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O-line Grades Week 1

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  • The GipperT The Gipper

    No, to me, this sounds like it is based on observation....and observation is subjective, ergo, the statistic is subjective. Many statistics are just that way.

    @the-gipper said:

    No, to me, this sounds like it is based on observation....and observation is subjective, ergo, the statistic is subjective. Many statistics are just that way.

    I've tried it with my eyes closed... doesn't work as well.

    "When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196

  • Statistics are NOT subjective in any way, that's the entire point.

    Besides, the appropriate question would be to ask precisely where the grade demarcations are: What has to happen to be a +, what's a 0, what's a -.

    Once the measurement methodology is defined, the analysis is sound... whether you like it or not.

    If the method is repeatable and reproducible, it's legit.

    "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." Paul Brown
  • U Unsympathetic

    Statistics are NOT subjective in any way, that's the entire point.

    Besides, the appropriate question would be to ask precisely where the grade demarcations are: What has to happen to be a +, what's a 0, what's a -.

    Once the measurement methodology is defined, the analysis is sound... whether you like it or not.

    If the method is repeatable and reproducible, it's legit.

    @unsympathetic said:

    Besides, the appropriate question would be to ask precisely where the grade demarcations are: What has to happen to be a +, what's a 0, what's a -.

    @tour2ma said:

    I grade each OL for each play using:

    '+' if assignment was achieved;

    '0' if assignment was not critical to the play; or

    '-' if assignment was not achieved.

    If an assignment was key to the success or failure of a given play the above grade may be doubled.

    The above are the guidelines I use. I have to infer the assignment as well as judge its achievement and criticality. For the vast majority of the evaluations, all three aspects are obvious at first look. Some take two looks. Some take three. The more looks, the less objective the evaluation will end up being.

    "When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196

  • Tour2ma, thanks for the work you have put in, really interesting stuff. Over the years I have shifted my attention more and more to the O-Line on snaps to try and educate myself as to why plays pan out the way they do. Not being born and raised in the US I have never been schooled, via participation, in the finer points of O-Line assignments and their success or failure. When I am born again I hope its in North East Ohio and I'm big boned.

    Howie.

    Tailgate loving, Steelers hating, Trans-Atlantic Browns fan. Annually disappointed since '88. Annually optimistic since '88. GO BROWNS!
  • HowieDawgH HowieDawg

    Tour2ma, thanks for the work you have put in, really interesting stuff. Over the years I have shifted my attention more and more to the O-Line on snaps to try and educate myself as to why plays pan out the way they do. Not being born and raised in the US I have never been schooled, via participation, in the finer points of O-Line assignments and their success or failure. When I am born again I hope its in North East Ohio and I'm big boned.

    Howie.

    @howiedawg said:

    Tour2ma, thanks for the work you have put in, really interesting stuff.

    ..+1....

  • Yes, I would pay for reports like this, but since you are already doing it for free ... carry on.

    Alex Mack having an All Pro year ...

    Z

  • IbleedbrownI Ibleedbrown

    @tour2ma said:

    Claims? Where? What claims?

    The grading is subjective, but at a different level than the garden variety, "Fred played well, Bob played well, but Frank sucked," subjectivity.

    In grading plays there are sometimes close calls in assigning individual play grades, e.g., "missed the block, but did it effect the outcome?"

    The math is objective... because it's math...

    The final translation to a letter grade is subjective to a degree, but given the totals I'd maintain it is true of the lower end only.

    The letter grading could be consistent, like a test in school. Positive plays divided by total plays and you'd get a percentage. By that standard Mack would land a 90%, which is an A- using 10 point increments for letter grades.

    Not that it detracts as this is excellent work.

    Thanks again, all...

    Z, I'll let you buy me a beer someday... 😉

    Just so long as my work does not appear under "you-know-who's" by-line in some on-line "article", I'm cool with free...

    Then again... maybe it could earn me a PFWA badge and I can become an even more insufferable prick...

    @ibleedbrown said:

    The letter grading could be consistent, like a test in school. Positive plays divided by total plays and you'd get a percentage. By that standard Mack would land a 90%, which is an A- using 10 point increments for letter grades.

    I hear you...

    I think having to deal with negative totals last year (think Oniel Cousins... if you dare...) has led me to think of a "net 0" score as the pass/ fail pivot point.

    Plus a "run in" with a curve-busting, German transfer student in a college Physics course has made me resist grading too harshly.

    If I follow you, then Alex would have been the week's only 'A'.

    Mack.. 36/40 = 90% ---> A

    Thomas 26/30 = 87% ---> B

    Greco. 16/29 = 55% ---> F

    Bito.. 14/29 = 48% ---> F-

    Shwrtz 09/24 = 38% ---> F--

    Just seems way too harsh to me. It might be better to just drop the percentages and grades altogether and let folks interpret the data as they will...

    Or not... 😉

    "When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196
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