Art Modell up for HOF
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Take way the emotion and Art deserves to be in the HOF. He did more for the league than most any other owner.
It's time to forgive and forget. Leave the petty emotions aside. He belongs in the HOF.
Had these current Browns been a formidable team since their return in 99…by winning division titles, having a Super Bowl appearance or two, and beating the Steelers more than they beat us, then the thought of forgiving and forgetting would come easily in my opinion. It would for me.
Much of the bitterness towards Modell stems from the bitterness we hold against having to root for a perennial loser.
Had these current Browns been a formidable team since their return in 99…by winning division titles, having a Super Bowl appearance or two, and beating the Steelers more than they beat us, then the thought of forgiving and forgetting would come easily in my opinion. It would for me.
Much of the bitterness towards Modell stems from the bitterness we hold against having to root for a perennial loser.
Well said! The sad thing is it really doesn't take that much to please us either. To your points in bold above, if someone like a Robert Kraft purchased this team - I agree the winning that would have followed would have removed a lot of the hostility.
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Had these current Browns been a formidable team since their return in 99…by winning division titles, having a Super Bowl appearance or two, and beating the Steelers more than they beat us, then the thought of forgiving and forgetting would come easily in my opinion. It would for me.
Much of the bitterness towards Modell stems from the bitterness we hold against having to root for a perennial loser.
Well said! The sad thing is it really doesn't take that much to please us either. To your points in bold above, if someone like a Robert Kraft purchased this team - I agree the winning that would have followed would have removed a lot of the hostility.
Well said! The sad thing is it really doesn't take that much to please us either. To your points in bold above, if someone like a Robert Kraft purchased this team - I agree the winning that would have followed would have removed a lot of the hostility.
So we hold hostility against Modell because other owners were screw-up's? Is that what I am hearing?
Look, he gets on the list because some people feel it's time to put him in the hall. Clevelanders have protest enough so that didn't happen while the guy was alive and could enjoy the moment. I don't see the reason for doing so now other than spite.
It's just not a good look. I am sorry to say that Cleveland fans haven't had a good look for many years now. I know we like to think we are loyal and one of the best fan bases in the league, but that isn't the way we are viewed elsewhere.
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Well said! The sad thing is it really doesn't take that much to please us either. To your points in bold above, if someone like a Robert Kraft purchased this team - I agree the winning that would have followed would have removed a lot of the hostility.
So we hold hostility against Modell because other owners were screw-up's? Is that what I am hearing?
Look, he gets on the list because some people feel it's time to put him in the hall. Clevelanders have protest enough so that didn't happen while the guy was alive and could enjoy the moment. I don't see the reason for doing so now other than spite.
It's just not a good look. I am sorry to say that Cleveland fans haven't had a good look for many years now. I know we like to think we are loyal and one of the best fan bases in the league, but that isn't the way we are viewed elsewhere.
So we hold hostility against Modell because other owners were screw-up's? Is that what I am hearing?
Look, he gets on the list because some people feel it's time to put him in the hall. Clevelanders have protest enough so that didn't happen while the guy was alive and could enjoy the moment. I don't see the reason for doing so now other than spite.
It's just not a good look. I am sorry to say that Cleveland fans haven't had a good look for many years now. I know we like to think we are loyal and one of the best fan bases in the league, but that isn't the way we are viewed elsewhere.
No, we hold hostility toward him for doing exactly what the Irsays did to their first fan base/customers. The difference? The new team in Baltimore won the Super Bowl Championship as early as 2001 (and rinsed and repeated that in 2013) so their fan base/customers didn't have to dwell on the void or the short term losing that followed. Result? There isn't the same lingering hostility in a sport where winning cures everything - leaving a large percentage of that fanbase quite thankful the Irsays departed after all. If they were still losing, I can assure you there would have been sufficient hostility prolonged.
In Cleveland, the move was in the mid 90s and there's only been 2 playoff teams here in the 30 years since. So yeah, there's a lingering sting here that frustrates the loyal and passionate fanbase here. People react differently ranging from where you stand on it all to where a lot of us stand in frustration. Fan isn't just a prefix of Fantastic. We've been through a lot together as a fanbase and the fact that we're all still here pulling for this team is a much better look than you want to think. That said, we're gonna vent whether we're buying the Sunday Ticket to watch this team or attending games in person.
Speaking of "not a good look", let's not pretend how often the national media likes to rub the heartache of the move and the type of football that has followed here in our fanbase's faces. Part of that includes rubbing the success at the Rathouse vrs the football follies that have continued to take place here in the stadium next to Lake Erie since 1999. I dare say I think we deserve a whole lot better here than we've received especially now that we have an owner that isn't going broke.
I welcome the only Defensive Coordinator to earn a Superbowl Ring in New Orleans while understanding Revenge of the Nerds is a sequel. "Come get some!" -
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So we hold hostility against Modell because other owners were screw-up's? Is that what I am hearing?
Look, he gets on the list because some people feel it's time to put him in the hall. Clevelanders have protest enough so that didn't happen while the guy was alive and could enjoy the moment. I don't see the reason for doing so now other than spite.
It's just not a good look. I am sorry to say that Cleveland fans haven't had a good look for many years now. I know we like to think we are loyal and one of the best fan bases in the league, but that isn't the way we are viewed elsewhere.
No, we hold hostility toward him for doing exactly what the Irsays did to their first fan base/customers. The difference? The new team in Baltimore won the Super Bowl Championship as early as 2001 (and rinsed and repeated that in 2013) so their fan base/customers didn't have to dwell on the void or the short term losing that followed. Result? There isn't the same lingering hostility in a sport where winning cures everything - leaving a large percentage of that fanbase quite thankful the Irsays departed after all. If they were still losing, I can assure you there would have been sufficient hostility prolonged.
In Cleveland, the move was in the mid 90s and there's only been 2 playoff teams here in the 30 years since. So yeah, there's a lingering sting here that frustrates the loyal and passionate fanbase here. People react differently ranging from where you stand on it all to where a lot of us stand in frustration. Fan isn't just a prefix of Fantastic. We've been through a lot together as a fanbase and the fact that we're all still here pulling for this team is a much better look than you want to think. That said, we're gonna vent whether we're buying the Sunday Ticket to watch this team or attending games in person.
Speaking of "not a good look", let's not pretend how often the national media likes to rub the heartache of the move and the type of football that has followed here in our fanbase's faces. Part of that includes rubbing the success at the Rathouse vrs the football follies that have continued to take place here in the stadium next to Lake Erie since 1999. I dare say I think we deserve a whole lot better here than we've received especially now that we have an owner that isn't going broke.
No, we hold hostility toward him for doing exactly what the Irsays did to their first fan base/customers. The difference? The new team in Baltimore won the Super Bowl Championship as early as 2001 (and rinsed and repeated that in 2013) so their fan base/customers didn't have to dwell on the void or the short term losing that followed. Result? There isn't the same lingering hostility in a sport where winning cures everything - leaving a large percentage of that fanbase quite thankful the Irsays departed after all. If they were still losing, I can assure you there would have been sufficient hostility prolonged.
In Cleveland, the move was in the mid 90s and there's only been 2 playoff teams here in the 30 years since. So yeah, there's a lingering sting here that frustrates the loyal and passionate fanbase here. People react differently ranging from where you stand on it all to where a lot of us stand in frustration. Fan isn't just a prefix of Fantastic. We've been through a lot together as a fanbase and the fact that we're all still here pulling for this team is a much better look than you want to think. That said, we're gonna vent whether we're buying the Sunday Ticket to watch this team or attending games in person.
Speaking of "not a good look", let's not pretend how often the national media likes to rub the heartache of the move and the type of football that has followed here in our fanbase's faces. Part of that includes rubbing the success at the Rathouse vrs the football follies that have continued to take place here in the stadium next to Lake Erie since 1999. I dare say I think we deserve a whole lot better here than we've received especially now that we have an owner that isn't going broke.
I don't feel like the Browns or any sports team owes me anything other than to show up and play the games when scheduled.
You post is emotion based, like I said in my first post...I guess it was the first. If the Browns had won the SB, everybody would be in favor of Modell being enshrined but since he didn't do it here and did it elsewhere, that doesn't count.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. -
No, we hold hostility toward him for doing exactly what the Irsays did to their first fan base/customers. The difference? The new team in Baltimore won the Super Bowl Championship as early as 2001 (and rinsed and repeated that in 2013) so their fan base/customers didn't have to dwell on the void or the short term losing that followed. Result? There isn't the same lingering hostility in a sport where winning cures everything - leaving a large percentage of that fanbase quite thankful the Irsays departed after all. If they were still losing, I can assure you there would have been sufficient hostility prolonged.
In Cleveland, the move was in the mid 90s and there's only been 2 playoff teams here in the 30 years since. So yeah, there's a lingering sting here that frustrates the loyal and passionate fanbase here. People react differently ranging from where you stand on it all to where a lot of us stand in frustration. Fan isn't just a prefix of Fantastic. We've been through a lot together as a fanbase and the fact that we're all still here pulling for this team is a much better look than you want to think. That said, we're gonna vent whether we're buying the Sunday Ticket to watch this team or attending games in person.
Speaking of "not a good look", let's not pretend how often the national media likes to rub the heartache of the move and the type of football that has followed here in our fanbase's faces. Part of that includes rubbing the success at the Rathouse vrs the football follies that have continued to take place here in the stadium next to Lake Erie since 1999. I dare say I think we deserve a whole lot better here than we've received especially now that we have an owner that isn't going broke.
I don't feel like the Browns or any sports team owes me anything other than to show up and play the games when scheduled.
You post is emotion based, like I said in my first post...I guess it was the first. If the Browns had won the SB, everybody would be in favor of Modell being enshrined but since he didn't do it here and did it elsewhere, that doesn't count.
If the Browns had won the SB, everybody would be in favor of Modell being enshrined but since he didn't do it here and did it elsewhere, that doesn't count.
I think you're catching on, but to put in context, because he deleted our team and left town to do it.
I think any fan base is allowed to feel or think that way.
If a sports team wants to keep people buying their product, be it season tickets or merch, then you're damn straight they owe it to the fans to put out a respectable product when they can. If you feel differently it's your right, but others want to hold owners accountable as they rake in profits from their fan base.
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I don't try to suppress anybody's right to feel as they do. I just feel that Art deserves to be in the HOF. His actions for the league warrant that. The only response is emotional rants about moving the team.
As for holding an owner accountable, what exactly do you do to hold an owner accountable? Not buy tickets? That's a sure way to keep the team in town. Go to games and hold up a cardboard sign? Tell others to not buy tickets?
It sounds cool to say you are going to hold the owner accountable, but what does that mean? A curious mind wants to know.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. -
I stop buying merch and stop buying tickets. I stop praising the douchbags for doing a bad job. I'll support the team but when given a chance, I'll protest the owner. This may be the only way to protest and hold him accountable, not allowing him in the HOF.
I think all his actions are motivated by money.
I have no emotion in this at all. I think the HOF is lame, I could care less who gets in or doesn't get in. If I ever get free tickets to go in again, I wouldn't even waste my time going in to use the restrooms. I don't even give Modell a second thought but I support my fellow fans in being upset because I myself remember when the Browns ceased to exist and it sucked.
I think people, emotion based or not, have every right to protest him going in if they choose. How can it not be emotion based? This is a past time we all enjoy and he made it go dead around here for a number of years and it hasn't recovered yet. I don't care you support him going in, that's cool too, I just don't know why you feel the need to people crap over this.
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I don't try to suppress anybody's right to feel as they do. I just feel that Art deserves to be in the HOF. His actions for the league warrant that. The only response is emotional rants about moving the team.
As for holding an owner accountable, what exactly do you do to hold an owner accountable? Not buy tickets? That's a sure way to keep the team in town. Go to games and hold up a cardboard sign? Tell others to not buy tickets?
It sounds cool to say you are going to hold the owner accountable, but what does that mean? A curious mind wants to know.
I don't try to suppress anybody's right to feel as they do. I just feel that Art deserves to be in the HOF. His actions for the league warrant that. The only response is emotional rants about moving the team.
As for holding an owner accountable, what exactly do you do to hold an owner accountable? Not buy tickets? That's a sure way to keep the team in town. Go to games and hold up a cardboard sign? Tell others to not buy tickets?
It sounds cool to say you are going to hold the owner accountable, but what does that mean? A curious mind wants to know.
I stopped buying season tickets because of Jimmy Haslam.
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No, we hold hostility toward him for doing exactly what the Irsays did to their first fan base/customers. The difference? The new team in Baltimore won the Super Bowl Championship as early as 2001 (and rinsed and repeated that in 2013) so their fan base/customers didn't have to dwell on the void or the short term losing that followed. Result? There isn't the same lingering hostility in a sport where winning cures everything - leaving a large percentage of that fanbase quite thankful the Irsays departed after all. If they were still losing, I can assure you there would have been sufficient hostility prolonged.
In Cleveland, the move was in the mid 90s and there's only been 2 playoff teams here in the 30 years since. So yeah, there's a lingering sting here that frustrates the loyal and passionate fanbase here. People react differently ranging from where you stand on it all to where a lot of us stand in frustration. Fan isn't just a prefix of Fantastic. We've been through a lot together as a fanbase and the fact that we're all still here pulling for this team is a much better look than you want to think. That said, we're gonna vent whether we're buying the Sunday Ticket to watch this team or attending games in person.
Speaking of "not a good look", let's not pretend how often the national media likes to rub the heartache of the move and the type of football that has followed here in our fanbase's faces. Part of that includes rubbing the success at the Rathouse vrs the football follies that have continued to take place here in the stadium next to Lake Erie since 1999. I dare say I think we deserve a whole lot better here than we've received especially now that we have an owner that isn't going broke.
I don't feel like the Browns or any sports team owes me anything other than to show up and play the games when scheduled.
You post is emotion based, like I said in my first post...I guess it was the first. If the Browns had won the SB, everybody would be in favor of Modell being enshrined but since he didn't do it here and did it elsewhere, that doesn't count.
I don't feel like the Browns or any sports team owes me anything other than to show up and play the games when scheduled.
You post is emotion based, like I said in my first post...I guess it was the first. If the Browns had won the SB, everybody would be in favor of Modell being enshrined but since he didn't do it here and did it elsewhere, that doesn't count.
Regarding Line 1 Above: Okay, thanks for sharing your feelings about it. Unfortunately, that's all the Browns are doing this year is show up so they can cash their very tiny little paychecks. No tough love required from us for constant repetition of all the following: false starts, illegal procedures (2 guys in motion at the same time), illegal formation (not enough guys on the line of scrimmage), holding, blown coverages, bad tackling, etc. Maybe people that have to make bigger economic sacrifices to afford taking their family to a game from a different state or locally - don't share the no big deal on the disappointing entertainment value. I'm not just saying this is all on the players - it starts at the top of the business for hiring those responsible for the entertainment value for their customers. Now they're gonna ghost a stadium they've only played 25 years in for a new one. Don't be surprised if our fans residing in Ohio do feel like the Browns owe them something.
Regarding Lines 2 & 3 from you: You are correct, the 1st thing I always think of when I hear "The Cleveland Browns" is our collective passion for this team we're always in here talking about. Yes "passion" is an emotion that has a way of connecting a 1st generation of football fans in a family witnessing all the Browns Championship Games from 46-55 to a 2nd generation seeing the Championship in 64 to 3rd and 4th generations of fans. Passion - it's an emotion. Confidence is a feeling teams get when they make a play that changes momentum. The team with the momentum has confidence - the team without momentum lacks confidence which changes statistics and scoreboards. However, I never commented on whether I felt he belonged in the Hall of Fame or not. I only replied to a post I agreed with about the bitterness many of our fans have held toward Modell rooting for a perennial loser since 99. Even worse, he was the one rewarded like a king while we went through it.
Regarding the Hall of Fame: IMO, any NFL owner with aspirations to make the Hall of Fame - can't be the only owner in the 90s who went broke. He was now the Jed Clampett of NFL Owners before he struck oil by mistake. Only in this non-fiction story he was given the financial equivalent for moving the team to a different state. When you get right down to it, he was rewarded for going broke here by the league. That opinion I just gave holds hands with my emotions about the whole PHUCKING thing. The BEST thing he did that I rarely hear him getting credit for was protect Ernie Davis from the media during his brutal battle with Leukemia. He also made sure financially that he got the best of care throughout that battle; while remaining a tremendous support to his family.
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No, we hold hostility toward him for doing exactly what the Irsays did to their first fan base/customers. The difference? The new team in Baltimore won the Super Bowl Championship as early as 2001 (and rinsed and repeated that in 2013) so their fan base/customers didn't have to dwell on the void or the short term losing that followed. Result? There isn't the same lingering hostility in a sport where winning cures everything - leaving a large percentage of that fanbase quite thankful the Irsays departed after all. If they were still losing, I can assure you there would have been sufficient hostility prolonged.
In Cleveland, the move was in the mid 90s and there's only been 2 playoff teams here in the 30 years since. So yeah, there's a lingering sting here that frustrates the loyal and passionate fanbase here. People react differently ranging from where you stand on it all to where a lot of us stand in frustration. Fan isn't just a prefix of Fantastic. We've been through a lot together as a fanbase and the fact that we're all still here pulling for this team is a much better look than you want to think. That said, we're gonna vent whether we're buying the Sunday Ticket to watch this team or attending games in person.
Speaking of "not a good look", let's not pretend how often the national media likes to rub the heartache of the move and the type of football that has followed here in our fanbase's faces. Part of that includes rubbing the success at the Rathouse vrs the football follies that have continued to take place here in the stadium next to Lake Erie since 1999. I dare say I think we deserve a whole lot better here than we've received especially now that we have an owner that isn't going broke.
I don't feel like the Browns or any sports team owes me anything other than to show up and play the games when scheduled.
You post is emotion based, like I said in my first post...I guess it was the first. If the Browns had won the SB, everybody would be in favor of Modell being enshrined but since he didn't do it here and did it elsewhere, that doesn't count.
I don't feel like the Browns or any sports team owes me anything other than to show up and play the games when scheduled.
You post is emotion based, like I said in my first post...I guess it was the first. If the Browns had won the SB, everybody would be in favor of Modell being enshrined but since he didn't do it here and did it elsewhere, that doesn't count.
Based on the other owner slime that's made it into Canton, you have a point. I've gone beyond the emotion point 'Peen read on.
Regarding the Hall of Fame: IMO, any NFL owner with aspirations to make the Hall of Fame - can't be the only owner in the 90s who went broke. He was now the Jed Clampett of NFL Owners before he struck oil by mistake. Only in this non-fiction story he was given the financial equivalent for moving the team to a different state. When you get right down to it, he was rewarded for going broke here by the league. That opinion I just gave holds hands with my emotions about the whole PHUCKING thing. The BEST thing he did that I rarely hear him getting credit for was protect Ernie Davis from the media during his brutal battle with Leukemia. He also made sure financially that he got the best of care throughout that battle; while remaining a tremendous support to his family.
Yes Art Modell, the only owner who went bankrupt running an unprecedented money machine that being an NFL owner confers.
And the only owner who managed to fire TWO HOF Coaches- Paul Brown, and if you don't think Bill Belichick is a mortal lock to get in when he's eligible, I've got some nice ocean property in Arizona I'd like to sell you.
Anyway.... Pure sympathy vote. I doubt he'll make the cut to the final selection.
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I don't try to suppress anybody's right to feel as they do. I just feel that Art deserves to be in the HOF. His actions for the league warrant that. The only response is emotional rants about moving the team.
As for holding an owner accountable, what exactly do you do to hold an owner accountable? Not buy tickets? That's a sure way to keep the team in town. Go to games and hold up a cardboard sign? Tell others to not buy tickets?
It sounds cool to say you are going to hold the owner accountable, but what does that mean? A curious mind wants to know.
I don't try to suppress anybody's right to feel as they do. I just feel that Art deserves to be in the HOF. His actions for the league warrant that. The only response is emotional rants about moving the team.
As for holding an owner accountable, what exactly do you do to hold an owner accountable? Not buy tickets? That's a sure way to keep the team in town. Go to games and hold up a cardboard sign? Tell others to not buy tickets?
It sounds cool to say you are going to hold the owner accountable, but what does that mean? A curious mind wants to know.
It’s sports ballpeen. I truly respect your position on this, but it’s unreasonable to try and separate emotion from sports in the grand scheme of things. It’s kinda what brings us here in the first place.
I’m trying real hard here to see this objectively. I get that he was a big player in negotiating tv deals and MNF.
I’m trying my damndest to compare that to his cons. He fired Paul Brown. He didn’t win a Superbowl in Cleveland. And he MOVED MY TEAM to Baltimore.
I tried to be a Ravens fan that year. I really did. It didn’t work out and l only then realized l was a fan of laundry and a city and the football that goes on in that city and here we are.
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I don't try to suppress anybody's right to feel as they do. I just feel that Art deserves to be in the HOF. His actions for the league warrant that. The only response is emotional rants about moving the team.
As for holding an owner accountable, what exactly do you do to hold an owner accountable? Not buy tickets? That's a sure way to keep the team in town. Go to games and hold up a cardboard sign? Tell others to not buy tickets?
It sounds cool to say you are going to hold the owner accountable, but what does that mean? A curious mind wants to know.
It’s sports ballpeen. I truly respect your position on this, but it’s unreasonable to try and separate emotion from sports in the grand scheme of things. It’s kinda what brings us here in the first place.
I’m trying real hard here to see this objectively. I get that he was a big player in negotiating tv deals and MNF.
I’m trying my damndest to compare that to his cons. He fired Paul Brown. He didn’t win a Superbowl in Cleveland. And he MOVED MY TEAM to Baltimore.
I tried to be a Ravens fan that year. I really did. It didn’t work out and l only then realized l was a fan of laundry and a city and the football that goes on in that city and here we are.
It’s sports ballpeen. I truly respect your position on this, but it’s unreasonable to try and separate emotion from sports in the grand scheme of things. It’s kinda what brings us here in the first place.
I’m trying real hard here to see this objectively. I get that he was a big player in negotiating tv deals and MNF.
I’m trying my damndest to compare that to his cons. He fired Paul Brown. He didn’t win a Superbowl in Cleveland. And he MOVED MY TEAM to Baltimore.
I tried to be a Ravens fan that year. I really did. It didn’t work out and l only then realized l was a fan of laundry and a city and the football that goes on in that city and here we are.
That is exactly how I see it... Fuck Modell!..
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You guys still arguing with ballpeen?
Haven't figured out that he's just a contrarian for the sake of being contrarian yet?
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You guys still arguing with ballpeen?
Haven't figured out that he's just a contrarian for the sake of being contrarian yet?
You guys still arguing with ballpeen?
Haven't figured out that he's just a contrarian for the sake of being contrarian yet?
There’s a legitimate point of view in there and someone has to play devil’s advocate with this whole thing.
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You guys still arguing with ballpeen?
Haven't figured out that he's just a contrarian for the sake of being contrarian yet?
There’s a legitimate point of view in there and someone has to play devil’s advocate with this whole thing.
There’s a legitimate point of view in there and someone has to play devil’s advocate with this whole thing.
Color me shocked and awed that he'd be the guy to do it... ?
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You guys still arguing with ballpeen?
Haven't figured out that he's just a contrarian for the sake of being contrarian yet?
You guys still arguing with ballpeen?
Haven't figured out that he's just a contrarian for the sake of being contrarian yet?
? He reminds me a lot of Gipper (and that's a good thing) in the sense he'll challenge a further look into something if he feels we're not being fair regarding the bigger picture or his angle on it all.
There's always going to be guys that get short changed with the Hall of Fame criteria used from many knuckleheads that don't even belong on the HOF selection committee. Sports writers that never covered our 80s teams (that made more playoffs and Conference Championship Games) roll their eyes every time they hear "Clay Matthews" who was the best LBer here whether he started as a Strongside LBer, Weakside LBer, MLB in a 4-3 or 3-4. Sometimes being unselfish and helping this team when others in the LBer Corps get injured may not + Pro Bowl votes from FANS. That said, our Defense was always very good throughout those 80s. My favorite 1st round was Clay and Ozzie in 1978. FWIW, Myles Garrett who is here primarily just to rush the passer (in an era where teams are passing far more frequently than ever) - didn't pass Clay as the franchise sack leader until his 7th season last year. I was at the playoff game when Buffalo was driving for what looked to be game winning points when Matthews intercepted Kelly at the 2 yard line to secure the victory. To me he was football's version of Cal Ripken in terms of steady, solid leadership with reliable talent that was durable and long term. Ripken made the HOF for his sport for those reasons. At a Browns Backer Banquet in Rochester NY former Pro Bowl Guard Joe DeLamielleure was asked who the toughest guy he ever faced was. Without hesitation he said "Clay Matthews is the toughest Son of a Bitch I've ever faced!" I think he knows a little more than sportswriters that don't cover this team.
Sorry for my sour grapes detour; BUT like my feeling about Matthews getting snubbed - I'm sure a lot of our fans today that didn't see a lot of him only want a higher Pro Bowl inventory. If he did all the same stuff and played for Pittsburgh - is there any question he would have been good enough for the HOF Committee? Because of this feeling I have - I can understand Ballpeen wanting to present where he stands on it all with Modell. I'm just being his Devil's Advocate...
I welcome the only Defensive Coordinator to earn a Superbowl Ring in New Orleans while understanding Revenge of the Nerds is a sequel. "Come get some!" -
You guys still arguing with ballpeen?
Haven't figured out that he's just a contrarian for the sake of being contrarian yet?
? He reminds me a lot of Gipper (and that's a good thing) in the sense he'll challenge a further look into something if he feels we're not being fair regarding the bigger picture or his angle on it all.
There's always going to be guys that get short changed with the Hall of Fame criteria used from many knuckleheads that don't even belong on the HOF selection committee. Sports writers that never covered our 80s teams (that made more playoffs and Conference Championship Games) roll their eyes every time they hear "Clay Matthews" who was the best LBer here whether he started as a Strongside LBer, Weakside LBer, MLB in a 4-3 or 3-4. Sometimes being unselfish and helping this team when others in the LBer Corps get injured may not + Pro Bowl votes from FANS. That said, our Defense was always very good throughout those 80s. My favorite 1st round was Clay and Ozzie in 1978. FWIW, Myles Garrett who is here primarily just to rush the passer (in an era where teams are passing far more frequently than ever) - didn't pass Clay as the franchise sack leader until his 7th season last year. I was at the playoff game when Buffalo was driving for what looked to be game winning points when Matthews intercepted Kelly at the 2 yard line to secure the victory. To me he was football's version of Cal Ripken in terms of steady, solid leadership with reliable talent that was durable and long term. Ripken made the HOF for his sport for those reasons. At a Browns Backer Banquet in Rochester NY former Pro Bowl Guard Joe DeLamielleure was asked who the toughest guy he ever faced was. Without hesitation he said "Clay Matthews is the toughest Son of a Bitch I've ever faced!" I think he knows a little more than sportswriters that don't cover this team.
Sorry for my sour grapes detour; BUT like my feeling about Matthews getting snubbed - I'm sure a lot of our fans today that didn't see a lot of him only want a higher Pro Bowl inventory. If he did all the same stuff and played for Pittsburgh - is there any question he would have been good enough for the HOF Committee? Because of this feeling I have - I can understand Ballpeen wanting to present where he stands on it all with Modell. I'm just being his Devil's Advocate...
? He reminds me a lot of Gipper (and that's a good thing) in the sense he'll challenge a further look into something if he feels we're not being fair regarding the bigger picture or his angle on it all.
There's always going to be guys that get short changed with the Hall of Fame criteria used from many knuckleheads that don't even belong on the HOF selection committee. Sports writers that never covered our 80s teams (that made more playoffs and Conference Championship Games) roll their eyes every time they hear "Clay Matthews" who was the best LBer here whether he started as a Strongside LBer, Weakside LBer, MLB in a 4-3 or 3-4. Sometimes being unselfish and helping this team when others in the LBer Corps get injured may not + Pro Bowl votes from FANS. That said, our Defense was always very good throughout those 80s. My favorite 1st round was Clay and Ozzie in 1978. FWIW, Myles Garrett who is here primarily just to rush the passer (in an era where teams are passing far more frequently than ever) - didn't pass Clay as the franchise sack leader until his 7th season last year. I was at the playoff game when Buffalo was driving for what looked to be game winning points when Matthews intercepted Kelly at the 2 yard line to secure the victory. To me he was football's version of Cal Ripken in terms of steady, solid leadership with reliable talent that was durable and long term. Ripken made the HOF for his sport for those reasons. At a Browns Backer Banquet in Rochester NY former Pro Bowl Guard Joe DeLamielleure was asked who the toughest guy he ever faced was. Without hesitation he said "Clay Matthews is the toughest Son of a Bitch I've ever faced!" I think he knows a little more than sportswriters that don't cover this team.
Sorry for my sour grapes detour; BUT like my feeling about Matthews getting snubbed - I'm sure a lot of our fans today that didn't see a lot of him only want a higher Pro Bowl inventory. If he did all the same stuff and played for Pittsburgh - is there any question he would have been good enough for the HOF Committee? Because of this feeling I have - I can understand Ballpeen wanting to present where he stands on it all with Modell. I'm just being his Devil's Advocate...
It bothers me that Junior Seau gets in and Mathews has numbers on par or better and still gets snubbed... So I share in your vitriol of the HOF committee.... on a side note.. The only thing Tony Grossi is good for is keeping Art out... Otherwise.. as reporters... Both him and MKC are complete useless hacks.. I yearn for the days of great reporting from the likes of Hal Lebovitz, Joe Menzer,Bob August and national columnists like Mike Royko and Herb Kamm.. And SI reporter Rick Tellander was always a great read...
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You guys still arguing with ballpeen?
Haven't figured out that he's just a contrarian for the sake of being contrarian yet?
? He reminds me a lot of Gipper (and that's a good thing) in the sense he'll challenge a further look into something if he feels we're not being fair regarding the bigger picture or his angle on it all.
There's always going to be guys that get short changed with the Hall of Fame criteria used from many knuckleheads that don't even belong on the HOF selection committee. Sports writers that never covered our 80s teams (that made more playoffs and Conference Championship Games) roll their eyes every time they hear "Clay Matthews" who was the best LBer here whether he started as a Strongside LBer, Weakside LBer, MLB in a 4-3 or 3-4. Sometimes being unselfish and helping this team when others in the LBer Corps get injured may not + Pro Bowl votes from FANS. That said, our Defense was always very good throughout those 80s. My favorite 1st round was Clay and Ozzie in 1978. FWIW, Myles Garrett who is here primarily just to rush the passer (in an era where teams are passing far more frequently than ever) - didn't pass Clay as the franchise sack leader until his 7th season last year. I was at the playoff game when Buffalo was driving for what looked to be game winning points when Matthews intercepted Kelly at the 2 yard line to secure the victory. To me he was football's version of Cal Ripken in terms of steady, solid leadership with reliable talent that was durable and long term. Ripken made the HOF for his sport for those reasons. At a Browns Backer Banquet in Rochester NY former Pro Bowl Guard Joe DeLamielleure was asked who the toughest guy he ever faced was. Without hesitation he said "Clay Matthews is the toughest Son of a Bitch I've ever faced!" I think he knows a little more than sportswriters that don't cover this team.
Sorry for my sour grapes detour; BUT like my feeling about Matthews getting snubbed - I'm sure a lot of our fans today that didn't see a lot of him only want a higher Pro Bowl inventory. If he did all the same stuff and played for Pittsburgh - is there any question he would have been good enough for the HOF Committee? Because of this feeling I have - I can understand Ballpeen wanting to present where he stands on it all with Modell. I'm just being his Devil's Advocate...
? He reminds me a lot of Gipper (and that's a good thing) in the sense he'll challenge a further look into something if he feels we're not being fair regarding the bigger picture or his angle on it all.
Oh yes, I've definitely noticed the similarities. ?
I might not agree with ballpeen on this, or honestly a lot of stuff, but he's a good, entertaining read. This place definitely could use more of that.
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Good takes guys.
Going on a tangent here, and yes, it's emotional ... ..
There are TOO MANY Steelers in the HOF.
I get it to a degree. They were "the team of the 70s." But Lynn Swan? John Stallworth? Or IMHO, Kevin Greene ( inducted as a Steelers, his choice)."
Hines Ward continues to be nominated, I call BS on that
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