Rock n roll HOF
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The guys against Abba getting in probably don't know where Sweden is.
The guys who do want them to get in, like it in the 2 hole. Congrats on liking ABBA.
p.s. I've been to Stockholm and ABBA sucks balls.
ROCK AND ROLL!!!!!!!!!!
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The guys who do want them to get in, like it in the 2 hole. Congrats on liking ABBA.
p.s. I've been to Stockholm and ABBA sucks balls.
ROCK AND ROLL!!!!!!!!!!
Rock encompasses a wide range of music.
The Bee Gees as an example wouldn't be what I call a rock band, but they are in and I don't think many would argue with their inclusion even if they didn't like the Bee Gees.
While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. -
The guys who do want them to get in, like it in the 2 hole. Congrats on liking ABBA.
p.s. I've been to Stockholm and ABBA sucks balls.
ROCK AND ROLL!!!!!!!!!!
Rock encompasses a wide range of music.
The Bee Gees as an example wouldn't be what I call a rock band, but they are in and I don't think many would argue with their inclusion even if they didn't like the Bee Gees.
While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
Funny...don't you remember ABBA's Fernando? Weird Al Yankovic could do an "Albert Belle" version.....I was running down to 2nd base, I smashed your face, Fernando (Vina).....
Also, I have both The Carpenters & Metallica on my MP3 player, FYI. You are profiling me, lol.
I take on the RRHOF is simply it is waaaaay too subjective, and cannot possibly please anybody. I have never visited the place, because my favorite, Black Sabbath, was snubbed for far too long. If it was up to me, the first class of inductees would have been the Beatles, Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, The Who, Elvis, CSNY, & Pink Floyd. I never attended any party or event where people say "can you put on some Joni Mitchell or Billy Joel?"
We all have different tastes in music, so having a RRHOF doesn't make sense.
Karlis Missed -
I just read a book "the history of R and R by Robert Palmer, the NYT rock critic (dunno if it's the old pop singer) and wasn't very taken by it.
It was well written enough but bored me.
The entire hook was tracing the "rock n roll" back through the African to Negro spiritual though blues through soul.
Spnt most of the time on Howlin' Wolf and James Brown Stax Motown etc.
Though I realize that was one of the roots of R and R it doesn't interest me a lot.
Even though the Beatles and Stones recorrded some R and B standards I'm way more in touch with where they went from there.
Procol Harum was king of blues based BUT it was the classical influence I liked.
So to a purist only hard bop is jazz.
Matter of fact there are factions that say if you play 5 notes the same twice in a tune it isn't jazz anymore.
Same with rock and roll.
Just different flavors.
I'm as big a music snob as anybody BUT when I step back I have to admit that if someone is listening to {insert some band you hate} and is moved by that music then it is just as valid as anything {insert band you love} ever recorded.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
I beg to disagree. Here is the evidence:
Curly was one partying MF! He died way to young from it.
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The guys who do want them to get in, like it in the 2 hole. Congrats on liking ABBA.
p.s. I've been to Stockholm and ABBA sucks balls.
ROCK AND ROLL!!!!!!!!!!
Rock encompasses a wide range of music.
The Bee Gees as an example wouldn't be what I call a rock band, but they are in and I don't think many would argue with their inclusion even if they didn't like the Bee Gees.
While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
Rock encompasses a wide range of music.
The Bee Gees as an example wouldn't be what I call a rock band, but they are in and I don't think many would argue with their inclusion even if they didn't like the Bee Gees.
While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
I am a huge Carol King and Metallica fan. The Bee Gees wrote some pretty kick ass music. But in NO way should Carol King or Bee Gee's or f*cking Madonna (don't get me started on this chick) be in the Rock N' Roll Hall of fame. That is the first failure of the Rock Hall, they never defined Rock n' Roll. And as I can see they will eventually run out of ROCK bands to put in, well, rock bands that have a record company backing and marketing. The Hall inevitably defined success incorrectly. Abba sold a boat load of albums and that is the Rock Hall's definition of success. Not the fact that they ROCK. For that matter they should of created a Pop Hall of Fame in San Francisco.
Luck is Tim Couch. Big, Dumb Goofy, slow thinking QB - Ghoolie, 2-28-12 -
I just read a book "the history of R and R by Robert Palmer, the NYT rock critic (dunno if it's the old pop singer) and wasn't very taken by it.
It was well written enough but bored me.
The entire hook was tracing the "rock n roll" back through the African to Negro spiritual though blues through soul.
Spnt most of the time on Howlin' Wolf and James Brown Stax Motown etc.
Though I realize that was one of the roots of R and R it doesn't interest me a lot.
Even though the Beatles and Stones recorrded some R and B standards I'm way more in touch with where they went from there.
Procol Harum was king of blues based BUT it was the classical influence I liked.
So to a purist only hard bop is jazz.
Matter of fact there are factions that say if you play 5 notes the same twice in a tune it isn't jazz anymore.
Same with rock and roll.
Just different flavors.
I'm as big a music snob as anybody BUT when I step back I have to admit that if someone is listening to {insert some band you hate} and is moved by that music then it is just as valid as anything {insert band you love} ever recorded.
WSS
I'm as big a music snob as anybody BUT when I step back I have to admit that if someone is listening to {insert some band you hate} and is moved by that music then it is just as valid as anything {insert band you love} ever recorded.
I agree Steve but it's not Rock in my opinion. I think why many people are upset on letting Abba, Madonna and RUN DMC (f*ck that, that is 100% wrong) in the Hall because for the first 15 years or so, they inductees were based on soul or rock. They defined rock and the Hall by the bands they inducted in the first 20 years or so. THEY DID IT. Then they start running out of bands who sold 50 million records and need to save face. It's phony. Just wait, in 10 years you will see Back Street Boys and Celine Dion get in, just watch. Which are NO different then bullshit Madonna puts out. All sold 30 million of one album. They got money and need more publicity, put them into the Rock Hall. You think Abba just sold another million records, upon getting inducted, YES! What a sham.
I think of anyone Steve you would respect this view point.
Luck is Tim Couch. Big, Dumb Goofy, slow thinking QB - Ghoolie, 2-28-12 -
I'm as big a music snob as anybody BUT when I step back I have to admit that if someone is listening to {insert some band you hate} and is moved by that music then it is just as valid as anything {insert band you love} ever recorded.
I agree Steve but it's not Rock in my opinion. I think why many people are upset on letting Abba, Madonna and RUN DMC (f*ck that, that is 100% wrong) in the Hall because for the first 15 years or so, they inductees were based on soul or rock. They defined rock and the Hall by the bands they inducted in the first 20 years or so. THEY DID IT. Then they start running out of bands who sold 50 million records and need to save face. It's phony. Just wait, in 10 years you will see Back Street Boys and Celine Dion get in, just watch. Which are NO different then bullshit Madonna puts out. All sold 30 million of one album. They got money and need more publicity, put them into the Rock Hall. You think Abba just sold another million records, upon getting inducted, YES! What a sham.
I think of anyone Steve you would respect this view point.
I agree Steve but it's not Rock in my opinion. I think why many people are upset on letting Abba, Madonna and RUN DMC (f*ck that, that is 100% wrong) in the Hall because for the first 15 years or so, they inductees were based on soul or rock. They defined rock and the Hall by the bands they inducted in the first 20 years or so. THEY DID IT. Then they start running out of bands who sold 50 million records and need to save face. It's phony. Just wait, in 10 years you will see Back Street Boys and Celine Dion get in, just watch. Which are NO different then bullshit Madonna puts out. All sold 30 million of one album. They got money and need more publicity, put them into the Rock Hall. You think Abba just sold another million records, upon getting inducted, YES! What a sham.
I think of anyone Steve you would respect this view point.
What is Rock and Roll then?
Only Bill Haley?
Only Chuck Berry?
Annette Funicello?
Bobby Sherman?
I don't think you can define most bands out.
I'd say it's basically music young people like.
There may be an element of rebellion.
But rebellion against the foilkies led to beach pop that led to the hippies led to disco led to grunge.
List me five you consider seminal Rock and Roll.
WSS
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I agree Steve but it's not Rock in my opinion. I think why many people are upset on letting Abba, Madonna and RUN DMC (f*ck that, that is 100% wrong) in the Hall because for the first 15 years or so, they inductees were based on soul or rock. They defined rock and the Hall by the bands they inducted in the first 20 years or so. THEY DID IT. Then they start running out of bands who sold 50 million records and need to save face. It's phony. Just wait, in 10 years you will see Back Street Boys and Celine Dion get in, just watch. Which are NO different then bullshit Madonna puts out. All sold 30 million of one album. They got money and need more publicity, put them into the Rock Hall. You think Abba just sold another million records, upon getting inducted, YES! What a sham.
I think of anyone Steve you would respect this view point.
What is Rock and Roll then?
Only Bill Haley?
Only Chuck Berry?
Annette Funicello?
Bobby Sherman?
I don't think you can define most bands out.
I'd say it's basically music young people like.
There may be an element of rebellion.
But rebellion against the foilkies led to beach pop that led to the hippies led to disco led to grunge.
List me five you consider seminal Rock and Roll.
WSS
What is Rock and Roll then?
Only Bill Haley?
Only Chuck Berry?
Annette Funicello?
Bobby Sherman?
I don't think you can define most bands out.
I'd say it's basically music young people like.
There may be an element of rebellion.
But rebellion against the foilkies led to beach pop that led to the hippies led to disco led to grunge.
List me five you consider seminal Rock and Roll.
WSS
Disco to Grunge? You left out 20 years of shitty hair bands, cheesy key-tars and piano ties Steve.
Not sure what you mean seminal, sorry out of work, brain not functioning correctly.
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Ah, here is the rub. Two bands that I probably wouldn't give the time of day to, and you want them into the RRHOF. Everyone has their favorite genre that perhaps they feel is overlooked.
Well, metal/hard rock is a pretty big genre and these two are a couple of the main originators besides Sabbath. They will definitely be in eventually.
Also, they have the numbers to back it up as far as record sales, huge tours etc.
I prefer to call it the Eclectic Conglomerate of Cultural Music Hall of Fame. Some of this stuff is not even close to rock and roll.
Well, metal/hard rock is a pretty big genre and these two are a couple of the main originators besides Sabbath. They will definitely be in eventually.
Also, they have the numbers to back it up as far as record sales, huge tours etc.
I prefer to call it the Eclectic Conglomerate of Cultural Music Hall of Fame. Some of this stuff is not even close to rock and roll.
Well, Metal also has Metallica in there, plus I don't know if you consider Van Halen "metal". I always have sorta. And don't forget Hendrix and Led Zeppelin. Lots of people think of them as "metal".
I would say that "Progressive" Rock is as big a genre, and far less represented. Only Pink Floyd and now Genesis are now is as far as I know. No Jethro Tull, Procul Harum, Yes, King Crimson, Roxy Music, etc. are in.
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Maybe this isn't the right forum for this topic, but here goes anyway:
Here is this year's class of Inductees into the Rock n' Roll Hall of Fame:
ABBA
Genesis
The Hollies
The Stooges
Jimmy Cliff
Issues/Questions:
A. If a pop superstar group like ABBA is to be inducted, why not a pop superstar like Neil Diamond and Barbara Streisand?
B. Genesis is like the first progressive rock band to make it. An overlooked genre.
C. The Hollies were in with the British Invasion.
D. Jimmy Cliff was a reggae pioneer. Except for he and Bob Marley, what other reggae acts are in or are considered?
E. The Stooges were a pioneer of the punk genre.
Groups NOT inducted:
Perhaps the biggest surprise is that the Red Hot Chili Peppers weren't inducted. I suspect they will be soon. Also overlooked:
Jethro Tull
Journey
Joe Cocker
Alice Cooper
Deep Purple
Dire Straits
Donovan
The Doobie Brothers
Electric Light Orchestra
Emerson, Lake, and Palmer
Grand Funk Railroad
Hall and Oates
Heart
Janet Jackson
King Crimson
The Monkees
The Moody Blues
Ted Nugent
Rush
Tina Turner (though she is in as part of Ike and Tina)
Yes
Roxy Music
Todd Rundgren
various metal groups like Iron Maiden and Judas Priest
Kool and the Gang
and feel free to name anyone I left out.
Until Free or Bad Company is inducted, getting Paul Rodgers in....the voice of RR is going to be excluded.
Paul Rodgers is the best rock singer ever.
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It's not the Rock N' Roll hall of fame anymore. I am embarrassed of it. F*cking ABBA. Whatever.
It's not the Rock N' Roll hall of fame anymore. I am embarrassed of it. F*cking ABBA. Whatever.
It is sorta head scratching. ABBA in, but no Kiss or Alice Cooper?
Dancing Queen in? Rock n' Roll All Night out?
Take a Chance on me in? But I'm Eighteen, and School's Out out?
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The guys who do want them to get in, like it in the 2 hole. Congrats on liking ABBA.
p.s. I've been to Stockholm and ABBA sucks balls.
ROCK AND ROLL!!!!!!!!!!
Rock encompasses a wide range of music.
The Bee Gees as an example wouldn't be what I call a rock band, but they are in and I don't think many would argue with their inclusion even if they didn't like the Bee Gees.
While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
Rock encompasses a wide range of music.
The Bee Gees as an example wouldn't be what I call a rock band, but they are in and I don't think many would argue with their inclusion even if they didn't like the Bee Gees.
While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
Sure, you make a point, but what about these guys as well:
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While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
Funny...don't you remember ABBA's Fernando? Weird Al Yankovic could do an "Albert Belle" version.....I was running down to 2nd base, I smashed your face, Fernando (Vina).....
Also, I have both The Carpenters & Metallica on my MP3 player, FYI. You are profiling me, lol.
I take on the RRHOF is simply it is waaaaay too subjective, and cannot possibly please anybody. I have never visited the place, because my favorite, Black Sabbath, was snubbed for far too long. If it was up to me, the first class of inductees would have been the Beatles, Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, The Who, Elvis, CSNY, & Pink Floyd. I never attended any party or event where people say "can you put on some Joni Mitchell or Billy Joel?"
We all have different tastes in music, so having a RRHOF doesn't make sense.
Funny...don't you remember ABBA's Fernando? Weird Al Yankovic could do an "Albert Belle" version.....I was running down to 2nd base, I smashed your face, Fernando (Vina).....
Also, I have both The Carpenters & Metallica on my MP3 player, FYI. You are profiling me, lol.
I take on the RRHOF is simply it is waaaaay too subjective, and cannot possibly please anybody. I have never visited the place, because my favorite, Black Sabbath, was snubbed for far too long. If it was up to me, the first class of inductees would have been the Beatles, Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, The Who, Elvis, CSNY, & Pink Floyd. I never attended any party or event where people say "can you put on some Joni Mitchell or Billy Joel?"
We all have different tastes in music, so having a RRHOF doesn't make sense.
Uh, none of those guys were eligible in the "first class" because you had to have had a record out 25 years before you were eligible, and it had not been 25 years yet for those guys. But that first class did have Elvis, Chuck Berry, Buddy Holly, James Brown, Ray Charles, Little Richard, Sam Cooke, the Everly Brothers and a few others. You got a problem with that group? The others got in pretty much when they were eligible, except perhaps for BS.
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I'm as big a music snob as anybody BUT when I step back I have to admit that if someone is listening to {insert some band you hate} and is moved by that music then it is just as valid as anything {insert band you love} ever recorded.
I agree Steve but it's not Rock in my opinion. I think why many people are upset on letting Abba, Madonna and RUN DMC (f*ck that, that is 100% wrong) in the Hall because for the first 15 years or so, they inductees were based on soul or rock. They defined rock and the Hall by the bands they inducted in the first 20 years or so. THEY DID IT. Then they start running out of bands who sold 50 million records and need to save face. It's phony. Just wait, in 10 years you will see Back Street Boys and Celine Dion get in, just watch. Which are NO different then bullshit Madonna puts out. All sold 30 million of one album. They got money and need more publicity, put them into the Rock Hall. You think Abba just sold another million records, upon getting inducted, YES! What a sham.
I think of anyone Steve you would respect this view point.
I agree Steve but it's not Rock in my opinion. I think why many people are upset on letting Abba, Madonna and RUN DMC (f*ck that, that is 100% wrong) in the Hall because for the first 15 years or so, they inductees were based on soul or rock. They defined rock and the Hall by the bands they inducted in the first 20 years or so. THEY DID IT. Then they start running out of bands who sold 50 million records and need to save face. It's phony. Just wait, in 10 years you will see Back Street Boys and Celine Dion get in, just watch. Which are NO different then bullshit Madonna puts out. All sold 30 million of one album. They got money and need more publicity, put them into the Rock Hall. You think Abba just sold another million records, upon getting inducted, YES! What a sham.
I think of anyone Steve you would respect this view point.
Well, Kosar, this is where you are getting it wrong. It is NOT the Rock Hall of Fame, it is the Rock n' Roll Hall of Fame....and to a lot of people there is a difference. "Rock" to me infers a "heavier" type of music, at least in the way a lot of people use the term, where "Rock n Roll" is a far more inclusive type of music which encompasses even pop music pretty much. I mean, Pat Boone and Ricky Nelson styled themselve Rock n Rollers, but probably would not be thought of as Rock performers. Thus "Rock" may not be a wide enough genre to include ABBA and Madonna, but "Rock N' Roll" is.
And I just don't get this antipathy toward Madonna.In fact, I think you are dead wrong in your classification of her. She, in essence was the prototypical Rock n Roll artist in the same vein Elvis was. First off, she is an outstanding vocalist and song writer, she pushed the social/sexual envelope to the point of rebellion, just as all the original rock n rollers did in their day, and she is an incredible performer.
I dunno, does she somehow threaten your masculinity? If so, I think that is exactly what she was going for.
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Funny...don't you remember ABBA's Fernando? Weird Al Yankovic could do an "Albert Belle" version.....I was running down to 2nd base, I smashed your face, Fernando (Vina).....
Also, I have both The Carpenters & Metallica on my MP3 player, FYI. You are profiling me, lol.
I take on the RRHOF is simply it is waaaaay too subjective, and cannot possibly please anybody. I have never visited the place, because my favorite, Black Sabbath, was snubbed for far too long. If it was up to me, the first class of inductees would have been the Beatles, Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, The Who, Elvis, CSNY, & Pink Floyd. I never attended any party or event where people say "can you put on some Joni Mitchell or Billy Joel?"
We all have different tastes in music, so having a RRHOF doesn't make sense.
Uh, none of those guys were eligible in the "first class" because you had to have had a record out 25 years before you were eligible, and it had not been 25 years yet for those guys. But that first class did have Elvis, Chuck Berry, Buddy Holly, James Brown, Ray Charles, Little Richard, Sam Cooke, the Everly Brothers and a few others. You got a problem with that group? The others got in pretty much when they were eligible, except perhaps for BS.
Uh, none of those guys were eligible in the "first class" because you had to have had a record out 25 years before you were eligible, and it had not been 25 years yet for those guys. But that first class did have Elvis, Chuck Berry, Buddy Holly, James Brown, Ray Charles, Little Richard, Sam Cooke, the Everly Brothers and a few others. You got a problem with that group? The others got in pretty much when they were eligible, except perhaps for BS.
No, I don't have a problem with that group. It looks I have a problem with the 25 year thing, because, IMHO, those groups I mentioned (and some I didn't) should have been a "slam dunk" without a 25 year wait. I guess a different analogy could be that if the Football HOF was founded tomorrow, Paul Brown, Jim Brown, YA Title, etc. would be "automatics," no vote even needed/considered.
That's all...like many of us seem to agree on, it's a personal-taste thing. I don't care for Madonna or The Sex Pistols, yet I think they were inducted before Black Sabbath.....absolutely wrong.
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Uh, none of those guys were eligible in the "first class" because you had to have had a record out 25 years before you were eligible, and it had not been 25 years yet for those guys. But that first class did have Elvis, Chuck Berry, Buddy Holly, James Brown, Ray Charles, Little Richard, Sam Cooke, the Everly Brothers and a few others. You got a problem with that group? The others got in pretty much when they were eligible, except perhaps for BS.
No, I don't have a problem with that group. It looks I have a problem with the 25 year thing, because, IMHO, those groups I mentioned (and some I didn't) should have been a "slam dunk" without a 25 year wait. I guess a different analogy could be that if the Football HOF was founded tomorrow, Paul Brown, Jim Brown, YA Title, etc. would be "automatics," no vote even needed/considered.
That's all...like many of us seem to agree on, it's a personal-taste thing. I don't care for Madonna or The Sex Pistols, yet I think they were inducted before Black Sabbath.....absolutely wrong.
No, I don't have a problem with that group. It looks I have a problem with the 25 year thing, because, IMHO, those groups I mentioned (and some I didn't) should have been a "slam dunk" without a 25 year wait. I guess a different analogy could be that if the Football HOF was founded tomorrow, Paul Brown, Jim Brown, YA Title, etc. would be "automatics," no vote even needed/considered.
That's all...like many of us seem to agree on, it's a personal-taste thing. I don't care for Madonna or The Sex Pistols, yet I think they were inducted before Black Sabbath.....absolutely wrong.
Even when the Football HOF was founded, there was a 5 year wait requirement for players, and coaches had to be retired. I don't have a problem with the "wait" requirement overall. In fact Paul Browns DID have to wait to be inducted!
(And I might believe that not even to this date should Black Sabbath belong in the HOF. I don't believe, but I might if it were based solely on my personal tastes, so it is silly to proclaim something "absolutely wrong" because of personal preference)
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No, I don't have a problem with that group. It looks I have a problem with the 25 year thing, because, IMHO, those groups I mentioned (and some I didn't) should have been a "slam dunk" without a 25 year wait. I guess a different analogy could be that if the Football HOF was founded tomorrow, Paul Brown, Jim Brown, YA Title, etc. would be "automatics," no vote even needed/considered.
That's all...like many of us seem to agree on, it's a personal-taste thing. I don't care for Madonna or The Sex Pistols, yet I think they were inducted before Black Sabbath.....absolutely wrong.
Even when the Football HOF was founded, there was a 5 year wait requirement for players, and coaches had to be retired. I don't have a problem with the "wait" requirement overall. In fact Paul Browns DID have to wait to be inducted!
(And I might believe that not even to this date should Black Sabbath belong in the HOF. I don't believe, but I might if it were based solely on my personal tastes, so it is silly to proclaim something "absolutely wrong" because of personal preference)
Even when the Football HOF was founded, there was a 5 year wait requirement for players, and coaches had to be retired. I don't have a problem with the "wait" requirement overall. In fact Paul Browns DID have to wait to be inducted!
(And I might believe that not even to this date should Black Sabbath belong in the HOF. I don't believe, but I might if it were based solely on my personal tastes, so it is silly to proclaim something "absolutely wrong" because of personal preference
)Ok, it's point-counter point time
War Pigs > Material Girl
Paranoid > Papa Don't Preach
Sweet Leaf > Lucky Star
NIB > La Isla Bonita
We Sold Our Souls for Rock n Roll > Immaculate Collection
Ozzy studio voice > Madonna studio voice
Ozzy live voice > Madonna live voice
Black Sabbath innovative in rock, British Invasion > Popular hit maker of the 80s & 90s, like Hall & Oates (started in 70s, I know)
Yeah, it's my personal preference of course, but I could certainly go on forever. We will only agree to disagree.
Karlis Missed -
Rock encompasses a wide range of music.
The Bee Gees as an example wouldn't be what I call a rock band, but they are in and I don't think many would argue with their inclusion even if they didn't like the Bee Gees.
While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
I am a huge Carol King and Metallica fan. The Bee Gees wrote some pretty kick ass music. But in NO way should Carol King or Bee Gee's or f*cking Madonna (don't get me started on this chick) be in the Rock N' Roll Hall of fame. That is the first failure of the Rock Hall, they never defined Rock n' Roll. And as I can see they will eventually run out of ROCK bands to put in, well, rock bands that have a record company backing and marketing. The Hall inevitably defined success incorrectly. Abba sold a boat load of albums and that is the Rock Hall's definition of success. Not the fact that they ROCK. For that matter they should of created a Pop Hall of Fame in San Francisco.
I am a huge Carol King and Metallica fan. The Bee Gees wrote some pretty kick ass music. But in NO way should Carol King or Bee Gee's or f*cking Madonna (don't get me started on this chick) be in the Rock N' Roll Hall of fame. That is the first failure of the Rock Hall, they never defined Rock n' Roll. And as I can see they will eventually run out of ROCK bands to put in, well, rock bands that have a record company backing and marketing. The Hall inevitably defined success incorrectly. Abba sold a boat load of albums and that is the Rock Hall's definition of success. Not the fact that they ROCK. For that matter they should of created a Pop Hall of Fame in San Francisco.
Carole King definitely deserves to be in, and it's not because of her track record as a performer. She was part of the tin pan alley song writing factory in the early 60s ala Leiber and Stoller, Neil Diamond, Phil Spector, etc. She wrote a lot of hit songs. Having had a top selling album in Tapestry was just icing on the cake. Bee Gees were blue eyed soul before they made Disco so popular. They had some great stuff in the late 60s/early 70s.
regarding all the boo-hooing over ABBA getting in....I think ABBA is the least of our worries regarding the HOF. They put freakin' Run DMC, Madonna, and Grand Master Flash in, and they're trying to put in LL Cool J. Jan Wenner needs to go. Lynch mob is an order I think.
One name hardly mentioned is T.Rex. They should be in. They are so influential to their contemporaries and other bands after them. David Bowie stole Marc Bolan's shock rock tactics. They were a HUGE band in Britain back in the day, and had a few big hit records in America as well. I think they'll get in eventually, but I'm growing tired of waiting.
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Rock encompasses a wide range of music.
The Bee Gees as an example wouldn't be what I call a rock band, but they are in and I don't think many would argue with their inclusion even if they didn't like the Bee Gees.
While ABBA is clearly at the opposite end of the Rock spectrum from say, Nine Inch Nails, their music was widely popular and I don't have any beef with their inclusion even though I never bought any of their records and "Dancing Queen" is about the only song I can remember by title.
Remember, rock covers a wide range. If you are stuck on the opposite end of that range, I do understand why one would question the inclusion.
I am sure people who dig the Carpenters don't have much use for Meticallica. It doesn't make them correct either.
I am a huge Carol King and Metallica fan. The Bee Gees wrote some pretty kick ass music. But in NO way should Carol King or Bee Gee's or f*cking Madonna (don't get me started on this chick) be in the Rock N' Roll Hall of fame. That is the first failure of the Rock Hall, they never defined Rock n' Roll. And as I can see they will eventually run out of ROCK bands to put in, well, rock bands that have a record company backing and marketing. The Hall inevitably defined success incorrectly. Abba sold a boat load of albums and that is the Rock Hall's definition of success. Not the fact that they ROCK. For that matter they should of created a Pop Hall of Fame in San Francisco.
That is the first failure of the Rock Hall, they never defined Rock n' Roll.
You can't define rock...it is a blend of many types of music.
Johnny Cash in if the RR hall, but most think of him as a country music star, but in the early days, he went a little more country, Elvis went a little more pop, and it is what it is......Bill Haley was a country singer who hit it as a rock star. Conway Twitty was a rock crooner hit made it in country.
There is no definition.
OK....it sounds like you like the heavier end of the music..but Ozzie is no more important to the sound than is Ricky Nelson.
Ricky Nelson did a lot for RR.
Do you know what it was???
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