Best Browns #1 draft pick ever
-
Here is a list of the players selected by the Browns in the First Round of the Draft in their history:
)
1950 13 Ken Carpenter WR/RB Oregon State
1951 14 Kenny Konz DB Louisiana State
1952 10 Bert Rechichar DB/RB/K/LB/P Tennessee [1]
12 Harry Agganis QB Boston [2]
1953 11 Doug Atkins † DL/E Tennessee
1954 1 Bobby Garrett * QB Stanford [3]
12 John Bauer OL Illinois
1955 13 Kurt Burris CB/LB Oklahoma
1956 13 Preston Carpenter E/RB/TE Arkansas
1957 6 Jim Brown † FB Syracuse
1958 13 Jim Shofner DB Texas Christian
1959 11 Rich Kreitling WR/E Illinois
1960 8 Jim Houston DL/LB Ohio State
1961 10 Bobby Crespino WR/E/TE Mississippi [4]
1962 4 Gary Collins WR/P Maryland [5]
11 Leroy Jackson RB Western Illinois [6]
1963 9 Tom Hutchinson E/WR Kentucky
1964 11 Paul Warfield † WR/E Ohio State
1965 — — No Pick — — [7]
1966 14 Milt Morin TE Massachusetts
1967 18 Bob Matheson DL/LB Duke
1968 21 Marv Upshaw DL/K Trinity (Texas)
1969 20 Ron Johnson RB Michigan
1970 3 Mike Phipps QB Purdue [8]
21 Bob McKay OT Texas
1971 14 Clarence Scott DB Kansas
1972 18 Thom Darden DB Michigan
1973 16 Steve Holden WR Arizona State [9]
22 Pete Adams OG USC
1974 — — No Pick — — [10]
1975 5 Mack Mitchell DL Houston
1976 7 Mike Pruitt FB/RB Purdue
1977 17 Robert Jackson LB Texas A&M
1978 12 Clay Matthews LB USC
23 Ozzie Newsome † TE Alabama [11]
1979 20 Willis Adams WR Houston [12]
1980 27 Charles White RB USC [13]
1981 22 Hanford Dixon CB Southern Miss
1982 3 Chip Banks LB/WR USC
1983 — — No Pick — — [14]
1984 18 Don Rogers S UCLA
1985 — — No Pick — — [15]
1986 — — No Pick — — [16]
1987 5 Mike Junkin LB Duke [17]
1988 21 Clifford Charlton LB Florida
1989 13 Eric Metcalf RB/WR Texas [18]
1990 — — No Pick — — [19]
1991 2 Eric Turner DB UCLA
1992 9 Tommy Vardell FB/RB Stanford
1993 14 Steve Everitt C Michigan [20]
1994 9 Antonio Langham CB Alabama
29 Derrick Alexander WR Michigan [21]
1995 30 Craig Powell LB Ohio State [22]
1996 Suspended operations from 1996-1998
1997
1998
1999 1 Tim Couch * QB Kentucky
2000 1 Courtney Brown * DE Penn State
2001 3 Gerard Warren DT Florida
2002 16 William Green RB Boston College [23]
2003 21 Jeff Faine C Notre Dame
2004 6 Kellen Winslow II TE Miami (Florida) [24]
2005 3 Braylon Edwards WR Michigan
2006 13 Kamerion Wimbley LB Florida State [25]
2007 3 Joe Thomas OT Wisconsin [26]
22 Brady Quinn QB Notre Dame [27]
2008 — — No Pick — — [27]
2009 21 — Alex Mack C California [28]
2010 7 — Joe Haden CB Florida
The following players also have to be placed into this mix as first round picks were traded for them:
1962 Ernie Davis RB in trade with Washington
1965 Ted Connolly OG in trade with San Francisco
1974 Bob Babich in trade with San Diego
1983 Tom Cousineau in trade with Buffalo
1985 and 1986 Bernie Kosar in trade with Buffalo
1990 traded for multiple lower round picks previous year
2008 traded for Brady Quinn, already on above list.
OK, so, if you would rank say, your Top Ten of all these choices (and bottom 5 or 10 if you would)
-
Top Five
Jim Brown
Paul Warfield
Gary Collins
Bernie Kosar
Mike Pruitt
Eric Metcalf
Ozzie
Worst
John Bauer
Craig Powell
Brady Quinn
Ted Connally
Kurt Burris
Offense Wins.......Franchise QB's are the key.............Defense keeps you in the game.........Go Buckeyes -
This thread will suffice in lieu of my usual "Survey Monday" OK? Here are my choices:
Studs:
1. Jim Brown
2. Paul Warfield
3. Ozzie Newsome
4. Bernie Kosar
5. Clay Mathews
6. Gary Collins
7. Hanford Dixon
8. Eric Metcalf
9. Joe Thomas for his potential
10. Doug Atkins, only here because he made the HOF playing for other teams
Duds:
1. Craig Powell
2. Mike Junkin
3. Clifford Charlton
4. Bobby Garret (#1 overall QB who proved worthless)
5. Gerard Warren
-
This thread will suffice in lieu of my usual "Survey Monday" OK? Here are my choices:
Studs:
1. Jim Brown
2. Paul Warfield
3. Ozzie Newsome
4. Bernie Kosar
5. Clay Mathews
6. Gary Collins
7. Hanford Dixon
8. Eric Metcalf
9. Joe Thomas for his potential
10. Doug Atkins, only here because he made the HOF playing for other teams
Duds:
1. Craig Powell
2. Mike Junkin
3. Clifford Charlton
4. Bobby Garret (#1 overall QB who proved worthless)
5. Gerard Warren
This thread will suffice in lieu of my usual "Survey Monday" OK? Here are my choices:
Studs:
1. Jim Brown
2. Paul Warfield
3. Ozzie Newsome
4. Bernie Kosar
5. Clay Mathews
6. Gary Collins
7. Hanford Dixon
8. Eric Metcalf
9. Joe Thomas for his potential
10. Doug Atkins, only here because he made the HOF playing for other teams
Duds:
1. Craig Powell
2. Mike Junkin
3. Clifford Charlton
4. Bobby Garret (#1 overall QB who proved worthless)
5. Gerard Warren
I like your stud list but add Quinn, Brown and Phipps to the duds and take off Warren. He might not have been a stud but as of last year he is still playing (and maybe this year, not sure) He can't be a dud on this list. No way!
“The Wait Is Over, The Browns Will Be In The Playoffs This Year!" -
Here is my other 5 Duds. These picks were all prior to 1963 so they are less well known and their impact, or lack thereof is a bit lost, but they should still be counted. Jim Brown was drafted in the 50s, so these guys taken in the 50s have to be compared to that:
Harry Agannis. QB. Never played a down for the Browns. Accepted to take an offer with the Red Sox to play baseball. Two years later, he got pneumonia, developed a pulmonary embolism, and died.
John Bauer. OL Never played a down for the Browns. Played all of two games with the Giants. That was it for his NFL career.
Kurt Burris. CB. Never played a down in the NFL. Went to play in Canada where he did pretty well apparently. Played for 2 Grey Cup Champions.
Bobby Crespino. TE. Played 3 years with the Browns, but only caught 6 passes in all those years. Not the kind of production you would expect. ..considering Browns shortly thereafter had good TEs in John Brewer and Milt Morin.
Leroy Jackson. RB. Never played a down with the Browns. Played 2 years with Redskins where he had all of 52 carries and 142 yards in his career. Part of the Ernie Davis deal, so perhaps he should get some slack. But, if we are doing this objectively, then his place on the dud list should probably be taken by:
Ernie Davis. RB. Never played a down (except in preseason). Died of Leukemia.
-
This thread will suffice in lieu of my usual "Survey Monday" OK? Here are my choices:
Studs:
1. Jim Brown
2. Paul Warfield
3. Ozzie Newsome
4. Bernie Kosar
5. Clay Mathews
6. Gary Collins
7. Hanford Dixon
8. Eric Metcalf
9. Joe Thomas for his potential
10. Doug Atkins, only here because he made the HOF playing for other teams
Duds:
1. Craig Powell
2. Mike Junkin
3. Clifford Charlton
4. Bobby Garret (#1 overall QB who proved worthless)
5. Gerard Warren
I like your stud list but add Quinn, Brown and Phipps to the duds and take off Warren. He might not have been a stud but as of last year he is still playing (and maybe this year, not sure) He can't be a dud on this list. No way!
I like your stud list but add Quinn, Brown and Phipps to the duds and take off Warren. He might not have been a stud but as of last year he is still playing (and maybe this year, not sure) He can't be a dud on this list. No way!
He was a dud for us, and what he did with the Browns is what counts. If you take him off, then YOU have to take Quinn off. For all we know in the future he may lead a team to a Super Bowl.....after all, he is still playing too. Quinn gave the Browns as much as Warren did.
-
By the way, on Bobby Garrett. He was the #1 overall selection in the draft as a QB out of Stanford. However, he was cut by the Browns in training camp, picked up by the Packers, threw all of 30 passes and cut by them.
The reason: Uncontrollable stuttering. He couldn't hardly communicate the plays in the huddle or do the snap count. So he was let go and never played again.
Needless to say, the scouting system wasn't as good then as it is now. Such a problem would have obviously been ferreted out before he was drafted. The big question was: how was he able to play so successfully at Stanford with such a problem?
-
Here is my honorable mention list: Jim Houston, Milt Morin, Clarence Scott, Thom Darden, Mike Pruitt, Robert Jackson, Eric Turner, Steve Everitt, Kellen Winslow Jr.
-
I like your stud list but add Quinn, Brown and Phipps to the duds and take off Warren. He might not have been a stud but as of last year he is still playing (and maybe this year, not sure) He can't be a dud on this list. No way!
He was a dud for us, and what he did with the Browns is what counts. If you take him off, then YOU have to take Quinn off. For all we know in the future he may lead a team to a Super Bowl.....after all, he is still playing too. Quinn gave the Browns as much as Warren did.
He was a dud for us, and what he did with the Browns is what counts. If you take him off, then YOU have to take Quinn off. For all we know in the future he may lead a team to a Super Bowl.....after all, he is still playing too. Quinn gave the Browns as much as Warren did.
Quinn gave us NOTHING and I doubt if he ever sees the field again in the NFL unless there is a freak rash of injuries!
-
He was a dud for us, and what he did with the Browns is what counts. If you take him off, then YOU have to take Quinn off. For all we know in the future he may lead a team to a Super Bowl.....after all, he is still playing too. Quinn gave the Browns as much as Warren did.
Quinn gave us NOTHING and I doubt if he ever sees the field again in the NFL unless there is a freak rash of injuries!
Quinn gave us NOTHING and I doubt if he ever sees the field again in the NFL unless there is a freak rash of injuries!
OK, but, I think I have documented at least 10 others that gave us less.
And, you can make your own list if you want. That is what you were asked to do. Go do it.
-
OK, but, I think I have documented at least 10 others that gave us less.
And, you can make your own list if you want. That is what you were asked to do. Go do it.
Yeah I will get on that just because that is what you asked O great one. I found a list that I liked, yours, you should be happy, except for the one glarring flaw. No WAY IN HELL WARREN COMES CLOSE TO MAKING THAT LIST! You can try to justify it away by saying he was a bigger bust for the Browns, but actually some of his best numbers came when he was with the Brown's. And go do a little research and you will find out that their numbers are almost identical for the time they were with the Browns. (See Below) Courtney' only good season was 2000. And Warren is going on his 10th year in the league and Brown is doing what? Not playing thats for sure. Maybe he didn't live up to expected potential but definately NOT A BUST! you have named like 20 busts/duds now and you have him at #5 Just ridiculous IMO.
Warren 116 tackles 16.5 sacks 34 assists 4 forced fumbles and 4 fumble recoveries (9 passes defended)
Brown 134 tackles 17 sacks 36 assists 6 forced fumbles and 6 fumble recoveries 1td (8 passes defended)
So in the 4 years for both the difference is.......
In favor of Brown mostly.....
18 tackles
.5 sacks
2 assists
2 ff
2 fumble recoveries
1td
-1 pass defended
But also keep in mind one was a DE (Brown) And one IS a DT (Warren)
Warren also ranks 1532th overall since 1950
Brown ranks 3329th overall since 1950
According to Pro Football Reference.com with is the closest thing we have to scientifically rank players based on their performance over time.
“The Wait Is Over, The Browns Will Be In The Playoffs This Year!" -
Top 5
1) Jim Brown
2)Ozzie Newsome
3)Bernie Kosar
4)Clay Matthews
5)Hanford Dixon
I have to admit I'm showing my age here, I know Gary Collins was a stud, but I never saw him play (same with Jim Brown). I was 7 when my Dad took me to my first game in 1970 vs Cincy. I put Clarence Scott & Thom Darden in that "honorable mention" class.
Bottom 5
1)Mike Junkin
2) Willis Adams
3) Mack Mitchell
4) Craig Powell
5)Charles White
-
Here is my other 5 Duds. These picks were all prior to 1963 so they are less well known and their impact, or lack thereof is a bit lost, but they should still be counted. Jim Brown was drafted in the 50s, so these guys taken in the 50s have to be compared to that:
Harry Agannis. QB. Never played a down for the Browns. Accepted to take an offer with the Red Sox to play baseball. Two years later, he got pneumonia, developed a pulmonary embolism, and died.
John Bauer. OL Never played a down for the Browns. Played all of two games with the Giants. That was it for his NFL career.
Kurt Burris. CB. Never played a down in the NFL. Went to play in Canada where he did pretty well apparently. Played for 2 Grey Cup Champions.
Bobby Crespino. TE. Played 3 years with the Browns, but only caught 6 passes in all those years. Not the kind of production you would expect. ..considering Browns shortly thereafter had good TEs in John Brewer and Milt Morin.
Leroy Jackson. RB. Never played a down with the Browns. Played 2 years with Redskins where he had all of 52 carries and 142 yards in his career. Part of the Ernie Davis deal, so perhaps he should get some slack. But, if we are doing this objectively, then his place on the dud list should probably be taken by:
Ernie Davis. RB. Never played a down (except in preseason). Died of Leukemia.
Ernie Davis. RB. Never played a down (except in preseason). Died of Leukemia.
Guys whose lives are cut short by leukemia are duds? In my opinion, a 'dud' is either someone who they should have known couldn't play (see Smith, Akili) or someone who failed to deliver when given the opportunity (see Thomas, Blair). There are people who fit the latter who battled injuries (see Bosworth, Brian) but to see a man cut down in his youth and to label him this way is tough for me to swallow.
Have you ever met a leukemia patient? I'm sure the last thing on their minds is whether they can play football or not.
Just my .02
-
OK, but, I think I have documented at least 10 others that gave us less.
And, you can make your own list if you want. That is what you were asked to do. Go do it.
Yeah I will get on that just because that is what you asked O great one. I found a list that I liked, yours, you should be happy, except for the one glarring flaw. No WAY IN HELL WARREN COMES CLOSE TO MAKING THAT LIST! You can try to justify it away by saying he was a bigger bust for the Browns, but actually some of his best numbers came when he was with the Brown's. And go do a little research and you will find out that their numbers are almost identical for the time they were with the Browns. (See Below) Courtney' only good season was 2000. And Warren is going on his 10th year in the league and Brown is doing what? Not playing thats for sure. Maybe he didn't live up to expected potential but definately NOT A BUST! you have named like 20 busts/duds now and you have him at #5 Just ridiculous IMO.
Warren 116 tackles 16.5 sacks 34 assists 4 forced fumbles and 4 fumble recoveries (9 passes defended)
Brown 134 tackles 17 sacks 36 assists 6 forced fumbles and 6 fumble recoveries 1td (8 passes defended)
So in the 4 years for both the difference is.......
In favor of Brown mostly.....
18 tackles
.5 sacks
2 assists
2 ff
2 fumble recoveries
1td
-1 pass defended
But also keep in mind one was a DE (Brown) And one IS a DT (Warren)
Warren also ranks 1532th overall since 1950
Brown ranks 3329th overall since 1950
According to Pro Football Reference.com with is the closest thing we have to scientifically rank players based on their performance over time.
Yeah I will get on that just because that is what you asked O great one. I found a list that I liked, yours, you should be happy, except for the one glarring flaw. No WAY IN HELL WARREN COMES CLOSE TO MAKING THAT LIST! You can try to justify it away by saying he was a bigger bust for the Browns, but actually some of his best numbers came when he was with the Brown's. And go do a little research and you will find out that their numbers are almost identical for the time they were with the Browns. (See Below) Courtney' only good season was 2000. And Warren is going on his 10th year in the league and Brown is doing what? Not playing thats for sure. Maybe he didn't live up to expected potential but definately NOT A BUST! you have named like 20 busts/duds now and you have him at #5 Just ridiculous IMO.
Warren 116 tackles 16.5 sacks 34 assists 4 forced fumbles and 4 fumble recoveries (9 passes defended)
Brown 134 tackles 17 sacks 36 assists 6 forced fumbles and 6 fumble recoveries 1td (8 passes defended)
So in the 4 years for both the difference is.......
In favor of Brown mostly.....
18 tackles
.5 sacks
2 assists
2 ff
2 fumble recoveries
1td
-1 pass defended
But also keep in mind one was a DE (Brown) And one IS a DT (Warren)
Warren also ranks 1532th overall since 1950
Brown ranks 3329th overall since 1950
According to Pro Football Reference.com with is the closest thing we have to scientifically rank players based on their performance over time.
OK, I will replace Warren with C. Brown on my Dud list of 10. Does that make you happy?
-
Ernie Davis. RB. Never played a down (except in preseason). Died of Leukemia.
Guys whose lives are cut short by leukemia are duds? In my opinion, a 'dud' is either someone who they should have known couldn't play (see Smith, Akili) or someone who failed to deliver when given the opportunity (see Thomas, Blair). There are people who fit the latter who battled injuries (see Bosworth, Brian) but to see a man cut down in his youth and to label him this way is tough for me to swallow.
Have you ever met a leukemia patient? I'm sure the last thing on their minds is whether they can play football or not.
Just my .02
Guys whose lives are cut short by leukemia are duds? In my opinion, a 'dud' is either someone who they should have known couldn't play (see Smith, Akili) or someone who failed to deliver when given the opportunity (see Thomas, Blair). There are people who fit the latter who battled injuries (see Bosworth, Brian) but to see a man cut down in his youth and to label him this way is tough for me to swallow.
Have you ever met a leukemia patient? I'm sure the last thing on their minds is whether they can play football or not.
Just my .02
Well, yes, it is a question I stuggled with somewhat, but like you said, should we not put someone on the "Dud" list whose career was curtailed by injury? Those persons are often included in the various "bust" lists. I am not trying to make a moral judgment on Ernie Davis considering the way he perished. Nevertheless, should an illness be considered differently than an injury? Like I said, I struggled with it, but, objectively, you have to say that the team's investment in him was "wasted" albeit tragically.
We could say the same about Don Rogers. He might have become a serious stud, but because he died of a cocaine overdose, he really ends up being a dud. Should the manner of Davis's death vs. the manner of Roger's death affect our evaluation strictly as an asset to the team? I don't know.
-
Top Five
Jim Brown
Paul Warfield
Gary Collins
Bernie Kosar
Mike Pruitt
Eric Metcalf
Ozzie
Worst
John Bauer
Craig Powell
Brady Quinn
Ted Connally
Kurt Burris
Top Five
Jim Brown
Paul Warfield
Gary Collins
Bernie Kosar
Mike Pruitt
Eric Metcalf
Ozzie
Worst
John Bauer
Craig Powell
Brady Quinn
Ted Connally
Kurt Burris
How come your top 5 has 7?
-
Top Five
Jim Brown
Paul Warfield
Gary Collins
Bernie Kosar
Mike Pruitt
Eric Metcalf
Ozzie
Worst
John Bauer
Craig Powell
Brady Quinn
Ted Connally
Kurt Burris
How come your top 5 has 7?
-
can't decide between Tommy Vardell or Willie Green. guess i'll go with....NEITHER. lol
plenty of fun to poke in that list.
i'm gonna hafta say Erocc. in his prime he'd start on any team today...but so would Jim Brown, Clay, Ozzie, Hanford, and Bernie would certainly get consideration.
but i still like the excitement Turner brought to every game. he was like a trump card.
now they just drafted two hitters for our backfield. you know i'm stoked to see how this years draft class plays out.
-
Guys whose lives are cut short by leukemia are duds? In my opinion, a 'dud' is either someone who they should have known couldn't play (see Smith, Akili) or someone who failed to deliver when given the opportunity (see Thomas, Blair). There are people who fit the latter who battled injuries (see Bosworth, Brian) but to see a man cut down in his youth and to label him this way is tough for me to swallow.
Have you ever met a leukemia patient? I'm sure the last thing on their minds is whether they can play football or not.
Just my .02
Well, yes, it is a question I stuggled with somewhat, but like you said, should we not put someone on the "Dud" list whose career was curtailed by injury? Those persons are often included in the various "bust" lists. I am not trying to make a moral judgment on Ernie Davis considering the way he perished. Nevertheless, should an illness be considered differently than an injury? Like I said, I struggled with it, but, objectively, you have to say that the team's investment in him was "wasted" albeit tragically.
We could say the same about Don Rogers. He might have become a serious stud, but because he died of a cocaine overdose, he really ends up being a dud. Should the manner of Davis's death vs. the manner of Roger's death affect our evaluation strictly as an asset to the team? I don't know.
Well, yes, it is a question I stuggled with somewhat, but like you said, should we not put someone on the "Dud" list whose career was curtailed by injury? Those persons are often included in the various "bust" lists. I am not trying to make a moral judgment on Ernie Davis considering the way he perished. Nevertheless, should an illness be considered differently than an injury? Like I said, I struggled with it, but, objectively, you have to say that the team's investment in him was "wasted" albeit tragically.
We could say the same about Don Rogers. He might have become a serious stud, but because he died of a cocaine overdose, he really ends up being a dud. Should the manner of Davis's death vs. the manner of Roger's death affect our evaluation strictly as an asset to the team? I don't know.
A fine point you make but perhaps it needs a little more teasing out: Don Rogers died of a choice he made. That (to me, at least) leaves you on far worse moral ground than someone who was injured in the course of NFL duty or someone who had a serious illness that happened outside of the sports career...(e.g., Lou Gehrig). There is a certain amount of tragedy that we as fans are willing to accept if it's not related to something they chose to do.
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login