James Harrison
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mikeyP72 said:
How do you ignore users on this new board?
Please do. One less mongoloid to follow me around.
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mikeyP72 said:
How do you ignore users on this new board?
Please do. One less mongoloid to follow me around.
Homotron said:
Please do. One less mongoloid to follow me around.
Homo is obviously mentally challenged. He feels a strong need to be here.
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Homotron said:
Please do. One less mongoloid to follow me around.
Homo is obviously mentally challenged. He feels a strong need to be here.
Homo is obviously mentally challenged. He feels a strong need to be here.
Prior to a few cute threads I hadn't posted in a few months. I'm happy to just read but the "mentally challenged" here are hard to ignore. Don't be one of them.
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I think you missed Riffers point totally. While its true the injuries havent affected your team as bad. Theres this thing called "Luck". And your team has had more than its fair share of it. the AFCN is not the strongest division in Football by virtue of the Browns not doing well and the Bungles self imploding at every turn. The Ravens are still growing with Joe Flacco who looks like he's getting there. Now you compound that with the Browns coaching carousel and the injuries that have struck us to the point of science fiction in terms of volume, its not even remotely close. The Steelers have been running the same scheme basically for years. Run the ball and play tough, smart defense. The Browns since it re-birth have not had stability in any area, Except ownership. Its a little easier when you have someone of the quality of Kevin Colbert running the ship for what almost better than a decade if not more?. The Steelers have been very VERY lucky and thats not taking away from them being a talented team, they are. But trying to compare the Browns injuries to the Steelers injuries is a huge reach. One team has had major stability while one is still trying to find itself. But winning championships are not annointed just because your talented enough. It takes a considerable amount of teamwork and "Luck". The ball has bounced your way favorably. Kevin Colbert, Dick LeBeau and Troy Polamalu are not gonna live forever. Dont be foolish enough to sit there and think the "Luck" is gonna last forever, It wont. It never does.
Seems as if you're putting a whole HELL of a lot on Luck rather than on merit and running a tight ship from top to bottom. Kevin Colbert is still young for a front office guru. Unless he decides to retire he'll be running the Steelers front office for a good long while. Fact of the matter is what you call "luck" isn't luck at all but several well calculated pieces that make up a much larger puzzle. Yes there is "luck" involved in football but I'm more a fate guy than a luck guy and the misconception that "luck" is what gets you over the hump is both short sighted and naive. If we're being honest with ourselves the down fall of the Browns hasn't been about being unlucky but rather a matter of quite honestly, not being very good. You've "lucked" your way in to top 10 draft picks for the last flipping decade and only a few have shown for anything. Poor front office decisions, poor coaching hires, poor drafting, poor player management. All the instances of staff infection which is flat out medical staff ignorance as far as I'm concerned. It was like a epidemic. Dick Lebeau isn't going to be doing his thing for much longer and I wouldn't be surprised if Polamalu retires soon. (Season or two) Sooooooo Nickers I don't really believe in "luck" because "luck" hasn't gotten me anywhere in life, I have. The same can be said for the best teams in any sport, the best companies in any market and the best teachers in any school. It's not about "LUCK" because "LUCK" nickers is for those unwilling to look at the reality that sits before them. It's an excuse. Plain and simple. The Steelers are good for a reason and it sure as Sh.it isn't about luck.
Homotron said:
Seems as if you're putting a whole HELL of a lot on Luck rather than on merit and running a tight ship from top to bottom. Kevin Colbert is still young for a front office guru. Unless he decides to retire he'll be running the Steelers front office for a good long while. Fact of the matter is what you call "luck" isn't luck at all but several well calculated pieces that make up a much larger puzzle. Yes there is "luck" involved in football but I'm more a fate guy than a luck guy and the misconception that "luck" is what gets you over the hump is both short sighted and naive. If we're being honest with ourselves the down fall of the Browns hasn't been about being unlucky but rather a matter of quite honestly, not being very good. You've "lucked" your way in to top 10 draft picks for the last flipping decade and only a few have shown for anything. Poor front office decisions, poor coaching hires, poor drafting, poor player management. All the instances of staff infection which is flat out medical staff ignorance as far as I'm concerned. It was like a epidemic. Dick Lebeau isn't going to be doing his thing for much longer and I wouldn't be surprised if Polamalu retires soon. (Season or two) Sooooooo Nickers I don't really believe in "luck" because "luck" hasn't gotten me anywhere in life, I have. The same can be said for the best teams in any sport, the best companies in any market and the best teachers in any school. It's not about "LUCK" because "LUCK" nickers is for those unwilling to look at the reality that sits before them. It's an excuse. Plain and simple. The Steelers are good for a reason and it sure as Sh.it isn't about luck.
Your so naive. Im not saying luck is the only ingredient,however, It plays a bigger part than you think. If you think every successful team,business or whatever institution makes it to the top because of fate alone. your totally dead wrong. thats like saying just because a farmer is a good farmer, it means he will have a bountiful harvest every season, just because he's a good farmer ,and fate was on his side and he can ignore the conditions that produce a poor yield, Sorry bub ,but the world doesnt operate in a straight line. you can ignore the truth all you like. Just because you wish for something, All the faith and fate in the world does not mean it will happen. there are things called circumstances, that can change things on a whim. If Roethlisberger went down with an injury in say week two. Do you honestly think Charlie Batch could lead your team to a superbowl?. theres a reason hes a back up. I highly doubt it. He would have to play nearly flawless football. I guess it wasnt luck when Mendenhall fumbled the ball and Ben threw 2 picks in the SB this year...That was all fate!...Now...Whose really being honest here. It certainly is not you.
Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~ -
Tell you what Snapper, do yourself a favor and go read Terry Pluto's book 'False Start'. If you want to be kind of an expert on the Browns for your Steeler brethren, then learn a little about the recent history, it is not so easy to encapsulate as you attempt to do. When you do this, you come off as a tool for the most part, and I for one won't placate your ego when you are so biased and incorrectly opinionated.
False Start breaks down how the Browns were put behind the 8 ball from expansion before a team was even formed. As a matter of fact, I am quoted in that book and the quote was directly related to the first game back against Pitt.
The Browns were absolutely gutted by injuries from 99 on. 2007 was the only year they stayed fairly injury free, but the injuries they had were major and hit their top draft picks and FA's, not to mention even their depth guys at the most critical of positions----like oline. If you would come off your high horse of demeaning the Browns and propping your Steelers for a second, you would realize that this organization had no continuity and were forced to overpay for FA's to field a team. Many of these guys gave piss poor returns on their signings over the years, either from injury or under performing. You will notice our old Browns won the Super Bowl and have become your arch rival, that is what continuity brings.
Another point is high draft picks kill organizations when stuck in a cycle of paying those ridiculous rookie salaries that has since finally been rectified with the new CBA. The design for parity basically had the opposite effect as the guaranteed contracts kept going up. You miss on a top pick or they have injury issues (Couch, Brown, Warren, Winslow, Edwards, Jones, Hardesty etc) that sets your organization back.
Now, am I saying the Browns haven't shot themselves in the foot repeatedly? Hell no, but each new staff and FO kept having the same issues and before they could get things right, the demand for change caused the team to start from scratch again. It has become a cyclical effect that Holmgren is trying to rectify now. We just got rid of a pretty good coach because the guy was hired before Walrus, but Mangini has established a solid foundation to build on going forward and did a lot of the dirty work. Now we have a front office and coaching staff who are completely on the same page both schematically and philosophically. Going forward, the team will be able to continue building this thing and hopefully establish the continuity needed to be competitive for years.
It is well documented I can't stand Steeler fans, most are complete idiots and front runners. If they are not banwagonners, they are dumb hillbilly types who know two shits about the game. You are not in either group, I think you have potential as a legit and knowledgeable Pitt fan. However, when you try to write a quick school type essay on the Browns you come across very ignorant. This is not a KSU paper writing contest where you just take a few things you think you know and mesh them on paper to make sense, this real and factual.
You missed the point on "luck", but deep down you know the Steelers have had an awful lot of things go their way over the years. Every team has injuries, but Pitt has avoided the major injury bug for over a good decade and has gotten a lot of calls go their way over that time. Most people know this, not just Browns fans.
Regarding your Steeler fans not bailing I call bullshit. Let this team go way under .500 for about three years in a row and see how quickly your little Utopian Steeler Nation crumbles. Your home town fans will still be there (albeit bitching and whining incessantly) but the national bandwagon swoon will end quicker than shit. Your fans, much like you, prop themselves as success stories because of the Steelers winning. All that gay shit will end quickly when they lose for a couple of seasons, take it to the bank and book it.
Enjoy it while it lasts, because it won't last forever and that is guaranteed. Oh, and Roid Monk is a punk, stop pretending he isn't.
Is a pig's ass pork? -
Homotron said:
Seems as if you're putting a whole HELL of a lot on Luck rather than on merit and running a tight ship from top to bottom. Kevin Colbert is still young for a front office guru. Unless he decides to retire he'll be running the Steelers front office for a good long while. Fact of the matter is what you call "luck" isn't luck at all but several well calculated pieces that make up a much larger puzzle. Yes there is "luck" involved in football but I'm more a fate guy than a luck guy and the misconception that "luck" is what gets you over the hump is both short sighted and naive. If we're being honest with ourselves the down fall of the Browns hasn't been about being unlucky but rather a matter of quite honestly, not being very good. You've "lucked" your way in to top 10 draft picks for the last flipping decade and only a few have shown for anything. Poor front office decisions, poor coaching hires, poor drafting, poor player management. All the instances of staff infection which is flat out medical staff ignorance as far as I'm concerned. It was like a epidemic. Dick Lebeau isn't going to be doing his thing for much longer and I wouldn't be surprised if Polamalu retires soon. (Season or two) Sooooooo Nickers I don't really believe in "luck" because "luck" hasn't gotten me anywhere in life, I have. The same can be said for the best teams in any sport, the best companies in any market and the best teachers in any school. It's not about "LUCK" because "LUCK" nickers is for those unwilling to look at the reality that sits before them. It's an excuse. Plain and simple. The Steelers are good for a reason and it sure as Sh.it isn't about luck.
Your so naive. Im not saying luck is the only ingredient,however, It plays a bigger part than you think. If you think every successful team,business or whatever institution makes it to the top because of fate alone. your totally dead wrong. thats like saying just because a farmer is a good farmer, it means he will have a bountiful harvest every season, just because he's a good farmer ,and fate was on his side and he can ignore the conditions that produce a poor yield, Sorry bub ,but the world doesnt operate in a straight line. you can ignore the truth all you like. Just because you wish for something, All the faith and fate in the world does not mean it will happen. there are things called circumstances, that can change things on a whim. If Roethlisberger went down with an injury in say week two. Do you honestly think Charlie Batch could lead your team to a superbowl?. theres a reason hes a back up. I highly doubt it. He would have to play nearly flawless football. I guess it wasnt luck when Mendenhall fumbled the ball and Ben threw 2 picks in the SB this year...That was all fate!...Now...Whose really being honest here. It certainly is not you.
Your so naive. Im not saying luck is the only ingredient,however, It plays a bigger part than you think. If you think every successful team,business or whatever institution makes it to the top because of fate alone. your totally dead wrong. thats like saying just because a farmer is a good farmer, it means he will have a bountiful harvest every season, just because he's a good farmer ,and fate was on his side and he can ignore the conditions that produce a poor yield, Sorry bub ,but the world doesnt operate in a straight line. you can ignore the truth all you like. Just because you wish for something, All the faith and fate in the world does not mean it will happen. there are things called circumstances, that can change things on a whim. If Roethlisberger went down with an injury in say week two. Do you honestly think Charlie Batch could lead your team to a superbowl?. theres a reason hes a back up. I highly doubt it. He would have to play nearly flawless football. I guess it wasnt luck when Mendenhall fumbled the ball and Ben threw 2 picks in the SB this year...That was all fate!...Now...Whose really being honest here. It certainly is not you.
All you're doing is contradicting yourself. If it's not luck and it's not fate then what is it? OH right the Steelers are a top tier organization across the board and they have a great deal of success because of that fact. You first made it about luck. I said I don't believe much in "luck" but would put some stock in fate and the idea that you reap what you sow. Instead of chalking the Steelers success up to being lucky, playing in a "weak" division and hitting on draft picks, why not just admit the the Steelers are a model franchise from which most should follow? It's a hell of a lot easier than doing this cute little dance. The Steelers were supposed to implode last season without Ben. Instead they won 3 of the 4 without him and went on to the Super Bowl. Pittsburgh drafts at the top of the league consistently, hires the best Coaches for the job, doesn't over pay their players and removes the problems before they explode. Mendenhall fumbled that football because Clay Matthews is a student of the game and recognized that play before it happened. Bruce Arians is a bit notorious in Pittsburgh for his predictable ground game or the lack thereof. All of which is another point I'd like to address. The STeelers with Bruce Arians as the offensive coordinator and Ben under center aren't a run first team. They haven't been one for the last few seasons. Soooooooo Nicker's you're dead wrong with that assessment above and Ben threw the one pic because it was a horrible throw and the other because it was a great play on the ball by the GB defender. Pittsburgh lost BUT we've been there before and we'll be there again. Let me know when you're done making yourself look like a moron. Chicken little was banned from the Pittsburgh area. He lives in your backyard.
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month) -
Tell you what Snapper, do yourself a favor and go read Terry Pluto's book 'False Start'. If you want to be kind of an expert on the Browns for your Steeler brethren, then learn a little about the recent history, it is not so easy to encapsulate as you attempt to do. When you do this, you come off as a tool for the most part, and I for one won't placate your ego when you are so biased and incorrectly opinionated.
False Start breaks down how the Browns were put behind the 8 ball from expansion before a team was even formed. As a matter of fact, I am quoted in that book and the quote was directly related to the first game back against Pitt.
The Browns were absolutely gutted by injuries from 99 on. 2007 was the only year they stayed fairly injury free, but the injuries they had were major and hit their top draft picks and FA's, not to mention even their depth guys at the most critical of positions----like oline. If you would come off your high horse of demeaning the Browns and propping your Steelers for a second, you would realize that this organization had no continuity and were forced to overpay for FA's to field a team. Many of these guys gave piss poor returns on their signings over the years, either from injury or under performing. You will notice our old Browns won the Super Bowl and have become your arch rival, that is what continuity brings.
Another point is high draft picks kill organizations when stuck in a cycle of paying those ridiculous rookie salaries that has since finally been rectified with the new CBA. The design for parity basically had the opposite effect as the guaranteed contracts kept going up. You miss on a top pick or they have injury issues (Couch, Brown, Warren, Winslow, Edwards, Jones, Hardesty etc) that sets your organization back.
Now, am I saying the Browns haven't shot themselves in the foot repeatedly? Hell no, but each new staff and FO kept having the same issues and before they could get things right, the demand for change caused the team to start from scratch again. It has become a cyclical effect that Holmgren is trying to rectify now. We just got rid of a pretty good coach because the guy was hired before Walrus, but Mangini has established a solid foundation to build on going forward and did a lot of the dirty work. Now we have a front office and coaching staff who are completely on the same page both schematically and philosophically. Going forward, the team will be able to continue building this thing and hopefully establish the continuity needed to be competitive for years.
It is well documented I can't stand Steeler fans, most are complete idiots and front runners. If they are not banwagonners, they are dumb hillbilly types who know two shits about the game. You are not in either group, I think you have potential as a legit and knowledgeable Pitt fan. However, when you try to write a quick school type essay on the Browns you come across very ignorant. This is not a KSU paper writing contest where you just take a few things you think you know and mesh them on paper to make sense, this real and factual.
You missed the point on "luck", but deep down you know the Steelers have had an awful lot of things go their way over the years. Every team has injuries, but Pitt has avoided the major injury bug for over a good decade and has gotten a lot of calls go their way over that time. Most people know this, not just Browns fans.
Regarding your Steeler fans not bailing I call bullshit. Let this team go way under .500 for about three years in a row and see how quickly your little Utopian Steeler Nation crumbles. Your home town fans will still be there (albeit bitching and whining incessantly) but the national bandwagon swoon will end quicker than shit. Your fans, much like you, prop themselves as success stories because of the Steelers winning. All that gay shit will end quickly when they lose for a couple of seasons, take it to the bank and book it.
Enjoy it while it lasts, because it won't last forever and that is guaranteed. Oh, and Roid Monk is a punk, stop pretending he isn't.
Tell you what Snapper, do yourself a favor and go read Terry Pluto's book 'False Start'. If you want to be kind of an expert on the Browns for your Steeler brethren, then learn a little about the recent history, it is not so easy to encapsulate as you attempt to do. When you do this, you come off as a tool for the most part, and I for one won't placate your ego when you are so biased and incorrectly opinionated.
False Start breaks down how the Browns were put behind the 8 ball from expansion before a team was even formed. As a matter of fact, I am quoted in that book and the quote was directly related to the first game back against Pitt.
The Browns were absolutely gutted by injuries from 99 on. 2007 was the only year they stayed fairly injury free, but the injuries they had were major and hit their top draft picks and FA's, not to mention even their depth guys at the most critical of positions----like oline. If you would come off your high horse of demeaning the Browns and propping your Steelers for a second, you would realize that this organization had no continuity and were forced to overpay for FA's to field a team. Many of these guys gave piss poor returns on their signings over the years, either from injury or under performing. You will notice our old Browns won the Super Bowl and have become your arch rival, that is what continuity brings.
Another point is high draft picks kill organizations when stuck in a cycle of paying those ridiculous rookie salaries that has since finally been rectified with the new CBA. The design for parity basically had the opposite effect as the guaranteed contracts kept going up. You miss on a top pick or they have injury issues (Couch, Brown, Warren, Winslow, Edwards, Jones, Hardesty etc) that sets your organization back.
Now, am I saying the Browns haven't shot themselves in the foot repeatedly? Hell no, but each new staff and FO kept having the same issues and before they could get things right, the demand for change caused the team to start from scratch again. It has become a cyclical effect that Holmgren is trying to rectify now. We just got rid of a pretty good coach because the guy was hired before Walrus, but Mangini has established a solid foundation to build on going forward and did a lot of the dirty work. Now we have a front office and coaching staff who are completely on the same page both schematically and philosophically. Going forward, the team will be able to continue building this thing and hopefully establish the continuity needed to be competitive for years.
It is well documented I can't stand Steeler fans, most are complete idiots and front runners. If they are not banwagonners, they are dumb hillbilly types who know two shits about the game. You are not in either group, I think you have potential as a legit and knowledgeable Pitt fan. However, when you try to write a quick school type essay on the Browns you come across very ignorant. This is not a KSU paper writing contest where you just take a few things you think you know and mesh them on paper to make sense, this real and factual.
You missed the point on "luck", but deep down you know the Steelers have had an awful lot of things go their way over the years. Every team has injuries, but Pitt has avoided the major injury bug for over a good decade and has gotten a lot of calls go their way over that time. Most people know this, not just Browns fans.
Regarding your Steeler fans not bailing I call bullshit. Let this team go way under .500 for about three years in a row and see how quickly your little Utopian Steeler Nation crumbles. Your home town fans will still be there (albeit bitching and whining incessantly) but the national bandwagon swoon will end quicker than shit. Your fans, much like you, prop themselves as success stories because of the Steelers winning. All that gay shit will end quickly when they lose for a couple of seasons, take it to the bank and book it.
Enjoy it while it lasts, because it won't last forever and that is guaranteed. Oh, and Roid Monk is a punk, stop pretending he isn't.
I may check out that book as I'm looking for something to read after finish the one I'm reading now. I also don't want to compartmentalize your entire post and respond to each point. I'm getting tired of typing out long tirades today. However with the way Pittsburgh drafts, with Tomlin as the Coach and with Ben under center this team is never going to go under .500 three seasons in a row. I'll be surprised if we see under .500 over the course of the next decade. The draft process, the Rooney's and Tomlin clearly have a formula and that formula works. It's been working for as long as I can remember and there is little reason to think things are going to change. If you had to do empirical research on the Steelers I'm sure your findings would yield the same results. It is what is is Riff. I will say this and you can mark your calender when I figure it out. I'm planning to return to my old stomping grounds if and when Football season ever starts. A lot of my great college friends go to games on the regular. I'm planning to at least try to go to a few whether the Browns are playing the Steelers or not. I'll swing by the Brownsboard tailgate and you'll quickly find I'm not some over the top ego maniac, maybe then the animosity will die down. I'm not a bad guy and I'm not trying to be. I'm tired of the ridiculous comments on this message board and I WILL respond each and every time until I'm banned. Just how I am and how I always will be. Take it or leave it riff. I'll tone down the "enlightened" jargon and will check out that book if I can find a copy. I could be more read on the Browns.
-
http://www.amazon.com/False-Start-Browns-Were-Fail/dp/1886228884
You can get it for about 5 bucks on Amazon.
Here is another link that gives a full description:
Shoot me an email at [email protected]
http://www.grayco.com/cleveland/books/28884/index.shtml
False Start
How the New Browns Were Set Up to Fail
by Terry Pluto
Format: Hardcover, 176 pages, 5.3 x 8 inches
Illustrations: 30 black-and-white photographs
ISBN: 978-1-886228-88-7
Price: $19.95
Description
Free Sample
Reviews
About Terry Pluto
References
Description
It was supposed to be the dawn of a grand new era of football in Cleveland.
Instead, it was a rude wakeup call.
When the new Cleveland Browns took the field in 1999, legions of loyal fans—once heartsick, abandoned, and disgusted at the loss of their team in 1995—were ready to forgive the past and embrace the future . . . a new owner, a new team, a new stadium.
They just wanted their Browns back.
They didn't get what they bargained for.
In the five years since a new team called the Browns arrived to play on Cleveland's lakefront, this has become clear: Browns fans got a bum deal. The NFL traded one of the most storied teams in football history for a franchise mired in mediocrity.
These were the fans who, after owner Art Modell skipped town with their beloved Browns, became the only fans ever to take on the NFL, demand their team back—and win.
Yet while they were celebrating the supposed victory that kept “our name, our colors, our team” in Cleveland, fans should have been looking over their shoulders and keeping a close watch on the NFL. There would be few reasons to celebrate in the years to come.
In this book, award-winning sportswriter, Terry Pluto takes a hard look at the first five years of the new Cleveland Browns franchise and doesn't like what he sees.
Pluto chronicles the backroom deals, big-money power plays, poor decisions, and plain bad luck that have dogged the new Browns franchise since its inception.
Browns fans still stand by, waiting for a return to glory. How much longer must they wait? Pluto sifts through the clues from past seasons and looks for answers. This frank analysis will offer fans some solace along with an explanation for their misery.
Is a pig's ass pork? -
Your so naive. Im not saying luck is the only ingredient,however, It plays a bigger part than you think. If you think every successful team,business or whatever institution makes it to the top because of fate alone. your totally dead wrong. thats like saying just because a farmer is a good farmer, it means he will have a bountiful harvest every season, just because he's a good farmer ,and fate was on his side and he can ignore the conditions that produce a poor yield, Sorry bub ,but the world doesnt operate in a straight line. you can ignore the truth all you like. Just because you wish for something, All the faith and fate in the world does not mean it will happen. there are things called circumstances, that can change things on a whim. If Roethlisberger went down with an injury in say week two. Do you honestly think Charlie Batch could lead your team to a superbowl?. theres a reason hes a back up. I highly doubt it. He would have to play nearly flawless football. I guess it wasnt luck when Mendenhall fumbled the ball and Ben threw 2 picks in the SB this year...That was all fate!...Now...Whose really being honest here. It certainly is not you.
All you're doing is contradicting yourself. If it's not luck and it's not fate then what is it? OH right the Steelers are a top tier organization across the board and they have a great deal of success because of that fact. You first made it about luck. I said I don't believe much in "luck" but would put some stock in fate and the idea that you reap what you sow. Instead of chalking the Steelers success up to being lucky, playing in a "weak" division and hitting on draft picks, why not just admit the the Steelers are a model franchise from which most should follow? It's a hell of a lot easier than doing this cute little dance. The Steelers were supposed to implode last season without Ben. Instead they won 3 of the 4 without him and went on to the Super Bowl. Pittsburgh drafts at the top of the league consistently, hires the best Coaches for the job, doesn't over pay their players and removes the problems before they explode. Mendenhall fumbled that football because Clay Matthews is a student of the game and recognized that play before it happened. Bruce Arians is a bit notorious in Pittsburgh for his predictable ground game or the lack thereof. All of which is another point I'd like to address. The STeelers with Bruce Arians as the offensive coordinator and Ben under center aren't a run first team. They haven't been one for the last few seasons. Soooooooo Nicker's you're dead wrong with that assessment above and Ben threw the one pic because it was a horrible throw and the other because it was a great play on the ball by the GB defender. Pittsburgh lost BUT we've been there before and we'll be there again. Let me know when you're done making yourself look like a moron. Chicken little was banned from the Pittsburgh area. He lives in your backyard.
Homotron said:
All you're doing is contradicting yourself. If it's not luck and it's not fate then what is it? OH right the Steelers are a top tier organization across the board and they have a great deal of success because of that fact. You first made it about luck. I said I don't believe much in "luck" but would put some stock in fate and the idea that you reap what you sow. Instead of chalking the Steelers success up to being lucky, playing in a "weak" division and hitting on draft picks, why not just admit the the Steelers are a model franchise from which most should follow? It's a hell of a lot easier than doing this cute little dance. The Steelers were supposed to implode last season without Ben. Instead they won 3 of the 4 without him and went on to the Super Bowl. Pittsburgh drafts at the top of the league consistently, hires the best Coaches for the job, doesn't over pay their players and removes the problems before they explode. Mendenhall fumbled that football because Clay Matthews is a student of the game and recognized that play before it happened. Bruce Arians is a bit notorious in Pittsburgh for his predictable ground game or the lack thereof. All of which is another point I'd like to address. The STeelers with Bruce Arians as the offensive coordinator and Ben under center aren't a run first team. They haven't been one for the last few seasons. Soooooooo Nicker's you're dead wrong with that assessment above and Ben threw the one pic because it was a horrible throw and the other because it was a great play on the ball by the GB defender. Pittsburgh lost BUT we've been there before and we'll be there again. Let me know when you're done making yourself look like a moron. Chicken little was banned from the Pittsburgh area. He lives in your backyard.
[/quote
The only one who keeps acting like a moron, is you. but go ahead and be My guest and ignore the warnings.
-
http://www.amazon.com/False-Start-Browns-Were-Fail/dp/1886228884
You can get it for about 5 bucks on Amazon.
Here is another link that gives a full description:
Shoot me an email at [email protected]
http://www.grayco.com/cleveland/books/28884/index.shtml
False Start
How the New Browns Were Set Up to Fail
by Terry Pluto
Format: Hardcover, 176 pages, 5.3 x 8 inches
Illustrations: 30 black-and-white photographs
ISBN: 978-1-886228-88-7
Price: $19.95
Description
Free Sample
Reviews
About Terry Pluto
References
Description
It was supposed to be the dawn of a grand new era of football in Cleveland.
Instead, it was a rude wakeup call.
When the new Cleveland Browns took the field in 1999, legions of loyal fans—once heartsick, abandoned, and disgusted at the loss of their team in 1995—were ready to forgive the past and embrace the future . . . a new owner, a new team, a new stadium.
They just wanted their Browns back.
They didn't get what they bargained for.
In the five years since a new team called the Browns arrived to play on Cleveland's lakefront, this has become clear: Browns fans got a bum deal. The NFL traded one of the most storied teams in football history for a franchise mired in mediocrity.
These were the fans who, after owner Art Modell skipped town with their beloved Browns, became the only fans ever to take on the NFL, demand their team back—and win.
Yet while they were celebrating the supposed victory that kept “our name, our colors, our team” in Cleveland, fans should have been looking over their shoulders and keeping a close watch on the NFL. There would be few reasons to celebrate in the years to come.
In this book, award-winning sportswriter, Terry Pluto takes a hard look at the first five years of the new Cleveland Browns franchise and doesn't like what he sees.
Pluto chronicles the backroom deals, big-money power plays, poor decisions, and plain bad luck that have dogged the new Browns franchise since its inception.
Browns fans still stand by, waiting for a return to glory. How much longer must they wait? Pluto sifts through the clues from past seasons and looks for answers. This frank analysis will offer fans some solace along with an explanation for their misery.
http://www.amazon.com/False-Start-Browns-Were-Fail/dp/1886228884
You can get it for about 5 bucks on Amazon.
Here is another link that gives a full description:
Shoot me an email at [email protected]
http://www.grayco.com/cleveland/books/28884/index.shtml
False Start
How the New Browns Were Set Up to Fail
by Terry Pluto
Format: Hardcover, 176 pages, 5.3 x 8 inches
Illustrations: 30 black-and-white photographs
ISBN: 978-1-886228-88-7
Price: $19.95
Description
Free Sample
Reviews
About Terry Pluto
References
Description
It was supposed to be the dawn of a grand new era of football in Cleveland.
Instead, it was a rude wakeup call.
When the new Cleveland Browns took the field in 1999, legions of loyal fans—once heartsick, abandoned, and disgusted at the loss of their team in 1995—were ready to forgive the past and embrace the future . . . a new owner, a new team, a new stadium.
They just wanted their Browns back.
They didn't get what they bargained for.
In the five years since a new team called the Browns arrived to play on Cleveland's lakefront, this has become clear: Browns fans got a bum deal. The NFL traded one of the most storied teams in football history for a franchise mired in mediocrity.
These were the fans who, after owner Art Modell skipped town with their beloved Browns, became the only fans ever to take on the NFL, demand their team back—and win.
Yet while they were celebrating the supposed victory that kept “our name, our colors, our team” in Cleveland, fans should have been looking over their shoulders and keeping a close watch on the NFL. There would be few reasons to celebrate in the years to come.
In this book, award-winning sportswriter, Terry Pluto takes a hard look at the first five years of the new Cleveland Browns franchise and doesn't like what he sees.
Pluto chronicles the backroom deals, big-money power plays, poor decisions, and plain bad luck that have dogged the new Browns franchise since its inception.
Browns fans still stand by, waiting for a return to glory. How much longer must they wait? Pluto sifts through the clues from past seasons and looks for answers. This frank analysis will offer fans some solace along with an explanation for their misery.
I have the book False Start. Incidently...Its at My Brothers house and I need to get it back from him.It's an awesome read. All I can say Riff is it's no use trying to make this tool (Homotard) understand What we are trying to impart to him. If he wants to act like a Stooler Jack ass all his life thats fine by Me. But, your wasting your time with him. He's a 28 year old punk who thinks he knows it all. I even tried to debate nice with him the last couple of posts Ive made, and he's hell bent on keeping his head up his ass and just implies Im a moron. I was watching football long before he became a shot of sperm. Both you and I, have watched good organizations go down the tubes in no time. He refuses to accept the inevitable, that this will eventually happen. Just like life itself it's cyclical. So are football organizations or any other organization. Okay,Im done with rant...Peace out.
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http://www.amazon.com/False-Start-Browns-Were-Fail/dp/1886228884
You can get it for about 5 bucks on Amazon.
Here is another link that gives a full description:
Shoot me an email at [email protected]
http://www.grayco.com/cleveland/books/28884/index.shtml
False Start
How the New Browns Were Set Up to Fail
by Terry Pluto
Format: Hardcover, 176 pages, 5.3 x 8 inches
Illustrations: 30 black-and-white photographs
ISBN: 978-1-886228-88-7
Price: $19.95
Description
Free Sample
Reviews
About Terry Pluto
References
Description
It was supposed to be the dawn of a grand new era of football in Cleveland.
Instead, it was a rude wakeup call.
When the new Cleveland Browns took the field in 1999, legions of loyal fans—once heartsick, abandoned, and disgusted at the loss of their team in 1995—were ready to forgive the past and embrace the future . . . a new owner, a new team, a new stadium.
They just wanted their Browns back.
They didn't get what they bargained for.
In the five years since a new team called the Browns arrived to play on Cleveland's lakefront, this has become clear: Browns fans got a bum deal. The NFL traded one of the most storied teams in football history for a franchise mired in mediocrity.
These were the fans who, after owner Art Modell skipped town with their beloved Browns, became the only fans ever to take on the NFL, demand their team back—and win.
Yet while they were celebrating the supposed victory that kept “our name, our colors, our team” in Cleveland, fans should have been looking over their shoulders and keeping a close watch on the NFL. There would be few reasons to celebrate in the years to come.
In this book, award-winning sportswriter, Terry Pluto takes a hard look at the first five years of the new Cleveland Browns franchise and doesn't like what he sees.
Pluto chronicles the backroom deals, big-money power plays, poor decisions, and plain bad luck that have dogged the new Browns franchise since its inception.
Browns fans still stand by, waiting for a return to glory. How much longer must they wait? Pluto sifts through the clues from past seasons and looks for answers. This frank analysis will offer fans some solace along with an explanation for their misery.
I have the book False Start. Incidently...Its at My Brothers house and I need to get it back from him.It's an awesome read. All I can say Riff is it's no use trying to make this tool (Homotard) understand What we are trying to impart to him. If he wants to act like a Stooler Jack ass all his life thats fine by Me. But, your wasting your time with him. He's a 28 year old punk who thinks he knows it all. I even tried to debate nice with him the last couple of posts Ive made, and he's hell bent on keeping his head up his ass and just implies Im a moron. I was watching football long before he became a shot of sperm. Both you and I, have watched good organizations go down the tubes in no time. He refuses to accept the inevitable, that this will eventually happen. Just like life itself it's cyclical. So are football organizations or any other organization. Okay,Im done with rant...Peace out.
I have the book False Start. Incidently...Its at My Brothers house and I need to get it back from him.It's an awesome read. All I can say Riff is it's no use trying to make this tool (Homotard) understand What we are trying to impart to him. If he wants to act like a Stooler Jack ass all his life thats fine by Me. But, your wasting your time with him. He's a 28 year old punk who thinks he knows it all. I even tried to debate nice with him the last couple of posts Ive made, and he's hell bent on keeping his head up his ass and just implies Im a moron. I was watching football long before he became a shot of sperm. Both you and I, have watched good organizations go down the tubes in no time. He refuses to accept the inevitable, that this will eventually happen. Just like life itself it's cyclical. So are football organizations or any other organization. Okay,Im done with rant...Peace out.
Name some of the "good organizations that went down the tubes" and define the reasons they went down the sh.itter. As far as the book is concerned it's not the first I've heard of it and I actually have a couple of friends that didn't like it. Mostly because Pluto takes the woe is me approach and blames it on certain things that may or may not have been as big a factor as he leads on. I'll still probably check it out if for no other reason than the sake of argument. As far as the above where exactly were you trying to play nice? lol. I don't see anywhere in this thread where you made even a meager attempt to play nice. Good organizations have a formula and the best ones stick to it. It's when you stray from that approach that you get in trouble. The Steelers have had 3 Coaches over the last 4 decades. How many have the Browns have, The Steelers have hit on every first round pick in recent memory outside of Troy Edwards when I was a young buck. They've also had success in the later rounds, the most recent example being Mike Wallace. Lamar Woodley was a second round pick. The very man in this thread being beaten down was cut several times before making his niche. Good teams take calculated gambles, pride themselves on integrity and hold true to their word. Pittsburgh hasn't had to over pay free agents or their own players because they draft so well and they've been drafting like that since the 70's.
I whole heartedly believe that in order for any kind of fall to occur the Rooney's would have to sell the team and that isn't going to happen, at least not any time soon. You can call me naive, you can call me hard headed or even arrogant but there is absolutely nothing to suggest I'm not correct in my above assessment. Until we're all proven otherwise I'd say that's status quo in Pittsburgh would you not?
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Taken from my primary message board. A small breakdown of the article from a guy that hadn't read it until recently. Take it or leave it. I thought the Lebeau comment was the most interesting.
(NOT MY WORDS BELOW)
Couple thoughts:
1. It wasn't as bad as it was made out to be
2. How come no one pointed out the bad word Lebeau F You to Goodell in that piece: “That’s what we’re told by Coach LeBeau — blow through the guy, not to him. When the fines came down, he said, ‘Don’t change a damn thing. You’re doing it the way we do it on this team.’ ”
A coach saying to disregard the commission seems like a bigger story than all the James Harrison anti PC comments.
3. How bout the endorsement from Clark? “There are guys who are workaholics, and then there’s James. Dudes hurt themselves training with him,” says teammate Clark.
This is why James can say anything he wants. He works way harder than everyone. Ben, Mendy, or no other Steeler can really say anything given James work ethic.
And to point out James didn't do anything either in the SuperBowl is a bit of a joke. The guy was seriously injured yet played through the pain. Given his back surgery we now know about, I suspect most guys would have given up on last season - not James.
4. “I hate those motherxxxxers,” he says, “especially those two clowns who talked about me after the fines.” He’s referring to Rodney Harrison, the ex-Patriot turned analyst on NBC’s Sunday Night Football, and Tedy Bruschi, another former Pat who appears on ESPN. “Sayin’ I’m dirty — bad word, Harrison was the dirtiest player ever, a steroid cheater who was known by the whole world to be a headhunter and late hitter. And Bruschi’s an idiot, straight-up simple. I’d like to meet them both in a dark alley.”
How come no one talked about the Pats being cheaters? All these writers are owned by the NFL and Kraft. And the best part about the quote is it sounds like James wants Bruschi and Harrison at the same time in that dark alley. I bet those 2 have nightmares.
5. The racisms James alludes to has nothing to do with the fines like I had thought from comments, but more to do with protecting white QBs. And he makes an interesting point about paying $5k for slamming Vince Young, but then paying $20k for bumping Drew Brees.
Here's a situation where he may have a little bit of a point. But he may also want to take a look at his own offense and see the shots Ben and Byron have taken throughout their career without any flags fines. I think Lefty may have taken the worst shots thru his career, but Ben takes more w/o fines. But he is a Steeler so the racial rules of Goodell may be trumped by his dislike for our team.
I dunno if there's really racism protecting different QBs? But it does seem like it's ok to hit a black QB or Ben to me. I would say maybe it has something to do with mobility, but Byron stands in cement and can't move, so that throws that theory out the window.
6. Everyone that has a problem with James is a hypocrite. This is a guy that's probably given more of himself than any Steelers player we've had. And he's one bad mofo. And we celebrate him for it. But then off the field, we want his words to sound like they came from Barrack Obama.
We're expecting too much from this guy. On one hand we want him to be the baddest man on the planet. And then on the other hand, we want him to act like refined british royalty. What else would you expect to come from the mouth of one of the baddest dudes to walk the earth?
Actually, his words convey a bit of a childlike innocence. Get over the F#ck, F@g, etc. curses. Those are no big deal, just the way some people talk. But when you get past that, you realize, there's no BS in James' speech. He's raw. And that's something we could all learn from. 99% of what people say is BS to cover up their own insecurities.
And I'm sure there's some folks brave enough to speak their mind without fear. But most likely it's because of their innocence and that they probably don't know to put up a wall or a filter.
And one other side comment, if you look through the volunteer photos on Steelers.com, there's 2 guys in most of the photos. CBatch and James Harrison. And the latter is the one that's always with the kids with the biggest smile on his face.
All these commenters on James missed the real story. It's a shame. This guy's a one of a kind.
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mikeyP72 said:
So JH is brave for being a xxxxing moron?
You have your heroes I'll have mine.
Dumbass.
Not my words above but I don't think he's a moron. He's also not one of my heroes but he is a beast, that much is undeniable. Dick Lebeau seems to like him too.
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mikeyP72 said:
No one's once denied he's a beast.
A roided out, neanderthal. Beast is a very accurate description.
He's not on roids either. You can read the interviews. One is referenced above. He works harder than anyone on the team and for good reason considering the amount of times he's been cut. He has a chip on his shoulder and he plays with passion and aggression. If you don't like it tough sh.it but I'd bet my house that if you drug tested the guy tomorrow he'd come up negative. It's just a pathetic ruse used by you and your brethren to justify getting your ass handed to you. If you're a tank you must be on roids. Should I compile a list of players in the NFL that "HAVE TO BE ON ROIDS" ?
lol
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mikeyP72 said:
LOL okay, the guy goes from being cut from multiple NFL teams through his twenties then just suddenly beast modes when he is 29?
Around that same time he got a charge for assault on his girlfriend.
Then this in the super bowl:
He was cut because early on he was regarded as "uncoachable" or so I've read. He stuck on special teams for us because he was a work horse and eventually he was given a shot when Joey Porter got hurt. He's always been a monster and if you weren't being a closed minded hater you'd acknowledge that fact. Look at pictures when he first came in to the league and pictures now. He looks exactly the same and the guy getting blasted went straight at his knees the play before in a attempt to take him out of the game. Cute how easily things are taken out of context. I haven't checked your articles but it was a doctor that had plenty of other patients outside the Steelers that was labeled for HGH, that doesn't mean it was being used in the Pittsburgh locker room. I guess if I have a friend and he goes out and kills a family member, I must be in on it because we know one another lol.
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Birdbrains of a squeeler feather farg together. Everybody but squeeler fans know that. The squeeler fans are too busy being whining, intrusive, egg-sucking weasels.
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Birdbrains of a squeeler feather farg together. Everybody but squeeler fans know that. The squeeler fans are too busy being whining, intrusive, egg-sucking weasels.
Birdbrains of a squeeler feather farg together. Everybody but squeeler fans know that. The squeeler fans are too busy being whining, intrusive, egg-sucking weasels.
You can disagree but you don't have to come across as a complete dip sh.it. The above barely makes sense and you're so busy trying to use cute nicknames you stumbled all over your own poorly pieced together statement.
Here's a interview excerpt from James Farrior
"I talked to (Steelers linebacker James) Farrior and (he) said, 'Listen, we thought the dude was straight crazy. We thought the guy had severe emotional problems,' " Solotaroff said on "The Dan Patrick Show" on Thursday. "And I'm not sure James has amended his opinion of Mr. Harrison, but he loves him, and so does everybody on that defense. They love this guy to pieces."
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month) -
Birdbrains of a squeeler feather farg together. Everybody but squeeler fans know that. The squeeler fans are too busy being whining, intrusive, egg-sucking weasels.
You can disagree but you don't have to come across as a complete dip sh.it. The above barely makes sense and you're so busy trying to use cute nicknames you stumbled all over your own poorly pieced together statement.
Here's a interview excerpt from James Farrior
"I talked to (Steelers linebacker James) Farrior and (he) said, 'Listen, we thought the dude was straight crazy. We thought the guy had severe emotional problems,' " Solotaroff said on "The Dan Patrick Show" on Thursday. "And I'm not sure James has amended his opinion of Mr. Harrison, but he loves him, and so does everybody on that defense. They love this guy to pieces."
Homotron said:
You can disagree but you don't have to come across as a complete dip sh.it. The above barely makes sense and you're so busy trying to use cute nicknames you stumbled all over your own poorly pieced together statement.
Here's a interview excerpt from James Farrior
"I talked to (Steelers linebacker James) Farrior and (he) said, 'Listen, we thought the dude was straight crazy. We thought the guy had severe emotional problems,' " Solotaroff said on "The Dan Patrick Show" on Thursday. "And I'm not sure James has amended his opinion of Mr. Harrison, but he loves him, and so does everybody on that defense. They love this guy to pieces."
More Stooler rhetoric and bullshit...of course they'll stick up for the bastard, untill things get so bad to the point he throws everyone under the bus. He's already thrown gay ben and fumblinball under..hell why stop there?...And again Homotard, your reading skills suck if you cant understand what Cal was saying, or more like your just being an asshole to him, just for the sake of doing so. Wich is why vermin like you dont belong here. Your bullshit is beyond hilarious. Your immaturity never ceases to amaze Me. If you want AFCN news. Do what smart people do. Type into Google "AFCN news". Im sure a wealth of articles and links will come up. you dont need to come here, just like I dont need a stooler fan board for info. Now go run along play with your little tabs.
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mikeyP72 said:
To discredit the many accusations of the Steeler organization and the league as a whole as being involved with HGH and steroids you are clearly the naive one. If someone popped for roids or HGH on the Browns I wouldn't be the least bit surprised. The fact that your team doctor had has hands in that stuff is a red flag. A big ole Soviet sized Red Flag over the Kremlin so everyone can see.
Denying that as absurd is completely hilarious.
To discredit the increase in aggression on the field and seemingly instant improvement in James Harrison's ability is also naive. The guy is a mental midget, or "uncoachable" as you put it. How else do people like that get ahead in life? They cheat.
He continually proves how dumb he is everytime he opens his mouth. He's a thug and a neanderthal. Whether or not he's on roids, which he probably is, he's still a xxxxing idiot.
I cannot honestly believe you can sit there and defend this guy... For someone who claims we have Brown and Orange goggles on, you need to take a step back and take off the Piss and Black blinders.
Mikey...He's a blind tool who completly exposes himself as a fraud repeatedly. He's the typical delusional circle jerk you run into in life. I Liken it to a Skagg Mower that you start up and let it keep hitting a brick wall...It never stops bouncing/hitting off the wall because it doesnt know any better. It's just how some kids are. He will hopefully find out the hard way,If he's lucky enough to let his mind step up to next level of consciousness, wich I have high doubts about because he's so stuck on his own conceited view of himself. I dont know how old you are,But Im sure you understand alot kids at 28 years old dont have their act together yet. I know Myself I never acted like a self pontificating tool toward others at that age or younger. I was lucky enough to have awesome parents that instilled to Me, honesty and respect toward others at a very young age. Im not gonna get into semantics, But I had alot more to deal with than most kids But, I never sat back and made excuses or cried for why things were. You never focus on your weaknesses. You only focus on your strengths and try your level best to to improve on them. The point being ,anything he says to Me doesnt bother Me because Ive fried much bigger fish in life. Let him be a pompous ass if he likes...In the end it doesnt change how we live life,pay our bills or love our families and friends.
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mikeyP72 said:
To discredit the many accusations of the Steeler organization and the league as a whole as being involved with HGH and steroids you are clearly the naive one. If someone popped for roids or HGH on the Browns I wouldn't be the least bit surprised. The fact that your team doctor had has hands in that stuff is a red flag. A big ole Soviet sized Red Flag over the Kremlin so everyone can see.
Denying that as absurd is completely hilarious.
To discredit the increase in aggression on the field and seemingly instant improvement in James Harrison's ability is also naive. The guy is a mental midget, or "uncoachable" as you put it. How else do people like that get ahead in life? They cheat.
He continually proves how dumb he is everytime he opens his mouth. He's a thug and a neanderthal. Whether or not he's on roids, which he probably is, he's still a xxxxing idiot.
I cannot honestly believe you can sit there and defend this guy... For someone who claims we have Brown and Orange goggles on, you need to take a step back and take off the Piss and Black blinders.
Mikey...He's a blind tool who completly exposes himself as a fraud repeatedly. He's the typical delusional circle jerk you run into in life. I Liken it to a Skagg Mower that you start up and let it keep hitting a brick wall...It never stops bouncing/hitting off the wall because it doesnt know any better. It's just how some kids are. He will hopefully find out the hard way,If he's lucky enough to let his mind step up to next level of consciousness, wich I have high doubts about because he's so stuck on his own conceited view of himself. I dont know how old you are,But Im sure you understand alot kids at 28 years old dont have their act together yet. I know Myself I never acted like a self pontificating tool toward others at that age or younger. I was lucky enough to have awesome parents that instilled to Me, honesty and respect toward others at a very young age. Im not gonna get into semantics, But I had alot more to deal with than most kids But, I never sat back and made excuses or cried for why things were. You never focus on your weaknesses. You only focus on your strengths and try your level best to to improve on them. The point being ,anything he says to Me doesnt bother Me because Ive fried much bigger fish in life. Let him be a pompous ass if he likes...In the end it doesnt change how we live life,pay our bills or love our families and friends.
Mikey...He's a blind tool who completly exposes himself as a fraud repeatedly. He's the typical delusional circle jerk you run into in life. I Liken it to a Skagg Mower that you start up and let it keep hitting a brick wall...It never stops bouncing/hitting off the wall because it doesnt know any better. It's just how some kids are. He will hopefully find out the hard way,If he's lucky enough to let his mind step up to next level of consciousness, wich I have high doubts about because he's so stuck on his own conceited view of himself. I dont know how old you are,But Im sure you understand alot kids at 28 years old dont have their act together yet. I know Myself I never acted like a self pontificating tool toward others at that age or younger. I was lucky enough to have awesome parents that instilled to Me, honesty and respect toward others at a very young age. Im not gonna get into semantics, But I had alot more to deal with than most kids But, I never sat back and made excuses or cried for why things were. You never focus on your weaknesses. You only focus on your strengths and try your level best to to improve on them. The point being ,anything he says to Me doesnt bother Me because Ive fried much bigger fish in life. Let him be a pompous ass if he likes...In the end it doesnt change how we live life,pay our bills or love our families and friends.
Are you kidding? I'm supposed to be civil and respectful when all anyone ever does is attempt to sh.it on me in pathetic fashion? I don't know what planet you live on but if someone climbs in my face with a bunch of name calling and ridiculous BS I'm not going to say, "Thank you sir, may I have some more". I was raised to treat everyone as I myself would like to be treated. The approach I take here is not one I'd ever take with someone I just met in real life. Your self-aggrandizing is nauseating. As far as the Steelers are concerned the minute our old team doctor was linked to HGH he was respectfully removed from the organization. He's still a proponent of HGH but his use of HGH doesn't necessarily mean it's the only way he chose to treat his professional athlete clients. After all putting a team out of business would only be detrimental to his own bottom line. When it all boils down the "steroid claims" are all a excuse for your teams mediocrity. It's always been the case. "They're better than us, they must being cheating" lol
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month)
.jpg.a1a2b9a0c33008fdaf4097d8fe2cfd64.jpg "Riffer X"){kind=avatar}
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