Grossi's Annual Ranking of Roster
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DA belongs at #1.
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Of course he is, so is 93% of the NFL players that sit the bench.
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lewis should be @ the bottomm. we improved remarkably without him.
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DA belongs at #1.
DA belongs at #1.
I think his ranking is correct. Afterall it mirrors where his teams are usually ranked offensively in the NFL: 32nd
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DA belongs at #1.
I think his ranking is correct. Afterall it mirrors where his teams are usually ranked offensively in the NFL: 32nd
I think his ranking is correct. Afterall it mirrors where his teams are usually ranked offensively in the NFL: 32nd
Mahahahaha!
Good point and i agree with grossi's opinion that DA doesnt look comfortable in the mangini offense..he really doesnt ,and even though BQ was adjusting to this setup he didnt look very comfortable in it either..im thinking QB in the draft hopefully not a 1st rounder but a 2nd or 3rd rounder to push BQ over the hump or out of the picture..DA is a goner...
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Agreed. It is what it is now. No pointing fingers. I do like the Shaun Rogers thing about him being to fast. I wonder if he was a DE if that would help his cause. Im just looking forward to Free Agency and the Draft, even though it is a 3 day process this year.
Agreed. It is what it is now. No pointing fingers. I do like the Shaun Rogers thing about him being to fast. I wonder if he was a DE if that would help his cause. Im just looking forward to Free Agency and the Draft, even though it is a 3 day process this year.
Believe it or not, there was a game early in the season where Rogers lined up as the RDE and either Robaire Smith or Rubin played Nose Tackle when that happened. I LOVED seeing that because it worked well.
This rarely gets mentioned but Ryan used some variations of his dad's 46 D at times. It's nice to know now that Savage is gone - we finally have the right players to be able to use such a D.
Take a look at the following promising new faces added our LBer corps just this year (inspite of Savage only leaving us with 4 draft picks to our name):
Marcus Benard
Justin Trusnik
Matt Roth
Kaluka Maiva
David Bowens
Eric Barton
David Veikune
The LBer corps is no longer a cavity or weakness folks. Seems to me, Eric Mangini was better at FINDING 3-4 personnel than Savage was. When he added HIS guys - we actaully won 4 in a row and I stopped hearing how much our defense needed Jackson OR Rogers for that matter. In fact, it was NICE for Shaun Rogers to see that Mangini's system CAN/DOES work when players fully buy into it. I'm not saying he didn't - I just had the impression he was sort of on the fence about it and whether he wanted to stay here any longer. Now, he sees alot of excited young players and momentum building and I can't imagine him wanting out. That's a good thing.
- Tom F.
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I liked seeing Cribbs and Thomas at #1, 2. Rogers was a beast, but when he went out, Rubin stepped up HUGE.
Other guys I Liked seeing roughly where they were: Harrison, Roth (I banged his drum from the day Cleveland acquired him), Moore, Furrey, and Mass (I bet some put these last two much higher). Furrey is a bad TE, decent DB. Mass is a so-so WR at best. Good athlete, no hands.
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I liked seeing Cribbs and Thomas at #1, 2. Rogers was a beast, but when he went out, Rubin stepped up HUGE.
Other guys I Liked seeing roughly where they were: Harrison, Roth (I banged his drum from the day Cleveland acquired him), Moore, Furrey, and Mass (I bet some put these last two much higher). Furrey is a bad TE, decent DB. Mass is a so-so WR at best. Good athlete, no hands.
I liked seeing Cribbs and Thomas at #1, 2. Rogers was a beast, but when he went out, Rubin stepped up HUGE.
Other guys I Liked seeing roughly where they were: Harrison, Roth (I banged his drum from the day Cleveland acquired him), Moore, Furrey, and Mass (I bet some put these last two much higher). Furrey is a bad TE, decent DB. Mass is a so-so WR at best. Good athlete, no hands.
I think MoMass is more of a #2 WR at this level because GA had a freshman named Green that became their go-to guy in MoMass' final season there even though they had an equivalent # of receptions, yards and TDs. We're talking about a Freshman equalling him as he got more reps so you get the idea MoMass isn't gonna be seen as a #1 WR at the NFL level. Good point about Furrey not being a good receiver but a decent asset to our secondary.
- Tom F.
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I think his ranking is correct. Afterall it mirrors where his teams are usually ranked offensively in the NFL: 32nd
Mahahahaha!
Good point and i agree with grossi's opinion that DA doesnt look comfortable in the mangini offense..he really doesnt ,and even though BQ was adjusting to this setup he didnt look very comfortable in it either..im thinking QB in the draft hopefully not a 1st rounder but a 2nd or 3rd rounder to push BQ over the hump or out of the picture..DA is a goner...
Mahahahaha!
Good point and i agree with grossi's opinion that DA doesnt look comfortable in the mangini offense..he really doesnt ,and even though BQ was adjusting to this setup he didnt look very comfortable in it either..im thinking QB in the draft hopefully not a 1st rounder but a 2nd or 3rd rounder to push BQ over the hump or out of the picture..DA is a goner...
Hmm... interesting thought. I don't know that better competition will help BQ get over the hump, but it's an interesting thought that needs to be explored.
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1. What has BQ done so well to rank himself much higher than DA by 6 positions ?
2. What has JL done to rank himself higher than DA and BQ ? Atleast BQ and DA did not go against their coach.
3. Why is Furrey ranked lower than both our "give it to the RB" QB's ? His impact on the safety is higher than the impact of our QB's on the game.
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Jamal Lewis is the only player on that list that made be wonder what the hell grossi was thinking about. Everything else seemed pretty fair
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Jamal Lewis is the only player on that list that made be wonder what the hell grossi was thinking about. Everything else seemed pretty fair
Jamal Lewis is the only player on that list that made be wonder what the hell grossi was thinking about. Everything else seemed pretty fair
he was thinking about his anti-Mangini agenda and giving Jamal a salute imo.
he throws digs at Mangini at every opportunity ie: Kokinis signed Royal, not Mangini.
i've been beating Mike Adams' drum for years...retaining him WAS actually a FA move by EM, and one of the first things Mangini did here>>>signing him to a long extention...but Grossi gives no nod there.
i like that he notices things i do though, such as Rogers making lanes as the o-line shouts the bullfighter's "Olay!". the old version of this board tried to chastise me for making reference to this, and for suggesting he might be able to disrupt better from DE. but no...he could never play there (!). lmfao.
i agree with most of his rankings and captions though.
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I liked seeing Cribbs and Thomas at #1, 2. Rogers was a beast, but when he went out, Rubin stepped up HUGE.
Other guys I Liked seeing roughly where they were: Harrison, Roth (I banged his drum from the day Cleveland acquired him), Moore, Furrey, and Mass (I bet some put these last two much higher). Furrey is a bad TE, decent DB. Mass is a so-so WR at best. Good athlete, no hands.
I liked seeing Cribbs and Thomas at #1, 2. Rogers was a beast, but when he went out, Rubin stepped up HUGE.
Other guys I Liked seeing roughly where they were: Harrison, Roth (I banged his drum from the day Cleveland acquired him), Moore, Furrey, and Mass (I bet some put these last two much higher). Furrey is a bad TE, decent DB. Mass is a so-so WR at best. Good athlete, no hands.
i think you meant WR instead of TE re: Furrey...but i have to disagree about Mo's hands>>>he caught every ball i saw thrown near him. to me he's a typical promising WR who is a rookie in the NFL.
my only gripe, and it's a BIG gripe, is his inability to defend against interception. errant throws happen and QB's sometimes give players opportunities to make a play, and when they do WRs have a great opportunity even if they can't catch the ball to prevent the INT. this is Mo's weakest aspect of his game for certain...maybe he should spend a little time on ST to toughen him up. haha his blocking on running plays is awesome for a rookie but on passing plays his body positioning needs work and he's not physical enough when going for the ball.
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I liked seeing Cribbs and Thomas at #1, 2. Rogers was a beast, but when he went out, Rubin stepped up HUGE.
Other guys I Liked seeing roughly where they were: Harrison, Roth (I banged his drum from the day Cleveland acquired him), Moore, Furrey, and Mass (I bet some put these last two much higher). Furrey is a bad TE, decent DB. Mass is a so-so WR at best. Good athlete, no hands.
i think you meant WR instead of TE re: Furrey...but i have to disagree about Mo's hands>>>he caught every ball i saw thrown near him. to me he's a typical promising WR who is a rookie in the NFL.
my only gripe, and it's a BIG gripe, is his inability to defend against interception. errant throws happen and QB's sometimes give players opportunities to make a play, and when they do WRs have a great opportunity even if they can't catch the ball to prevent the INT. this is Mo's weakest aspect of his game for certain...maybe he should spend a little time on ST to toughen him up. haha his blocking on running plays is awesome for a rookie but on passing plays his body positioning needs work and he's not physical enough when going for the ball.
i think you meant WR instead of TE re: Furrey...but i have to disagree about Mo's hands>>>he caught every ball i saw thrown near him. to me he's a typical promising WR who is a rookie in the NFL.
my only gripe, and it's a BIG gripe, is his inability to defend against interception. errant throws happen and QB's sometimes give players opportunities to make a play, and when they do WRs have a great opportunity even if they can't catch the ball to prevent the INT. this is Mo's weakest aspect of his game for certain...maybe he should spend a little time on ST to toughen him up. haha his blocking on running plays is awesome for a rookie but on passing plays his body positioning needs work and he's not physical enough when going for the ball.
Mo will be elite in a year or two. He reminds me of a younger Reggie Wayne.
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I think his ranking is correct. Afterall it mirrors where his teams are usually ranked offensively in the NFL: 32nd
Mahahahaha!
Good point and i agree with grossi's opinion that DA doesnt look comfortable in the mangini offense..he really doesnt ,and even though BQ was adjusting to this setup he didnt look very comfortable in it either..im thinking QB in the draft hopefully not a 1st rounder but a 2nd or 3rd rounder to push BQ over the hump or out of the picture..DA is a goner...
Mahahahaha!
Good point and i agree with grossi's opinion that DA doesnt look comfortable in the mangini offense..he really doesnt ,and even though BQ was adjusting to this setup he didnt look very comfortable in it either..im thinking QB in the draft hopefully not a 1st rounder but a 2nd or 3rd rounder to push BQ over the hump or out of the picture..DA is a goner...
i thought BQ looked pretty comfortable in the system, just not too comfortable when it came to accuracy. he seemed to run the offense pretty well, with far fewer penalties, and making the correct reads and play changes. he just had trouble actually completing passes.
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1. KR-PR-WR Josh Cribbs: Spiritual leader, dynamic force, team's most popular player, and one of league's best pure footballers.
2. LT Joe Thomas: A stalwart tackle who's 3-for-3 in Pro Bowl selections.
3. NT Shaun Rogers: Limited to 11 games; the revelation of his absence was that his quickness creates -- rather than closes -- running lanes.
4. LB Kamerion Wimbley: Quiet, improving as an overall linebacker, and indestructible.
5. LB David Bowens: A true pro and warrior who might have had the finest of his 11 NFL seasons.
6. DE Robaire Smith: Deserved league comeback player-of-year consideration.
7. FB Lawrence Vickers: Just an awesome force in the run and return games.
8. RB Jerome Harrison: A remarkable three-game finish elevates his status in 2010.
9. LB Matt Roth: Crammed in a lot of plays in six games; a keeper.
10. LG Eric Steinbach: Rose to Mangini's challenge and re-established himself as a top-notch lineman no matter his weight.
11. C Alex Mack: Eventful rookie year ended on good note; could be a fixture for years.
12. PK Phil Dawson: Calf injury cost him five games; was 5-of-7 from 40 yards and more.
13. P Dave Zastudil: Was having Pro Bowl-like year through eight games until knee injury.
14. LS Ryan Pontbriand: Still one of league's most dependable long snappers.
15. FS Brodney Pool: Was leading team with four INTs before concussion in 11th game.
16. CB Eric Wright: Showed definite improvement in coverage and tackling.
17. S-CB Mike Adams: Valuable DB and special teamer who is underrated by most.
18. TE Evan Moore: Displayed best hands on team in five-game stint; re-sign him now.
19. RB Jamal Lewis: Hit the 30-year-old wall hard; concussion symptoms ended his career.
20. NT Ahtyba Rubin: Might prove to be one of Phil Savage's best value draft picks.
21. DE Kenyon Coleman: Solid pro, but had better years with the Jets.
22. LB Jason Trusnik: Solid special teamer proved he can contribute on defense.
23. DL C.J. Mosley: Made some plays in 12 games before ankle injury.
24. WR Mohamed Massaquoi: A mostly up-and-some down year; two 100-yard receiving games and an 18.5-yard average.
25. OL Floyd Womack: Was the best right tackle on the team.
26. QB Brady Quinn: Did a lot of things well, but accuracy has to improve for him to turn the corner.
27. DE Corey Williams: Truly belongs in a four-man line.
28. S Abram Elam: Looked in camp like he'd be a much bigger force.
29. OL Hank Fraley: Defied odds of staying on and then contributed more than anyone expected as a backup lineman and personal tutor to Mack.
30. LB Eric Barton: Finished seventh in tackles despite missing eight games with neck injury.
31. LB Marcus Benard: Had 3 1/2 sacks in six games, including two in win over Steelers.
32. QB Derek Anderson: Never looked comfortable in the Mangini system; needs fresh start.
33. WR-S Mike Furrey: One of NFL's rare two-way players, he actually looked better at safety.
34. LB Kaluka Maiava: Surprise contributor on defense in his first year.
35. LB Blake Costanzo: Leading tackler on special teams; they don't call him "Psycho" for nothing.
36. WR Chansi Stuckey: Nineteen catches in 11 games; 17 came in four games.
37. RB Chris Jennings: TD run in win over Pittsburgh was team's first by a back.
38. DL Brian Schaefering: Another breakout performer in the Pittsburgh game.
39. OG Rex Hadnot: Didn't have a great year, perhaps due to camp knee injury.
40. TE Michael Gaines: Looked like the best tight end, until Moore came along.
41. S Nick Sorensen: Second-leading tackler on special teams.
42. WR Brian Robiskie: When he played, he looked OK. Why he didn't play remains a mystery.
43. TE Robert Royal: Mangini's first free agent signee had 11 catches and almost as many drops.
44. CB Brandon McDonald: Should be reinvented as a nickel back covering slot receivers.
45. S Ray Ventrone: Solid special teams core player.
46. S Hank Poteat: That P.I. on the Hail Mary in Detroit? I mean, wow.
47. LT John St. Clair: You can't hide a player at right tackle.
47. LB Alex Hall: Fell off the map; might simply be too stiff and tall to play OLB.
48. CB Gerard Lawson: Failed to make some headway in his second season.
49. P Reggie Hodges: As replacement punters go, at least he didn't whiff any.
The following players either were on injured reserve for longer than nine games or did not see enough playing time to be ranked. They are listed alphabetically:
NR: WR Jake Allen: Appeared in one game after claimed from Green Bay.
NR: LB Titus Brown: Spent 15 weeks on practice squad.
NR: RB James Davis: Training camp phenom whose rookie season was wasted by "opportunity period" injury.
NR: TE Greg Estandia: Four catches in seven games after claimed from Jacksonville.
NR: CB Coye Francies: Sixth-round pick who was inactive for 10 games.
NR: LB Arnold Harrison: Ex-Steeler, not to be confused with James Harrison.
NR: TE Steve Heiden: Felt personal pressure to rush himself back after off-season knee surgery; might retire.
NR: LB D'Qwell Jackson: Averaged almost 10 tackles over six games until injury robbed him of needed experience in Mangini defense.
NR: QB Brett Ratliff: No. 3 passer who assisted in the Gatorade dunking of Mangini.
NR: DL Derreck Robinson: Appeared in two games after Dec. 7 signing.
NR: CB Ramzee Robinson: Appeared in three games after being claimed from Eagles.
NR: OT Ryan Tucker: Probably has played his last down but hasn't filed retirement papers.
NR: LB David Veikune: Second-round pick tried to learn two positions and wound up learning neither well enough to play.
NR: OL Billy Yates: Active for six games after Sept. 16 signing.
1. KR-PR-WR Josh Cribbs: Spiritual leader, dynamic force, team's most popular player, and one of league's best pure footballers.
2. LT Joe Thomas: A stalwart tackle who's 3-for-3 in Pro Bowl selections.
3. NT Shaun Rogers: Limited to 11 games; the revelation of his absence was that his quickness creates -- rather than closes -- running lanes.
4. LB Kamerion Wimbley: Quiet, improving as an overall linebacker, and indestructible.
5. LB David Bowens: A true pro and warrior who might have had the finest of his 11 NFL seasons.
6. DE Robaire Smith: Deserved league comeback player-of-year consideration.
7. FB Lawrence Vickers: Just an awesome force in the run and return games.
8. RB Jerome Harrison: A remarkable three-game finish elevates his status in 2010.
9. LB Matt Roth: Crammed in a lot of plays in six games; a keeper.
10. LG Eric Steinbach: Rose to Mangini's challenge and re-established himself as a top-notch lineman no matter his weight.
11. C Alex Mack: Eventful rookie year ended on good note; could be a fixture for years.
12. PK Phil Dawson: Calf injury cost him five games; was 5-of-7 from 40 yards and more.
13. P Dave Zastudil: Was having Pro Bowl-like year through eight games until knee injury.
14. LS Ryan Pontbriand: Still one of league's most dependable long snappers.
15. FS Brodney Pool: Was leading team with four INTs before concussion in 11th game.
16. CB Eric Wright: Showed definite improvement in coverage and tackling.
17. S-CB Mike Adams: Valuable DB and special teamer who is underrated by most.
18. TE Evan Moore: Displayed best hands on team in five-game stint; re-sign him now.
19. RB Jamal Lewis: Hit the 30-year-old wall hard; concussion symptoms ended his career.
20. NT Ahtyba Rubin: Might prove to be one of Phil Savage's best value draft picks.
21. DE Kenyon Coleman: Solid pro, but had better years with the Jets.
22. LB Jason Trusnik: Solid special teamer proved he can contribute on defense.
23. DL C.J. Mosley: Made some plays in 12 games before ankle injury.
24. WR Mohamed Massaquoi: A mostly up-and-some down year; two 100-yard receiving games and an 18.5-yard average.
25. OL Floyd Womack: Was the best right tackle on the team.
26. QB Brady Quinn: Did a lot of things well, but accuracy has to improve for him to turn the corner.
27. DE Corey Williams: Truly belongs in a four-man line.
28. S Abram Elam: Looked in camp like he'd be a much bigger force.
29. OL Hank Fraley: Defied odds of staying on and then contributed more than anyone expected as a backup lineman and personal tutor to Mack.
30. LB Eric Barton: Finished seventh in tackles despite missing eight games with neck injury.
31. LB Marcus Benard: Had 3 1/2 sacks in six games, including two in win over Steelers.
32. QB Derek Anderson: Never looked comfortable in the Mangini system; needs fresh start.
33. WR-S Mike Furrey: One of NFL's rare two-way players, he actually looked better at safety.
34. LB Kaluka Maiava: Surprise contributor on defense in his first year.
35. LB Blake Costanzo: Leading tackler on special teams; they don't call him "Psycho" for nothing.
36. WR Chansi Stuckey: Nineteen catches in 11 games; 17 came in four games.
37. RB Chris Jennings: TD run in win over Pittsburgh was team's first by a back.
38. DL Brian Schaefering: Another breakout performer in the Pittsburgh game.
39. OG Rex Hadnot: Didn't have a great year, perhaps due to camp knee injury.
40. TE Michael Gaines: Looked like the best tight end, until Moore came along.
41. S Nick Sorensen: Second-leading tackler on special teams.
42. WR Brian Robiskie: When he played, he looked OK. Why he didn't play remains a mystery.
43. TE Robert Royal: Mangini's first free agent signee had 11 catches and almost as many drops.
44. CB Brandon McDonald: Should be reinvented as a nickel back covering slot receivers.
45. S Ray Ventrone: Solid special teams core player.
46. S Hank Poteat: That P.I. on the Hail Mary in Detroit? I mean, wow.
47. LT John St. Clair: You can't hide a player at right tackle.
47. LB Alex Hall: Fell off the map; might simply be too stiff and tall to play OLB.
48. CB Gerard Lawson: Failed to make some headway in his second season.
49. P Reggie Hodges: As replacement punters go, at least he didn't whiff any.
I think the list is great; and it's tough to get a consensus on every guy. I don't think there's much to tweak. And I think his assessments are real good.
His comment about Hodges was the only real head scratcher when we factor in what a pleasant surprise the guy was. Did anyone notice how many times his punts pinned our final 4 opponents inside their own 10-15 yard line? Field position was HUGE to those victories and Hodges was doing it at a fraction of Zastudil's salary. I thought he gave the Browns a good bang for the buck considering he didn't have a job at the time of Zastudil's injury.
I would put David Bowens at #4 because his versatility to play inside or out at a very high level was so clutch. Not only that, BUT he actually upgraded the ILBer position in terms of WHERE tackles were being made most consisetntly WITHOUT Rogers keeping blockers off him like others before him had the priviledge of. More specifically, better performance with tougher ergonomics. Best 1st step instinct I've seen from all the guys we tried at ILBer.
- Tom F.
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i think you meant WR instead of TE re: Furrey...but i have to disagree about Mo's hands>>>he caught every ball i saw thrown near him. to me he's a typical promising WR who is a rookie in the NFL.
my only gripe, and it's a BIG gripe, is his inability to defend against interception. errant throws happen and QB's sometimes give players opportunities to make a play, and when they do WRs have a great opportunity even if they can't catch the ball to prevent the INT. this is Mo's weakest aspect of his game for certain...maybe he should spend a little time on ST to toughen him up. haha his blocking on running plays is awesome for a rookie but on passing plays his body positioning needs work and he's not physical enough when going for the ball.
Mo will be elite in a year or two. He reminds me of a younger Reggie Wayne.
Mo will be elite in a year or two. He reminds me of a younger Reggie Wayne.
only if he improves the weaknesses i spoke of, can't be wide open every pass. but if you think he can do it then why not.
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MoMass has poor to bad hands. And he doesn't know how to adjust to a throw either.
Despite not being in the top 20 for targets IN THE AFC, he was top 16 for drops IN THE NFL.
Seriously, guys? He will never be elite, but he might be a good WR2.
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