Next 2 games are key for Kyle Orton's future with Bears

Lumbergh

@shepwrite said:
I think the McNabb/Vikings thing happens. He wants it and they want it. Just a gut, though.
Cassell is read hot whether you agree with it or not. He's playing better every week, he's healthy, he's 25, he's 6'4", he's strong-armed, and now he's experienced. He will NOT go back to being a backup and New England WILL move him, one way or the other. No doubt about it. If they franchise him, it will be to set up a trade, not pay him Top 5 QB money.

Just assume one job opening will be filled by Cassell. There isn't one GM on earth who would rather have Anderson. Not one.

And as I've said before, watch out for a Leinart move. I think teams would trade a higher pick for Leinart right now than for Anderson. If you polled NFL GMs, I'm convinced you'd get an overwhelming majority for Leinart.

If we get a third round pick for him, I'll be stunned.

if there's one thing we know about shep it's that he not afraid to make bold predictions that are completely off base.

Here's some real truths:

McNabb likely will stay in Philly.

Cassell has done about half of what Anderson did, and did it on a MUCH better team.

Leinart isn't on anybody's radar at all.

WPB Dawg Fan

@lumbergh said:
Here's some real truths:
McNabb likely will stay in Philly.

Cassell has done about half of what Anderson did, and did it on a MUCH better team.

Leinart isn't on anybody's radar at all.

I agree 100%.

Cassel's value is probably still pretty high (as others mentioned) in the QB starved NFL. But I still think he hasn't proven anything based on the level of defenses he played and the way he shat the bed against good defenses. The next 2 weeks he goes against 2 more shitty pass defenses...so he will continue to look like a god...but even if they make the playoffs they will be one and done as all the AFC playoff teams outside of Denver have very good pass defenses.

BrownIndian

I see a good chance that DA may be traded to St Lous Rams. They are in need of a NFL experience quarterback someone not too old but can hold down the job while they try to improve the team.

? Masters

@wpb-dawg-fan said:
Sorry, don't see the Cassel love. It just doesn't make sense to me to hype a guy who has done decent on LAST YEARS SUPER BOWL RUNNER UP...and only for one year...when we all saw what happened to DA after his one year of greatness.
Besides which, I also showed that Cassel has not done well against anyone ranked above 20th in pass defense...so big deal.

Do you not remember Rob Johnson and Matt Shuab? There stock jumped pretty darn high doing a lot less than Cassel has done.

No way will they Franchise tag Cassel. That would cost NE way to much money if they couldn't move him. Might give him the restricted tag, but even that might be a bit pricy. Cassel's value could change even more if NE makes the playoffs and they win in the first round.

? Masters

@lumbergh said:
Cassell has a long way to go to get mentioned up with DA.
His 18 TD passes are about a third of what Tom Brady had last year with the same team.

And I didn't see Cassell on the Pro Bowl list either.

Where he's at next year depends on Tom Brady's recovery.

DA has proven to be who he is after 20+ starts. Cassel hasn't.

I didn't see Cassel look like a bad QB in the pro bowl last year either.

? Masters

@shepwrite said:
Oh, and NO... Anderson's situation last year wasn't worse than anybody's anywhere any time. He had perfect protection, a 1,300 yard rusher, and two Pro Bowl pass catchers.
Cassel has a better passer rating than Anderson, but the most important stat is his completion percentage of about 64. Anderson's completion percentage has been stuck in the 50s and it tells you something about his accuracy, which is really troubling.

Cassel is hot property right now and Anderson is not.

Shhhhhhh...... no one wants to hear that...

Cassel has also beat 2 teams that might make the playoffs. Something DA didn't do.

Oh, and John, you noted Cassel hasn't beat a team with a D in the top 20, but that isn't true. MIA's D is ranked 8th, but he lit them up for 415 yards and 3 TDs in the second meeting. A sign of learning. Something DA never did.

WPB Dawg Fan

@shepwrite said:
Here's a nice blog on Leinart's situation, where he'll be very expensive for AZ to keep if they give Warner an extension:
http://28sherman.blogspot.com/2008/11/wher...art-end-up.html

Shep...please...

Here is Leinarts contract:

8/14/2006: Signed a six-year, $50.8 million contract. The deal contains $14 million in guarantees, including a $7.575 million option bonus in the second year. 2008: $735,000, 2009: $1.11 million, 2010: $2.485 million, 2011: $7.36 million, 2012: Free Agent

so he costs AZ just under $3.6M for the NEXT 2 YEARS!!! That is dirt cheap for a backup with his potential. The decision is AZ isn't coming until the end of 2010.

WPB Dawg Fan

On top of that, they JUST payed Leinart a $7.85M bonus this past offseason. They are going to want a big return on that money...and that means Matt can hold the clipboard for a couple of more years without complaining.

? 88fingerslewy

@brownindian said:
I see a good chance that DA may be traded to St Lous Rams. They are in need of a NFL experience quarterback someone not too old but can hold down the job while they try to improve the team.

I think so too. Not only that, based on the Rams record, you'll get an early pick in whatever you round you trade for. I've thought St.Louis all along. We'll see.

JewDago

trading him to st. louis would be great. they're abysmal. even a fourth from them is practically a third. what i don't understand is why they'd want him. bulger is practically the same QB, and it seems like the fans and media in st. louis have soured on him.

WPB Dawg Fan

@shepwrite said:
Something about contracts I don't get, and maybe you know, John: Why does it seem like EVERYBODY is a f/a after year 4? Is Leinart not a free agent until after year six? Why would he do that?
But if that's the whole story, you're right: He's trapped for two more seasons. And that would be another WEIRD situation. You rarely see a first round pick get so little on-field time to develop. Leinart looked really strong as his rookie year progressed, then he was on a very short leash with Wisenhunt. You get the sense they like each other as much as Crennel and Quinn.

Top of round 1 guys get 5-6 year contracts. Everyone else gets 3-4 yr contracts.

Leinart signed a huge 6 year deal in '06...meaning his FA is 2012.

Quinn on the other hand signed a 5 yr deal in '07...so he goes FA in 2012 as well. Think about Quinns contract...is he never makes more than $700k as his base. The rest was all bonus driven.

? 88fingerslewy

@jewdago said:
trading him to st. louis would be great. they're abysmal. even a fourth from them is practically a third. what i don't understand is why they'd want him. bulger is practically the same QB, and it seems like the fans and media in st. louis have soured on him.

It's just a hunch about the Rams but in todays pro sports and the egos out there, someone might think "I'll coach 'em up right" and they'll take a chance. Because DA's young, someone will probably want to give him a good look in their system. Who knows. Wishful thinking. His rostor bonus might be roadblock though. I'm not sure but doesn't the obligation of the bonus land with the team he's on in March?

Lumbergh

88fingerslewy said:
It's just a hunch about the Rams but in todays pro sports and the egos out there, someone might think "I'll coach 'em up right" and they'll take a chance. Because DA's young, someone will probably want to give him a good look in their system. Who knows. Wishful thinking. His rostor bonus might be roadblock though. I'm not sure but doesn't the obligation of the bonus land with the team he's on in March?

Anderson's 5 mil roster bonus is peanuts compared to the 27 mil guaranteed in Bulger's 65 mil contract.

Contrary to common belief, Anderson's roster bonus probably won't be much of a factor in whether he is traded or not. It depends a lot more on if the new coach likes him or not.

...cue shep claiming that DA will get cut and betting his left teste on it. This spring shep's nickname will become "ONE-NUT"

Riffer X

@wpb-dawg-fan said:
Top of round 1 guys get 5-6 year contracts. Everyone else gets 3-4 yr contracts.
Leinart signed a huge 6 year deal in '06...meaning his FA is 2012.

Quinn on the other hand signed a 5 yr deal in '07...so he goes FA in 2012 as well. Think about Quinns contract...is he never makes more than $700k as his base. The rest was all bonus driven.

Butchie used to push for 6 year deals on rooks and it really pissed people off.

WPB Dawg Fan

@lumbergh said:
Anderson's 5 mil roster bonus is peanuts compared to the 27 mil guaranteed in Bulger's 65 mil contract.
Contrary to common belief, Anderson's roster bonus probably won't be much of a factor in whether he is traded or not. It depends a lot more on if the new coach likes him or not.

I would agree with you somewhat, but the NEW guy is going to have until March 1st to make that decision...which means all he has to go on is film...and over the past 18 games that is not very flattering for DA.

Another factor is that in 2010 his contract balloons up to $7.45M with a $2M bonus...compared to the $700k per year for BQ.

With us needing SEVERAL players...his contact money (and bonus) will go a long way to landing some top FA's and signing our 1st round draftee.

? mz.

@lumbergh said:
Anderson's 5 mil roster bonus is peanuts compared to the 27 mil guaranteed in Bulger's 65 mil contract.
Contrary to common belief, Anderson's roster bonus probably won't be much of a factor in whether he is traded or not. It depends a lot more on if the new coach likes him or not.

...cue shep claiming that DA will get cut and betting his left teste on it. This spring shep's nickname will become "ONE-NUT"

Looks like you're willing to bet Anderson is on our 2009 roster.

The fact is we're not paying his base $1.45 million salary plus the $5 million (correct?) roster bonus for 2009 for a backup QB. DA's (READ: your) saving grace here is that even though Romeo has named Quinn his 2009 starter, he isn't going to get the opportunity to do so unless he plays fantasy football. One never knows...perhaps the new coach will like DA better. But, if said new coach has a brain, he will not.

Bottom line: DA won't be here, and the reason is mostly financial. He'd be a serviceable backup.

JewDago

@lumbergh said:
Anderson's 5 mil roster bonus is peanuts compared to the 27 mil guaranteed in Bulger's 65 mil contract.

bulger's contract is a monster, and he only signed it last summer. he's still got four seasons after this one on it. no way they can move him or really even justify benching him, so i don't really see a chance that the rams take DA off our hands.

that was some short-lived hope.

WPB Dawg Fan

In all probability, DA will be given the chance to negotiate a trade from the beginning...with the understanding that he will be re-negotiating his contract with any team that wants him. There is less than $15M remaining on DA's contact...and that would be a VERY affordable 5yr deal for some other club.

The Browns also have the ability to restructure his contract and avoid the $5M bonus on March 1...and that would give them MORE leverage to get a decent trade out of it.

JewDago

let's hope he agrees to those conditions. if not, he can just force the browns to cut him and sign with whomever he pleases, which, at this point, is looking like the likeliest scenario unless he can find someone who wants him badly enough to trade for him.

cmac12

Can't read it all. But DA did beat a playoff team and played great doing it. They are called the Super Bowl Champion NY Giants.

He played well half the year last year and no so good the rest of the year. He also played great against the Giants this year and not too bad against a very good Ravens defense and pretty good a few other games. He Also played bad against several teams this year including one that the Browns won (the Bungles).

Cassell is a product of the system. If he is put in the same system he will be a decent QB. The only QB that I would take in the current market for the price you would have to pay is McNabb. And I think his price might be too high.

DA's value has dropped since last year dramatically and he will be a bargin deal for a team like the Vikings. He can restructure his deal to make it a longer term deal so that his signing bonus is over more years making it not such a great cap hit. That is how DA can control his destination by who is willing to restructure his contract with.

The Browns can't lose because if they can get a 3rd rounder for DA then the fan base will be happy. A 3rd rounder is not too much for a team like the Vikings to pay for a 25 year old QB with a strong arm and 27 or so starts under his belt. It would be a good fit for them and much cheaper than Cassell would be.

As far as beating good teams. Yea you can say DA has not beat many playoff teams as a starter. But, let me ask you what QB on this team has?

The best way for DA to help this team now is through a trade. But, don't be surprised if he goes to a team like the Vikings that he ends up having a pretty good career. I mean the Browns are not excatly a place for QBs to flourish, think 12 QBs in 11 years have started. That is good coaching and front office work there.

Always say, watch what you wish for, you might get it.