Dink and Dunk
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Excellent point DT...the short passes work when you make the backers take 10-14 yards drops in coverage rather than 4 yard drops.
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Tom Brady and Trent Edwards both averaged over 10 yards/completion, I believe. That ain't dink and dunk.
Then again, Brady has Randy Moss and Edwards now has TO (for a couple games anyway).
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as i stated in another thread, according to the play by play we took a whopping total of 4, count em 4, "deep" passes before the game got out of control. That only means 4 passes were roughly longer than 10 yards the whole time I feel like we had a shot to win the game. That's not going to win games
Secondly, to compare what Tom Brady was doing to Brady Quinn is downright dumb. Tom Brady was giving what the defense was giving him. And as someone else was stated, people have to respect Tom Brady's arm and can't play him just on short passes. Quinn does not have even the slightest amount of that respect. The browns offense is to only throw 3-7 yards consistently and try to push it down the field. The problem is, defenses are smart enough to pinch in and keep the linebackers 5 yards off the ball. Next thing you know boom, 3 and out. I hope Quinn and the offense takes more shots, but only time will tell.
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as i stated in another thread, according to the play by play we took a whopping total of 4, count em 4, "deep" passes before the game got out of control. That only means 4 passes were roughly longer than 10 yards the whole time I feel like we had a shot to win the game. That's not going to win games
Secondly, to compare what Tom Brady was doing to Brady Quinn is downright dumb. Tom Brady was giving what the defense was giving him. And as someone else was stated, people have to respect Tom Brady's arm and can't play him just on short passes. Quinn does not have even the slightest amount of that respect. The browns offense is to only throw 3-7 yards consistently and try to push it down the field. The problem is, defenses are smart enough to pinch in and keep the linebackers 5 yards off the ball. Next thing you know boom, 3 and out. I hope Quinn and the offense takes more shots, but only time will tell.
Tom Brady was giving what the defense was taking him.
Quote of the f--king week right here
2009-10 Browns Prediction: 8-8 -
I watched BQ at ND a lot and let me tell ya...the stuff that chud started when BQ took over last year and we seen against the vikings is way less than bq dink and dunk....its more like micro dink and dump that depends heavily on yards after the catch and smart alert speedy WRs with a knack to make the break after the catch...i dont really like it to much because our guys thusfar have failed to block/pick/decieve/cut their way out...but if it starts working things will happen...
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@shepwrite said:
I was hoping this would be a serious and interesting discussion.Phil Rivers just "dinked and dunked" the Charges to a 90 yard game winning drive. He was 6 of 7 for 80 yards, something like that, and never really went downfield. It was masterful. It was, in fact, what a sophisticated NFL passing game looks like. Same for Tom Brady, once he got in rhythm. Quinn's last drive of the game looked a lot like Rivers last drive of the game with very similar numbers, except for the TD, which was 26 yards.
A deep completion for both Brady and Rivers was about 15-20 yards from the line of scrimmage, usually in the middle, in a crease.
The PD charted Quinn's passes and said his performance, given all the variables, was closer to a B- than an F. He had three full-on drops, two completions lost to penalties, and at least a few other balls that should've been caught. He extended some plays nicely and Mangini complimented his check-offs. He threw at least three nice passes of 25 yards or more that were either caught or should have been (Braylon's TD wiped out by penalty, drop by Braylon down the left sideline, and TD to Royal). All three were accurate.
Everybody concerned says the interception came on a bad route by Edwards.
All that said, Quinn did not have a good game. But he did not have a horrible game, either. The playcalling was definitely questionable, giving him very few first down throws, and Football Outsiders has run the amazing stats on that. Throwing and third and over 8 is just really hard, and Quinn did a lot of that.
The Browns want their offense to look like the ones led by Brady and Rivers last night, not the one run by J-Fat, who really is a black DA. But they didn't call the game like that.
Mangini indicated that Quinn will receive a long run of starts before any real judgments are made, according to Doerschuck. As it should be.
Did you hear greenie last night as Jamarcus the Hut ran out?
"The massive jamarcus russell"
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@shepwrite said:
Mangini indicated that Quinn will receive a long run of starts before any real judgments are made, according to Doerschuck. As it should be.However Mangini said that before he had to sit through a game with Quinn as QB.
Last Sunday proved that "Fingergate" vs the Texans was no fluke. He really is that ineffective as a quarterback.
Don't expect Mangini to sit idle and watch his last shot to be an NFL head coach slip out of Brady Quinn's hand - Yepremian style.
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Another thing rarely mentioned on this board but that is extremely important to Quinn's game is a quality TE. We don't have a difference-maker at TE and it's showing up.
Those criticizing Quinn's (mostly futile) use of Royal on Sunday don't understand Quinn's game. He's excellent at using his TE and helped two of his ND TEs get drafted pretty high (Carlson and Fasano) because he helped showcase their skills.
"Dink and dunk" is a Lumberghian phrase that means nothing in reality. High completion percentage invariably leads to good things, assuming there are people who can actually do something with the ball when they catch it.
We don't have a ton of those guys and the ones we do have aren't getting the ball enough. Some of that is on Quinn, certainly, but some of that is on Daboll as well.
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Another thing rarely mentioned on this board but that is extremely important to Quinn's game is a quality TE. We don't have a difference-maker at TE and it's showing up.
Those criticizing Quinn's (mostly futile) use of Royal on Sunday don't understand Quinn's game. He's excellent at using his TE and helped two of his ND TEs get drafted pretty high (Carlson and Fasano) because he helped showcase their skills.
"Dink and dunk" is a Lumberghian phrase that means nothing in reality. High completion percentage invariably leads to good things, assuming there are people who can actually do something with the ball when they catch it.
We don't have a ton of those guys and the ones we do have aren't getting the ball enough. Some of that is on Quinn, certainly, but some of that is on Daboll as well.
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@jadbf said:
No change will be made before then.8 weeks now?
Weren't you part of the "GIVE HIM THREE YEARS" club?
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Yeah, that's why Jeff Samardzija went from a nobody to a difference-maker at ND, because Quinn never found him downfield. Oh, and what's Samardzija doing now, since he obviously was such a great WR that he obviously made all of Quinn's horrible TD throws look good?
Pitching for the Cubs.
RIIIIIIIGHT. Quinn definitely has never made a WR look good before.
Purely Lumberghian reasoning, yet again.l
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@jadbf said:
No change will be made before then.8 weeks now?
Weren't you part of the "GIVE HIM THREE YEARS" club?
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Why are we even talking about this? BQ has proven that he can throw long. Its just a matter of being comfortable with it. That's something he needs to work on with his receivers (and more importantly) he needs an offensive coach who will give him the opportunity to do that. Too bad Daboll looks horrid from what I've seen.
@shepwrite said:
I think we all saw how much Rivers, Brady, Romo, and Brees use their TEs.They have TEs that can actually catch the ball, though.
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Yeah, that's why Jeff Samardzija went from a nobody to a difference-maker at ND, because Quinn never found him downfield. Oh, and what's Samardzija doing now, since he obviously was such a great WR that he obviously made all of Quinn's horrible TD throws look good?
Pitching for the Cubs.
RIIIIIIIGHT. Quinn definitely has never made a WR look good before.
Purely Lumberghian reasoning, yet again.l
Yeah, that's why Jeff Samardzija went from a nobody to a difference-maker at ND, because Quinn never found him downfield. Oh, and what's Samardzija doing now, since he obviously was such a great WR that he obviously made all of Quinn's horrible TD throws look good?
Pitching for the Cubs.
RIIIIIIIGHT. Quinn definitely has never made a WR look good before.
Purely Lumberghian reasoning, yet again.l
Jeff Samardzija spurned the NFL draft. He was supposedly a mid-late first rounder.... might have been picked BEFORE Quinn if he hadn't removed his name from the draft.
Apparently Quinn made the 13 or 14 or so NFL draftees he played with look great and they had nothing to do with it themselves.
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Yeah, that's why Jeff Samardzija went from a nobody to a difference-maker at ND, because Quinn never found him downfield. Oh, and what's Samardzija doing now, since he obviously was such a great WR that he obviously made all of Quinn's horrible TD throws look good?
Pitching for the Cubs.
RIIIIIIIGHT. Quinn definitely has never made a WR look good before.
Purely Lumberghian reasoning, yet again.l
Jeff Samardzija spurned the NFL draft. He was supposedly a mid-late first rounder.... might have been picked BEFORE Quinn if he hadn't removed his name from the draft.
Apparently Quinn made the 13 or 14 or so NFL draftees he played with look great and they had nothing to do with it themselves.
Jeff Samardzija spurned the NFL draft. He was supposedly a mid-late first rounder.... might have been picked BEFORE Quinn if he hadn't removed his name from the draft.
HUH? Samardzija was never a mid-late 1st rounder on any draft board I have seen (and w/ the help of google I found he was projected as a 7th rounder or UDFA). You dont' get taken as a WR in round one w/ a 4.55 40 time.
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Jeff Samardzija spurned the NFL draft. He was supposedly a mid-late first rounder.... might have been picked BEFORE Quinn if he hadn't removed his name from the draft.
HUH? Samardzija was never a mid-late 1st rounder on any draft board I have seen (and w/ the help of google I found he was projected as a 7th rounder or UDFA). You dont' get taken as a WR in round one w/ a 4.55 40 time.
Masters said:
HUH? Samardzija was never a mid-late 1st rounder on any draft board I have seen (and w/ the help of google I found he was projected as a 7th rounder or UDFA). You dont' get taken as a WR in round one w/ a 4.55 40 time.Ah yes, the Dancing 6'5" Bosnian Leprechaun. Dude had hands.
Hands and separation in spades though. Separation even if he had to get it vertically.
I hope Kokinis keeps track of him.
He was picked in June '06 by the Cubs org. and was playing in their minor league org. that summer. I don't believe many experts even bothered to project him for the '07 draft.
I do not know if he even asked the NFL for an official projection. He might have.
It seems someone felt he might have been a first rounder. : http://www.nfl-draft-site.com/2007/01/wr-j...is-back-on.html
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Yeah, that's why Jeff Samardzija went from a nobody to a difference-maker at ND, because Quinn never found him downfield. Oh, and what's Samardzija doing now, since he obviously was such a great WR that he obviously made all of Quinn's horrible TD throws look good?
Pitching for the Cubs.
RIIIIIIIGHT. Quinn definitely has never made a WR look good before.
Purely Lumberghian reasoning, yet again.l
Jeff Samardzija spurned the NFL draft. He was supposedly a mid-late first rounder.... might have been picked BEFORE Quinn if he hadn't removed his name from the draft.
Apparently Quinn made the 13 or 14 or so NFL draftees he played with look great and they had nothing to do with it themselves.
Jeff Samardzija spurned the NFL draft. He was supposedly a mid-late first rounder.... might have been picked BEFORE Quinn if he hadn't removed his name from the draft.
Apparently Quinn made the 13 or 14 or so NFL draftees he played with look great and they had nothing to do with it themselves.
Well, since Masters and ndneighbor already handed you your ass on your Lumberghian post, I'll only add this:
Why in good God's name would Samardzija have given up millions as a first-rounder to ride a bus around the midwest?
Do you Manwagoners even think about what you post anymore or has your bitterness destroyed your few remaining brain cells?
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@shepwrite said:
I think we all saw how much Rivers, Brady, Romo, and Brees use their TEs.Exactly. Ben Watson & his wife (who is lovely) bought Brady's old house. That's how close they are.
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@shepwrite said:
Jeff S. would've been a decent red zone guy, a fourth WR... but that's why he played baseball. He had trouble separating against good teams, which is why Brady was always running around like a wild man. None of their skill players is doing anything in the league and their defense blew beyond comprehension.You know, that ain't gonna change just because you want it to. It's kinda common knowledge. Those Weis/Quinn teams were absurdly overrated and looked outmatched against every good team.
I still maintain that tOSU spent the better half of 3 hours mugging the shit out of Samardzija during the 2005 (season) Fiesta bowl.
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