What Can We Learn From New Hot Teams
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@king-ghoolie-lives said:
Could you imagine Donald Trump sitting down to talk strategies with someone who has never earned $250,000 in a year? Of course not. So too, will most of the comments here come from nincompoops.
Yes, you are a nincompoop.
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@king-ghoolie-lives said:
Frenchie,
There are definite ingredients that go into a winning team. However, people are simpletons when talking about success and winning. I think mostly if a person has never run a successful company, grown a business or otherwise accomplished the very pinnacle of something, they really aren't going to have much to offer up, at least much of any value on this topic.
Could you imagine Donald Trump sitting down to talk strategies with someone who has never earned $250,000 in a year? Of course not. So too, will most of the comments here come from nincompoops.
Some SB winners seem to have common ingredients, yet others weave off course, ie the SB Ravens who won with a shit QB. The first thing that a successful person learns is that you cannot find success by duplicating what has already come and passed.
Case in point, the Browns; they try over and over to hire people who were successful in the past, only to find out that it always fails. This is predicatble, and so to will Holmgren fail.
Why? SIMPLE............. time doens't stand still. Circumstances that once were, will never be again. What worked in the past, isn't applicable today. Those players, conditions, level of competition, bounce of the ball, injuries, lucky breaks, etc etc etc............. will never come together again.
Holmgren has never worked as a GM in his life. He is being paid to learn and he is too satisfied and fat to have any hunger to win.
THAT, in essence what those teams have, and the Browns don't; A hunger to win.
So you are saying you would rather have a guy like Trump as a GM instead of Holmgren? Holmgren actually has been successful in football and knows how the business works. You must have forgotten that Trump already failed in football! Maybe this will refresh your memory: http://dailycaller.com/2010/07/28/trumps-youre-fired-moment-in-football/. Just because you are successful in 1 business endeavor does not mean you will be in another.
So you are saying you would rather have a guy like Trump as a GM instead of Holmgren? Holmgren actually has been successful in football and knows how the business works. You must have forgotten that Trump already failed in football! Maybe this will refresh your memory: http://dailycaller.com/2010/07/28/trumps-youre-fired-moment-in-football/. Just because you are successful in 1 business endeavor does not mean you will be in another.
Do people even read posts anymore? You're just as bad as the guy you're trying to flame about comprehending a paragraph.
He made a comparison to a Trump taking advice from a guy who makes $250,000 a year is like the Browns Front Office taking advice from us.
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It takes time to recover from years of shitty drafts.
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So you are saying you would rather have a guy like Trump as a GM instead of Holmgren? Holmgren actually has been successful in football and knows how the business works. You must have forgotten that Trump already failed in football! Maybe this will refresh your memory: http://dailycaller.com/2010/07/28/trumps-youre-fired-moment-in-football/. Just because you are successful in 1 business endeavor does not mean you will be in another.
Do people even read posts anymore? You're just as bad as the guy you're trying to flame about comprehending a paragraph.
He made a comparison to a Trump taking advice from a guy who makes $250,000 a year is like the Browns Front Office taking advice from us.
Do people even read posts anymore? You're just as bad as the guy you're trying to flame about comprehending a paragraph.
He made a comparison to a Trump taking advice from a guy who makes $250,000 a year is like the Browns Front Office taking advice from us.
You are missing the point. His first 2 paragraphs of his previous post are an attempt to inflate his ego and discredit our opinions. He has countless other posts telling us how he has been really successful in the music industry. I’m assuming he has probably made over 250k in a year so he is trying to lump himself in a category with Trump (which is still laughable), while assuming the rest of us have never made that much (which according to him = nincompoops). And because of his success in one industry, he thinks he has superior football knowledge. So my point was to show that guys like Trump can have success in one industry, but that doesn’t mean they have superior knowledge in another. So no I was not specifically just talking about Trump. Put 2 and 2 together here…
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Frenchie-
I think that there are a few reasons and perhaps in some cases they apply more to one team than the others. For my money it boils down like this:
1) Winning the trenches. There really is NOT a position in football that you can ignore but offensive line is a great place to build; you can have all of the great skill players in the world but if no one blocks, you're hosed. Tom Brady looks awful pedestrian under pressure. Detroit has built a solid offensive line and a dominant defensive line. Control the line of scrimmage and you control the game.
2) Franchise QB. I don't know that SF or Buffalo have one but Detroit does and none of the QBs playing for these teams are making huge mistakes.
3) Multi-dimensional offense- You'll notice that all of these teams can find balance on offense. Sure, the Lions like to pass more than run (as most teams nowadays do) but they have to be able to run the ball enough...especially when they have to get a yard or run clock. They don't rely on one weapon.
4) Athletic defense- San Francisco is winning mainly on defense and it's one that's been built over time.
5) Learning how to win. I know our previous coach is not the most popular guy but teams have to learn how to win and finish off opponents. How many times have we seen the Browns play well enough to win but come up short? It's about limiting mistakes and executing when it matters most.
Of course, the experts always seem to say that if you're building from scratch the importance of the players acquired starts with QB, LT, pass rusher, MLB...that's not a bad way to think about it as those are the highest impact when building a core. Ask yourself: Does SF/Buf/Det/Oakland have those? Let's look
SF: Alex Smith, ?Aldon Smith, Staley, Patrick Willis (3 of 4 at least)
Buf: Fitzpatrick, ?Shawn Merriman, Demetrius Bell, Nick Barnett (2 or 3 of 4)
Det: Stafford, Vanden Bosch, Jeff Backus, ?Steven Tulloch (I will argue 4 of 4)
Oak: ?Campbell, ?Veldheer (has been good), Lamarr Houston, McClain (at least 2 of 4)
Where do the Browns sort out?
?McCoy, Thomas, ?Sheard/Mitchell, Jackson. That's 2 of 4 by this man's estimation.
Frenchie-
I think that there are a few reasons and perhaps in some cases they apply more to one team than the others. For my money it boils down like this:
1) Winning the trenches. There really is NOT a position in football that you can ignore but offensive line is a great place to build; you can have all of the great skill players in the world but if no one blocks, you're hosed. Tom Brady looks awful pedestrian under pressure. Detroit has built a solid offensive line and a dominant defensive line. Control the line of scrimmage and you control the game.
2) Franchise QB. I don't know that SF or Buffalo have one but Detroit does and none of the QBs playing for these teams are making huge mistakes.
3) Multi-dimensional offense- You'll notice that all of these teams can find balance on offense. Sure, the Lions like to pass more than run (as most teams nowadays do) but they have to be able to run the ball enough...especially when they have to get a yard or run clock. They don't rely on one weapon.
4) Athletic defense- San Francisco is winning mainly on defense and it's one that's been built over time.
5) Learning how to win. I know our previous coach is not the most popular guy but teams have to learn how to win and finish off opponents. How many times have we seen the Browns play well enough to win but come up short? It's about limiting mistakes and executing when it matters most.
Of course, the experts always seem to say that if you're building from scratch the importance of the players acquired starts with QB, LT, pass rusher, MLB...that's not a bad way to think about it as those are the highest impact when building a core. Ask yourself: Does SF/Buf/Det/Oakland have those? Let's look
SF: Alex Smith, ?Aldon Smith, Staley, Patrick Willis (3 of 4 at least)
Buf: Fitzpatrick, ?Shawn Merriman, Demetrius Bell, Nick Barnett (2 or 3 of 4)
Det: Stafford, Vanden Bosch, Jeff Backus, ?Steven Tulloch (I will argue 4 of 4)
Oak: ?Campbell, ?Veldheer (has been good), Lamarr Houston, McClain (at least 2 of 4)
Where do the Browns sort out?
?McCoy, Thomas, ?Sheard/Mitchell, Jackson. That's 2 of 4 by this man's estimation.
As opposed to Earl, the trenches are for duffesses, the way to winning is players who make plays on offense followed by disruptive d players.........but of course Brownstown has been enamored with D and useless bloated OL guys and that is the problem.. Defense does not win Championships OFFENSE DOEs............and the easiest part to fix is the OL and the part that does jack when the skill players suck
When Brownstown gets it ..........maybe we will win...............and maybe you will see the light it ..........it ends in the trenches not starts there
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Is everyone panicking and we're .500? When we beat the Gaider's we're going to be one game out. We have played tough defences ( Cinci / Miami with Sparano's back on the wall / Tenn)
So I don't see how we score less then 20 vs. the raiders.
Can we keep Run DMC in check? Will be tough he's the best back in football..but let the raiders take their penalties
The only thing that is scary is return to the black hole first game back after Al Davis...it will be a wild scene so we have to keep it close in the first Q.
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Is everyone panicking and we're .500? When we beat the Gaider's we're going to be one game out. We have played tough defences ( Cinci / Miami with Sparano's back on the wall / Tenn)
So I don't see how we score less then 20 vs. the raiders.
Can we keep Run DMC in check? Will be tough he's the best back in football..but let the raiders take their penalties
The only thing that is scary is return to the black hole first game back after Al Davis...it will be a wild scene so we have to keep it close in the first Q.
Is everyone panicking and we're .500? When we beat the Gaider's we're going to be one game out. We have played tough defences ( Cinci / Miami with Sparano's back on the wall / Tenn)
So I don't see how we score less then 20 vs. the raiders.
Can we keep Run DMC in check? Will be tough he's the best back in football..but let the raiders take their penalties
The only thing that is scary is return to the black hole first game back after Al Davis...it will be a wild scene so we have to keep it close in the first Q.
I again guess you missed how the OL is the last thing in wiinning and the the D second last........................maybe sometimes Brownstown will get it
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Is everyone panicking and we're .500? When we beat the Gaider's we're going to be one game out. We have played tough defences ( Cinci / Miami with Sparano's back on the wall / Tenn)
So I don't see how we score less then 20 vs. the raiders.
Can we keep Run DMC in check? Will be tough he's the best back in football..but let the raiders take their penalties
The only thing that is scary is return to the black hole first game back after Al Davis...it will be a wild scene so we have to keep it close in the first Q.
Is everyone panicking and we're .500? When we beat the Gaider's we're going to be one game out. We have played tough defences ( Cinci / Miami with Sparano's back on the wall / Tenn)
So I don't see how we score less then 20 vs. the raiders.
Can we keep Run DMC in check? Will be tough he's the best back in football..but let the raiders take their penalties
The only thing that is scary is return to the black hole first game back after Al Davis...it will be a wild scene so we have to keep it close in the first Q.
We aren't going to be able to control either line of scrimmage and our defensive back seven is slow while they are stacked with speed. So. Tell me again how we're going to beat the Raiders?
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Is everyone panicking and we're .500? When we beat the Gaider's we're going to be one game out. We have played tough defences ( Cinci / Miami with Sparano's back on the wall / Tenn)
So I don't see how we score less then 20 vs. the raiders.
Can we keep Run DMC in check? Will be tough he's the best back in football..but let the raiders take their penalties
The only thing that is scary is return to the black hole first game back after Al Davis...it will be a wild scene so we have to keep it close in the first Q.
Is everyone panicking and we're .500? When we beat the Gaider's we're going to be one game out. We have played tough defences ( Cinci / Miami with Sparano's back on the wall / Tenn)
So I don't see how we score less then 20 vs. the raiders.
Can we keep Run DMC in check? Will be tough he's the best back in football..but let the raiders take their penalties
The only thing that is scary is return to the black hole first game back after Al Davis...it will be a wild scene so we have to keep it close in the first Q.
I'll be the first to route for the Browns and hope they win this weekend. I do believe that on any given Sunday any NFL team has a good chance of winning against any other team. But I am disappointed by what I've seen so far by the Browns in the first four games (inconsistent and uncoordinated) and I saw the highlights of the last Raiders game. I am concerned that going into the black hole, our team could get intimidated, beaten up, and run over. Let's hope my fears are just that.
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just what has holmgren done....exactly?
won a superbowl as a coach, with ron wolf as his GM...whom i might add, brought in farve and white.
took a huge position with the seahawks as Exec. VP, GM and head coach. how long did that gig last? 4 years....he was fired as GM after 4 years. a few years later, after he was stictly the coach, he took them to the superbowl in '05.
now he's here in a role he failed at once. that gives me that warm and fuzzy...ya know? great coach, failure as a leader.
I am not proclaiming Holmgren as our savior. My point is he actually has football knowledge. He was responsible for bringing in Heckert and it has resulted in 2 pretty good drafts. The jury is still out on Shurmur but I don't see how you can write off Holmgren for what he has done here so far.
I am not proclaiming Holmgren as our savior. My point is he actually has football knowledge. He was responsible for bringing in Heckert and it has resulted in 2 pretty good drafts. The jury is still out on Shurmur but I don't see how you can write off Holmgren for what he has done here so far.
I hear you and you're right about what Holmgren has done well. But I'll also say that I am disappointed that he has not done more. That's a lot of money for a guy that hired someone to make quality draft picks and a few good trades. I expected him to be much more of a seasoned leader and strategist. I could be wrong looking at it from way out here, but "his" team is lacking in many areas that I think he could have done more to improve it. Furthermore, he implemented a whole new system on offence that doesn't use our strengths as well as last year and was brought in during a strike shortened season.
Perhaps I'm being too harsh. I don't know.
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