Mangini A Real Class Act!
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We know Mangini tried hard to make this franchise win.
And we thank him for that.
We also know now that he is the one who can leave with class.
There's no discussion: anything less than 8-8 next year is a failure for the Walrus, at least as far as I'm concerned.
And I'm one of those who wanted Mangini to leave.
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"I have to make a change"
I don't like that one bit from Holmgren. It shows insecurity. Getting rid of a good coach because of pressure shows weakness. I know ultimately the fans pay your salary but that doesn't mean you should listen to them. As a whole, they are an ignorant breed that only think one game ahead or behind and do not see the big picture. Sadly, I know the organization made a mistake with this move, my only hope is that Mangini made enough headway for the next coach to be successful.
"I have to make a change"
I don't like that one bit from Holmgren. It shows insecurity. Getting rid of a good coach because of pressure shows weakness. I know ultimately the fans pay your salary but that doesn't mean you should listen to them. As a whole, they are an ignorant breed that only think one game ahead or behind and do not see the big picture. Sadly, I know the organization made a mistake with this move, my only hope is that Mangini made enough headway for the next coach to be successful.
So you have no faith in Holgrem a guy who's taken team to the SB 3 times but your all in love with a sub .500 HC because of some perceived progress he made. Mangini seemed to be a good disciplinarian but not a winner. He had 2 good years in NY based mostly on what he inherited then ran them into the ground.
He wasn't fired because of pressure from fans he was fired because he didn't win.
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I like Mangini. He is way better than what he replaced on the field in the personnel decision process. He is the best coach we had since reborn in 99.
Players like to play for him and they play hard and he can be an adequate coach
Now the real question, can he be an elite coach who always has his team in the hunt
Based on so far the answer is no.
The main reason I say this is because Offensively the Browns are vanilla and weak and he does NOT show he has the vision to run a high power offense.
And having a high power offense is the Head Coach's job not the OC
Further Offense wins Championships and ours right now is one of the worst in the league NOT even middle of the pack
The OC and DC reflect the Head Coach and often are given way too much credit for the roles.
That all said, I believe Holmgren wanted to be able to shoot a bigger gun and that is why Mangini is gone. I also believe that Holmgren also believes offense wins championships
I hope Mangini does well, however, I am not upset he is gone unless of course we replace with the likes of Fox or Gruden which is NO potential for improvement
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"I have to make a change"
I don't like that one bit from Holmgren. It shows insecurity. Getting rid of a good coach because of pressure shows weakness. I know ultimately the fans pay your salary but that doesn't mean you should listen to them. As a whole, they are an ignorant breed that only think one game ahead or behind and do not see the big picture. Sadly, I know the organization made a mistake with this move, my only hope is that Mangini made enough headway for the next coach to be successful.
So you have no faith in Holgrem a guy who's taken team to the SB 3 times but your all in love with a sub .500 HC because of some perceived progress he made. Mangini seemed to be a good disciplinarian but not a winner. He had 2 good years in NY based mostly on what he inherited then ran them into the ground.
He wasn't fired because of pressure from fans he was fired because he didn't win.
So you have no faith in Holgrem a guy who's taken team to the SB 3 times but your all in love with a sub .500 HC because of some perceived progress he made. Mangini seemed to be a good disciplinarian but not a winner. He had 2 good years in NY based mostly on what he inherited then ran them into the ground.
He wasn't fired because of pressure from fans he was fired because he didn't win.
Are you serious?! Mangini inherited a 4-12 Jets team and made them a 10-6 team in his first year. He had a bad second year and went 9-7 the final year. Brett Favre played terribly and cost Mangini his job. So if 9-7 is running a team into the ground, I would love to be "run into the ground." Why do you think the jets drafted Sanchez with Rex Ryan? Because they didn't have a QB and that was the one big thing missing from their team.
Mangini's big flaw is not being able to judge QB talent. He liked Clemmons, Ratliff, an old Favre under a new system, and Delhomme. Granted, Holmgren brought in Delhomme and also Colt McCoy. That's why I would have stuck with Mangini and got an offensive coordinator that could have helped develop Colt McCoy. That said I trust Holmgren will pick a good coach. But if the next coach fails, (less than 8-8 record next year) then yes I will lose all faith in Holmgren...
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"I have to make a change"
I don't like that one bit from Holmgren. It shows insecurity. Getting rid of a good coach because of pressure shows weakness. I know ultimately the fans pay your salary but that doesn't mean you should listen to them. As a whole, they are an ignorant breed that only think one game ahead or behind and do not see the big picture. Sadly, I know the organization made a mistake with this move, my only hope is that Mangini made enough headway for the next coach to be successful.
So you have no faith in Holgrem a guy who's taken team to the SB 3 times but your all in love with a sub .500 HC because of some perceived progress he made. Mangini seemed to be a good disciplinarian but not a winner. He had 2 good years in NY based mostly on what he inherited then ran them into the ground.
He wasn't fired because of pressure from fans he was fired because he didn't win.
So you have no faith in Holgrem a guy who's taken team to the SB 3 times but your all in love with a sub .500 HC because of some perceived progress he made. Mangini seemed to be a good disciplinarian but not a winner. He had 2 good years in NY based mostly on what he inherited then ran them into the ground.
He wasn't fired because of pressure from fans he was fired because he didn't win.
Well Holmgren had Montana, Favre and Hasselback
2 HOF'ers and a very good NFL QB
Mangini had Quinn, Anderson, Delhomme, Wallace,Colt
2 guys who were 3rd string in 2010 and out of league in 2011(BQ and DA) a washed up JD, a career back up SW and a 3rd RD ROOKIE draft pick
Comparisions are absurd
So Holmgren and WHOMEVER is the coach should be a play off team in 2011..correct
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I like Mangini. He is way better than what he replaced on the field in the personnel decision process. He is the best coach we had since reborn in 99.
Players like to play for him and they play hard and he can be an adequate coach
Now the real question, can he be an elite coach who always has his team in the hunt
Based on so far the answer is no.
The main reason I say this is because Offensively the Browns are vanilla and weak and he does NOT show he has the vision to run a high power offense.
And having a high power offense is the Head Coach's job not the OC
Further Offense wins Championships and ours right now is one of the worst in the league NOT even middle of the pack
The OC and DC reflect the Head Coach and often are given way too much credit for the roles.
That all said, I believe Holmgren wanted to be able to shoot a bigger gun and that is why Mangini is gone. I also believe that Holmgren also believes offense wins championships
I hope Mangini does well, however, I am not upset he is gone unless of course we replace with the likes of Fox or Gruden which is NO potential for improvement
I like Mangini. He is way better than what he replaced on the field in the personnel decision process. He is the best coach we had since reborn in 99.
Players like to play for him and they play hard and he can be an adequate coach
Now the real question, can he be an elite coach who always has his team in the hunt
Based on so far the answer is no.
The main reason I say this is because Offensively the Browns are vanilla and weak and he does NOT show he has the vision to run a high power offense.
And having a high power offense is the Head Coach's job not the OC
Further Offense wins Championships and ours right now is one of the worst in the league NOT even middle of the pack
The OC and DC reflect the Head Coach and often are given way too much credit for the roles.
That all said, I believe Holmgren wanted to be able to shoot a bigger gun and that is why Mangini is gone. I also believe that Holmgren also believes offense wins championships
I hope Mangini does well, however, I am not upset he is gone unless of course we replace with the likes of Fox or Gruden which is NO potential for improvement
Can you post without spewing your "offense wins championships" crap? I'm not sure its possible
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So you have no faith in Holgrem a guy who's taken team to the SB 3 times but your all in love with a sub .500 HC because of some perceived progress he made. Mangini seemed to be a good disciplinarian but not a winner. He had 2 good years in NY based mostly on what he inherited then ran them into the ground.
He wasn't fired because of pressure from fans he was fired because he didn't win.
Well Holmgren had Montana, Favre and Hasselback
2 HOF'ers and a very good NFL QB
Mangini had Quinn, Anderson, Delhomme, Wallace,Colt
2 guys who were 3rd string in 2010 and out of league in 2011(BQ and DA) a washed up JD, a career back up SW and a 3rd RD ROOKIE draft pick
Comparisions are absurd
So Holmgren and WHOMEVER is the coach should be a play off team in 2011..correct
So Holmgren and WHOMEVER is the coach should be a play off team in 2011..correct
Ideally yes, but if not and the Browns are 9-7 or even 8-8 next year as long as they can beat teams with 1 win or teams who are on a 10 game losing streak that would be acceptable.
Most players coaches and fans want to get to the playoffs. I'm not sure what Manginites want maybe 6-10 or 9-7 while being in or at least AT every game. You'all seem pretty happy w ith back to back 5-11's.
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I like Mangini. He is way better than what he replaced on the field in the personnel decision process. He is the best coach we had since reborn in 99.
Players like to play for him and they play hard and he can be an adequate coach
Now the real question, can he be an elite coach who always has his team in the hunt
Based on so far the answer is no.
The main reason I say this is because Offensively the Browns are vanilla and weak and he does NOT show he has the vision to run a high power offense.
And having a high power offense is the Head Coach's job not the OC
Further Offense wins Championships and ours right now is one of the worst in the league NOT even middle of the pack
The OC and DC reflect the Head Coach and often are given way too much credit for the roles.
That all said, I believe Holmgren wanted to be able to shoot a bigger gun and that is why Mangini is gone. I also believe that Holmgren also believes offense wins championships
I hope Mangini does well, however, I am not upset he is gone unless of course we replace with the likes of Fox or Gruden which is NO potential for improvement
Can you post without spewing your "offense wins championships" crap? I'm not sure its possible
Can you post without spewing your "offense wins championships" crap? I'm not sure its possible
When you figure out it is true....instead of calling it "sprewing.... crap".......I wont have to say it anymore.
Gotta teach the kids what brings winning........your support is needed!!
Maybe you'll get it some day, until then peace bro
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"I have to make a change"
I don't like that one bit from Holmgren. It shows insecurity. Getting rid of a good coach because of pressure shows weakness. I know ultimately the fans pay your salary but that doesn't mean you should listen to them. As a whole, they are an ignorant breed that only think one game ahead or behind and do not see the big picture. Sadly, I know the organization made a mistake with this move, my only hope is that Mangini made enough headway for the next coach to be successful.
So you have no faith in Holgrem a guy who's taken team to the SB 3 times but your all in love with a sub .500 HC because of some perceived progress he made. Mangini seemed to be a good disciplinarian but not a winner. He had 2 good years in NY based mostly on what he inherited then ran them into the ground.
He wasn't fired because of pressure from fans he was fired because he didn't win.
So you have no faith in Holgrem a guy who's taken team to the SB 3 times but your all in love with a sub .500 HC because of some perceived progress he made. Mangini seemed to be a good disciplinarian but not a winner. He had 2 good years in NY based mostly on what he inherited then ran them into the ground.
He wasn't fired because of pressure from fans he was fired because he didn't win.
There is so much that is incorrect in this statement that I honestly don't know where to start.
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So you have no faith in Holgrem a guy who's taken team to the SB 3 times but your all in love with a sub .500 HC because of some perceived progress he made. Mangini seemed to be a good disciplinarian but not a winner. He had 2 good years in NY based mostly on what he inherited then ran them into the ground.
He wasn't fired because of pressure from fans he was fired because he didn't win.
There is so much that is incorrect in this statement that I honestly don't know where to start.
There is so much that is incorrect in this statement that I honestly don't know where to start.
My opinion and assumptions are no more wrong than yours. You mentioned the big picture. The big picture is wins and losses, your record.
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There is so much that is incorrect in this statement that I honestly don't know where to start.
My opinion and assumptions are no more wrong than yours. You mentioned the big picture. The big picture is wins and losses, your record.
My opinion and assumptions are no more wrong than yours. You mentioned the big picture. The big picture is wins and losses, your record.
First off, the team he ran into the ground went to the playoffs the year after he was let go in which he had a winning record.
Second, I have faith in Holmgren although he didn't get to any superbowls in the capacity that he is in now. What I said was that it scared me that he thought he had to make a change. Which sounds to me as if he succumbed to the pressure of the fans, who as a whole, are idiots.
Lastly, the big picture is wins and losses? Really? So we were good to go after 2007 with Crennel winning 10 games? I'm glad we are sitting pretty now. The big picture is building a solid foundation, then adding talent and depth to make winning sustainable. What Mangini did with this team is being overlooked by a lot of myopic homers.
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My opinion and assumptions are no more wrong than yours. You mentioned the big picture. The big picture is wins and losses, your record.
First off, the team he ran into the ground went to the playoffs the year after he was let go in which he had a winning record.
Second, I have faith in Holmgren although he didn't get to any superbowls in the capacity that he is in now. What I said was that it scared me that he thought he had to make a change. Which sounds to me as if he succumbed to the pressure of the fans, who as a whole, are idiots.
Lastly, the big picture is wins and losses? Really? So we were good to go after 2007 with Crennel winning 10 games? I'm glad we are sitting pretty now. The big picture is building a solid foundation, then adding talent and depth to make winning sustainable. What Mangini did with this team is being overlooked by a lot of myopic homers.
First off, the team he ran into the ground went to the playoffs the year after he was let go in which he had a winning record.
Second, I have faith in Holmgren although he didn't get to any superbowls in the capacity that he is in now. What I said was that it scared me that he thought he had to make a change. Which sounds to me as if he succumbed to the pressure of the fans, who as a whole, are idiots.
Lastly, the big picture is wins and losses? Really? So we were good to go after 2007 with Crennel winning 10 games? I'm glad we are sitting pretty now. The big picture is building a solid foundation, then adding talent and depth to make winning sustainable. What Mangini did with this team is being overlooked by a lot of myopic homers.
We can agree on one thing. Fans are idiots.
Myopic homers like the ones that after a 10 win season kept screaming that BQ should become the starter.
After a '07 one could have said that the Browns had turned a corner and winning consistently is now possible with hindsight we see it wasn't. At least they were winning some games. Whos to say that EM's imaginary improvement would continue.
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My opinion and assumptions are no more wrong than yours. You mentioned the big picture. The big picture is wins and losses, your record.
First off, the team he ran into the ground went to the playoffs the year after he was let go in which he had a winning record.
Second, I have faith in Holmgren although he didn't get to any superbowls in the capacity that he is in now. What I said was that it scared me that he thought he had to make a change. Which sounds to me as if he succumbed to the pressure of the fans, who as a whole, are idiots.
Lastly, the big picture is wins and losses? Really? So we were good to go after 2007 with Crennel winning 10 games? I'm glad we are sitting pretty now. The big picture is building a solid foundation, then adding talent and depth to make winning sustainable. What Mangini did with this team is being overlooked by a lot of myopic homers.
First off, the team he ran into the ground went to the playoffs the year after he was let go in which he had a winning record.
Second, I have faith in Holmgren although he didn't get to any superbowls in the capacity that he is in now. What I said was that it scared me that he thought he had to make a change. Which sounds to me as if he succumbed to the pressure of the fans, who as a whole, are idiots.
Lastly, the big picture is wins and losses? Really? So we were good to go after 2007 with Crennel winning 10 games? I'm glad we are sitting pretty now. The big picture is building a solid foundation, then adding talent and depth to make winning sustainable. What Mangini did with this team is being overlooked by a lot of myopic homers.
Mike Holmgren knows what building a foundation looks like since he took two teams with no recent history of success to the tune of 3 Super Bowls, has had 5 of his coaches go on to be successful Head Coaches (2 made the Super Bowl), and understands how to put a staff together. He has the Rolodex and the status to get some of the smarter people in football here.
And Eric Mangini attracted Rob Ryan and Brian Daboll.
Enough said........
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I'm not sure if some of you morons understand that MH went to superbowls as a COACH not PRESIDENT. Its the same as when Savage was. Whatever you say Walrus, yes Walrus, your the greatest Walrus. I'm rooting for the guy, but the best thing he has done to this point is bring Heckertt. Make him earn your respect like you did Mangini. Don't stand there with your mouth open!
βIt is impossible to get a man to understand something if his livelihood depends on him not understanding.β -
I'm not sure if some of you morons understand that MH went to superbowls as a COACH not PRESIDENT. Its the same as when Savage was. Whatever you say Walrus, yes Walrus, your the greatest Walrus. I'm rooting for the guy, but the best thing he has done to this point is bring Heckertt. Make him earn your respect like you did Mangini. Don't stand there with your mouth open!
I'm not sure if some of you morons understand that MH went to superbowls as a COACH not PRESIDENT. Its the same as when Savage was. Whatever you say Walrus, yes Walrus, your the greatest Walrus. I'm rooting for the guy, but the best thing he has done to this point is bring Heckertt. Make him earn your respect like you did Mangini. Don't stand there with your mouth open!
That is fine but if I am going to get into a battle of wits with regards to building a foundation for winning football here in Cleveland, I am going to trust the guy that did it not once, but TWICE. And he was front and center on those rebuilding projects. Coach, president, whatever - he has much more experience and worthy of more trust than Mangini.
So you can throw around the term "morons" all you want, it still doesn't change the fact that if given a choice, most "non-moron" fans trust the guy with more experience and hands on decision making skills turning around a franchise.
I don't blindly trust him, but I am no going to beat the guy up for sacking a coach who lost 22 games in 2 seasons here.
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I'm not sure if some of you morons understand that MH went to superbowls as a COACH not PRESIDENT. Its the same as when Savage was. Whatever you say Walrus, yes Walrus, your the greatest Walrus. I'm rooting for the guy, but the best thing he has done to this point is bring Heckertt. Make him earn your respect like you did Mangini. Don't stand there with your mouth open!
That is fine but if I am going to get into a battle of wits with regards to building a foundation for winning football here in Cleveland, I am going to trust the guy that did it not once, but TWICE. And he was front and center on those rebuilding projects. Coach, president, whatever - he has much more experience and worthy of more trust than Mangini.
So you can throw around the term "morons" all you want, it still doesn't change the fact that if given a choice, most "non-moron" fans trust the guy with more experience and hands on decision making skills turning around a franchise.
I don't blindly trust him, but I am no going to beat the guy up for sacking a coach who lost 22 games in 2 seasons here.
That is fine but if I am going to get into a battle of wits with regards to building a foundation for winning football here in Cleveland, I am going to trust the guy that did it not once, but TWICE. And he was front and center on those rebuilding projects. Coach, president, whatever - he has much more experience and worthy of more trust than Mangini.
So you can throw around the term "morons" all you want, it still doesn't change the fact that if given a choice, most "non-moron" fans trust the guy with more experience and hands on decision making skills turning around a franchise.
I don't blindly trust him, but I am no going to beat the guy up for sacking a coach who lost 22 games in 2 seasons here.
Ok.....like I said I'm rooting for him too. But he is part of 1 losing season here in place where you only get 2. Now I ask what has he done to this point that you brag to people about? I'll wait........
βIt is impossible to get a man to understand something if his livelihood depends on him not understanding.β -
That is fine but if I am going to get into a battle of wits with regards to building a foundation for winning football here in Cleveland, I am going to trust the guy that did it not once, but TWICE. And he was front and center on those rebuilding projects. Coach, president, whatever - he has much more experience and worthy of more trust than Mangini.
So you can throw around the term "morons" all you want, it still doesn't change the fact that if given a choice, most "non-moron" fans trust the guy with more experience and hands on decision making skills turning around a franchise.
I don't blindly trust him, but I am no going to beat the guy up for sacking a coach who lost 22 games in 2 seasons here.
Ok.....like I said I'm rooting for him too. But he is part of 1 losing season here in place where you only get 2. Now I ask what has he done to this point that you brag to people about? I'll wait........
Ok.....like I said I'm rooting for him too. But he is part of 1 losing season here in place where you only get 2. Now I ask what has he done to this point that you brag to people about? I'll wait........
He fired mangini! Nuff said
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Ok.....like I said I'm rooting for him too. But he is part of 1 losing season here in place where you only get 2. Now I ask what has he done to this point that you brag to people about? I'll wait........
He fired mangini! Nuff said
Ok.....like I said I'm rooting for him too. But he is part of 1 losing season here in place where you only get 2. Now I ask what has he done to this point that you brag to people about? I'll wait........
He fired mangini! Nuff said
Aaaannnd heres the pitch....high hanging curveball.......booom it's outa' here.
Thread done!
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