Does the start of this season prove it wasn't Romeo's fault?
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The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
dude, there are teams like Washington and Rams that have a bigger QB problem than us. It is not the QB position that is the problem, It is selecting the right QB for the QB position that is the problem. Trust me if we had a a lot more good players in the team then we will have had a clearer picture.
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UMMMMM.....What? The draft? or the inept fkn coaching? The pitt game in the rain did it for me....right after kicking a fg down by three scores in the dallas game
How many years of drafting and expensive free agent acquisitions and we still don't have a single suitable 3-4 LBer. We'd start LBers 4-7 on Baltimore's squad. That says enough to me.
Hall is all that's left of LAST YEAR'S draft. If Quinn doesn't make a major turn around, I feel comfortable saying that Savage was every bit as bad as Davis in the draft. In fact, Davis's final draft was a pretty good one . . . maybe he'd figured it out. I'm pretty sure that all of those players are still somewhere on an NFL roster. People also don't realize that the reason Opie could squander all that $$ on expensive FA acquisitions was because Davis purged after his playoff year and restructured or dumped the cap straddling contracts of Couch, Brown and Warren.
Best financial move in this new Browns era was the lockout of Couch. Otherwise he would have held the Browns hostage to his contract like that bull shit he pulled on the Packers.
Opie's no-brainer positive moves I rate as follows: Rogers trade. Zastadil. Cribbs (the last one was pure luck).
Debatable good moves? Drafting Thomas (See Peterson and the fact that Thomas is solid, but not spectacular), Steinbach (also solid, but not spectacular and overpaid) Draft: Vickers (A for draft slot), McDonald (B for drat slot), Wright (C+ for draft slot and trade, still with upside).
Some hope left (Quinn)(D- right now considering consideration given -- but maybe he'll turn it around) Hall (B+ still alot of potential) Harrison (C+ for potential, but sliding). Peerman might take his position next season. Rubin (not enough on him yet to grade)
Considering draft position I'd have to rate Wimbley, Edwards and Pool as misses. One good year out of Edwards and Wimbley is not enough for top 10 picks. Willie Green compares to Wimbley and trading down from Ngata kind of seals that deal. It's chicken and the egg with Edwards. Who knows what he might have been if it were not for Opie's Dilfer, Frye, et al. Qbing brain farts. I'd still rather have Crocker than Pool.
I'm not a fan of DQ. The tackle count doesn't impress me -- see Andra Davis, Ben Taylor. I'd give the pick no more than a C because I don't think Jackson starts on any good 3-4 defense, but realize that some people may not agree.
Crennel was not a good head coach, but his personnel helped him to look completely inept.
Debatable good moves? Drafting Thomas (See Peterson and the fact that Thomas is solid, but not spectacular)
I agreed with everything you said until this. He allowed what, 1 sack his rookie year?? And 4.5 last year? yeah 4.5 is no improvement, but I'm sure I don't need to get into how bad our team was last year....it can't all be placed on him. Bottom line is JT is a stud and some may call me crazy for it but I'll take him over Peterson anyday...this team is not ready for an elite running back, it would just be wasted talent.
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According to posters in another thread, Phil was high on Russell but Slick Al beat him to it. If that is the case, hopefully Mangini takes over in future drafts. Ownership can't stand behind Phil forever. We need the Browns to get on with it and become strong again. No matter what these new Steelers "fans" say, there is no rivalry stronger, better, add any adjective here, than Steelers vs Browns in the NFL.
FYI - before posting on a rival board, try to know something about the team other than news blips you happen upon. Savage is gone and has been for some time. We now have Kokinas as our GM, who is a good friend of Mangini and was actually hand selected BY Mangini...so you can be assured they will work together on the drafting of players.
The Browns have basically jettisoned a lot of average players and brought in a bunch of intelligent role players in an effort, IMHO, to teach the young guys what it takes to be a professional and to win.
Over the last years, the Browns PLAYERS were the ones with the loudest voices, and many of those were nothing more than complaints. Now, it is MANGINI with the loudest voice (even if he doesn't say much) and HE is controlling the locker room not only with his presence, but with the presence of consummate professionals who buy into his system.
Often times when you are changing the CULTURE of a team, you have to actually reduce the talent at first. That may have been the case this off-season in certain positions.
As for the QB situation, that is a calculated risk for the betterment of the team down the line. The Browns already knew that DA was not the long term answer...they just need to know if BQ can be. If not, our record will reflect that and leave us in a position to draft one of the top 2 QB's (McCoy/Bradford), and bring in a veteran (I bet Pennington is available soon).
Therefore, I am willing to take this year on the chin to see if the Browns FO finally has a clue.
FYI - before posting on a rival board, try to know something about the team other than news blips you happen upon. Savage is gone and has been for some time. We now have Kokinas as our GM, who is a good friend of Mangini and was actually hand selected BY Mangini...so you can be assured they will work together on the drafting of players.
The Browns have basically jettisoned a lot of average players and brought in a bunch of intelligent role players in an effort, IMHO, to teach the young guys what it takes to be a professional and to win.
Over the last years, the Browns PLAYERS were the ones with the loudest voices, and many of those were nothing more than complaints. Now, it is MANGINI with the loudest voice (even if he doesn't say much) and HE is controlling the locker room not only with his presence, but with the presence of consummate professionals who buy into his system.
Often times when you are changing the CULTURE of a team, you have to actually reduce the talent at first. That may have been the case this off-season in certain positions.
As for the QB situation, that is a calculated risk for the betterment of the team down the line. The Browns already knew that DA was not the long term answer...they just need to know if BQ can be. If not, our record will reflect that and leave us in a position to draft one of the top 2 QB's (McCoy/Bradford), and bring in a veteran (I bet Pennington is available soon).
Therefore, I am willing to take this year on the chin to see if the Browns FO finally has a clue.
Well said.
What the hell, one more year of suffering isn't going to kill us.
It will only make us stronger, right?
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The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
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The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
-
The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
I highly doubt you see that...unless DA comes in at the end of this year and just lights it up.
DA had 28 or so games to prove something, and he proved that he had a good 9 game stretch against a few of the worst defenses in the league. He then proved that he couldn't solve the cover 2 defense, and everyone promptly employed it against him (except for the Giants, and look how that turned out).
No, if BQ dumps...then we are going to have the record to scoop up one of the top QB's, Bradford, McCoy or Pike (I doubt Tebow goes that high).
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Lol, Steeler fans still think Phil "The BUffalo" Savage is our GM
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The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
Either that or they will go with a veteran.
I am honestly tired of grooming young QB's. Pick one of these guys, either one, Anderson and Quinn and bring in a vet that can either push them or make them ride the pine.
I think this team should just follow the model of the old Browns. Defense and running and have a QB that can actually hit an open receiver or two without looking mentally handicapped in the process.
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Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
Either that or they will go with a veteran.
I am honestly tired of grooming young QB's. Pick one of these guys, either one, Anderson and Quinn and bring in a vet that can either push them or make them ride the pine.
I think this team should just follow the model of the old Browns. Defense and running and have a QB that can actually hit an open receiver or two without looking mentally handicapped in the process.
Either that or they will go with a veteran.
I am honestly tired of grooming young QB's. Pick one of these guys, either one, Anderson and Quinn and bring in a vet that can either push them or make them ride the pine.
I think this team should just follow the model of the old Browns. Defense and running and have a QB that can actually hit an open receiver or two without looking mentally handicapped in the process.
I agree with that too.
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Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
Either that or they will go with a veteran.
I am honestly tired of grooming young QB's. Pick one of these guys, either one, Anderson and Quinn and bring in a vet that can either push them or make them ride the pine.
I think this team should just follow the model of the old Browns. Defense and running and have a QB that can actually hit an open receiver or two without looking mentally handicapped in the process.
Either that or they will go with a veteran.
I am honestly tired of grooming young QB's. Pick one of these guys, either one, Anderson and Quinn and bring in a vet that can either push them or make them ride the pine.
I think this team should just follow the model of the old Browns. Defense and running and have a QB that can actually hit an open receiver or two without looking mentally handicapped in the process.
OK, that sounds all well and good, but name the the QB that we won anything with that we didn't groom with the old club.
@junkyard-dawg said:
You're forgetting one of Manginis guys will be a Free Agent at the end of this season. I wouldn't discount us signing Kellen Clemens to be our starting QB.First, we don't even know if Clemens will actually get to the market...he is their #2 guy.
Second, all the guys he has brought over have lots of experience...Clemens has less (or will have less) than the 2 guys we already have. I doubt he goes that route.
Third, look at Cassel and Schaub. They are the latest backups to cross to a new team to try and start. Now, what are their records? Don't you think that Mangini and Kokinas don't know that???
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Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
I highly doubt you see that...unless DA comes in at the end of this year and just lights it up.
DA had 28 or so games to prove something, and he proved that he had a good 9 game stretch against a few of the worst defenses in the league. He then proved that he couldn't solve the cover 2 defense, and everyone promptly employed it against him (except for the Giants, and look how that turned out).
No, if BQ dumps...then we are going to have the record to scoop up one of the top QB's, Bradford, McCoy or Pike (I doubt Tebow goes that high).
I highly doubt you see that...unless DA comes in at the end of this year and just lights it up.
DA had 28 or so games to prove something, and he proved that he had a good 9 game stretch against a few of the worst defenses in the league. He then proved that he couldn't solve the cover 2 defense, and everyone promptly employed it against him (except for the Giants, and look how that turned out).
No, if BQ dumps...then we are going to have the record to scoop up one of the top QB's, Bradford, McCoy or Pike (I doubt Tebow goes that high).
The more I see out of Pike the more I think he's going to be the best pro qb within 3 seasons.
I think McCoy is going to have the biggest immediate impact at qb given his intelligence and accuracy but won't wind up being as good as Bradford or Pike (so long as they wind up in decent situations) in the long run.
There's also that Snead kid floating around, I haven't really seen much on him to make any assessments.
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Thus far Mangini is not any kind of upgrade from RAC.
They won't draft any 1st round QBs. If Quinn can't keep the QB job then Anderson will be the QB.
I highly doubt you see that...unless DA comes in at the end of this year and just lights it up.
DA had 28 or so games to prove something, and he proved that he had a good 9 game stretch against a few of the worst defenses in the league. He then proved that he couldn't solve the cover 2 defense, and everyone promptly employed it against him (except for the Giants, and look how that turned out).
No, if BQ dumps...then we are going to have the record to scoop up one of the top QB's, Bradford, McCoy or Pike (I doubt Tebow goes that high).
DA had 28 or so games to prove something, and he proved that he had a good 9 game stretch against a few of the worst defenses in the league. He then proved that he couldn't solve the cover 2 defense, and everyone promptly employed it against him (except for the Giants, and look how that turned out).
yawn. don't bore us with this garbage.
Nobody is buying this but BQ Nation. nobody.
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DA had 28 or so games to prove something, and he proved that he had a good 9 game stretch against a few of the worst defenses in the league. He then proved that he couldn't solve the cover 2 defense, and everyone promptly employed it against him (except for the Giants, and look how that turned out).
yawn. don't bore us with this garbage.
Nobody is buying this but BQ Nation. nobody.
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DA had 28 or so games to prove something, and he proved that he had a good 9 game stretch against a few of the worst defenses in the league. He then proved that he couldn't solve the cover 2 defense, and everyone promptly employed it against him (except for the Giants, and look how that turned out).
yawn. don't bore us with this garbage.
Nobody is buying this but BQ Nation. nobody.
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According to posters in another thread, Phil was high on Russell but Slick Al beat him to it. If that is the case, hopefully Mangini takes over in future drafts. Ownership can't stand behind Phil forever. We need the Browns to get on with it and become strong again. No matter what these new Steelers "fans" say, there is no rivalry stronger, better, add any adjective here, than Steelers vs Browns in the NFL.
FYI - before posting on a rival board, try to know something about the team other than news blips you happen upon. Savage is gone and has been for some time. We now have Kokinas as our GM, who is a good friend of Mangini and was actually hand selected BY Mangini...so you can be assured they will work together on the drafting of players.
The Browns have basically jettisoned a lot of average players and brought in a bunch of intelligent role players in an effort, IMHO, to teach the young guys what it takes to be a professional and to win.
Over the last years, the Browns PLAYERS were the ones with the loudest voices, and many of those were nothing more than complaints. Now, it is MANGINI with the loudest voice (even if he doesn't say much) and HE is controlling the locker room not only with his presence, but with the presence of consummate professionals who buy into his system.
Often times when you are changing the CULTURE of a team, you have to actually reduce the talent at first. That may have been the case this off-season in certain positions.
As for the QB situation, that is a calculated risk for the betterment of the team down the line. The Browns already knew that DA was not the long term answer...they just need to know if BQ can be. If not, our record will reflect that and leave us in a position to draft one of the top 2 QB's (McCoy/Bradford), and bring in a veteran (I bet Pennington is available soon).
Therefore, I am willing to take this year on the chin to see if the Browns FO finally has a clue.
FYI - before posting on a rival board, try to know something about the team other than news blips you happen upon. Savage is gone and has been for some time. We now have Kokinas as our GM, who is a good friend of Mangini and was actually hand selected BY Mangini...so you can be assured they will work together on the drafting of players.
The Browns have basically jettisoned a lot of average players and brought in a bunch of intelligent role players in an effort, IMHO, to teach the young guys what it takes to be a professional and to win.
Over the last years, the Browns PLAYERS were the ones with the loudest voices, and many of those were nothing more than complaints. Now, it is MANGINI with the loudest voice (even if he doesn't say much) and HE is controlling the locker room not only with his presence, but with the presence of consummate professionals who buy into his system.
Often times when you are changing the CULTURE of a team, you have to actually reduce the talent at first. That may have been the case this off-season in certain positions.
As for the QB situation, that is a calculated risk for the betterment of the team down the line. The Browns already knew that DA was not the long term answer...they just need to know if BQ can be. If not, our record will reflect that and leave us in a position to draft one of the top 2 QB's (McCoy/Bradford), and bring in a veteran (I bet Pennington is available soon).
Therefore, I am willing to take this year on the chin to see if the Browns FO finally has a clue.
My bad. I even remember when he was fired. Just forgot and I got off base anyhow in regards to my original post. Yes, DA had a bad ending in 07? after a good start, but in that good start he looked really good. I never really understood what happened to him at the end or the next season.
With all of the competition for the #1 job at QB I think DA deserves a shot if Quinn doesnt pay off. Quinn, however deserves to play at least the 1st 10 games because 2 games proves nothing. Just think if Drew Brees didnt get a fair chance.
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FYI - before posting on a rival board, try to know something about the team other than news blips you happen upon. Savage is gone and has been for some time. We now have Kokinas as our GM, who is a good friend of Mangini and was actually hand selected BY Mangini...so you can be assured they will work together on the drafting of players.
The Browns have basically jettisoned a lot of average players and brought in a bunch of intelligent role players in an effort, IMHO, to teach the young guys what it takes to be a professional and to win.
Over the last years, the Browns PLAYERS were the ones with the loudest voices, and many of those were nothing more than complaints. Now, it is MANGINI with the loudest voice (even if he doesn't say much) and HE is controlling the locker room not only with his presence, but with the presence of consummate professionals who buy into his system.
Often times when you are changing the CULTURE of a team, you have to actually reduce the talent at first. That may have been the case this off-season in certain positions.
As for the QB situation, that is a calculated risk for the betterment of the team down the line. The Browns already knew that DA was not the long term answer...they just need to know if BQ can be. If not, our record will reflect that and leave us in a position to draft one of the top 2 QB's (McCoy/Bradford), and bring in a veteran (I bet Pennington is available soon).
Therefore, I am willing to take this year on the chin to see if the Browns FO finally has a clue.
My bad. I even remember when he was fired. Just forgot and I got off base anyhow in regards to my original post. Yes, DA had a bad ending in 07? after a good start, but in that good start he looked really good. I never really understood what happened to him at the end or the next season.
With all of the competition for the #1 job at QB I think DA deserves a shot if Quinn doesnt pay off. Quinn, however deserves to play at least the 1st 10 games because 2 games proves nothing. Just think if Drew Brees didnt get a fair chance.
My bad. I even remember when he was fired. Just forgot and I got off base anyhow in regards to my original post. Yes, DA had a bad ending in 07? after a good start, but in that good start he looked really good. I never really understood what happened to him at the end or the next season.
With all of the competition for the #1 job at QB I think DA deserves a shot if Quinn doesnt pay off. Quinn, however deserves to play at least the 1st 10 games because 2 games proves nothing. Just think if Drew Brees didnt get a fair chance.
While I agree giving Quinn 10 games or even the whole season makes sense for the development of him, it wouldn't surprise me if they benched him if he continues to suck it up before his large incentive for making so many starts kicks in. Especially with the economy the way it is and the way teams are struggling to sell games out, they will look to cut costs any way possible.
Just a theory...
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The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
You're a dip shit.
We need right side OL and a decent running back.
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Masters said:
And apparently Eric Mangini so far.Oh, and the other NFL teams that needed a QB and didn't even make a try for DA in the offseason (at least that any new outlet could get a hold of).
Really?Tell me then oh prophet of all things....why didn't anyone make a REAL...note the word real, offer for quinn? I really don't get this quinn adoration...this guy has done nothing,and I expect another poor showing from him this Sunday.
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Masters said:
And apparently Eric Mangini so far.Oh, and the other NFL teams that needed a QB and didn't even make a try for DA in the offseason (at least that any new outlet could get a hold of).
Really?Tell me then oh prophet of all things....why didn't anyone make a REAL...note the word real, offer for quinn? I really don't get this quinn adoration...this guy has done nothing,and I expect another poor showing from him this Sunday.
Really?Tell me then oh prophet of all things....why didn't anyone make a REAL...note the word real, offer for quinn? I really don't get this quinn adoration...this guy has done nothing,and I expect another poor showing from him this Sunday.
Profit of all things? Hardly.
Who knows if any reported trade offer is real. But there were at least rumored/reported ones for Quinn this offseason. As I said in the post you responded to, "at least that any new outlet could get a hold of". There were reported for Quinn. There were zero for DA. Doesn't mean no one was interested, but not interested enough to cause a ripple in the press pool.
And I have no adoration for Quinn. He's played all of 5 NFL games total. It's the adoration for DA that doesn't make sense. It's just like the adoration for Kelly Holcomb.
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The one area that is holding the Browns back is the QB position, in my opinion. Find your new Bernie and find your way out of the cellar........Does Anderson warrant another shot or is it 1st round, 1st pick QB time? Well, the Lions will always own the 1st pick, but you get my meaning.........
You're a dip shit.
We need right side OL and a decent running back.
AdaM said:
You're a dip shit.We need right side OL and a decent running back.
Getting a right side and a RB that are pro bowl worthy won't bring success to the QB position.
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