Weis... how much does his endorsement really mean?
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Diehard I have put out the statistics of DA's last 5 games and it means nothing to the pro quinn crowd. "cockpit" teams whose defensive rating suck, bail out catches by Kw and BE, Locking onto KW something BQ DID EXACTLy, are all used to criticize anything he did now suddenly none of those things are in play.
BQ has done NOTHING yet and the fans PERCEPTION is not fact. He led us to a loss... is it all his fault? NO but it would be if it was DA. ITs not his team permanently it is for the rest of the season and thats it until he proves what Fans THINK he may have. Nothing has been decided as much as the pro bq crowd thinks it is.
Diehard I have put out the statistics of DA's last 5 games and it means nothing to the pro quinn crowd.
Come on man. You didn't but up his stats for the last 5 games, you put up the cumulative total QBR for his last 5 games. Which is heavily skewed by the game against the G-men.
Right in this thread is his totals for his last 5 games, game by game, and it ain't pretty. The stats also don't show the should of been picks either.
Read JADBF's signature line. It explains why people believe DA should hit the bench and that people did not believe he was the only problem on the team.
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how many games have you been to Greythan? I was at the Buffalo game last year driving thru the storm and back again. Just because you like to attempt to frame any discussion on BQ by me as anti ND does not mean its true. I have been to almost EVERY home game for you to make that sort of unqualified conjecture just because I dont agree with most fans on one topic is juvenile and obviously incorrect.
I did put up his comp rating, qb rating, yds per throw, tds, int, yards per game etc. Again "his stats are skewed by the giants game" always trying to qualify anything positive by giving a example of the one game theory.
should have been picks, ok what about the should have been tds, or whatever hypothetical denigrating qualifying reason you can come up with. should have been, cockpit, circus catches, bad defenses, see a pattern.
Wait Brady played a terrible D... so its should not count right? What about the bail out catches and locking in only winslow? the low balls, high balls and the stats are only good because of the cockpit? What about the last drive where he threw incompletes when he had a chance to lead us down the field to win against a terrible D with more tools because we had STallworth and a running game..
What the same criticisms of DA dont hold for Brady? I am sorry Did we lose that game where everybody is all happy about Brady? I see his bad throws and locking in on a reciever is no problem in our "cockpit" his incompletes to kill the last drive and the other set in the redzone we could not score a td dont count because its BRADY but if it was DA..... O then his good stats would only be because of the the terrible D and he was bailed out by Kw yet he killed the last drives with his incompletes and he could not score in the redzone because his decision making is not good and he is not athletic enough or have the it factor or leadership... Wait it was Brady not Da yet we see or hear nothing.... Suddenly its the other team factors not the qb position. I know when I made these points I was blind because it was DA. I was justifying for Da and not holding him accountable.
I dont think it was Brady fault we lost however against a poor defense with more tools the comparison to how we lost two games back to back are clearly valid.
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how many games have you been to Greythan? I was at the Buffalo game last year driving thru the storm and back again. Just because you like to attempt to frame any discussion on BQ by me as anti ND does not mean its true. I have been to almost EVERY home game for you to make that sort of unqualified conjecture just because I dont agree with most fans on one topic is juvenile and obviously incorrect.
I did put up his comp rating, qb rating, yds per throw, tds, int, yards per game etc. Again "his stats are skewed by the giants game" always trying to qualify anything positive by giving a example of the one game theory.
should have been picks, ok what about the should have been tds, or whatever hypothetical denigrating qualifying reason you can come up with. should have been, cockpit, circus catches, bad defenses, see a pattern.
Wait Brady played a terrible D... so its should not count right? What about the bail out catches and locking in only winslow? the low balls, high balls and the stats are only good because of the cockpit? What about the last drive where he threw incompletes when he had a chance to lead us down the field to win against a terrible D with more tools because we had STallworth and a running game..
What the same criticisms of DA dont hold for Brady? I am sorry Did we lose that game where everybody is all happy about Brady? I see his bad throws and locking in on a reciever is no problem in our "cockpit" his incompletes to kill the last drive and the other set in the redzone we could not score a td dont count because its BRADY but if it was DA..... O then his good stats would only be because of the the terrible D and he was bailed out by Kw yet he killed the last drives with his incompletes and he could not score in the redzone because his decision making is not good and he is not athletic enough or have the it factor or leadership... Wait it was Brady not Da yet we see or hear nothing.... Suddenly its the other team factors not the qb position. I know when I made these points I was blind because it was DA. I was justifying for Da and not holding him accountable.
I dont think it was Brady fault we lost however against a poor defense with more tools the comparison to how we lost two games back to back are clearly valid.
how many games have you been to Greythan? I was at the Buffalo game last year driving thru the storm and back again. Just because you like to attempt to frame any discussion on BQ by me as anti ND does not mean its true. I have been to almost EVERY home game for you to make that sort of unqualified conjecture just because I dont agree with most fans on one topic is juvenile and obviously incorrect.
I did put up his comp rating, qb rating, yds per throw, tds, int, yards per game etc. Again "his stats are skewed by the giants game" always trying to qualify anything positive by giving a example of the one game theory.
should have been picks, ok what about the should have been tds, or whatever hypothetical denigrating qualifying reason you can come up with. should have been, cockpit, circus catches, bad defenses, see a pattern.
Wait Brady played a terrible D... so its should not count right? What about the bail out catches and locking in only winslow? the low balls, high balls and the stats are only good because of the cockpit? What about the last drive where he threw incompletes when he had a chance to lead us down the field to win against a terrible D with more tools because we had STallworth and a running game..
What the same criticisms of DA dont hold for Brady? I am sorry Did we lose that game where everybody is all happy about Brady? I see his bad throws and locking in on a reciever is no problem in our "cockpit" his incompletes to kill the last drive and the other set in the redzone we could not score a td dont count because its BRADY but if it was DA..... O then his good stats would only be because of the the terrible D and he was bailed out by Kw yet he killed the last drives with his incompletes and he could not score in the redzone because his decision making is not good and he is not athletic enough or have the it factor or leadership... Wait it was Brady not Da yet we see or hear nothing.... Suddenly its the other team factors not the qb position. I know when I made these points I was blind because it was DA. I was justifying for Da and not holding him accountable.
I dont think it was Brady fault we lost however against a poor defense with more tools the comparison to how we lost two games back to back are clearly valid.
Sev, it's not that your criticisms of BQ aren't valid ones, it just becomes obvious that throughout your body of posts, that you are a stats/individual thumper when discussing DA and a results/outcome thumper when it comes to BQ (he lost to Denver/LSU/OSU/USC - like he's the 1st to lose to any of those teams
).And regarding the final drive vs Denver (as if the entire performance before it ever resembled an effort that DA put together
There is a difference in hitting Winslow in the hands vs. hitting Suggs in the hands. -
Diehard I have put out the statistics of DA's last 5 games and it means nothing to the pro quinn crowd.
Come on man. You didn't but up his stats for the last 5 games, you put up the cumulative total QBR for his last 5 games. Which is heavily skewed by the game against the G-men.
Right in this thread is his totals for his last 5 games, game by game, and it ain't pretty. The stats also don't show the should of been picks either.
Read JADBF's signature line. It explains why people believe DA should hit the bench and that people did not believe he was the only problem on the team.
Masters said:
Come on man. You didn't but up his stats for the last 5 games, you put up the cumulative total QBR for his last 5 games. Which is heavily skewed by the game against the G-men.Good point Masterbater. We should throw out DA's game against the Giants. Sure he's the only QB to beat the Giants in their last 14 games, but who cares?
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Masters said:
Come on man. You didn't but up his stats for the last 5 games, you put up the cumulative total QBR for his last 5 games. Which is heavily skewed by the game against the G-men.Good point Masterbater. We should throw out DA's game against the Giants. Sure he's the only QB to beat the Giants in their last 14 games, but who cares?
Good point Masterbater. We should throw out DA's game against the Giants. Sure he's the only QB to beat the Giants in their last 14 games, but who cares?
Yep, throw it out. Yep, who cares. Throw out his lowest while you're at it. A guy usually isn't as good as his best game or as bad as his worst.
I love watching DA when he comes out on fire, as he did against the Gmen this year and the Bengals last year. Nobody expects it to be his norm, but he needs to have the ability to settle back down and at least be average. Or God forbid, above average.
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Sev, you just don't show an ounce of balance on the topic.
Find me the post where I annointed BQ as "the answer". What most posters have stated is that his play against Denver was promising. I agree.
What most posters have also said is that DA has to be accountable for his play and that his league low passer rating was not solely the fault of his supporting cast. (A point you somehow fail to acknowledge.)
Its pretty simple. DA lost his job due to poor performance. Had he played well in the eyes of his coaches, we still wouldn't be seeing Quinn on the field. You'd probably be seeing Quinn in another uniform if DA had truly built upon last year.
Lots of road to travel before we can say Quinn is or isn't the solution. But for you to start this thread was flat out juvenile. Give up, you fighting with shadows. I mean seriously. Reread the bullshit you posted to start this thread:
Currently 5-4 and looking at another losing season with a cream puff schedule. Jimmy Clausen well SUCKS...
Between RAC and Weis both beneficiaries of being in proximity to Belicheck but neither really are producing nothing on thier own. I remember all of the talk of being pro ready and Weis said this and that about BQ. How much water does that really hold?
We will se what BQ can do over the next few games if he can lead us to WIN as a team considering it was supposably the QB position holding us back.
So if we lose 80% of our next 7 games what then?
How can you expect to be taken seriously? The root of your argument is that DA was playing just fine and we should have stuck with him. The FO and coaching staff disagree along with most rational fans. What's worse is you post this after Quinn plays a pretty good game. Why don't you wait until he inevitably plays poorly? Then you can celebrate and post all the anti-Quin, anti-ND, anti-Weiss crap you want.
You're becoming a joke. Only surpassed by that moron from Oregon. That should scare you.
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Masters said:
Come on man. You didn't but up his stats for the last 5 games, you put up the cumulative total QBR for his last 5 games. Which is heavily skewed by the game against the G-men.Good point Masterbater. We should throw out DA's game against the Giants. Sure he's the only QB to beat the Giants in their last 14 games, but who cares?
Good point Masterbater. We should throw out DA's game against the Giants. Sure he's the only QB to beat the Giants in their last 14 games, but who cares?
No you don't. The point is that you have to look game by game. Not an average. If you're gonna use an average, you got to throw out the highest and the lowest so it isn't skewed. Though it still doesn't tell you how he really has done. Which wasn't good.
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Legacy I dont know what BQ will do, he has 7 more games and we as fans at this point need to see him. I just happen to think the criticisms of DA are a bit extreme due to perception and bias.
When I have chose to for quite some time to look at total team factors I was accused of giving DA a pass etc. The fact that BQ did some very similar things and yet no one is using the same criticisms reeks of selective hypocracy.
I dont think and anyone who says This is BQ's team permanently after one game and a loss against a crappy D that the QB position. Does he have a good chance? yes but he is going to have to prove it on the field with wins over the next 7 games.
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Legacy I dont know what BQ will do, he has 7 more games and we as fans at this point need to see him. I just happen to think the criticisms of DA are a bit extreme due to perception and bias.
When I have chose to for quite some time to look at total team factors I was accused of giving DA a pass etc. The fact that BQ did some very similar things and yet no one is using the same criticisms reeks of selective hypocracy.
I dont think and anyone who says This is BQ's team permanently after one game and a loss against a crappy D that the QB position. Does he have a good chance? yes but he is going to have to prove it on the field with wins over the next 7 games.
Legacy I dont know what BQ will do, he has 7 more games and we as fans at this point need to see him. I just happen to think the criticisms of DA are a bit extreme due to perception and bias.
When I have chose to for quite some time to look at total team factors I was accused of giving DA a pass etc. The fact that BQ did some very similar things and yet no one is using the same criticisms reeks of selective hypocracy.
I dont think and anyone who says This is BQ's team permanently after one game and a loss against a crappy D that the QB position. Does he have a good chance? yes but he is going to have to prove it on the field with wins over the next 7 games.
What did Quinn do similar to DA? The only similarity so far is that CLE lost the game.
Brady, not one pass that should have been picked or picked (no similarity).
No wasted TO, delay of games, guys lined up wrong, or confusion on the O (no similarity)
No panicing in the pocket (no similarity)
Led a go ahead scoring drive in the 4th QTR (no similarity)
Completed well over 50% of his passes (no similarity)
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First of all Greythan you dont know what the coaching staff or management think of why they changed to Quinn. Mortenson from ESPN probably has a whole hell of lot more inside information than you or any fans of the browns do. This was a change mandated from the ownership possibly nobody really knows so quit posting on the coaches opinions or thoughts like they are facts. YOU DONT KNOW.
Anything they said after the presser release especially RAC has been widely panned as pr. As for the post thread it amused me because of the all the backing of WHY quinn was supposed to be so good from Weis is now sort of damaged. RAC was also part of the title of the thread and both of these two people have had influence on us and fans perception of what is wrong.
Greythan denigrate me any way it makes you feel good. I dont care if you and especially you dont agree with my positions. I have a right to them regardless and its funny how you disappeared after your predictions for DA and the Giants game.
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Legacy I dont know what BQ will do, he has 7 more games and we as fans at this point need to see him. I just happen to think the criticisms of DA are a bit extreme due to perception and bias.
When I have chose to for quite some time to look at total team factors I was accused of giving DA a pass etc. The fact that BQ did some very similar things and yet no one is using the same criticisms reeks of selective hypocracy.
I dont think and anyone who says This is BQ's team permanently after one game and a loss against a crappy D that the QB position. Does he have a good chance? yes but he is going to have to prove it on the field with wins over the next 7 games.
Legacy I dont know what BQ will do, he has 7 more games and we as fans at this point need to see him. I just happen to think the criticisms of DA are a bit extreme due to perception and bias.
When I have chose to for quite some time to look at total team factors I was accused of giving DA a pass etc. The fact that BQ did some very similar things and yet no one is using the same criticisms reeks of selective hypocracy.
I dont think and anyone who says This is BQ's team permanently after one game and a loss against a crappy D that the QB position. Does he have a good chance? yes but he is going to have to prove it on the field with wins over the next 7 games.
I don't follow your logic of 'he has 7 more games'. He'll get way more than 7 games unless he comes out and looks like Charlie Frye vs. PIT week 1, 2007.
The FO has a decision to make on Anderson, and it's an easy one. If you want to keep him, then the contract gets renegotiated; otherwise you trade him (if possible) or cut him (if he can't be traded).
There are too many holes on this team to throw away that kind of money on a backup QB.
What 'same things' did Quinn do as Anderson? I didn't see him throw interceptions, fumble the ball, or generally make poor decisions. In fact, he was the Anti-Anderson in nearly every respect. Every QB has poor throws in a game; Anderson's problem is that he seems to have MANY more poor throws than average, makes TERRIBLE decisions, and absolutely folds under pressure.
If you can't see that, I don't know what to say.
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First of all Greythan you dont know what the coaching staff or management think of why they changed to Quinn. Mortenson from ESPN probably has a whole hell of lot more inside information than you or any fans of the browns do. This was a change mandated from the ownership possibly nobody really knows so quit posting on the coaches opinions or thoughts like they are facts. YOU DONT KNOW.
Anything they said after the presser release especially RAC has been widely panned as pr. As for the post thread it amused me because of the all the backing of WHY quinn was supposed to be so good from Weis is now sort of damaged. RAC was also part of the title of the thread and both of these two people have had influence on us and fans perception of what is wrong.
Greythan denigrate me any way it makes you feel good. I dont care if you and especially you dont agree with my positions. I have a right to them regardless and its funny how you disappeared after your predictions for DA and the Giants game.
First of all Greythan you dont know what the coaching staff or management think of why they changed to Quinn. Mortenson from ESPN probably has a whole hell of lot more inside information than you or any fans of the browns do. This was a change mandated from the ownership possibly nobody really knows so quit posting on the coaches opinions or thoughts like they are facts. YOU DONT KNOW.
Anything they said after the presser release especially RAC has been widely panned as pr. As for the post thread it amused me because of the all the backing of WHY quinn was supposed to be so good from Weis is now sort of damaged. RAC was also part of the title of the thread and both of these two people have had influence on us and fans perception of what is wrong.
Greythan denigrate me any way it makes you feel good. I dont care if you and especially you dont agree with my positions. I have a right to them regardless and its funny how you disappeared after your predictions for DA and the Giants game.
Why do you and other change Mortenson's words. He did not say it came from the owner ship or had any source saying that much. He speculated it was from ownership or listening to the fans.
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Legacy I dont know what BQ will do, he has 7 more games and we as fans at this point need to see him. I just happen to think the criticisms of DA are a bit extreme due to perception and bias.
When I have chose to for quite some time to look at total team factors I was accused of giving DA a pass etc. The fact that BQ did some very similar things and yet no one is using the same criticisms reeks of selective hypocracy.
I dont think and anyone who says This is BQ's team permanently after one game and a loss against a crappy D that the QB position. Does he have a good chance? yes but he is going to have to prove it on the field with wins over the next 7 games.
I don't follow your logic of 'he has 7 more games'. He'll get way more than 7 games unless he comes out and looks like Charlie Frye vs. PIT week 1, 2007.
The FO has a decision to make on Anderson, and it's an easy one. If you want to keep him, then the contract gets renegotiated; otherwise you trade him (if possible) or cut him (if he can't be traded).
There are too many holes on this team to throw away that kind of money on a backup QB.
What 'same things' did Quinn do as Anderson? I didn't see him throw interceptions, fumble the ball, or generally make poor decisions. In fact, he was the Anti-Anderson in nearly every respect. Every QB has poor throws in a game; Anderson's problem is that he seems to have MANY more poor throws than average, makes TERRIBLE decisions, and absolutely folds under pressure.
If you can't see that, I don't know what to say.
The FO has a decision to make on Anderson, and it's an easy one. If you want to keep him, then the contract gets renegotiated; otherwise you trade him (if possible) or cut him (if he can't be traded).
There are too many holes on this team to throw away that kind of money on a backup QB.
DA's contract isn't breaking the bank and he isn't gonna renegotiate his contract just so that he can make less than BQ. Not gonna happen. Sorry BQ fan.
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The FO has a decision to make on Anderson, and it's an easy one. If you want to keep him, then the contract gets renegotiated; otherwise you trade him (if possible) or cut him (if he can't be traded).
There are too many holes on this team to throw away that kind of money on a backup QB.
DA's contract isn't breaking the bank and he isn't gonna renegotiate his contract just so that he can make less than BQ. Not gonna happen. Sorry BQ fan.
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We need an ignore option, not only to ignore posters, but to be able to ignore their quotes as well.
I was ecstatic to see Lummy on my ignore list but people just keep quoting him, it almost defeats the purpose.
Point is, DA flopped, Romeo hasn't got a clue, and Lummy still sucks then swallows.
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BQ is not " THE ANSWER". The browns have several problems and BQ is a hopeful savior of one of them. One game into it, and so far, he's passed the test. Browns fans need to hope that he is "the guy" to bring consistancy to that position so the franchise can move on to other areas. Without question, enough time has been allowed to find out that DA is not dependable week in and week out....Keep your fingers crossed for BQ
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and its funny how you disappeared after your predictions for DA and the Giants game.
I was right here bubbleboy.
I posted several complimentary points about DA. He played a fantastic game that evening. Pretty impressive considering the Giants are the best team in football for my money.
However, I didn't waiver from my long running concern with DA and that's consistency. That's his ability to perform well when things aren't going perfect.
Its almost comical how you want to use the small sample size argument to attack Quinn's debut and yet turn around and reference an equally small sample with DA. Even more ironic considering the significant evidence of poor outings from DA that actually support the QB change.
There's no debating with you, however, since you'll never allow for being wrong. Even when faced with factual corrections ("DA's first start was week two last year"..... wrong), you can't muster the internal fortitude to own up.
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Page 5 and no post from me insight?
I gotta start getting busy weeding out all these BQ homo's.
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the best part of your cinci statement is what you initially referred to his start as the pitt game not the 2006 season and you even referred to the cinci game. Not until you actually looked at nfl.com did you search for his "official franchise starts" in 06 AFTER i had posted.
It really does not matter, you BQ boosters will continue to be hypocritical regardless of the realities. IF he does prove out after playing this year fine but the book is not closed by a mile as much as some of you think it is.
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the best part of your cinci statement is what you initially referred to his start as the pitt game not the 2006 season and you even referred to the cinci game. Not until you actually looked at nfl.com did you search for his "official franchise starts" in 06 AFTER i had posted.
I didn't correct you in that thread. Another poster did. (Inspecta? or Lemo? Not sure.)
Regardless, you never did say, "Yeah, good point. I guess comparing DA's Cincy game to Quinn's first start isn't really apples to apples." Something like that would have built your credibility. FYI.
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