Chris Matthews: Gun Control Speech Coming Soon
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Let's try this one more time: you can be for stricter gun laws, like Dick Cheney suggests, and it doesn't mean you're trying to ban hunting and take away everyone's guns.
Stop being a shrieking hysteric.
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I'm not being any such thing.
We already have all the laws we need here in Ohio.
Any more laws, and it defies common sense, and is actually counter-productive,
and a violation of the 2nd Amendment.
If you want to restrict who can own a car, a knife, a rope, rat poison,
coat hangers, javelins, rocks, tree branches and hands, as well
as guns, then at least you'd be being consistent.
But, alas, there is no consistency in liberalville, your imaginary hometown.
Go ahead. Bet me that I can't find a bunch of articles where it is admitted that
gun restrictions are just a step in the total ban direction. And no, I didn't do a search ahead of time.
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Okay. I searched "gun control just a step in the total gun ban direction.
You try it. Here's a few of the best selections, just from the first page.
It's not "hysteria", Heck. It's reality. Check it out for yourself. And remember, I said it here,
BEFORE I went and looked it up.
You don't deal well with reality. And you don't seem to be able to
stay on any particular topic consistently.
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mediamatters.org/reports/200907290052 - Cached<LI sb_id="ms__id279"><H3 sb_id="ms__id282">U.S. Agrees to Timetable for UN Gun Ban | Gun Digest - The ... </H3>... is just the first step toward their plans for total gun confiscation. The worldwide gun control mob will ... Clinton steps in. Once the UN Gun Ban is ... Greatest Guns of Gun ...www.gundigest.com/article/U.S.%20Agrees%20to%20Timetable... - Cached<LI sb_id="ms__id288">
What is the difference between gun control and gun ban ... <LI sb_id="ms__id297">A gun ban means that guns "aren't allowed" or are even outlawed. At ... Gun control is "a good first step" towards a total gun ban, just ask chuck schumer, he says it all the ...answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080530221447AAebLak - Cached
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Furthermore, let me kick your backside once more:
It isn't any kind of "hysteria".
Here's the article from the first link above, since you won't read it otherwise:
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.S. Agrees to Timetable for UN Gun Banadmin | Jan 27, 2010 | Comments 0
The United Nations and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton are moving forward with their plan to confiscate your guns.The United States joined 152 other countries in support of the Arms Trade Treaty Resolution, which establishes the dates for the 2012 UN conference intended to attack American sovereignty by stripping Americans of the right to keep and bear arms.
Working groups of anti-gun countries will begin scripting language for the conference this year, creating a blueprint for other countries when they meet at the full conference.
The stakes couldn’t be higher.
Former United Nation’s ambassador John Bolton has cautioned gun owners about the Arms Trade Treaty and says the UN “is trying to act as though this is really just a treaty about international arms trade between nation states, but there’s no doubt that the real agenda here is domestic firearms control.”
Establishing the dates for the Arms Trade Treaty Conference is just the first step toward their plans for total gun confiscation.
The worldwide gun control mob will ensure the passage of an egregious, anti-gun treaty…
. . .and that’s where Secretary of State Hillary Clinton steps in.
Once the UN Gun Ban is passed by the General Assembly of the United Nations it must be ratified by each nation, including the United States.
As an arch enemy of gun owners, Clinton has pledged to push the U.S. Senate to ratify the treaty. She will push for passage of this outrageous treaty designed to register, ban and CONFISCATE firearms owned by private citizens like YOU. Read more
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Dick Cheney says we should look at limiting magazine size.
"I'd certainly be willing to listen to ideas. I have always been a gun advocate, obviously had a strong voting record on behalf of the Second Amendment. That's just what I believe, and whether or not there's some measure there in terms of limiting the size of the magazine that you can buy to go with semi-automatic weapons -- we've had that in place before. Maybe it's appropriate to reestablish that kind of thing, but I think you do have to be careful, obviously."
Dick Cheney says we should look at limiting magazine size.
"I'd certainly be willing to listen to ideas. I have always been a gun advocate, obviously had a strong voting record on behalf of the Second Amendment. That's just what I believe, and whether or not there's some measure there in terms of limiting the size of the magazine that you can buy to go with semi-automatic weapons -- we've had that in place before. Maybe it's appropriate to reestablish that kind of thing, but I think you do have to be careful, obviously."
I'm 100% positive the wackos that currently own "Extenze flavored" magazines will be willing to hand them in if a "new law" is enacted prohibiting them.
Because when I am getting ready to go on a shooting rampage, and editing my youtube manifestos, I make a quick trip to the local constable to make sure I'm using the right sized magazine. I'd hate to break a law, when I'm out killing folks.
Embarrassing.
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Aren't you sort of missing the point, Leg? No one is imagining the scenario you're imagining, so pointing out how ridiculous it is isn't a very good argument.
Unless you can find me someone out there suggesting that if we enact the kind of restrictions Dick Cheney is talking about lunatics will hand in their extended magazines.
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Aren't you sort of missing the point, Leg? No one is imagining the scenario you're imagining, so pointing out how ridiculous it is isn't a very good argument.
Unless you can find me someone out there suggesting that if we enact the kind of restrictions Dick Cheney is talking about lunatics will hand in their extended magazines.
Aren't you sort of missing the point, Leg? No one is imagining the scenario you're imagining, so pointing out how ridiculous it is isn't a very good argument.
Unless you can find me someone out there suggesting that if we enact the kind of restrictions Dick Cheney is talking about lunatics will hand in their extended magazines.
You're not suggesting that there aren't plenty of reasonably sane Americans who'd like to see guns banned altogether are you Heck?
They might see this as a step in the right direction.
I was gonna end with a "no?"
WSS
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Aren't you sort of missing the point, Leg? No one is imagining the scenario you're imagining, so pointing out how ridiculous it is isn't a very good argument.
Unless you can find me someone out there suggesting that if we enact the kind of restrictions Dick Cheney is talking about lunatics will hand in their extended magazines.
Aren't you sort of missing the point, Leg? No one is imagining the scenario you're imagining, so pointing out how ridiculous it is isn't a very good argument.
Unless you can find me someone out there suggesting that if we enact the kind of restrictions Dick Cheney is talking about lunatics will hand in their extended magazines.
No, you're sort of missing the point. My point is that a new law wont fix the problem of extended magazines currently in the hands of nut-jobs. I'm saying they wont be lining up to hand in the newly illegal clips. (Remember: the nut-jobs are the problem, not the magazine size.) Therefore, a new law isn't the solution, but colossal waste of legislative resources.
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For example:
The nutcases who went into the Colorado school and shot up the place?
They had more than one weapon.
Reduce the size of a 20 shot clip, to only 10 shots allowable,
and a nutcase will simply carry two pistols to act out in violent crime.
But, I think the anti gun wackos know that.
After the clip smaller size doesn't work, then they can happily
call for a ban of all guns.
It isn't the guns. A mother drove her car into a lake, and her young sons drowned.
People get stabbed. Auto hit and run murders.
There is a good reason why the Nazi's took all the guns from the German people.
Note: there is a statue of a pistol with a twisted barrel at the U.N.
Don't go there with "gee, all we have to do is er... restrict ownership just a wee bit more"
Nobody believes that.
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Aren't you sort of missing the point, Leg? No one is imagining the scenario you're imagining, so pointing out how ridiculous it is isn't a very good argument.
Unless you can find me someone out there suggesting that if we enact the kind of restrictions Dick Cheney is talking about lunatics will hand in their extended magazines.
You're not suggesting that there aren't plenty of reasonably sane Americans who'd like to see guns banned altogether are you Heck?
They might see this as a step in the right direction.
I was gonna end with a "no?"
WSS
You're not suggesting that there aren't plenty of reasonably sane Americans who'd like to see guns banned altogether are you Heck?
They might see this as a step in the right direction.
I was gonna end with a "no?"
WSS
There are some, sure. And they're also irrelevant because it'd clearly be unconstitutional to do so. And they're even more irrelevant because I'm not sure you could find a single member of Congress who takes that position, or even something close to that.
No one is seriously trying to "take away your guns", nor could they. This is why people who trade in that kind of stuff are woefully uninformed or paranoid, probably both.
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Aren't you sort of missing the point, Leg? No one is imagining the scenario you're imagining, so pointing out how ridiculous it is isn't a very good argument.
Unless you can find me someone out there suggesting that if we enact the kind of restrictions Dick Cheney is talking about lunatics will hand in their extended magazines.
No, you're sort of missing the point. My point is that a new law wont fix the problem of extended magazines currently in the hands of nut-jobs. I'm saying they wont be lining up to hand in the newly illegal clips. (Remember: the nut-jobs are the problem, not the magazine size.) Therefore, a new law isn't the solution, but colossal waste of legislative resources.
No, you're sort of missing the point. My point is that a new law wont fix the problem of extended magazines currently in the hands of nut-jobs. I'm saying they wont be lining up to hand in the newly illegal clips. (Remember: the nut-jobs are the problem, not the magazine size.) Therefore, a new law isn't the solution, but colossal waste of legislative resources.
I know what your point is, and that's exactly what my comment was referring to. I'm saying those are not very good arguments. Because they're not.
And why would you imagine that magazine restrictions would only be designed to stop this exact incident, with this exact type of nutjob, from happening again? Again, you're missing the point by focusing on the idea that any new law would be a) a foolproof way to stop this type of thing from happening again, or
would get nutjobs to hand in their illegal clips. But that wouldn't be the point of new legislation. Also, it seems clear that if this nutjob hadn't been able to so easily obtain an extended magazine he wouldn't have been able to shoot so many people so quickly. And we also know that he was stopped when he finally had to reload.
So here's the upside of the law: in some situations, these types of events won't bring the same body count.
Or let me give you another example: the cops pull over a guy with a small arsenal of legal guns, but with illegal magazine clips, on his way to shoot up the ACLU and Tides Foundation. In addition to charging him with conspiracy to commit murder, you can charge him with additional firearm violations and get him off the streets for a longer period of time.
Or here's another example: a cop pulls a nutjob like Jared Loughner and finds his gun with an extended ammo clip. Jared gets arrested, found to be insane, and put in the system and can no longer legally obtain a gun.
The downside of the legislation: some people will have to reload more often at shooting ranges.
Now, is that a common sense gun law? We've had it before, and recently. Seems to make sense to me. Will it make a huge dent in gun crimes in America? I wouldn't think so, but it would have some impact, and would not violate anyone's 2nd Amendment rights. If you need to own a gun for your personal protection, it's hard to imagine a scenario where you're in a shootout requiring 30 rounds at once. These clips will be used almost exclusively by gang members, criminals, and people on murder sprees. I don't see the need to defend that.
So I don't think it's a colossal waste of legislative time at all. Assault weapons bans can be riddled with holes and end up being more for show than anything, but that's no reason we shouldn't try to make one that isn't riddled with holes.
PS - When did cops shoot the guy who wanted to kill everyone at the ACLU and the Tides Foundation? When he paused to reload.
PPS - In addition to Dick Cheney, cops also don't like extended magazines in the hands of nutjobs and criminals. So let's stop pretending this is some bleeding heart issue driven by people who want to ban guns altogether.
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Also, does anyone want to guess where that guy was inspired to "start a revolution" by shooting up the ACLU and the Tides Foundation, the latter being an obscure environmental organization that no one had ever heard of until recently?
Just take a guess.
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A former Bush aid was murdered and dumped in a dumpster.
Sarah Palin gets death threats from the left.
President Reagan was shot.
Sarah Palin's children receive death threats.
Want to know where those violent, threatening people get their ideas?
From you and Shep, maybe. From CNN and MSNBS, Solon and MoveonupObamaosshorts.orgy.
There isn't any "paranoia" when we can point out, that Hillary and Obamao et all, AGREE with
the UN's stance on disarming civilian populations. As a non-gun owner, Heck, you are out in left field,
and don't understand gun owenship, responsibilities, and the attacks on gun ownership.
If you applied the same rationalization to other murders, Heck, it isn't guns that consistently is used
by nutcases in the crimes. So, you tell me, why is it, that ONLY guns are targeted @@ for "restrictions" and
not any other weapon? That in itself, is a leading indicator of the bigotry toward gun ownership, and also,
the ulterior motives of those on the left who espouse gun control, knowing full well it won't stop that crime.
Was Bobby Kennedy killed with a pistol with a huge clip? Take a guess, Heck...
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Nah, you won't answer that question, like you ignore the UN stuff, with Hillary and Obamao support.... etc.
I suppose we should limit revolvers to TWO shots, eh?
It's all bogus, beyond common sense. And the ulterior motive is, yes it is...
banning hunting, and gun ownership.
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"Convicted assassin Sirhan Sirhan shot and killed Presidential candidate United States Senator Robert F. Kennedy in Los Angeles, California on 5 June 1968 with an eight-shot Iver Johnson .22 caliber Cadet 55-A revolver (serial number H-53725, Trial-People's Exhibit #6, misidentified in trial testimony as S/N H-18602).".
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Again, Cal, you're not understanding what I'm writing. No one is suggesting that a law like this would stop all gun crimes. Don't be ridiculous and hysterical.
Anyone else?
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No, you're sort of missing the point. My point is that a new law wont fix the problem of extended magazines currently in the hands of nut-jobs. I'm saying they wont be lining up to hand in the newly illegal clips. (Remember: the nut-jobs are the problem, not the magazine size.) Therefore, a new law isn't the solution, but colossal waste of legislative resources.
I know what your point is, and that's exactly what my comment was referring to. I'm saying those are not very good arguments. Because they're not.
And why would you imagine that magazine restrictions would only be designed to stop this exact incident, with this exact type of nutjob, from happening again? Again, you're missing the point by focusing on the idea that any new law would be a) a foolproof way to stop this type of thing from happening again, or
would get nutjobs to hand in their illegal clips. But that wouldn't be the point of new legislation. Also, it seems clear that if this nutjob hadn't been able to so easily obtain an extended magazine he wouldn't have been able to shoot so many people so quickly. And we also know that he was stopped when he finally had to reload.
So here's the upside of the law: in some situations, these types of events won't bring the same body count.
Or let me give you another example: the cops pull over a guy with a small arsenal of legal guns, but with illegal magazine clips, on his way to shoot up the ACLU and Tides Foundation. In addition to charging him with conspiracy to commit murder, you can charge him with additional firearm violations and get him off the streets for a longer period of time.
Or here's another example: a cop pulls a nutjob like Jared Loughner and finds his gun with an extended ammo clip. Jared gets arrested, found to be insane, and put in the system and can no longer legally obtain a gun.
The downside of the legislation: some people will have to reload more often at shooting ranges.
Now, is that a common sense gun law? We've had it before, and recently. Seems to make sense to me. Will it make a huge dent in gun crimes in America? I wouldn't think so, but it would have some impact, and would not violate anyone's 2nd Amendment rights. If you need to own a gun for your personal protection, it's hard to imagine a scenario where you're in a shootout requiring 30 rounds at once. These clips will be used almost exclusively by gang members, criminals, and people on murder sprees. I don't see the need to defend that.
So I don't think it's a colossal waste of legislative time at all. Assault weapons bans can be riddled with holes and end up being more for show than anything, but that's no reason we shouldn't try to make one that isn't riddled with holes.
PS - When did cops shoot the guy who wanted to kill everyone at the ACLU and the Tides Foundation? When he paused to reload.
PPS - In addition to Dick Cheney, cops also don't like extended magazines in the hands of nutjobs and criminals. So let's stop pretending this is some bleeding heart issue driven by people who want to ban guns altogether.
I know what your point is, and that's exactly what my comment was referring to. I'm saying those are not very good arguments. Because they're not.
And why would you imagine that magazine restrictions would only be designed to stop this exact incident, with this exact type of nutjob, from happening again? Again, you're missing the point by focusing on the idea that any new law would be a) a foolproof way to stop this type of thing from happening again, or
would get nutjobs to hand in their illegal clips. But that wouldn't be the point of new legislation. Also, it seems clear that if this nutjob hadn't been able to so easily obtain an extended magazine he wouldn't have been able to shoot so many people so quickly. And we also know that he was stopped when he finally had to reload.
The magazine could have been obtained just the same, as it is a magazine currently in existence. He might have been stopped sooner if somebody else in the audience had a firearm.
So here's the upside of the law: in some situations, these types of events won't bring the same body count.
In what way? Pretty sure he was arming himself with what he wanted to, not with simply what was available to him.
Or let me give you another example: the cops pull over a guy with a small arsenal of legal guns, but with illegal magazine clips, on his way to shoot up the ACLU and Tides Foundation. In addition to charging him with conspiracy to commit murder, you can charge him with additional firearm violations and get him off the streets for a longer period of time.
Or here's another example: a cop pulls a nutjob like Jared Loughner and finds his gun with an extended ammo clip. Jared gets arrested, found to be insane, and put in the system and can no longer legally obtain a gun.
Holy hypotheticals, Batman. Were extended clips to be illegal, would Jared have been brandishing them out the window like a moron to initiate the routine traffic stop? wtf? Or do suddenly illegal extended magazines now come with a bumper sticker that says "xxxx a warrant, search me anyway"? Why wasn't he stopped this time?
The downside of the legislation: some people will have to reload more often at shooting ranges.
Now, is that a common sense gun law? We've had it before, and recently. Seems to make sense to me. Will it make a huge dent in gun crimes in America? I wouldn't think so, but it would have some impact, and would not violate anyone's 2nd Amendment rights. If you need to own a gun for your personal protection, it's hard to imagine a scenario where you're in a shootout requiring 30 rounds at once. These clips will be used almost exclusively by gang members, criminals, and people on murder sprees. I don't see the need to defend that.
Right. Because if there is one way to keep contraband off the streets and out of the hands of delinquents, that's to criminalize it.
So I don't think it's a colossal waste of legislative time at all. Assault weapons bans can be riddled with holes and end up being more for show than anything, but that's no reason we shouldn't try to make one that isn't riddled with holes.
There are two amendments to our Constitution that would strongly disagree with you.
PS - When did cops shoot the guy who wanted to kill everyone at the ACLU and the Tides Foundation? When he paused to reload.
PPS - In addition to Dick Cheney, cops also don't like extended magazines in the hands of nutjobs and criminals. So let's stop pretending this is some bleeding heart issue driven by people who want to ban guns altogether.
Exactly - but they WILL NOT DISAPPEAR JUST BECAUSE THEY ARE ILLEGAL. See Marijauna, cocaine, and the thousands of illegal fire-arms currently populating our streets and putting our police officers in danger.
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Just for your information almost anyone can make an extended magazine.
So it wont matter if there is a law or not, those who want one will still be able to make one or have one made.
But the typical whining knee jerk liberal will want to create new laws and regulations against law abiding citizens.
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Again, Leg, can you make your argument without arguing against a point that I'm not making? Every point you just made used the same tactic.
And the assault weapons ban was constitutional, remember? It had a ban on this type of magazine. It was the law of the land, and recently. Why would you think that re-upping the ban would be unconstitutional now? It wouldn't be.
As for your scoffing at the idea that making a certain type of ammunition clip "contraband" would have no impact, that's sort of a lazy argument too. Much like scoffing at the notion that cops often find illegal material in a person's car when they pull them over. These are scenarios that are just too impossible for you to imagine? Really? Cops don't search vehicles?
Come on. You can do better than pretending.
What's your rationale for keeping a clip that size? Why would one need one to defend their home, or for protection, or hunting?
What about "cop killer" bullets? What's the rationale for those?
What guns laws would you like to see?
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Again, Leg, can you make your argument without arguing against a point that I'm not making? Every point you just made used the same tactic.
And the assault weapons ban was constitutional, remember? It had a ban on this type of magazine. It was the law of the land, and recently. Why would you think that re-upping the ban would be unconstitutional now? It wouldn't be.
As for your scoffing at the idea that making a certain type of ammunition clip "contraband" would have no impact, that's sort of a lazy argument too. Much like scoffing at the notion that cops often find illegal material in a person's car when they pull them over. These are scenarios that are just too impossible for you to imagine? Really? Cops don't search vehicles?
Come on. You can do better than pretending.
What's your rationale for keeping a clip that size? Why would one need one to defend their home, or for protection, or hunting?
What about "cop killer" bullets? What's the rationale for those?
What guns laws would you like to see?
Again, Leg, can you make your argument without arguing against a point that I'm not making? Every point you just made used the same tactic.
And the assault weapons ban was constitutional, remember? It had a ban on this type of magazine. It was the law of the land, and recently. Why would you think that re-upping the ban would be unconstitutional now? It wouldn't be.
As for your scoffing at the idea that making a certain type of ammunition clip "contraband" would have no impact, that's sort of a lazy argument too. Much like scoffing at the notion that cops often find illegal material in a person's car when they pull them over. These are scenarios that are just too impossible for you to imagine? Really? Cops don't search vehicles?
Come on. You can do better than pretending.
What's your rationale for keeping a clip that size? Why would one need one to defend their home, or for protection, or hunting?
What about "cop killer" bullets? What's the rationale for those?
What guns laws would you like to see?
Which arguments exactly are you not making? The list of hypotheticals? The wall of hyperbole you're asking everyone to climb in order to have a simple discussion?
I'm scoffing at the notion of simply making something contraband in an effort to eradicate its presence/use because I BACKED IT UP WITH EVIDENCE. Amendments 18 & 21 specifically. Weed. Coke. Anything else that even a preacher could obtain with a phone-call or two. A Tuesday for Andy Dick.
The Assault weapons ban didn't actually ban fully automatic weapons. Only semi-autos. Like banning Bartles & James vs banning moonshine. Since its inception, we've had Columbine, VaTech, Az, the Pennsylvania Amish thing, among others. Way to go Congress! #fail
Of course cops find illegal items during routine stops. But you're tossing out a ton of "what if's" that I'm exposing as "whiffs." Sure a cop could have pulled Jared over and iced him for having an illegal clip, but he didn't because there was no cause to pull him over in the 1st place. For your argument to work, you'd have to allow the police to step up their profiling game. I'm certain you don't want that.
Here's one: What if a drunk driver ran an intersection and killed Jared as he was making his way to the rally? Maybe we should bring drunk driving back on the table. Afterall, look what we would have prevented in magical what-if land.
Cop Killer bullets? Seriously, Tipper? You mean the bullets invented by a police officer right? Look, Criminals will always have access to things they aren't supposed to. Shuffling "the list" every few years wont change that.
I'm kind of more interested in how our government intends to dream up 2 trillion dollars. And get our infrastructure out of the Mayberry ages. Replace our power-grid with something efficient. You keep worrying over the difference between killing 6 people, vs 3 people.
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