO.   That said, the only injury he had last year was an elbow injury when he got hit throwing the ball in the pocket.  It's up to his coaching staff and himself at how safe and smart he wants to be when he does run.  

Isn't it possible to like a QB that is very accurate and talented at passing that can also RUN the ball?  Doesn't Josh Allen do this?  Watson isn't built to try to take on LBers like Josh tries to do at times so I doubt we'll see him pretending he's Larry Csonka.  That said, the only injury Allen had last year was an elbow injury when he got hit throwing the ball in the pocket.  It's up to him and his coaching staff at how safe and smart he wants to be when he does run.    Another QB that was great at throwing the ball even though he never had a great Offensive Line was Russell Wilson; so he extended drives with his legs as often as he needed to.  The ONLY serious injury he had was about 2 or 3 years ago IN THE POCKET when he dislocated/fractured the fingers on his throwing hand.  I've never seen the same guy since that happened; and neither have the 2 teams that employed him.  

And your other extreme of preferring a Tom Brady when Jimmy Haslam is our owner (not to be confused with Robert Kraft) would give the cement shoe'd QB you desire a Jedrick Wills responsible for his blind side.  Good luck with that one.  The last time I saw Brady play against the Browns he had a LT looking/playing like Wills. It wasn't a very good day for the GOAT.

Rather than rewiring the QB the Browns did sign, how about using all of his football assets so success is possible?  I keep forgetting this franchise isn't owned by Robert Kraft in this conversation too. That said, it doesn't have to be an RPO.  That's just 1 idea. I like it because we have a Pro Bowl Guard on either side of Center where the first inside read takes place and a Pro Bowl RB that should limit the frequency of how often Watson needs to keep the ball (especially when he can throw the ball as one of the options when he doesn't hand it to Chubb).  I'm open to other ideas that don't pretend it's easy to see the next Tom Brady playing for the Browns.  If we're gonna go back to previous eras of QBs and dream - why not hope we have the next Otto Graham that can run or throw based on what the defense is giving him?  

@ballpeen said:

We also tend to stick to old thinking and think about guys like Kosar or Unitas lumbering around

Tom Brady.  

Yes, I know QB's can get hurt without running RPO's.  Look at the 9'ers Championship game.  But I like the way Cincy uses Joe Burrow.  I'd prefer to see Watson used like John Elway.  

@ballpeen said:

Every package goes in through Memphis and out of Memphis.  If that Airport gets gummed up for some reason, it gums up the delivery system everywhere.

You are correct.  (of course, Fedex ground does not go through the Memphis hub).  And UPS air goes through Louisville KY.

@orion said:

Good....cos they don't let me bring my umbrella inside. 

It's supposed to be freakin' cold this Saturday.   I'm glad my grandson's basketball playoff game is indoors. 

How come they don't play baseball in the rain and/or snow?   That game was made to be played outside in the open air, by real men, right?   Wait!  Maybe that's why they call them the 'boys' of summer. 

Look at hockey.  It's a game to be played in frozen conditions and it has been played indoors for a long time.  I also wonder why all the college bowl games are played in places like New Orleans, Miami, and Pasadena and not places like Fargo and Buffalo?