@dutch-oven said:

Having an Italian like Al Pacino playing Paul Brown makes as much sense as anything you've spewed on this topic every three times a year you bring it up, I suppose.

Hollywood man, they always fuck things up

@flugel said:

You 2 guys aren't in the same huddle any more but it's only training camp. Speaking of which, are you guys gonna go tag-team again on the countdown to opening day? If either one of yuz has a vacation or long weekend - I could chip in and help. Sometimes I really feel the sting of the absence of MJP; especially the summer months leading up to training camp but moreso all year round.

I went to Youngstown recently, and almost automatically it made me think of mjp.

The board was a better place with him here, for sure.

@dutch-oven said:

Having an Italian like Al Pacino playing Paul Brown makes as much sense as anything you've spewed on this topic every three times a year you bring it up, I suppose.

You 2 guys aren't in the same huddle any more but it's only training camp. Speaking of which, are you guys gonna go tag-team again on the countdown to opening day? If either one of yuz has a vacation or long weekend - I could chip in and help. Sometimes I really feel the sting of the absence of MJP; especially the summer months leading up to training camp but moreso all year round.

@syd said:

I hear if a movie is to be made about the Og Paul Brown that Jeff Bridges or Al Pacino would play Coach Brown , while Curley from the 3 stooges would play lombardi

Having an Italian like Al Pacino playing Paul Brown makes as much sense as anything you've spewed on this topic every three times a year you bring it up, I suppose.

@dutch-oven said:

I'll never debate that - Paul Brown basically was the father of modern football and his influence IMO was greater than Lombardi's.

But if my life depended on the result of one football game, I'd go with Lombardi as head coach.

I hear if a movie is to be made about the Og Paul Brown that Jeff Bridges or Al Pacino would play Coach Brown , while Curley from the 3 stooges would play lombardi

@dutch-oven said:

That guy was such an asshole...

I'm shocked he wasn't a close friend of the admin.

I imagine he's in the crowd that's intimidated by a 150 lb boogey man like Dr Fauci. The visual of grown men in terror sleeping with the lights on because of him is as outrageous as it is hilarious.

I wouldn't have put anything political here but the only recent attempt I've made to post on the political board got deleted immediately; so I'll place my 1 or 2 annual political posts (if that) here for now. I edited it way down so I don't cause any further panic attacks for the Barney Fife in charge living the dream.

@flugel said:

Do you think he's ever had a worse nightmare than watching Cleveland come from behind to beat his team in the closing seconds last year? He's gotta live with the memory of a 5-12 Cleveland Browns team he frequently made fun of being just good enough to beat his pretenders.

That guy was such an asshole...

I'm shocked he wasn't a close friend of the admin.

@dutch-oven said:

Oh man, I totally forgot about that asshat.

Do you think he's ever had a worse nightmare than watching Cleveland come from behind to beat his team in the closing seconds last year? He's gotta live with the memory of a 5-12 Cleveland Browns team he frequently made fun of being just good enough to beat his pretenders.

@flugel said:

It's a good argument you have Dutch; but THANK GOD that annoying Packer fan isn't here to see any of this. If he re-surfaces - can you do me a favor and tell him the medication your doctor prescribed was making you hallucinate on July 30th?

Oh man, I totally forgot about that asshat.

@dutch-oven said:

I'll never debate that - Paul Brown basically was the father of modern football and his influence IMO was greater than Lombardi's.

But if my life depended on the result of one football game, I'd go with Lombardi as head coach.

It's a good argument you have Dutch; but THANK GOD that annoying Packer fan isn't here to see any of this. If he re-surfaces - can you do me a favor and tell him the medication your doctor prescribed was making you hallucinate on July 30th?

@dutch-oven said:

But if my life depended on the result of one football game, I'd go with Lombardi as head coach.

Counter-point: if you needed a Kevorkian-like ending, I'd go with Pat (un)Shurmer?

@dutch-oven said:

Well, we had Jim Brown, Bobby Mitchell, Gary Collins, eventually adding Paul Warfield and a pretty stout OLine too, lead by Gene Hickerson.

Yup. Those were the good ol' days. (Ernie Green more than Mitchell...and don't forget Milt Moran) But we could never beat those dang Packers. Between 1957 and 1979 we beat 'em once. Back in those days the QB's ran the offense and called the plays. Paul Brown however, would send in plays from time to time with his 'Messenger Guards'. Of course now no QB's call plays. The HC's are much more involved in the game play now than they ever were back in Lombardi's days.

@orion said:

I remember watching Browns / Packers games in the 60's and I always felt that they were just too dang good for us. Starr, Boyd Dowler, Carol Dayle, Paul Horning, Jim Taylor, etc. And they had a pretty good OLine of their own. And that Ray Nitschke was a genuine PITA to us.

Well, we had Jim Brown, Bobby Mitchell, Gary Collins, eventually adding Paul Warfield and a pretty stout OLine too, lead by Gene Hickerson.

@orion said:

I'm not so sure...he certainly had more talent across the roster...and Bart Starr running the offense on the field.

I think the offenses were comparable. The Browns had some serious talent on the offensive side.

And like I said, the Browns defense would have been better if Brown hadn't traded away three HOF defensive linemen.

Frank Ryan wasn't a slouch in comparison to Starr either. I think if Ryan played for Lombardi during the same era, the results for the Packers would have been similar. In a lot of ways they were comparable, both very cerebral QBs with good arms.

@dutch-oven said:

But if my life depended on the result of one football game, I'd go with Lombardi as head coach.

I'm not so sure...he certainly had more talent across the roster...and Bart Starr running the offense on the field.

@texasag1969 said:

(.)(.) ?

Put your moobs back in!.. Shame on you!!?

@flugel said:

and a Janet Jackson milker or 2...

(.)(.) ?

@dutch-oven said:

Paul Brown won three NFL titles.

Lombardi won three NFL titles and two Super Bowls, the first two in history.

In Otto Graham's 10 year Pro Football career under Paul Brown - Otto led the Browns to 10 consecutive Pro Football Championship appearances and won 7 of them. The Super Bowl is just another name for an NFL Championship with more Commercials and a Janet Jackson milker or 2...

@orion said:

...and the spoils go to the winners...but one could argue that on top of his NFL Championships Paul Brown was an innovator with such things as his shuttling plays into the QB, his emphasis on the draft as well as face masks. Of course when naming the trophy Brown's AAFC titles were scoffed at.

Well said! Paul Brown also experimented with wiring plays into the QB's helmet, which undoubtedly had people thinking he was walking a fine line/tightrope between insanity & Brilliance. Guess how they get plays in from the sideline to the QB today?

I had to give @syd high kudos. I think he's on the right track. I think Paul Brown should have at least had his name on the AFC Championship Trophy Award. There was NO Curley Lambeau laying the foundation and winning tradition before Paul Brown in Cleveland like Lombardi had. Paul Brown started up the Browns in 1946 and they won all 4 of the AAFC Championships in that Pro Football league before joining the NFL despite warnings from every direction "let's see how the Browns handle REAL competition in the NFL." How does making the NFL Championship Game in all of the 1st 6 seasons the Browns competed in the NFL sound? Okay, they won the NFL Championship in their very 1st season and proceeded to win 3 NFL Championships in those 1st 6 seasons/Championship appearances I spoke of. Speaking of speaking by not speaking, a great quote from him was "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less."

@orion said:

...and the spoils go to the winners...but one could argue that on top of his NFL Championships Paul Brown was an innovator with such things as his shuttling plays into the QB, his emphasis on the draft as well as face masks. Of course when naming the trophy Brown's AAFC titles were scoffed at.

I'll never debate that - Paul Brown basically was the father of modern football and his influence IMO was greater than Lombardi's.

But if my life depended on the result of one football game, I'd go with Lombardi as head coach.

@syd said:

if coach Brown had still been the Browns coach in 67 he may have very well won the first super bowl, he probably (even Tho the 67 roster wasnt bad at all) would have had a better roster and as a coach he is better than collier, so again fuck lombardi

If Brown hadn't traded three future Hall of Fame defensive players in the Doug Atkins, Willie Davis and Henry Jordan, two to the Packers, the Browns might have had a better than mediocre defense in the 60s. Imagine how that defensive line would have looked in orange and brown.

But he did.

@dutch-oven said:

Paul Brown won three NFL titles.

Lombardi won three NFL titles and two Super Bowls, the first two in history.

...and the spoils go to the winners...but one could argue that on top of his NFL Championships Paul Brown was an innovator with such things as his shuttling plays into the QB, his emphasis on the draft as well as face masks. Of course when naming the trophy Brown's AAFC titles were scoffed at.

@dutch-oven said:

Paul Brown won three NFL titles.

Lombardi won three NFL titles and two Super Bowls, the first two in history.

if coach Brown had still been the Browns coach in 67 he may have very well won the first super bowl, he probably (even Tho the 67 roster wasnt bad at all) would have had a better roster and as a coach he is better than collier, so again fuck lombardi