Peter King on the Browns
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it blows my mind how fast things changed on this board. ive been saying the whole time that firing mangini after 1 season would be a mistake because we really dont know where he is taking us. this isnt like most coach hires where you have talent on a team but the last coach sucked so the new coach should come in and turn it right around. mangini had to clean up a lot bs within the team (rebuild) however now everyone seems to be on the i hope mangini isnt fired bus when a month ago everyone wanted that czar to come in and fire mangini. this isnt directed to any poster/s this is just something i see now. this isnt a smart ass post or anything even close to attitude i just want thoughts and opinions of people who supported mangini the whole time.
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I just don't know about any of these reporters when it comes to this regime. The Browns don't let much leak out anymore and the media fires back by spewing anything they can to discredit Mangini and the rest of the organization. The whole having a 'czar' control the organization seems like more media bs than reality. Holmgren wasn't a god in Seattle, if he was, they'd never let him go, no matter what amount of money he wanted. The fact that they are letting him check out other places tells me more than the media ever could.
I have many questions about this whole GM scenario:
1. If Mangini is starting to pull this ship to the surface, why would any of us (including Lerner) want someone coming in and doing another housecleaning? This seems to be the way the Media is portraying all candidates for the job.
2. If a new GM comes in, keeps the coach and staff and lets Mangini decide the roster, then what is the GM really doing? Player contracts? Scouting? I guess that's fine as long as Mangini still has final say. If not, we're looking at another Savage/Crennel situation. Who wants that?
3. Why is another body necessary? Just so we can say we have a GM? Holgrem, Shanahan, Parcells, they all ran the organization from top to bottom without a true GM. They had their scouting departments, their contract departments, their marketing, merchandizing, and whatever other departments were necessary to run the organization, but in order to get the team to be winners, they made the command roster decisions.
A good coach knows what type of players he needs to form a solid team. If he's wrong, he's the fall guy, if he's right, he's the savior. I hope Mangini is the latter, and he's shown that since the Kokinis firing, that he's putting a product on the field with his type of guys, and we're competing. I may stand alone on this but if bringing in a head guy to force players down the coaches throat sounds like a good idea to you, please root for Pittsburgh.
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I just don't know about any of these reporters when it comes to this regime. The Browns don't let much leak out anymore and the media fires back by spewing anything they can to discredit Mangini and the rest of the organization. The whole having a 'czar' control the organization seems like more media bs than reality. Holmgren wasn't a god in Seattle, if he was, they'd never let him go, no matter what amount of money he wanted. The fact that they are letting him check out other places tells me more than the media ever could.
I have many questions about this whole GM scenario:
1. If Mangini is starting to pull this ship to the surface, why would any of us (including Lerner) want someone coming in and doing another housecleaning? This seems to be the way the Media is portraying all candidates for the job.
Exactly, there will be no house cleaning. Randy won't hire anybody unless Mangini is okay with it. And he won't be okay with another house cleaning or losing his job!
2. If a new GM comes in, keeps the coach and staff and lets Mangini decide the roster, then what is the GM really doing? Player contracts? Scouting? I guess that's fine as long as Mangini still has final say. If not, we're looking at another Savage/Crennel situation. Who wants that?
They are probably trying to make sure they are ALL on the same page, wanting to go in the same direction. If that's the case, sharing roster decisions will not be a problem at all.
A good coach knows what type of players he needs to form a solid team. If he's wrong, he's the fall guy, if he's right, he's the savior. I hope Mangini is the latter, and he's shown that since the Kokinis firing, that he's putting a product on the field with his type of guys, and we're competing. I may stand alone on this but if bringing in a head guy to force players down the coaches throat sounds like a good idea to you, please root for Pittsburgh.
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Good points buddy! The reason I'm not too worried about a GM rocking the boat is because Mangini job is safe. Because I am so certain of that, I have to trust that any hire, Holmgren or otherwise, will first have to be approved by Mangini. And so, a solid working relationship must be in place before any hire.
Also, I believe he will be our next "czar". reason being, he's been here 3 days and as all of us know, there is not 3 days worth of things to do in this town so there is a reason. The reason is, he wants to see how the coaching staff runs their practices before making a decision. Today being the first practice of the week, we'll know Friday morning.
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it blows my mind how fast things changed on this board. ive been saying the whole time that firing mangini after 1 season would be a mistake because we really dont know where he is taking us. this isnt like most coach hires where you have talent on a team but the last coach sucked so the new coach should come in and turn it right around. mangini had to clean up a lot bs within the team (rebuild) however now everyone seems to be on the i hope mangini isnt fired bus when a month ago everyone wanted that czar to come in and fire mangini. this isnt directed to any poster/s this is just something i see now. this isnt a smart ass post or anything even close to attitude i just want thoughts and opinions of people who supported mangini the whole time.
it blows my mind how fast things changed on this board. ive been saying the whole time that firing mangini after 1 season would be a mistake because we really dont know where he is taking us. this isnt like most coach hires where you have talent on a team but the last coach sucked so the new coach should come in and turn it right around. mangini had to clean up a lot bs within the team (rebuild) however now everyone seems to be on the i hope mangini isnt fired bus when a month ago everyone wanted that czar to come in and fire mangini. this isnt directed to any poster/s this is just something i see now. this isnt a smart ass post or anything even close to attitude i just want thoughts and opinions of people who supported mangini the whole time.
That would be me homey, check my posts. No argument against Mangini has ever held any water. From the media, the fans, or player(s). The guy is building a franchise from the bottom up, this is what it looks like and he's far more patient and resolute than any of us could ever be. I'm saying let him do his job. GIVE HIM AT LEAST 3 YEARS!!!
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Go back to Day One and I've been a big Mangini suppporter..Even at the seasons beginning when I was getting ripped every day..I'm no smarter then anyone on this board trust me, but the one thing I did know that this was going to be a tough year..
Too many bad character guys on this team, too many over paid underachieving, undiscipline, with an over sense of privledge..WTF did anyone think had to be done..Did you not watch the team last year?
Parcells was 1 and 11 his first year in NE
the following year he was 3-7 before they strung 6 in a row,then played ironicly the Browns
Took Parcells a couple of years but Mangini gets 13 games..f**k that
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Go back to Day One and I've been a big Mangini suppporter..Even at the seasons beginning when I was getting ripped every day..I'm no smarter then anyone on this board trust me, but the one thing I did know that this was going to be a tough year..
Too many bad character guys on this team, too many over paid underachieving, undiscipline, with an over sense of privledge..WTF did anyone think had to be done..Did you not watch the team last year?
Parcells was 1 and 11 his first year in NE
the following year he was 3-7 before they strung 6 in a row,then played ironicly the Browns
Took Parcells a couple of years but Mangini gets 13 games..f**k that
Go back to Day One and I've been a big Mangini suppporter..Even at the seasons beginning when I was getting ripped every day..I'm no smarter then anyone on this board trust me, but the one thing I did know that this was going to be a tough year..
Too many bad character guys on this team, too many over paid underachieving, undiscipline, with an over sense of privledge..WTF did anyone think had to be done..Did you not watch the team last year?
Parcells was 1 and 11 his first year in NE
the following year he was 3-7 before they strung 6 in a row,then played ironicly the Browns
Took Parcells a couple of years but Mangini gets 13 games..f**k that
Honestly i thought mankok took way to long to deal with edwards they did it right with smith and winslow but this team still has to many non factor underachievers on both sides of the ball ,many of them "mangini guys" i would like to see mangini get a chance to right the ship ,but he needs to realize that he may need to adjust some things offensively and lose daboll in "the process"...i like the WCO holmgren would bring and many of the players we have would be suited to it as well..
We have been rebuilding since 1964, Why stop now? GO BROWNS! -
I have been a fan of Mangini; My brother is a Jets' season ticket holder so I am very familiar with him. He really won me over during last season's back-to-back wins against NE and Tennessee. I haven't been on board with some of the things he's done but I've always maintained that since he has the job he should be given a chance to do what he was brought here to do. It hasn't all worked out but I think that the team that we've seen since the bye has been very different than the team we saw before it.
I don't like to see coaches maligned due to an "agenda" or bad reporting. That would be true no matter who the coach is. Unfortunately for Eric Mangini, he is a very polarizing figure in the media. A veritable lightning rod for controversy. I suppose you could look at it from a perspective of the fact that he shields the players from the slings and arrows but I think that's a double-edged sword.
I don't see that my posts now are necessarily any different than earlier in the year. I think that I tend to be more patient on these things. Sometimes that's good because I know I won't give up too early but other times not....when I seem to have held on too long.
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I have been a fan of Mangini; My brother is a Jets' season ticket holder so I am very familiar with him. He really won me over during last season's back-to-back wins against NE and Tennessee. I haven't been on board with some of the things he's done but I've always maintained that since he has the job he should be given a chance to do what he was brought here to do. It hasn't all worked out but I think that the team that we've seen since the bye has been very different than the team we saw before it.
I don't like to see coaches maligned due to an "agenda" or bad reporting. That would be true no matter who the coach is. Unfortunately for Eric Mangini, he is a very polarizing figure in the media. A veritable lightning rod for controversy. I suppose you could look at it from a perspective of the fact that he shields the players from the slings and arrows but I think that's a double-edged sword.
I don't see that my posts now are necessarily any different than earlier in the year. I think that I tend to be more patient on these things. Sometimes that's good because I know I won't give up too early but other times not....when I seem to have held on too long.
He really won me over during last season's back-to-back wins against NE and Tennessee.
What are your thoughts RE: the Jets mailing it in the last few weeks - in the middle of a playoff drive - as reported by a number of media outlets in the 3-State area?
Within the NFL ranks, I believe Mangini might be regarded as the 'W' among coaches.
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He really won me over during last season's back-to-back wins against NE and Tennessee.
What are your thoughts RE: the Jets mailing it in the last few weeks - in the middle of a playoff drive - as reported by a number of media outlets in the 3-State area?
Within the NFL ranks, I believe Mangini might be regarded as the 'W' among coaches.
What are your thoughts RE: the Jets mailing it in the last few weeks - in the middle of a playoff drive - as reported by a number of media outlets in the 3-State area?
Within the NFL ranks, I believe Mangini might be regarded as the 'W' among coaches.
The "W"? (please clarify)
Re: the Jets this season. I think that anytime the owner tries to ram PSLs down peoples throats by canning a coach whose team was one game short of the playoffs and disciplined you run the risk of ruining everything in the name of being "fan friendly". Woody Johnson has gotten his wish: a player-friendly, fan-friendly coach who is a walking sound-bite. The problem is that when you underachieve in NY, no one is going to turn a blind eye. After all, this is the city that canned Joe Torre.
I've been to two Jet games with my brother this year and it's painfully obvious that this team lacks leadership. It lacks discipline. The coaching staff suffers from great hubris. I normally don't go out on limbs to characterize the coach's personality but with Rex there are few mysteries. In the first Miami game, he didn't use his timeouts because he "didn't think they were gonna score" on his defense. The guy has balls. I'll give him that. That said, so far, he's done a hell of a lot of talkin' and not so much walkin'(kind of reminds you of Buddy Ryan and the Eagles). Someone had posted ranks of the offense and defense on another post and in measurable ways, they were a better team with Mangini, a one-armed QB who didn't want to be there and less talent on the defensive side of the ball. For a team that was so close last year, they've clearly gone backward in my mind.
When your SF Carrie Rhodes is more interested in trolling for Pro Bowl votes while being benched...you've got issues. Kris Jenkins was horribly angry when they fired EM last year as was Cotchery and Thomas Jones. The guys that mattered then can't be that happy now.
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What are your thoughts RE: the Jets mailing it in the last few weeks - in the middle of a playoff drive - as reported by a number of media outlets in the 3-State area?
Within the NFL ranks, I believe Mangini might be regarded as the 'W' among coaches.
The "W"? (please clarify)
Re: the Jets this season. I think that anytime the owner tries to ram PSLs down peoples throats by canning a coach whose team was one game short of the playoffs and disciplined you run the risk of ruining everything in the name of being "fan friendly". Woody Johnson has gotten his wish: a player-friendly, fan-friendly coach who is a walking sound-bite. The problem is that when you underachieve in NY, no one is going to turn a blind eye. After all, this is the city that canned Joe Torre.
I've been to two Jet games with my brother this year and it's painfully obvious that this team lacks leadership. It lacks discipline. The coaching staff suffers from great hubris. I normally don't go out on limbs to characterize the coach's personality but with Rex there are few mysteries. In the first Miami game, he didn't use his timeouts because he "didn't think they were gonna score" on his defense. The guy has balls. I'll give him that. That said, so far, he's done a hell of a lot of talkin' and not so much walkin'(kind of reminds you of Buddy Ryan and the Eagles). Someone had posted ranks of the offense and defense on another post and in measurable ways, they were a better team with Mangini, a one-armed QB who didn't want to be there and less talent on the defensive side of the ball. For a team that was so close last year, they've clearly gone backward in my mind.
When your SF Carrie Rhodes is more interested in trolling for Pro Bowl votes while being benched...you've got issues. Kris Jenkins was horribly angry when they fired EM last year as was Cotchery and Thomas Jones. The guys that mattered then can't be that happy now.
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George W. Bush
Meaning an idiot? I think you'd be surprised...and I'm not guessing.
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George W. Bush
Meaning an idiot? I think you'd be surprised...and I'm not guessing.
Meaning an idiot? I think you'd be surprised...and I'm not guessing.
Actually, I might cross paths with Peter King over the holidays. His brother is a friend of ours and we are going to an 'Open House' there.
I might ask PK - off the record - what Mangini's reputation is around the league.
Not to belabor a point, Earl, but I doubt he is respected or liked.
Just my opinion and nothing to prove or not.
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Apparently Kokinis found Evan Moore
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Meaning an idiot? I think you'd be surprised...and I'm not guessing.
Actually, I might cross paths with Peter King over the holidays. His brother is a friend of ours and we are going to an 'Open House' there.
I might ask PK - off the record - what Mangini's reputation is around the league.
Not to belabor a point, Earl, but I doubt he is respected or liked.
Just my opinion and nothing to prove or not.
Actually, I might cross paths with Peter King over the holidays. His brother is a friend of ours and we are going to an 'Open House' there.
I might ask PK - off the record - what Mangini's reputation is around the league.
Not to belabor a point, Earl, but I doubt he is respected or liked.
Just my opinion and nothing to prove or not.
Mangini was well respected as an asst in New England, fact. Mangini (remember Mangenious?) was well respected in New York as a Head Coach, fact. Now that he is here in Cleveland, he is not respected or liked? By whom? Oh, the East Coast media and JoeSixPat and Patriots fans and Jets fans and Mike Florio at PFT, all of whom are tossing and turning like psychos at the thought of the possibility Mangini could be successful here. And I'm not even throwing Grossi and McManamon into the conversation as they are in the tank with the rest of this miserable lot. Sorry, JMO, but I could care less what anyone in the media including Peter King has to say about Mangini, and the possibility of Mangini making them all sick to their stomachs by making it happen here only will make it that much better.
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I think it's funny that the media is calling for Mangini's head but did any of the media expect this team to win more than 4 games? NO.
Not many people outside of the Browns fanbase have watched the games I'm willing to bet and they don't see this team fight every game for Mangini like we do.
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Dawgfanforever88 said:
Moore was signed to the practice squad on nov the 9th Kokinis was fired on the 2nd does not compute.Kokinis knew Evan Moore b4 from Baltimore scouting.
Shapiro wanted Sizemore long before he was able to get him.
compute now.
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I was also telling people on this board that we needed to be patient and give Mangini at least 3 years to prove his worth. However, I have always maintained that hiring the coach before the GM was a bad idea and that Mangini has made his fair share of mistakes this season. And that's OK as long as thy learn from their mistakes and improve. But Mangini came really close to making too many mistakes IMO - and so many could have been easily avoided.
Much like the expressed views in this post, I am really uncomfortable with this Czar thing and the canidates asking for total control and authority. We all know that this doesn't work in the real world and it could result in another costly rebuilding exercise. If I were Lerner, I am looking for someone willing to be a leader, and also a part of the team, with Lerner and Mangini. Yes, I expect him to be and act like he's running the show. But he needs to be on board with the misson statement that Mangini was hired to develop and implement. If he is, there would be no reason fof Mangini to feel threatened and the three of them could work together to make their vision happen.
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Dawgfanforever88 said:
Moore was signed to the practice squad on nov the 9th Kokinis was fired on the 2nd does not compute.Kokinis knew Evan Moore b4 from Baltimore scouting.
Shapiro wanted Sizemore long before he was able to get him.
compute now.
Kokinis knew Evan Moore b4 from Baltimore scouting.
Shapiro wanted Sizemore long before he was able to get him.
compute now.
Lol does not mean he was there to sign him which he wasnt....your shapiro analogy holds no water because he wasnt fired before he signed sizemore. still not computing
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I just don't know about any of these reporters when it comes to this regime. The Browns don't let much leak out anymore and the media fires back by spewing anything they can to discredit Mangini and the rest of the organization. The whole having a 'czar' control the organization seems like more media bs than reality. Holmgren wasn't a god in Seattle, if he was, they'd never let him go, no matter what amount of money he wanted. The fact that they are letting him check out other places tells me more than the media ever could.
I have many questions about this whole GM scenario:
1. If Mangini is starting to pull this ship to the surface, why would any of us (including Lerner) want someone coming in and doing another housecleaning? This seems to be the way the Media is portraying all candidates for the job.
2. If a new GM comes in, keeps the coach and staff and lets Mangini decide the roster, then what is the GM really doing? Player contracts? Scouting? I guess that's fine as long as Mangini still has final say. If not, we're looking at another Savage/Crennel situation. Who wants that?
3. Why is another body necessary? Just so we can say we have a GM? Holgrem, Shanahan, Parcells, they all ran the organization from top to bottom without a true GM. They had their scouting departments, their contract departments, their marketing, merchandizing, and whatever other departments were necessary to run the organization, but in order to get the team to be winners, they made the command roster decisions.
A good coach knows what type of players he needs to form a solid team. If he's wrong, he's the fall guy, if he's right, he's the savior. I hope Mangini is the latter, and he's shown that since the Kokinis firing, that he's putting a product on the field with his type of guys, and we're competing. I may stand alone on this but if bringing in a head guy to force players down the coaches throat sounds like a good idea to you, please root for Pittsburgh.
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I have many questions about this whole GM scenario:
...
3. Why is another body necessary? Just so we can say we have a GM? Holgrem, Shanahan, Parcells, they all ran the organization from top to bottom without a true GM. They had their scouting departments, their contract departments, their marketing, merchandizing, and whatever other departments were necessary to run the organization, but in order to get the team to be winners, they made the command roster decisions.
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My feeling is that the franchise needs a voice so the head coach doesn't feel so much like he's out on a limb with the media and fans sawing the limb off behind him. I also think that Randy Lerner really WANTS success with the Browns but hasn't been able to find the formula. My guess is he's bringing in someone knowledgeable about the NFL and football to help set things right. Whether Homgren takes the job or not, he should be able to give Lerner some feedback on the state of the franchise. I don't think Lerner understands the game well enough to decide things like, "Is the OC competent or should we find someone else?" He needs someone other than the head coach to help him sift through these issues. I also think the team needs a GM to manage personnel acquisitions, contracts, salary cap, etc. so the coach can concentrate on coaching. This franchise is in a state that requires more than just a head coach to address all the problems.
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I think it's funny that the media is calling for Mangini's head but did any of the media expect this team to win more than 4 games? NO.
Not many people outside of the Browns fanbase have watched the games I'm willing to bet and they don't see this team fight every game for Mangini like we do.
I think it's funny that the media is calling for Mangini's head but did any of the media expect this team to win more than 4 games? NO.
Not many people outside of the Browns fanbase have watched the games I'm willing to bet and they don't see this team fight every game for Mangini like we do.
Funny how Todd Haley, Schwarz, Raheem Morris, Spagnuolo and Tom Cable get passes.
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