Browns sign a 2 year deal for veteran OT Cornelius Lucas

Flugel

@texasag1969 said:

We don't need any of these fatties-Ghoulie?

We got a well paid Zumba Instructor that will get them in REAL GOOD shape... ?

Orion

@berniesuperbowl2 said:

At least on paper, Lucas is an upgrade over both of our tackles from last year.

PFF grades him pretty high:

Look at Jedrick Wills grade, basically a third stringer:

Even Conklin was mediocre for his fat salary:

Conklin & Wills couldn't even start the season because they were still rehabbing from season ending injuries the season before. While I wouldn't hold out much hope for Wills playing any better perhaps Conklin might be better this year. Hopefully the new guy is as good as PFF thinks.

ballpeen

@orion said:

Conklin & Wills couldn't even start the season because they were still rehabbing from season ending injuries the season before. While I wouldn't hold out much hope for Wills playing any better perhaps Conklin might be better this year. Hopefully the new guy is as good as PFF thinks.

I don't think it's a matter of what PFF thinks. It's what the stats tell them. That said, past grades don't mean future grades will show the same thing.

BernieSuperBowl2

@ballpeen said:

I don't think it's a matter of what PFF thinks. It's what the stats tell them. That said, past grades don't mean future grades will show the same thing.

Wills is trash. Conklin is washed up. The stats DO matter.

Conklin was an All-Pro in 2020. He blew out his patellar tendon in 2021, tore his ACL in 2023. He's not the same guy. People think just because he was an All-Pro 5 years ago that he's still a stud. He's not. He's now an average tackle at best. Cut him, save $15M in cap space if there is something comparable. But don't tell me Conklin is going to be an All-Pro ever again, just like Chubb sadly, his best days are in the past and the injuries & age caught up to him.

tiamat63

Having a 33 year old OT can be rough.

The bright spot that helps pass pro, and (IMHO) can artificially inflate grades would be something like the Washington offense. They use a lot of high percentage and quick hitting throws, especially as an extension of the running game.

How 33 year knees hold up in an outside zone may be a different story entirely. But it helps to alleviate the major concern, this season anyway, that we have at OT.

BernieSuperBowl2

They restructured Conklin's contract. Run him into the ground for whatever football is left in him and then he's a free agent next year.

Revised Contract Framework
The new deal secures a $10 million salary for the coming season, with $9 million guaranteed and the opportunity to earn an additional $2 million in incentives. This restructuring eliminates a contractual year, transitioning Conklin’s free-agent status from 2027 to 2026. The adjustment effectively reduces the overall contract value from an earlier projection of approximately $17.7 million, contributing to the team’s broader financial rebalancing efforts.

ballpeen

@berniesuperbowl2 said:

Wills is trash. Conklin is washed up. The stats DO matter.

Conklin was an All-Pro in 2020. He blew out his patellar tendon in 2021, tore his ACL in 2023. He's not the same guy. People think just because he was an All-Pro 5 years ago that he's still a stud. He's not. He's now an average tackle at best. Cut him, save $15M in cap space if there is something comparable. But don't tell me Conklin is going to be an All-Pro ever again, just like Chubb sadly, his best days are in the past and the injuries & age caught up to him.

Like i said, past grades don't mean future grades will be similar.

You are talking about different things than Orion was talking about. My comment was about the new guy.

Wills is a lazy player who could be good, but he doesn't have the desire to work at being good. Conklin is a good player who has worked, but injuries have continued to plague him for several seasons. At some point as a player gets older you do have to factor that into the equation. Things can shift from being a fluke, random injury that can happen to anybody, any time, to something more of a chronic nature.

I know. In the past if I got injured it was along the lines of stepping off a curb wrong and rolling an ankle. That is a fluke thing. Can happen to anybody. Now, after more than 70 years on this earth, I can go to bed feeling fine and wake up injured. That is a chronic thing.

TexasAg1969

@ballpeen said:

I know. In the past if I got injured it was along the lines of stepping off a curb wrong and rolling an ankle. That is a fluke thing. Can happen to anybody. Now, after more than 70 years on this earth, I can go to bed feeling fine and wake up injured. That is a chronic thing.

Amen to that. Just last week (I'll be 78 on the 21st) I turned wrong in my sleep and woke up immediately with a "twinge" in my left knee. I walked it out with the dog before attempting racquetball later in the day. And yet I still don't understand why my wife won't give me a high paying no trade in extension contract.?‍???

nickers

@berniesuperbowl2 said:

Wills is trash. Conklin is washed up. The stats DO matter.

Conklin was an All-Pro in 2020. He blew out his patellar tendon in 2021, tore his ACL in 2023. He's not the same guy. People think just because he was an All-Pro 5 years ago that he's still a stud. He's not. He's now an average tackle at best. Cut him, save $15M in cap space if there is something comparable. But don't tell me Conklin is going to be an All-Pro ever again, just like Chubb sadly, his best days are in the past and the injuries & age caught up to him.

Love Conklins passion and zeal for the game.. But as you also mention Chubb... is declining... It happens to the best...I would love to see Chubb grind it out one more year...But I'm sadly facing like everyone else the reality it may be over for the Chubb era in CLE... He will for me always symbolize what Football in Cleveland is... Tradition... LeRoy Kelly.. Bobby Mitchell.. Ernie Davis.. Mack and Byner.. Greg and Mike Pruitt..... Hoard and Metcalf.... That is some damn fine talent to witness in a lifetime thus far... And I didnt mention Jim Brown although him Mitchell and Davis were just before my time.... Cleveland has a great tradition of running Backs who have become legendary and a huge part of the Cleveland Lore....

ballpeen

@nickers said:

Love Conklins passion and zeal for the game.. But as you also mention Chubb... is declining... It happens to the best...I would love to see Chubb grind it out one more year...But I'm sadly facing like everyone else the reality it may be over for the Chubb era in CLE... He will for me always symbolize what Football in Cleveland is... Tradition... LeRoy Kelly.. Bobby Mitchell.. Ernie Davis.. Mack and Byner.. Greg and Mike Pruitt..... Hoard and Metcalf.... That is some damn fine talent to witness in a lifetime thus far... And I didnt mention Jim Brown although him Mitchell and Davis were just before my time.... Cleveland has a great tradition of running Backs who have become legendary and a huge part of the Cleveland Lore....

All teams have their own legendary players. That said I am glad that Nick is back in the fold. I always felt he needed at least 1 more season to see if he still has it. I still suspect the chances are good that age and injury have caught up, but I didn't want to find out he still had it while playing for some other team.

Work him in tandem with some new young blood back we draft and see what happens. I suspect if not, his contract is such that it won't be hard to see him go in 26.

Canton Dawg

Another O lineman added. . .

Flugel

@canton-dawg said:

Another O lineman added. . .

I really liked this guy coming out of Oklahoma State. Like Bitonio, he was a very good Tackle in college. He offers this team some good flexibility upfront. Very good signing in my opinion...

Orion

The Browns on Thursday signed G Teven Jenkins (unrestricted free agent).

Jenkins (6-6, 321) is entering his fifth NFL season out of Oklahoma State. Originally selected by Chicago in the second round of the 2021 draft, Jenkins has appeared in 45 career games with 38 starts at left tackle, left guard and right guard. Last season, he started 14 games at left guard for the Bears.

---------

...just adding to the previous two posts. - Keep those OLinemen commin'. We need to sort out some good ones.

ballpeen

I like it any time you can bring in a player who can, or at least push other players for starting time at multiple positions.

syd

@berniesuperbowl2 said:

Jack Conklin is a potential post-June 1 cut candidate like they did with Dalvin Tomlinson. It would free up almost $15M in cap space.

which is why I would like to see them bring back Wills on a one year deal and play him at RT

Flugel

@syd said:

which is why I would like to see them bring back Wills on a one year deal and play him at RT

Syd you have some good ideas but this ain't one of them. What's he going to give us at RT with the same unwillingness to break a sweat that he didn't already give us at LT? Bringing him back would be rewarding all that. If this guy offered anything - don't you think 1 of 32 teams would have already signed him? If we're going to do that we should just put a classified ad in the paper "Gypsy needed - for a team that wants to pretend to solve their issues at offensive tackle. We offer an attractive signing bonus inclusive of a camel and flip-flops." And we wonder why we're bad. Dawand Jones shows up to camp 2 years in a row weighing 400 lbs as our best hope at LT? This is another guy that showed up with all the talent in the world not quite interested enough to prioritize it all for a career that requires commitment, discipline and effort. I don't care if he went to Ohio State - so did Orlando Pace who prioritized his NFL career to the extent he's in the Hall of Fame.

There's some good RTs in this draft we can get at a salary restricted rookie contract in rounds 3-6. There's also some good LTs in this draft in rounds 1-3. I wouldn't wait until round 3 per say, but we draft at the top of it. All I ask is can our scouts research some freakin work ethics this time around?

While Lucas is a current band-aid, he's 33 years old. That said, he does have 54 starts and participated in 129 games blended from the following teams: Lions, Rams, Saints, Bears and Washington.

ballpeen

I don't know if Lucas is any good, but the age doesn't bother me. At some positions age matters, some not so much. OL is one of those positions where age is less of a factor. I see linemen playing at a good level up near 40 years old.

Again, i don't know if he works out or not, but if he does i see no reason why he can't play for another 3-4 years. In todays toss and turn NFL, 3-4 years is about as much as you can expect out of any player.

To illustrate the age factor, age takes away speed before it takes away strength. O line isn't a position where speed is a key component to playing the position. Those guys usually start slow, and stay slow.

Speed for receivers is over rated. If a receiver runs at 4.6, the guy covering him is also running at 4.6. He can still get open if he has a bit of juke to him and can still make sharp, flat cuts.

On the other hand, if a corner runs a 4.6 but the receiver he is covering runs a 4.4, then you have a problem, so speed for a DB is far more important for a corner than it is for a receiver.

Flugel

@ballpeen said:

I don't know if Lucas is any good, but the age doesn't bother me. At some positions age matters, some not so much. OL is one of those positions where age is less of a factor. I see linemen playing at a good level up near 40 years old.

Again, i don't know if he works out or not, but if he does i see no reason why he can't play for another 3-4 years. In todays toss and turn NFL, 3-4 years is about as much as you can expect out of any player.

To illustrate the age factor, age takes away speed before it takes away strength. O line isn't a position where speed is a key component to playing the position. Those guys usually start slow, and stay slow.

Speed for receivers is over rated. If a receiver runs at 4.6, the guy covering him is also running at 4.6. He can still get open if he has a bit of juke to him and can still make sharp, flat cuts.

On the other hand, if a corner runs a 4.6 but the receiver he is covering runs a 4.4, then you have a problem, so speed for a DB is far more important for a corner than it is for a receiver.

I don't mind Lucas, believe it or not. I think he's a decent short term idea because in spite of his age the volume of play doesn't look like it caused a lot of wear and tear while it's given him enough experience to benefit him and the team he plays for. What I don't want the Browns to do is fall into a habit they can just settle for anyone at offensive tackle. That limits where you can run and how long you give your passer to throw. If we're going to invest in a QB - getting him a good LT is an ideal way to protect him. Like NE showed us - they got a rock solid LT from Purdue in 2001 (Matt Light) in the 2nd round who started 11 years protecting Brady's blind side. This year will have some good LTs in round 2 as well.

ballpeen

@flugel said:

I don't mind Lucas, believe it or not. I think he's a decent short term idea because in spite of his age the volume of play doesn't look like it caused a lot of wear and tear while it's given him enough experience to benefit him and the team he plays for. What I don't want the Browns to do is fall into a habit they can just settle for anyone at offensive tackle. That limits where you can run and how long you give your passer to throw. If we're going to invest in a QB - getting him a good LT is an ideal way to protect him. Like NE showed us - they got a rock solid LT from Purdue in 2001 (Matt Light) in the 2nd round who started 11 years protecting Brady's blind side. This year will have some good LTs in round 2 as well.

I get it, though I have to admit I won't be very happy drafting a LT that high this year. I am normally good with trenches guys, but we have a severe shortage of guys who get the ball and score points. I think we need to get a few more guys like that on the roster

Orion

@ballpeen said:

we have a severe shortage of guys who get the ball and score points. I think we need to get a few more guys like that on the roster

Truth right there. QB, RB, TE, WR.

Perhaps hunter helps the WR situation. But maybe not as much as we need. People talk of Cedric Tillman being someone we can count on but he missed a lot of games last year. Of course the elephant in the room is who's gonna get the ball to these possible WR and/or TE upgrades that we draft. Obviously, not having a franchise QB shouldn't stop us from drafting talented skill position players....but it IS a bit of a paradox.