The NFL Today???
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I can remember some of that, it was actually a decent league. I think the Michigan Panthers became the Baltimore Stars, and Jim Mora was their coach.
We wouldn't have obtained Kevin Mack, Mike Johnson, or Gerald "Ice Cube" McNeil if the USFL merged, so that I'm thankful for. Lindy Infante came here to run our offense, after being a head coach in that league too. I still say if "the Cube" didn't return that kickoff in 3 Rivers in 1986, we would have never broken that jinx.
It's ironic you put Baltimore in the AFC East...that's where those commies should be right now.
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Jacksonville, Oakland, Atlanta, Minnesota and Detroit are barely viable now from a financial perspective. San Francisco is right there with them. Oakland especially is teetering on the bridge of collapse. These 5 teams have been the bottom dwellers of the NFL from a profitability perspective for almost 5 years now. The NFL is going to be lucky to remain intact as is at this point unless the owners get the CBA concessions they want from the players or they can move some teams overseas. More teams would have caused even bigger problems. If the economy doesn't turn around soon it is going to get ugly for a few existing franchises.
The one and only time losing is acceptable is when it involves your virginity. -
Looks good, just one question do you think that the new york area could support 3 teams. Where would they have played? All three @ the meadowlands? I understand the ammount of people that live there but I don't think they could support 3 teams.
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Jacksonville, Oakland, Atlanta, Minnesota and Detroit are barely viable now from a financial perspective. San Francisco is right there with them. Oakland especially is teetering on the bridge of collapse. These 5 teams have been the bottom dwellers of the NFL from a profitability perspective for almost 5 years now. The NFL is going to be lucky to remain intact as is at this point unless the owners get the CBA concessions they want from the players or they can move some teams overseas. More teams would have caused even bigger problems. If the economy doesn't turn around soon it is going to get ugly for a few existing franchises.
Jacksonville, Oakland, Atlanta, Minnesota and Detroit are barely viable now from a financial perspective. San Francisco is right there with them. Oakland especially is teetering on the bridge of collapse. These 5 teams have been the bottom dwellers of the NFL from a profitability perspective for almost 5 years now. The NFL is going to be lucky to remain intact as is at this point unless the owners get the CBA concessions they want from the players or they can move some teams overseas. More teams would have caused even bigger problems. If the economy doesn't turn around soon it is going to get ugly for a few existing franchises.
I believe that is pure propagandist BS. I believe every NFL team is exceedingly financially successful. I think they are just greedy and want more, more, more. I believe the owners make billions and the players make millions.
Figure this out: The Census Bureau says that the average U.S. family has earnings of a little over $50,000 per year. The average NFL salary works out to about $770,000. Now, it takes the average person 15.4 years to make the average NFL salary. The average lifetime earnings in this country is about 2 million dollars. An NFL player can make that in about 2.5 years in the league. Of course, God only knows what an NFL owner makes in a year. The only team whose books are open are the Green Bay Packers, and though they took a hit this past year, they still made 9.8 million....which is over and above ALL expenses of that organization:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5379673
So, let's say the average NFL player, with the added teams from the USFL made only 10-12 times the average US family.
(I wish to God I could have just one year like that in my life.). And that the owners only make a profit of 10 million per year (the Packers were averaging well over 20 million before last year).
I think that with the 36 teams I outline....everyone concerned would do quite, quite well financially, even in these worst of times.
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Looks good, just one question do you think that the new york area could support 3 teams. Where would they have played? All three @ the meadowlands? I understand the ammount of people that live there but I don't think they could support 3 teams.
Looks good, just one question do you think that the new york area could support 3 teams. Where would they have played? All three @ the meadowlands? I understand the ammount of people that live there but I don't think they could support 3 teams.
They could have supported 3 teams. One may have had to play say in the Mets Stadium. So? Would that have been so bad? The Jets played in Shea Stadium for years. NYC just built the new massive Yankee Stadium. Maybe one would have been built in Brooklyn or out on Long Island.
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Jacksonville, Oakland, Atlanta, Minnesota and Detroit are barely viable now from a financial perspective. San Francisco is right there with them. Oakland especially is teetering on the bridge of collapse. These 5 teams have been the bottom dwellers of the NFL from a profitability perspective for almost 5 years now. The NFL is going to be lucky to remain intact as is at this point unless the owners get the CBA concessions they want from the players or they can move some teams overseas. More teams would have caused even bigger problems. If the economy doesn't turn around soon it is going to get ugly for a few existing franchises.
I believe that is pure propagandist BS. I believe every NFL team is exceedingly financially successful. I think they are just greedy and want more, more, more. I believe the owners make billions and the players make millions.
Figure this out: The Census Bureau says that the average U.S. family has earnings of a little over $50,000 per year. The average NFL salary works out to about $770,000. Now, it takes the average person 15.4 years to make the average NFL salary. The average lifetime earnings in this country is about 2 million dollars. An NFL player can make that in about 2.5 years in the league. Of course, God only knows what an NFL owner makes in a year. The only team whose books are open are the Green Bay Packers, and though they took a hit this past year, they still made 9.8 million....which is over and above ALL expenses of that organization:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5379673
So, let's say the average NFL player, with the added teams from the USFL made only 10-12 times the average US family.
(I wish to God I could have just one year like that in my life.). And that the owners only make a profit of 10 million per year (the Packers were averaging well over 20 million before last year).
I think that with the 36 teams I outline....everyone concerned would do quite, quite well financially, even in these worst of times.
I believe that is pure propagandist BS. I believe every NFL team is exceedingly financially successful. I think they are just greedy and want more, more, more. I believe the owners make billions and the players make millions.
Figure this out: The Census Bureau says that the average U.S. family has earnings of a little over $50,000 per year. The average NFL salary works out to about $770,000. Now, it takes the average person 15.4 years to make the average NFL salary. The average lifetime earnings in this country is about 2 million dollars. An NFL player can make that in about 2.5 years in the league. Of course, God only knows what an NFL owner makes in a year. The only team whose books are open are the Green Bay Packers, and though they took a hit this past year, they still made 9.8 million....which is over and above ALL expenses of that organization:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5379673
So, let's say the average NFL player, with the added teams from the USFL made only 10-12 times the average US family.
(I wish to God I could have just one year like that in my life.). And that the owners only make a profit of 10 million per year (the Packers were averaging well over 20 million before last year).
I think that with the 36 teams I outline....everyone concerned would do quite, quite well financially, even in these worst of times.
You're wrong, but entitiled to your opinion.
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I believe that is pure propagandist BS. I believe every NFL team is exceedingly financially successful. I think they are just greedy and want more, more, more. I believe the owners make billions and the players make millions.
Figure this out: The Census Bureau says that the average U.S. family has earnings of a little over $50,000 per year. The average NFL salary works out to about $770,000. Now, it takes the average person 15.4 years to make the average NFL salary. The average lifetime earnings in this country is about 2 million dollars. An NFL player can make that in about 2.5 years in the league. Of course, God only knows what an NFL owner makes in a year. The only team whose books are open are the Green Bay Packers, and though they took a hit this past year, they still made 9.8 million....which is over and above ALL expenses of that organization:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5379673
So, let's say the average NFL player, with the added teams from the USFL made only 10-12 times the average US family.
(I wish to God I could have just one year like that in my life.). And that the owners only make a profit of 10 million per year (the Packers were averaging well over 20 million before last year).
I think that with the 36 teams I outline....everyone concerned would do quite, quite well financially, even in these worst of times.
You're wrong, but entitiled to your opinion.
You're wrong, but entitiled to your opinion.
If it is an opinion I cannot be wrong, just different.
If it is a fact, I may be wrong, but I don't think I am.
You claim that there may be as many as 6 NFL teams in financial trouble. I claim that they are sublimely profitable, whereas before the economic dowturn they were obscenely profitable.
I think they are using the "poor economy" as simply leverage for the CBA negotiations to try to roll back the player salaries and to keep or enhance their obscene levels of profits.
My evidence is based on the only hard data that is available: The publicly owned Packers financial data.
There is no other viable evidence to support your claim.
Other owners may claim poor mouth, but like I said, that is pure propaganda in my opinion.
You want to prove your case? Have all 32 teams open up their financial data to independent analysis.
I suspect something like this may indeed be suggested by the NFLPA, but you know how far that will get? Bupkiss.
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Hey Gip, If I were to get in trouble would you be my lawyer-- You're pretty intense..
My question is, why shouldn't the owners make a greater share of the profits, they're the ones putting up the money..
This is capatialism man..When the people I worked for were driving Cadillacs I felt pretty good... When they started driving Yugo's I knew we were in trouble...
You do understand that they have owners meetings to see how they can maximize profits... It's a business...
Peace
T.Dawg
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The only team I would believe to be in financial trouble would be Jacksonville. Wouldn't Al Davis move back to LA if he were facing monetary difficulties?
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Hey Gip, If I were to get in trouble would you be my lawyer-- You're pretty intense..
My question is, why shouldn't the owners make a greater share of the profits, they're the ones putting up the money..
This is capatialism man..When the people I worked for were driving Cadillacs I felt pretty good... When they started driving Yugo's I knew we were in trouble...
You do understand that they have owners meetings to see how they can maximize profits... It's a business...
Peace
T.Dawg
Hey Gip, If I were to get in trouble would you be my lawyer-- You're pretty intense..
My question is, why shouldn't the owners make a greater share of the profits, they're the ones putting up the money..
This is capatialism man..When the people I worked for were driving Cadillacs I felt pretty good... When they started driving Yugo's I knew we were in trouble...
You do understand that they have owners meetings to see how they can maximize profits... It's a business...
Peace
T.Dawg
Except of course it is not like nearly every single other business in America. It has a Congressionally decreed monopoly.
And because of that, many people view that the ownership of a sports franchise is a public trust.
In fact, it was Daniel Snyder, certainly not one to not want to make a buck who said: We (owners) may carry the title, but the team belongs to the fans.
And I don't really have a problem with them making as much money as they can. Just don't go disrupting the season because you want to make more, more, more. Act like Trustees, not like those used car salesmen. The NFL owners are definitely driving a Cadillac, not a Yugo. Don't go throwing sugar in the gas tank.
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Want some financials? Click on the links on the left or the individual team names on the right.
http://www.forbes.com/2009/09/02/nfl-pro-f...9-nfl_land.html
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Want some financials? Click on the links on the left or the individual team names on the right.
http://www.forbes.com/2009/09/02/nfl-pro-f...9-nfl_land.html
Want some financials? Click on the links on the left or the individual team names on the right.
http://www.forbes.com/2009/09/02/nfl-pro-f...9-nfl_land.html
Nice.....just remember operating income isn't a profit line.
Operating income doesn't reflect things like taxes and interest payments, which for a operation the size of a NFL team can be sizable. Maybe we have some accountants in here who might know what else might not be reflected on the Op Income line of a financial statement.
The Browns for the year shown were projected at just over 20mil. I would think taxes and interest could eat up half that amount.
Going back to the Green Bay numbers which are known....it does show the teams profits are going down at a substantial rate while the expenses are moving up.
Good business dictates one recognize this trend and take action before the lines meet.
Owners don't have much price elasticity in what they charge for tickets, sponsorships, etc, so the only way to stop the trend is to cut other areas, and labor cost is the first area you address, especially since it is the cost driving up expenses above and beyond any of the other areas.
I think in the past owners could handle less profit, knowing their real payout was the investment in the business.
I think they are now seeing that valuation shrinking...and it makes sense...a team is only worth as much as someone is willing to pay for it.....just like a house. Your appraisal can say it is worth $400,000, but if all you get are offers for $250,000, your house is worth 250K.
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Want some financials? Click on the links on the left or the individual team names on the right.
http://www.forbes.com/2009/09/02/nfl-pro-f...9-nfl_land.html
Nice.....just remember operating income isn't a profit line.
Operating income doesn't reflect things like taxes and interest payments, which for a operation the size of a NFL team can be sizable. Maybe we have some accountants in here who might know what else might not be reflected on the Op Income line of a financial statement.
The Browns for the year shown were projected at just over 20mil. I would think taxes and interest could eat up half that amount.
Going back to the Green Bay numbers which are known....it does show the teams profits are going down at a substantial rate while the expenses are moving up.
Good business dictates one recognize this trend and take action before the lines meet.
Owners don't have much price elasticity in what they charge for tickets, sponsorships, etc, so the only way to stop the trend is to cut other areas, and labor cost is the first area you address, especially since it is the cost driving up expenses above and beyond any of the other areas.
I think in the past owners could handle less profit, knowing their real payout was the investment in the business.
I think they are now seeing that valuation shrinking...and it makes sense...a team is only worth as much as someone is willing to pay for it.....just like a house. Your appraisal can say it is worth $400,000, but if all you get are offers for $250,000, your house is worth 250K.
Nice.....just remember operating income isn't a profit line.
Operating income doesn't reflect things like taxes and interest payments, which for a operation the size of a NFL team can be sizable. Maybe we have some accountants in here who might know what else might not be reflected on the Op Income line of a financial statement.
The Browns for the year shown were projected at just over 20mil. I would think taxes and interest could eat up half that amount.
Going back to the Green Bay numbers which are known....it does show the teams profits are going down at a substantial rate while the expenses are moving up.
Good business dictates one recognize this trend and take action before the lines meet.
Owners don't have much price elasticity in what they charge for tickets, sponsorships, etc, so the only way to stop the trend is to cut other areas, and labor cost is the first area you address, especially since it is the cost driving up expenses above and beyond any of the other areas.
I think in the past owners could handle less profit, knowing their real payout was the investment in the business.
I think they are now seeing that valuation shrinking...and it makes sense...a team is only worth as much as someone is willing to pay for it.....just like a house. Your appraisal can say it is worth $400,000, but if all you get are offers for $250,000, your house is worth 250K.
A couple of matters: 1. I believe that business interest would in fact be a business expense and any profit would be shown only after the payment of that interest. Taxes on profit, no(not payroll taxes) because those taxes would be paid on the profit.
2. Nevertheless, a business that is making 90 mill in profit like the Redskins, or 70 mill like the Pats, or even only 20 mill like the Browns, still seems like a hugely successful venture to me.
And don't forget, the average $770,000.00 salaries being paid is all pre-profit expense.
My argument simply is that a 36 team NFL could still have been a fully viable economic Structure. It seems to me that if there were now 4 more teams, that would be 212 minimum more football players. So, maybe the average salary would only be $600,000.00 or 500K. That clearly would put them in the top 1% of all wage earners in the nation.
And the owners would still have enough to go around without going hungry, rest assured. Instead of 70 million in profit, maybe they make 60 million.
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