Matt Williamson on DA
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How do you get pretty high out of that? He was saying CLE should trade DA. What value he believe CLE could get out of DA on the market is not a scouting take on him.
Did you miss the part where Williamson agreed (or I believe he said that he couldn't argue with:) "Anderson being the real deal", or the part he alluded that if he were in Chicago's shoes that he would pull the trigger on offering a first rounder for DA (as in, "Wouldn't you?")?
NOTE: at the time of that comment, the Bears were 3-5, so he obviously considered that pick being mid-range first round.
I'd say that is a bit of an endorsement over the original comments made in the opening post of this thread.
He responded that he couldn't argue with the following questions/statements. He could be endorsing the opening, middle or end. I really can't read that as him saying he believe DA was the real deal.
Jay (NC): "Matt, when is everyone going to stop saying why the other team lost instead of why the browns won? That was a fair fight down to the wire, and the browns earned that one. I think Anderson is the real deal - improvement literally every game from day 1 - and I think the seahawks D was very tough and Anderson had his best game of the year."
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Yeah ATE is definately reaching on this one, that's for sure.
MAtt got fooled after a while last season, much like I did. I've said it before DA = fools gold. We have opposing teams praying DA keeps hanging on to his job by a thread. Very frustrating. Windows don't stay open very long in todays NFL. -
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Honestly, you won't know how much better or worse BQ is until you see him n a real game. You just won't.yeah I bet he would throw 3 TDs in the first half if they would have given him the start at Detroilet, right shep?
Word of advice to anybody having to deal with these BQ Fags trying to say that BQ is an unknown who's never played....just tell them Brady Quinn played a shitload this preseason including 2 starts and got waxed by all the 1st and 2nd teamers including by the Detroilet defense. Then in the Detroilet post game presser RAC said BQ's got a lot to learn. If BQ Nation had a half an effing memory cell in their brain when it comes to the golden boy's play they'd know that anybody who plays him is gonna just keep blitzing him since he can't make any decision in the pocket whatsoever except to dump off, dump off, dump off, dump off.
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If it takes a while for him to go from every-other-game good quarterbacking to every-game-good-quarterbacking thats all part of the process.
I am really starting to get behind this kid.
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Good points, but I don't quite see it that way. For one thing, they don't know what they have in Quinn until he plays, period. Practice is not games, they are controlled with no pass rush and no forcing the QB to make plays.If they didn't know what they had in him in practice they sure as shit knew what they had in his "breakout" game of his career in the motor city. It was a stellar performance against the powerhouse Detroilet Loins where Quinn directed a full two drives beyond the midfield stripe in only 3 qtrs of play.
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Forgot to say I changed named. This is justheretohelp but I thought that name was stupid so I changed it so I could be more of a real poster and not so much a poser. I like this team no matter who QB is. I got behind them because of DA but I like to see good play just as much as the next guy.
When DA was at Oregon State he was a bit frustrating to watch at times. You know he can make every throw in the game, but he does need to feel good behind his line.
My points on this post is not saying DA is the long term answer. My point is that for whatever reason the coaches have decided that DA gives them the best chance at the playoffs and keeping their jobs. Nobody is going to put their job on the line unless they think they are right. The fans want to see what BQ can do in real game situation, but it seems to me that the coaches want to stay with DA.
As I have agreed their have been several chances this year to pull DA and put BQ in the game to see if he could spark the team. The coaches did not do that. I have to assume that they know more than I do, because if they don't then they should be fired.
I disagree with alot on this board in that I do think that DA has alot of upside. He has not capped out on his talent. He needs to improve on alot of things, but from the games I have been able to see It seems to me that he has cut down on his ints and has improved on his short passes. He needs to up his completion percentage to around 60%, I agree.
Last game he had something like 14 completions for 280 yards. That is pretty good production. I would not say he has turned the corner. I said on a different post that he needs to have 5 good to great games out of 10, not 1. He needs to have 3 managed games out of 10, not 2. He needs to have only 2 poor games out of 10, not 7 or 8. He has to improve, no doubt. But it seems that the coaching staff is behind him and I have to believe it is for a reason.
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Nobody is going to put their job on the line unless they think they are right.I highlighted the operative word for you there.
Seriously, does anyone voluntarily do anything in their profession thinking that they're wrong in doing so?
Yet people make incorrect decisions all the time, thinking that they were right. There is a reason that multiple NFL coaches get canned every single year.
Just because they are the coach doesn't mean that they can't be wrong....after all, Crennelephant thought that Charlie Frye gave us the best chance to win last year, and we all know how that worked out.
Even if Quinn were better than DA in practice, Crennelephant will never let him see a game at this point because he's too afraid (justified or not) of Quinn making rookie mistakes.
It's like the catch-22 of a young college grad not being considered for jobs because of their lack of experience.
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Honestly, you won't know how much better or worse BQ is until you see him n a real game. You just won't.yeah I bet he would throw 3 TDs in the first half if they would have given him the start at Detroilet, right shep?
Word of advice to anybody having to deal with these BQ Fags trying to say that BQ is an unknown who's never played....just tell them Brady Quinn played a shitload this preseason including 2 starts and got waxed by all the 1st and 2nd teamers including by the Detroilet defense. Then in the Detroilet post game presser RAC said BQ's got a lot to learn. If BQ Nation had a half an effing memory cell in their brain when it comes to the golden boy's play they'd know that anybody who plays him is gonna just keep blitzing him since he can't make any decision in the pocket whatsoever except to dump off, dump off, dump off, dump off.
Dump off you say Lums? You mean something that DA has failed to master? I love seeing DA throw those swing passes 5' over guys heads.
When you gonna figure out preseason stats don't mean squat. Pathetic- if all you have to hang your hat on is the preseason game against the Lions as a reason Quinn shouldn't start. You do remember that Braylon Edwards didn't play, neither did Jamal Lewis. Couple of o-linemen out too IIRC.
Ahem, if you want to go the preseason route, your wonder boy DA looked like total crap in the Monday nighter against the Giants, 4-10, 40 yards, and a lost fumble that led to points. Amazing how he looked great against the same team when it counted. And you want to posit Quinn can't do the same?
Anderson is 31st in qb rating, 24th in yards, and 34th in completion %- any other team, that's a trip directly to the bench. That's with near bulletproof protection by the o-line BTW. If DA was playing behind the Steeler's sieve, he'd already be on IR.
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Allow me to reply to hoorta in Lum's stead.
"Last year BQ nation was pimping his great preseason performance. Obviously everyone who likes BQ all has the same opinion, so obviously you believed last year that his preseason performance meant he's going to be a great QB. Now that he had a 'bad' preseason this year, it suddenly means nothing. BQ nation blah blah blah blah blah blah. DA rules."
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Good points, but I don't quite see it that way. For one thing, they don't know what they have in Quinn until he plays, period. Practice is not games, they are controlled with no pass rush and no forcing the QB to make plays.
If they didn't know what they had in him in practice they sure as shit knew what they had in his "breakout" game of his career in the motor city. It was a stellar performance against the powerhouse Detroilet Loins where Quinn directed a full two drives beyond the midfield stripe in only 3 qtrs of play.
DA is crap get over it. Maybe BQ is to. Get over the BQ fags issue and look in the mirror. Your so in love with DA it's sick. The guy costs us 3 games with horrible qb play not decent but horrible get off it already.
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I said on a different post that he needs to have 5 good to great games out of 10, not 1. He needs to have 3 managed games out of 10, not 2. He needs to have only 2 poor games out of 10, not 7 or 8. He has to improve, no doubt. But it seems that the coaching staff is behind him and I have to believe it is for a reason.Well, you got my thinking about 10-game intervals, or even five game intervals, so I broke down the following;
In DA's last 5 games he's 3-2
In DA's last 10 games he's 5-5
In DA's last 15 games he's 8-7
In DA's last 20 games he's 12-8
In DA's only 22 games he's 13-9
Is that really that bad, compared to what this franchise was turning out prior to his arrival, which was:
5 games prior to DA startings 0-5
10 games prior to DA startings 2-8
15 games prior to DA startings 4-11
20 games prior to DA startings 6-14
22 games prior to DA startings 6-16
DA has almost as many wins in his last 10 starts (which some here will say were horrible) as the Browns had in their last 20 games prior to him taking over as a starter.
Our defense wasn't anything to write home about last season and has just begun to come-on this season. However, oppositions have scored 20-points or over on our marginal defense over the past 22-games (11) times. Our DA-lead Offense has scored over 20-points or more against opposing defenses (15) times in those same 22 games.
We've never lost back-to-back games until the start of this season where we lost 3-straight to Dallas, Pittsburgh & at Baltimore. We won 3-straight during mid-season last year, and have won back-to-back games 5-times under Anderson.
We've outscored our opponents 496-471 with DA at the helm.
We are 3-1 in our last four games and he's averaged 87% QB rating in that span, not throwing an INT in the last three games. (imagine his rating had Winslow, Steptoe & Heiden all didn't get stopped on the 1-yardline in the past two games)
Not a single stat above shows that he is worst than he is good. Every stat and record comes out on top. Compare that to any streak since 1999. It ain't like the kid came in and took over the Super Bowl Champs and made them mediocre.
I think it is a pretty dame solid start for a young career. Has it been perfect? Heck no, but certainly not headed for the scrap heap either.
Add in a Pro Bowl appearance, and single season records set by his receivers.
We have improved ... greatly improved.
If Brady Quinn can turn a 13-9 record into a 18-4 record out of the gate than he is worth looking into, but at this point that seems merely impossible. It's DA that has a better shot at continued improvements with his added experience.
DA's our starter, the past mess since our expansion is finally behind us.
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The DEFENSE has given up 20+ points:
Last 5 games: 1x (and that was a game where ZERO drives started on the far side of the 50)
Last 10 games: 2x
In fact, we only gave up 20+ by the DEFENSE 2x in the past 13 games!!! And 14 or less 6 times during that span!!!
So, who is responsible for those wins???
The fact is, DA has NOT HAD 2 CONSECUTIVE WEEKS OF AN 80+ QBR IN HIS ENTIRE PROFESSIONAL CAREER!!!
That is the epitome of inconsistent!
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The DEFENSE has given up 20+ points:Last 5 games: 1x (and that was a game where ZERO drives started on the far side of the 50)
Last 10 games: 2x
In fact, we only gave up 20+ by the DEFENSE 2x in the past 13 games!!! And 14 or less 6 times during that span!!!
So, who is responsible for those wins???
Remember when Flugels was writing daily odes to Kyle Orton a few seasons ago because all he did was win? I agree, you cannot judge a QB in a vacuum based only upon team wins and losses. Sticking with your below average QB for fear of making a change because your D is keeping you in games is insane.
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Remember when Flugels was writing daily odes to Kyle Orton a few seasons ago because all he did was win? I agree, you cannot judge a QB in a vacuum based only upon team wins and losses. Sticking with your below average QB for fear of making a change because your D is keeping you in games is insane.Big Difference!
The Bears Offense was ranked 26th in pts & 29th in yards, while the Defense was 1st & 2nd.
The Browns Offense was ranked 8th in pts and 8th in yards, while the Defense was 21st & 30th.
DA must be the luckiest guy in the World, first the easy schedule carries him, and now the defense ... wonder where such luck was the fisrt 7 years back.
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The DEFENSE has given up 20+ points:Last 5 games: 1x (and that was a game where ZERO drives started on the far side of the 50)
Last 10 games: 2x
In fact, we only gave up 20+ by the DEFENSE 2x in the past 13 games!!! And 14 or less 6 times during that span!!!
So, who is responsible for those wins???
The fact is, DA has NOT HAD 2 CONSECUTIVE WEEKS OF AN 80+ QBR IN HIS ENTIRE PROFESSIONAL CAREER!!!
That is the epitome of inconsistent!
Congrats Dan ... you showed our defense is superior!
Our Defense is so great, I almost hate to bring up the fact that they have allowed 150+ yards on the ground in 4 of our 7 games this season, where we are still trying to crack that milestone with our own running game which is obviously hampered by DA ... somehow.
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Good points, but I don't quite see it that way. For one thing, they don't know what they have in Quinn until he plays, period. Practice is not games, they are controlled with no pass rush and no forcing the QB to make plays.
If they didn't know what they had in him in practice they sure as shit knew what they had in his "breakout" game of his career in the motor city. It was a stellar performance against the powerhouse Detroilet Loins where Quinn directed a full two drives beyond the midfield stripe in only 3 qtrs of play.
Lumfreddy, you never watched the Detroilet game, remember?
Even if you did on DVR of something, I can name about 15 games that DA has played worse than Quinn that day with half the roster. Wanna play?
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Good points, but I don't quite see it that way. For one thing, they don't know what they have in Quinn until he plays, period. Practice is not games, they are controlled with no pass rush and no forcing the QB to make plays.
If they didn't know what they had in him in practice they sure as shit knew what they had in his "breakout" game of his career in the motor city. It was a stellar performance against the powerhouse Detroilet Loins where Quinn directed a full two drives beyond the midfield stripe in only 3 qtrs of play.
You're still here?
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Eli Manning and Derek Anderson had very similar stats last season (if not DA's was slightly better). The Giants won the Super Bowl and the Browns missed out of the playoffs.
Why?
Could the Giants Super Bowl run and 6-1 record this season have something to do with the Giants rushing for over 150-yrds in a game 9-times, to their opponents matching that feat just once? While the Browns opponents have reached that feat 8-times to the Browns gaining 150+ on the ground just 4 times in 23 games (all wins btw)?
There is more to this game than QB'ing. You might think this Defense is good but it isn't that good. And your images of Jamal Lewis are from yester-year when he was wearing purple. Joe Thomas is a great guy and he might be able to pass block, but no one thinks of the Browns as being scary in the three-yards-and-a-cloud-of-dust role (well, maybe the 3-yards part). Kellen Winslwo might have good hands, but ain't a blocking TE, etc.. (we have more problems than DA).
Every loss is pinned on DA and each win is discounted, but the stats I've put up show almost the opposite. The passing game has come out favorably compared to our opponents:
Last 10 games, our opponents passing yards: 1770
Last 10 games, the Browns passing yards: 1820
And the Running game or Run Defense have all yeilded to our opponents:
Last 10 games, our opponents rushing yards: 1366
Last 10 games, the Browns rushing yards: 1158
I don't want to even look up Time of Possesion on this "Bend-but-don't-be-blamed" Defense.
I'm not saying our running game sucks, or our defense sucks, or that DA is great. I'm saying that most arguments are hollow without including all three together along with many, many other factors.
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Seriously, it wasn't like the preseason game versus Detroit was some kind o meltdown. He was just okay.The bottom line on Quinn/DA from insider talk is this: Anderson has not earned his bonus yet. If he remains inconsistent this season, the Browns will commit to Quinn and move DA, period. Quinn will be even more analogous with Phil Rivers, handed the reins after two years of watching.
What would it take for Quinn to step in THIS year? Simple: two bad game in a row by Anderson... or realistically falling out of the playoff race. Whichever comes first.
The Browns committed to Anderson for 2008. They firmly believed he deserved a chance to build on 2007 and show that he could put 16 games together, not 9. To date, he hasn't lived up to that hope.
What would Anderson have to do to make the Browns believe they could go to a Super Bowl and maybe win it with him at quarterback?
Simple again: Play consistently well, week after week after week. He's yet to play two good games in a row, let alone three, so that's still ahead of him. These next two home games against Baltimore and Denver are HUGE for the team and for Anderson. If we win both and Anderson plays well, the chances of seeing Quinn before weeks 15 or 16 are nil, and rightfully so.
Buzz is that many within the organization seriously doubt if Anderson will ever be a consistent playoff caliber guy who steps up when the team needs him most, when the bullets (and blitzes) are flying. His window isn't very big anymore. Even Caplan says the Browns would NOT give Anderson his bonus if they had to choose today. They would commit to Quinn.
So we'll see.
Spot on post Shep, completely full of logic and substance.
Anybody rooting against DA is a moron, even if they don't want him here long term. I'd like to think the Browns know enough at this point that they are going to ride out the season with DA until it doesn't matter. Unless he all of a sudden gets consistent, he'll be moving on regardless.
As far as Eli Manning goes Satn, I still think he sucks. One of the most annoying things I've heard in years prior to our ass beating of the Giants was how Eli is now better than Peyton. Eli is not good at all, he has so many bad points to his game it's not funny. Comparing him to DA does nothing for me.
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