@flugel said:

Aside from your points, I'd be surprised if he didn't draft a DB somewhere in this draft.

That is always a solid prediction when Berry is involved. 

@ballpeen said:

Berry seems to draft a year ahead.  We may be deeper at guard today, maybe not so much next year.  We also have next year needs at DT.  We very well could go that way.

Aside from your points, I'd be surprised if he didn't draft a DB somewhere in this draft.

@flugel said:

Yeah, who knows?  You might be right Ballpeen.  If you are right - the good news is a lot of productive college tackles (lacking arm length) get drafted to play OG creating a bigger supply of Guards (ie: Joel Bitonio was a Tackle in college) overall.  This also means we wouldn't have to draft one in round 2 in order to secure a good one.  Besides, we don't need immediate impact at OG with Bitonio and Teller so they can defer to a later round for a developmental guy.

Just thinking out loud here. I think we have more depth inside at this time than at LT. Michael Dunn can play LG extremely well; and I'm guessing he could do the same at RG if we needed him to (that's an easier transition from 1 side to the other than OT).  He helped us beat SF without Bitonio.  They just signed a backup RG Germain Ifedi (who would only play RT if both Conklin and Jones are injured). Luke Wypler will also be counted on to backup Center an OG spot. Right now, I don't think we have a backup LT on the roster that anyone would have a great deal of confidence in (unless I'm forgetting someone I shouldn't be).

There's been mentions and thoughts on our board about moving Dawand Jones to LT.  I've warmed up to this idea more than I thought I would.  However, trying this the 1st training camp after a serious knee injury that landed him on IR and a surgery table might not be the best time to try this.  Like Dutch reminds us, we're not having any luck keeping Conklin healthy so we'll probably see more of Jones than Conklin at RT again.

My guess is we'll go LT with our first pick in round 2 unless a run on the position depletes the supply of them too far to consider what's left for round 2 value.  Very possible this could happen. 

Stay tuned... 

Berry seems to draft a year ahead.  We may be deeper at guard today, maybe not so much next year.  We also have next year needs at DT.  We very well could go that way.

https://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/draft-on-tap-assessing-offensive-linemen-prospects-in-the-2024-nfl-draft

@flugel said:

This was like 2022 when the Browns pretended DT wasn't important at all.  End result?  This team couldn't stop the run

I think that another factor was the thinking that the guys that were previously drafted to take over the IDL were now ready to step in and play at a high(er) level.  And as we found out they were rotational talent at best.  

@ballpeen said:

I'd say there is a higher probability we take an interior O-lineman before we would take a LT.  The only reason as I see it is there should be better guards on the board than LT prospects.

Yes.  Round 2 is more of a sweet spot for guards.  In general the pecking order would be:  LT, then RT, followed by G & OT's that are projected to be G's....and sprinkle the C position in there somewhere based on talent and/or ability to play G also.

We all have our own ideas on which position(s) we would like addressed 1st, and there'd be valid reasons for all of 'em.  But with no 1st round pick yet again we need to draft BPA and not try and force anything...at least until round 5.  Picks 54 & 85 have got to be able to help us in the future.  If they can help us this season, that's gravy.

@ballpeen said:

I'd say there is a higher probability we take an interior O-lineman before we would take a LT.  The only reason as I see it is there should be better guards on the board than LT prospects.

But, as you said, we will see what happens.  You never know who might or might no be there.

Yeah, who knows?  You might be right Ballpeen.  If you are right - the good news is a lot of productive college tackles (lacking arm length) get drafted to play OG creating a bigger supply of Guards (ie: Joel Bitonio was a Tackle in college) overall.  This also means we wouldn't have to draft one in round 2 in order to secure a good one.  Besides, we don't need immediate impact at OG with Bitonio and Teller so they can defer to a later round for a developmental guy.

Just thinking out loud here. I think we have more depth inside at this time than at LT. Michael Dunn can play LG extremely well; and I'm guessing he could do the same at RG if we needed him to (that's an easier transition from 1 side to the other than OT).  He helped us beat SF without Bitonio.  They just signed a backup RG Germain Ifedi (who would only play RT if both Conklin and Jones are injured). Luke Wypler will also be counted on to backup Center an OG spot. Right now, I don't think we have a backup LT on the roster that anyone would have a great deal of confidence in (unless I'm forgetting someone I shouldn't be).

There's been mentions and thoughts on our board about moving Dawand Jones to LT.  I've warmed up to this idea more than I thought I would.  However, trying this the 1st training camp after a serious knee injury that landed him on IR and a surgery table might not be the best time to try this.  Like Dutch reminds us, we're not having any luck keeping Conklin healthy so we'll probably see more of Jones than Conklin at RT again.

My guess is we'll go LT with our first pick in round 2 unless a run on the position depletes the supply of them too far to consider what's left for round 2 value.  Very possible this could happen. 

Stay tuned... 

@flugel said:

I have to agree. I think we're begging for trouble pretending 1 more year of Casper the Friendly Ghost at Left Tackle helps this team in any way.  This was like 2022 when the Browns pretended DT wasn't important at all.  End result?  This team couldn't stop the run or keep offensive linemen off the LB Corps. In fact, we had portions of the 2022 season where the entire 1st string of LBers were injured because of it.

Yeah, Wills under contract but does that light his fanny or make him feel entitled 1 more time?  I don't see a lot of playoff teams that have their biggest weakness upfront at Left Tackle. There may be some exceptions to that - like the Browns at the expense of needing 5 different QBs. When Wills went on IR, the Browns won 4 of their last 5 games.  The only one they lost in that stretch was in Cincy.  That day, they rested a lot of valuable starters while starting Jeff Driskell at QB.

Unfortunately, none of this means they'll take a LT.  There's probably going to be a run on them before we draft in round 2.  We'll see what happens...

I'd say there is a higher probability we take an interior O-lineman before we would take a LT.  The only reason as I see it is there should be better guards on the board than LT prospects.

But, as you said, we will see what happens.  You never know who might or might no be there.

@dutch-oven said:

You think they would pass on a LT because Wills is on the roster? Isn't he on the last season of his rookie contract?

And Conklin should retire. Guy can't stay healthy enough to play into October. 

Jones is the only Tackle on the roster worth building around long-term. 

I have to agree. I think we're begging for trouble pretending 1 more year of Casper the Friendly Ghost at Left Tackle helps this team in any way.  This was like 2022 when the Browns pretended DT wasn't important at all.  End result?  This team couldn't stop the run or keep offensive linemen off the LB Corps. In fact, we had portions of the 2022 season where the entire 1st string of LBers were injured because of it.

Yeah, Wills under contract but does that light his fanny or make him feel entitled 1 more time?  I don't see a lot of playoff teams that have their biggest weakness upfront at Left Tackle. There may be some exceptions to that - like the Browns at the expense of needing 5 different QBs. When Wills went on IR, the Browns won 4 of their last 5 games.  The only one they lost in that stretch was in Cincy.  That day, they rested a lot of valuable starters while starting Jeff Driskell at QB.

Unfortunately, none of this means they'll take a LT.  There's probably going to be a run on them before we draft in round 2.  We'll see what happens...

@dutch-oven said:

You think they would pass on a LT because Wills is on the roster? Isn't he on the last season of his rookie contract?

And Conklin should retire. Guy can't stay healthy enough to play into October. 

Jones is the only Tackle on the roster worth building around long-term. 

I agree with everything you said.  AND, I'm not real high on Wills.  (I'm the one who claims that he's got it written in his contract that he only need block for 3.5 seconds per play)  IMO, there are 3 positions that are 'first round important' positions.  QB, premier edge rusher and LT.  Not that you can't find really good ones in later rounds...but the probability goes down on a faster curve.  I think it'll be 2025 for LT...unless they find one on day 3 this year.

@orion said:

IMO, because we do have Jedrick Wills, we will not be drafting for the LT spot in round 2...and the RT spot seems set with two guys that could start...as well as the RG/RT veteran that we just signed.  Though I do expect a day 3 OT selection.

You think they would pass on a LT because Wills is on the roster? Isn't he on the last season of his rookie contract?

And Conklin should retire. Guy can't stay healthy enough to play into October. 

Jones is the only Tackle on the roster worth building around long-term. 

@gumby73 said:

Fast moving week..Since last Sunday.

A-Mega's stock went from the mid 80's, to now ranked #75 as of here https://www.nflmockdraftdatabase.com/big-boards/2024/consensus-big-board-2024

a.)Berry a.) trades a Tackle Watson to Tits for a 7th.  b.) Injury medical release of G Drew Forbes c.) A camp PS T retires named Murray. 

d.) Browns add a RT/RG Germaine Ifedi 

Ageing high Contracts at both G/RT.. Heck..We might be more in need, of developing a drafted G or T? Than we were this time last weekend  

• Rounds 2-3: Friday, April 26 at 7 p.m. ET.   Gates open at Noon ?

IMO, Left Tackles are somewhat like QBs in the sense teams will reach for them.  For example, Lindy's Draft Mag has Kiran Amegadije going to KC at #64 overall in their Mock Draft - even though they had him as their 13th highest rated Offensive Tackle as a 4th round projection.   He didn't make the Top 100 Rated Players posted in this mag based on consensus opinion of Field Level Media analysts. That said, the entire Ivy League got snobbed from that list.

My other Draft Mag from Athlon Sports has him rated #76 overall in their Top 100 players. Before I share where this Mock Draft has him going - there's been some trades between when this was printed vrs the other Mag.  This mag's mock draft also has KC taking Amegadije but this version has KC doing it at #63 overall.  I think the most up to date version has KC drafting in the 64th spot.

In either case, KC has a franchise QB to protect. Both Mock Drafts acknowledge the importance of that in terms of reaching above the ratings/projections into a limited supply of Left Tackles available to shield off the blind side of passer. 

@flugel said:

My spelling test says that's A-mega start to our draft Gumbs!

Fast moving week..Since last Sunday.

A-Mega's stock went from the mid 80's, to now ranked #75 as of here https://www.nflmockdraftdatabase.com/big-boards/2024/consensus-big-board-2024

a.)Berry a.) trades a Tackle Watson to Tits for a 7th.  b.) Injury medical release of G Drew Forbes c.) A camp PS T retires named Murray. 

d.) Browns add a RT/RG Germaine Ifedi 

Ageing high Contracts at both G/RT.. Heck..We might be more in need, of developing a drafted G or T? Than we were this time last weekend  

• Rounds 2-3: Friday, April 26 at 7 p.m. ET.   Gates open at Noon ?

@gumby73 said:

returning to slick Flug's 54th pick choices ?

1.) Being AB's choice..

It'd take a 22 y.o 4.3 speed WR to fall on pick #54? Still feels like Berry trades back. Berry's guardrails would put the younger LB Junior Colson ahead of my choice of local LB Payton Wilson. My believe is Colson won't get to #54 but, Payton Wilson may with injury testing/draft age..

Give me.. LB Payton Wilson at pick #54.. @flugel Morning Pancake special (cameraman sucks) .. My spelling test, calls him A-meg ! Stinging Bee-hive T, is raw enough to be the Browns/my 85th pick..

Meet playing angry, till whistle Jed Wills

My spelling test says that's A-mega start to our draft Gumbs! That Y for Yale just gave you a Y for Yahtzee. I was wondering where you were; and you didn't disappoint. Well done!  

@ballpeen said:

Also, the draft is only interesting when your team sucks........ When  you are picking in the 2nd round, it's futile to try to pinpoint guys we might draft.

Similar to what I said in February.  

Once we got through the bulk of free agency our more crucial needs became more in focus.  Now one can take a look at a few Big Boards and see what players are ranked in the area of pick 54...or 85.  Then one can take a cursory look at players at positions that you think are in need of help.  

(  the Browns home page did a segment on Ricky Pearson.  I've not read it...but I'll probably get around to it  )

But the few times we had the #1 overall pick kind of lacked a certain sex-appeal to when it was obvious who we were taking, like Myles. (But not the year we took Baker, that draft lead-up was bananas on here. Every day, calfox trying to outdo himself in being a whiny bitch. It was almost impressive. ?)

@flugel said:

Understood. I need my day job so I don't buy the magazine/guide to try to be like Mel Kiper Jr; and I hope no one else does either.  It's more of a last minute Cliffs Notes summary of research and rankings of guys at all positions - many that weren't televised in the region I live in very often. For example, a guy like BYU WR Puka Nacua last year or Brock Purdy (Mr Irrelevant) in 2022.  Most of the guys we've heard/seen a lot about are often drafted within the 1st 2-3 rounds of a 7 round draft.  On the 3rd day of the draft when it starts moving faster - names of selections appear and sometimes you don't even see their quick highlights until 10-15 minutes later.  That's when I'm really happy to have the resource to look up the guy the Browns picked.

As for the price, they stamp those prices right on the bar card on the bottom left corner of the magazine cover. And if they're going to over-charge a consumer - you're the guy I'd hand select to argue that all the way down to a discount Ballpeen.

Lindy's Sports Pro Football Mag was only $10.99 so I drank less beer that weekend.  Unfortunately, that still didn't help me find the 6 pack in my mid-section.  Should I put that on a milk carton?  "Has anyone seen Pus-Gut Flugel's Abs since 1982? Okay, did anyone ever see them before that?"  

Athlon Sports NFL Draft was a little more at $12.99. 

Don't get me wrong.  I don't care if some like that.  I wasn't trying to insult those who do.  I was just speaking for myself.  You are probably right on cost.  I haven't bought a draft guide in a long time.  The net overloads me with that information.  II was thinking of fantasy draft guides. Those seem to run in the $17 range.

Also, the draft is only interesting when your team sucks or you are actually in the draft and you are 4-5 picks away from your pick.  When you pick 4th, draft forums are non stop because it is pretty easy to cross off 2-3 players from a draft board and start to discuss players who you actually have a shot at drafting.  When  you are picking in the 2nd round, it's futile to try to pinpoint guys we might draft.. 

Not until the 1st round is over  will it be possible to even have a fair shot of picking our guy.

1.) Being AB's choice..

It'd take a 22 y.o 4.3 speed WR to fall on pick #54? Still feels like Berry trades back. Berry's guardrails would put the younger LB Junior Colson ahead of my choice of local LB Payton Wilson. My believe is Colson won't get to #54 but, Payton Wilson may with injury testing/draft age..

Give me.. LB Payton Wilson at pick #54.. @flugel Morning Pancake special (cameraman sucks) .. My spelling test, calls him A-meg ! Stinging Bee-hive T, is raw enough to be the Browns/my 85th pick..

Meet playing angry, till whistle Jed Wills

@ballpeen said:

I did at one point, at least until they started to cost $18.  It not that $18 is prohibitive, it's just that it doesn't matter all that much.  It's not like I seek to be a Jr. Mel or something.

Understood. I need my day job so I don't buy the magazine/guide to try to be like Mel Kiper Jr; and I hope no one else does either.  It's more of a last minute Cliffs Notes summary of research and rankings of guys at all positions - many that weren't televised in the region I live in very often. For example, a guy like BYU WR Puka Nacua last year or Brock Purdy (Mr Irrelevant) in 2022.  Most of the guys we've heard/seen a lot about are often drafted within the 1st 2-3 rounds of a 7 round draft.  On the 3rd day of the draft when it starts moving faster - names of selections appear and sometimes you don't even see their quick highlights until 10-15 minutes later.  That's when I'm really happy to have the resource to look up the guy the Browns picked.

As for the price, they stamp those prices right on the bar card on the bottom left corner of the magazine cover. And if they're going to over-charge a consumer - you're the guy I'd hand select to argue that all the way down to a discount Ballpeen.

Lindy's Sports Pro Football Mag was only $10.99 so I drank less beer that weekend.  Unfortunately, that still didn't help me find the 6 pack in my mid-section.  Should I put that on a milk carton?  "Has anyone seen Pus-Gut Flugel's Abs since 1982? Okay, did anyone ever see them before that?"  

Athlon Sports NFL Draft was a little more at $12.99. 

@flugel said:

If you're old school like some of us - go buy a draft Magazine and it'll get you up to speed with the names, positions and rankings within the position groups.

I did at one point, at least until they started to cost $18.  It not that $18 is prohibitive, it's just that it doesn't matter all that much.  It's not like I seek to be a Jr. Mel or something.

@flugel said:

does this type of talent heading into the prime of his career just wake up 1 day with a Charlie Frye skill-set

That's more or less the 64k question.  (the 'less' being that we don't think he'd be Charlie Frye bad)  But there does exist the possibility that all of the missed time and all of the pressure to perform up to the standard of a 3 first round pick traded player...negativity towards him from part of the Browns fan base...lingering legal issues, etc. might weigh on him to the extant that he never returns to his previous level of play.   I wouldn't bet $ either way.  

@orion said:

Yeah, but it's been so long that I think that the When has become If.

That's an absolute fair statement. 

I have serious doubts that we will ever see the 2018-20 Watson. 

He now has to overcome a shoulder injury to his throwing arm, all the noise he hears from his off-the-field allegations, and a questionable fit with Kevin Stefanski. 

I wouldn't bet on it. I hope I'm wrong.