Your Opinion?
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In some ways I think we might come out ahead....as long as real camp isn't missed.
I think this will put us in to more walk through type practices rather then hitting practices.
Back in the day, camp was used to get players in shape after driving cabs or selling beer all winter and spring long.
If players in those times were only 50% in shape heading in to camp, todays players are 85% in shape heading in to camp.
No doubt you need to be in football shape...I just don't think it takes as long....so we might end up fresher and crisper throughout the season.
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My expectations are huge re the Brown's this season but the reality of the strike and it's efffect on unit cohesiveness and the tall task of implementing a new o and d leaves
me with a bad feeling in my stomach. If and when camp starts the players and coaches are going to be so far behind the power curve that anything above the players
learning what their coachs expect and a fundamental grasping of the new o and d schemes seems remote. The bonds not developed in off season practice sessions and not getting
some real time experience on the field with the new coaches sure won't speed up the velocity of this train.
OTH, every other team will be going through similar growing pains so wtf over.
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The consensus opinion is that any team going into this year with a new coach/system/QB is going to be behind the 8 ball because of the lockout. I can understand that opinion, but it is just a generalization. Though, I think the lockout will be less of a factor the sooner they get going.
The real factor for the Browns is simply the fact that they are again starting over with a complete new system both offensively and defensively. If they didn't miss a day of practices they would have had a "growing period" to implement their new offense and defense.
This brings up a question in my mind which I am going to try to put in a new trivia thread. Stay tuned.
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Im staying out of this argument...Every time I express an opinion of or about Mangini I get toasted for it. I thought I lived in America...LOL. Im just gonna say "It is what it is'....Let the chips fall where they may...We have to live with what happens...The deeper in we go without an agreement points to haviong no season.
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I do certainly hope I'm wrong with what I said, but I really think you guys are wildly underestimating what OTA's and minicamps mean to a young team. All those things create a bond that's required for a team to grow. The veteran groups don't really need that type of thing, but we do. It may not seem like a big deal, but switching to a new coach with a new offensive scheme, a whole new defensive scheme AND a whole bunch of starters are rookies or have less than 3 years experience. I'm trying to look at the glass half full, but you can't just overlook all of that guys. Let's hope those informal workouts we've been having are working wonders.
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i for one think we never should have changed coaches and systems. ok i get it that holmgren is running the team but when does he stop being a guru and start being an al davis? mangini cleaned out the locker room, brought in tough quality players and if not for a dysfunctional illequipped offense would have probably kept his job.
don't want to start the old argument with fans who can't stand not 'winning now' and would trade away a paul warfield (quality)for a t.o. (cancer) cuz they could get to the lombardi trophy a little quicker, BUT i guess i will.
i really hope that we can all cheer for a winning browns team this year (pleez god!!!) and through spit and vinegar will admit to my wrongs when it comes to holmgren if this staff can pull off a winner within two years. BUT if not i'll call all you fxxkin holmgren fans on it while he's headed out to pasture to wrangle wranglers next to his old cow hand brett 'wonder boy look-at-my-junk' favre.
i for one think we never should have changed coaches and systems. ok i get it that holmgren is running the team but when does he stop being a guru and start being an al davis? mangini cleaned out the locker room, brought in tough quality players and if not for a dysfunctional illequipped offense would have probably kept his job.
don't want to start the old argument with fans who can't stand not 'winning now' and would trade away a paul warfield (quality)for a t.o. (cancer) cuz they could get to the lombardi trophy a little quicker, BUT i guess i will.
i really hope that we can all cheer for a winning browns team this year (pleez god!!!) and through spit and vinegar will admit to my wrongs when it comes to holmgren if this staff can pull off a winner within two years. BUT if not i'll call all you fxxkin holmgren fans on it while he's headed out to pasture to wrangle wranglers next to his old cow hand brett 'wonder boy look-at-my-junk' favre.
I agree with this sentiment.
But now that Shurmur is here, he has my full support. Just will suck if we suck because the owners and players all suck.
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i for one think we never should have changed coaches and systems. ok i get it that holmgren is running the team but when does he stop being a guru and start being an al davis? mangini cleaned out the locker room, brought in tough quality players and if not for a dysfunctional illequipped offense would have probably kept his job.
don't want to start the old argument with fans who can't stand not 'winning now' and would trade away a paul warfield (quality)for a t.o. (cancer) cuz they could get to the lombardi trophy a little quicker, BUT i guess i will.
i really hope that we can all cheer for a winning browns team this year (pleez god!!!) and through spit and vinegar will admit to my wrongs when it comes to holmgren if this staff can pull off a winner within two years. BUT if not i'll call all you fxxkin holmgren fans on it while he's headed out to pasture to wrangle wranglers next to his old cow hand brett 'wonder boy look-at-my-junk' favre.
I agree with this sentiment.
But now that Shurmur is here, he has my full support. Just will suck if we suck because the owners and players all suck.
Just will suck if we suck because the owners and players all suck.
hilarious!! good use of the word suck. yeah shurmur has got my support too. i just hope this new front office will stop this merry-go-round of coaching changes we've seen over the past 10+ years. just want to see the browns win a super bowl before i croak.
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Just will suck if we suck because the owners and players all suck.
hilarious!! good use of the word suck. yeah shurmur has got my support too. i just hope this new front office will stop this merry-go-round of coaching changes we've seen over the past 10+ years. just want to see the browns win a super bowl before i croak.
hilarious!! good use of the word suck. yeah shurmur has got my support too. i just hope this new front office will stop this merry-go-round of coaching changes we've seen over the past 10+ years. just want to see the browns win a super bowl before i croak.
Too late:
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Too late:
i finally got it. croak. what a knee-slapper!
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I will stick with my guns and i am glad that shurmur is the new coach but given the circumstances surrounding the browns and the league its going to be a rougher start than it had to be, but if there is football this year i still believe at some point in the season we will see good things happen and will still fare better overall than we would have under mangini..
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Offense will be better this year, but the defense will take two steps backwards imo. Im not worried about Shurmur and the effects of the lockout. We'll be OKAY...
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@king-ghoolie-lives said:
Shurmur, Mangini?
A difference? Good F%@#ing grief. Hey, I know, let's compare a Dyson Vacum Cleaner against a Shark?
Of course it isn't going to make a flipping difference. We just used a freaking 1st round pick to draft Gerrard Warren............... AGAIN...........
How the F_ _ K are the Browns going to win football games without a stellar QB, WRs, RB, DBs, LBs or DEs?
Yeah, yeah, I know, you love Peyton Hillis. When everyone puts 8 in the box and stuffs him, leaving us to a Kosar-like 3 yard pass on 3'd and 9, don't go around scratching your backside in bewilderment.
The Browns are very, very low on talent at the skilled positions. This has never translated into wins in the NFL and it isn't going to start now.
You have a 5 win team being run by a vacant, passionless owner, who handed off to a fat, one-foot-in-the-grave football exec who has no more fire in his belly for football than does Lerner.
Shit runs downhill. Lerner is shit, his Father was shit and begat shit. Randy gave us shit Phil Sewage (Coffe Fetcher for Ozzie) and Shit Romeo (coffee fetcher for Belichik).
Once again, Lerner tricks dummie Browns fans by hiring a "HE WAS SOMEONE ONCE" guy, so that they will again be pacified while waiting for Holmgren to produce.
Guess what? Holmgren ain'g gonna produce. He is going to sit on his fat ass until he gets a nice fat check for his "great contributions to the Browns.
5 - 11. That's the upside.
I'll agree the Browns need talent at the skill positions- but once you get past qb, it doesn't matter much. The Ravens won a Super Bowl with a s**t offense, and a great defense. Here's the list of the top 100 players in the NFL- as voted on by the players.
BTW, the list is about evenly divided between offense and defense. And plenty of fat defensive guys on the list, and about as many corners as WRs. The Browns have two guys in the top 100- Cribbs and Joe Thomas- and I'd debate that Joe is better than Jake Long.
As to skill positions, the last Super Bowl contestants- the Packers and the Steelers have a total of 5 players in the top 25- and four of them play defense. So there.
5-11 may be realistic Tom- new coach, new system- and no time to integrate either because of the lockout.
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@king-ghoolie-lives said:
Shurmur, Mangini?
A difference? Good F%@#ing grief. Hey, I know, let's compare a Dyson Vacum Cleaner against a Shark?
Of course it isn't going to make a flipping diffeence. We just used a freaking 1st round pick to draft Gerrard Warren............... AGAIN...........
How the F_ _ K are the Browns going to win football games without a stellar QB, WRs, RB, DBs, LBs or DEs?
Yeah, yeah, I know, you love Peyton Hillis. WHen everyone puts 8 in the box and stuffs him, leaving us to a Kosar-like 3 yard pass on 3'd and 9, don't go around scratching your backside in bewilderment.
The Browns are very, very low on talent at the skilled positions. This has never translated into wins in the NFL and it isn't going to start now.
You have a 5 win team being run by a vacant, passionless owner, who handed off to a fat, one-foot-in-the-grave football exec who has no more fire in his belly for football than does Lerner.
Shit runs downhill. Lerner is shit, his Father was shit and begat shit. Randy gave us shit Phil Sewage (Coffe Fetcher for Ozzie) and Shit Romeo (coffee fetcher for Belichik).
Once again, Lerner tricks dummie Browns fans by hiring a "HE WAS SOMEONE ONCE" guy, so that they will again be pacified while waiting for Holmgren to produce.
Guess what? Holmgren ain'g gonna produce. He is going to sit on his fat ass until he gets a nice fat check for his "great contributions to the Browns.
5 - 11. That's the upside.
I think you are under estimating our draft, and our skill position.
We could potentially have a good QB in McCoy, and a very good WR in Greg Little. At running back we have Hillis so I don't understand why you would include RB on your list. DB wise we have 2 future stars in Haden and Ward. LB we Fujita who played very well last year. I am also sure we will make some moves in free agency ... and I would be suprised if a DE and another WR weren't a high priority.
And don't forget about Watson who is a pretty good TE and we have some nice young potential behind him to make plays.
I also think that Robiskie (although I am not a huge fan of his) has a chance to do better as a WCO WR because the system matches his skill set a little bit better then what we were doing.
Do I think this is all going to translate into a 12-4 playoff team??? of course not. I do think we will be better then 5-11 as long as the lockout is settled soon and not in september.
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@king-ghoolie-lives said:
Shurmur, Mangini?
A difference? Good F%@#ing grief. Hey, I know, let's compare a Dyson Vacum Cleaner against a Shark?
Of course it isn't going to make a flipping diffeence. We just used a freaking 1st round pick to draft Gerrard Warren............... AGAIN...........
How the F_ _ K are the Browns going to win football games without a stellar QB, WRs, RB, DBs, LBs or DEs?
Yeah, yeah, I know, you love Peyton Hillis. WHen everyone puts 8 in the box and stuffs him, leaving us to a Kosar-like 3 yard pass on 3'd and 9, don't go around scratching your backside in bewilderment.
The Browns are very, very low on talent at the skilled positions. This has never translated into wins in the NFL and it isn't going to start now.
You have a 5 win team being run by a vacant, passionless owner, who handed off to a fat, one-foot-in-the-grave football exec who has no more fire in his belly for football than does Lerner.
Shit runs downhill. Lerner is shit, his Father was shit and begat shit. Randy gave us shit Phil Sewage (Coffe Fetcher for Ozzie) and Shit Romeo (coffee fetcher for Belichik).
Once again, Lerner tricks dummie Browns fans by hiring a "HE WAS SOMEONE ONCE" guy, so that they will again be pacified while waiting for Holmgren to produce.
Guess what? Holmgren ain'g gonna produce. He is going to sit on his fat ass until he gets a nice fat check for his "great contributions to the Browns.
5 - 11. That's the upside.
gotta say that that is without a doubt one of my top 10 browns fan's rants of all time.
simply superb.
realistically i think the browns are screwed this year only because of the lockout and the change of schemes. plenty of players/coaches have already said that it's gonna be a detriment to their team and those were teams that were pretty established before the lockout. to think it's not gonna cause a lot of problems for the browns is just wishful thinking at it's worst.
the good news is that the browns seem to be making steady improvement and would be a contender in any other division next year (if everything stays on track, and developes at either same or better than last year) for division champs and will definately have a much improved team/record for the 2012 year.
this year? sorry, but it's gonna be another year of top 10 draft selections.
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