Look Into The Future For A Thread Of Hope.
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I think that this team is going to surprise us and a lot of other clubs this year. The Browns have had some very bad luck. We should be due to have some good luck coming to us really soon. The only way a team can have such bad luck year after year and not finally catch a few breaks is if in fact the club is cursed. I don't believe in curses. I believe in good things coming to the patient and deserving. I think that if Cleveland took half the time to be thankful and support this team as some of you negative naysayers have in bashing them, we'd see a huge improvement in the culture of winning. Losing attitudes breeds a losing culture, whining and complaining do nothing to offset this mindset.
If I was the QB of the Browns and had the odds stacked against me and I didn't light it up, I think that I would do much better with a fanbase that said, "Look, we understand, we support you and wish you the best! Go Colt, Go!" As opposed to, "My god Colt, you suck balls, you've got a noodle arm and you're too short short shit McFrye...blah, blah, blah." It does nothing to instill confidence and loyalty, it just makes us look bad as a fanbase...
Look guys, I know that not all of us are like that, but the creakiest wheels get the grease, we as a fanbase have to be louder in our support and not let these finniewinkles spout off at the mouth without spraying real WD40 in there! You're either with us or against us, if you don't like it get out... I'm sure the Steelers could use more bandwagon fans!
What I'm saying is Colt is a good player and let's give him a chance, we don't need to draft Daffidill. We're gonna get a chance to see what Colt is made of this year with an offseason and a team on the same page... with some weapons and a plan. I for one am excited to see what he's got. Browns 4 Life!
I think that this team is going to surprise us and a lot of other clubs this year. The Browns have had some very bad luck. We should be due to have some good luck coming to us really soon. The only way a team can have such bad luck year after year and not finally catch a few breaks is if in fact the club is cursed. I don't believe in curses. I believe in good things coming to the patient and deserving. I think that if Cleveland took half the time to be thankful and support this team as some of you negative naysayers have in bashing them, we'd see a huge improvement in the culture of winning. Losing attitudes breeds a losing culture, whining and complaining do nothing to offset this mindset.
If I was the QB of the Browns and had the odds stacked against me and I didn't light it up, I think that I would do much better with a fanbase that said, "Look, we understand, we support you and wish you the best! Go Colt, Go!" As opposed to, "My god Colt, you suck balls, you've got a noodle arm and you're too short short shit McFrye...blah, blah, blah." It does nothing to instill confidence and loyalty, it just makes us look bad as a fanbase...
Look guys, I know that not all of us are like that, but the creakiest wheels get the grease, we as a fanbase have to be louder in our support and not let these finniewinkles spout off at the mouth without spraying real WD40 in there! You're either with us or against us, if you don't like it get out... I'm sure the Steelers could use more bandwagon fans!
What I'm saying is Colt is a good player and let's give him a chance, we don't need to draft Daffidill. We're gonna get a chance to see what Colt is made of this year with an offseason and a team on the same page... with some weapons and a plan. I for one am excited to see what he's got. Browns 4 Life!
Us supporting Colt means absolutely nothing. Its not the fans job to inspire confidence in the players (and if it is, I'm expecting a pay check.) That is the coach's job. If the players aren't confident then the coaching staff is doing something terribly wrong.
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I think that this team is going to surprise us and a lot of other clubs this year. The Browns have had some very bad luck. We should be due to have some good luck coming to us really soon. The only way a team can have such bad luck year after year and not finally catch a few breaks is if in fact the club is cursed. I don't believe in curses. I believe in good things coming to the patient and deserving. I think that if Cleveland took half the time to be thankful and support this team as some of you negative naysayers have in bashing them, we'd see a huge improvement in the culture of winning. Losing attitudes breeds a losing culture, whining and complaining do nothing to offset this mindset.
If I was the QB of the Browns and had the odds stacked against me and I didn't light it up, I think that I would do much better with a fanbase that said, "Look, we understand, we support you and wish you the best! Go Colt, Go!" As opposed to, "My god Colt, you suck balls, you've got a noodle arm and you're too short short shit McFrye...blah, blah, blah." It does nothing to instill confidence and loyalty, it just makes us look bad as a fanbase...
Look guys, I know that not all of us are like that, but the creakiest wheels get the grease, we as a fanbase have to be louder in our support and not let these finniewinkles spout off at the mouth without spraying real WD40 in there! You're either with us or against us, if you don't like it get out... I'm sure the Steelers could use more bandwagon fans!
What I'm saying is Colt is a good player and let's give him a chance, we don't need to draft Daffidill. We're gonna get a chance to see what Colt is made of this year with an offseason and a team on the same page... with some weapons and a plan. I for one am excited to see what he's got. Browns 4 Life!
Us supporting Colt means absolutely nothing. Its not the fans job to inspire confidence in the players (and if it is, I'm expecting a pay check.) That is the coach's job. If the players aren't confident then the coaching staff is doing something terribly wrong.
Us supporting Colt means absolutely nothing. Its not the fans job to inspire confidence in the players (and if it is, I'm expecting a pay check.) That is the coach's job. If the players aren't confident then the coaching staff is doing something terribly wrong.
Okay, sure... if that's what you want to believe...
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he's not the only one that thinks that way. if colts psyche is so fragile that he looks to fan support for confidence, then he needs a new job. if he's not mentally equipped to deal with off the field adversity/dissent, he certainly doesn't have what it takes to persevere on the field.
this isn't pop-warner....a weak minded individual like you describe has no place on the battlefield.
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Another year to cement the fact that Colt ain't got the right stuff as the Browns again
define the meaning of NFL talent disparity. 4-12 sounds 'bout right.
f jackie
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What offensive playmaking talent do we have?
An average QB capable of being above average with all the right pieces.
A #1 WR who didn't play his last year as a college WR (sat out a year) and was a converted Running Back.
A RB coming off of a major knee injury playing because the starting RB was a headcase (no fault to Shurmur). The other guy Ogawhatever coming from the practice squad to the starting lineup.
Two young guards
and a RT playing the year hurt and he wasn't good to begin with.
I'd say this had the makings of a 1-15 type offense.
And what conflict did Shurmur create?
What offensive playmaking talent do we have?
An average QB capable of being above average with all the right pieces.
A #1 WR who didn't play his last year as a college WR (sat out a year) and was a converted Running Back.
A RB coming off of a major knee injury playing because the starting RB was a headcase (no fault to Shurmur). The other guy Ogawhatever coming from the practice squad to the starting lineup.
Two young guards
and a RT playing the year hurt and he wasn't good to begin with.
I'd say this had the makings of a 1-15 type offense.
And what conflict did Shurmur create?
Its not what he created that I have a problem with, it is with what he didn't create: a competent offensive.
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he's not the only one that thinks that way. if colts psyche is so fragile that he looks to fan support for confidence, then he needs a new job. if he's not mentally equipped to deal with off the field adversity/dissent, he certainly doesn't have what it takes to persevere on the field.
this isn't pop-warner....a weak minded individual like you describe has no place on the battlefield.
he's not the only one that thinks that way. if colts psyche is so fragile that he looks to fan support for confidence, then he needs a new job. if he's not mentally equipped to deal with off the field adversity/dissent, he certainly doesn't have what it takes to persevere on the field.
this isn't pop-warner....a weak minded individual like you describe has no place on the battlefield.
I don't think Colt's psyche was fragile at all. I think he dealt with adversity fine. I don't think he was weak minded at all.
I think he was obviously hurt. (or do you not believe that a concussion constitutes an 'injury"), and I think that the direction/coaching he was given was absolutely piss poor.
Never forget that.
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What offensive playmaking talent do we have?
An average QB capable of being above average with all the right pieces.
A #1 WR who didn't play his last year as a college WR (sat out a year) and was a converted Running Back.
A RB coming off of a major knee injury playing because the starting RB was a headcase (no fault to Shurmur). The other guy Ogawhatever coming from the practice squad to the starting lineup.
Two young guards
and a RT playing the year hurt and he wasn't good to begin with.
I'd say this had the makings of a 1-15 type offense.
And what conflict did Shurmur create?
Its not what he created that I have a problem with, it is with what he didn't create: a competent offensive.
Its not what he created that I have a problem with, it is with what he didn't create: a competent offensive.
I think the talent issue is more of a concern- but I may change my mind if we draft some offensive playmakers and we still aren't going anywhere.
You can't win with the offense that was assembled last year. I don't care who is coaching. At least he shuffled the deck with WRs gave Little a chance to develope. He had no choice at RB because of injuries and he was teaching a Qb with limitations a brand new offense.
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Don't think it matters who they draft since Shurmur and his terrible offense/play calling are still here.. Is this FO really that arrogant to draft Tannehill and say to the fans hey we are content with a project QB and another possible losing season, since he most likely will not help this team at all in '12.. I just don't see how they can draft Tanny when they have to show improvement next year!!
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Hey Brownies, let's play a little game here. I say that the Browns are gonna stay at the 4 spot and take a playmaker there. We have Trent Richardson. We have Justin Blackmon. We have Morris Claiborn and Ryan Tannihill. This is our upcoming opponents:
Week 1 Sunday 9/9/2012 Bengals @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 2 Sunday 9/16/2012 Browns @ Giants CBS 1:00 PM
Week 3 Sunday 9/23/2012 Browns @ Cowboys CBS 4:15 PM
Week 4 Thursday 9/27/2012 Ravens @ Browns NFLN 8:20 PM
Week 5 Sunday 10/7/2012 Browns @ Broncos CBS 4:15 PM
Week 6 Sunday 10/14/2012 Chargers @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 7 Sunday 10/21/2012 Redskins @ Browns FOX 1:00 PM
Week 8 Sunday 10/28/2012 Browns @ Steelers CBS 1:00 PM
Week 9 Monday 11/5/2012 Eagles @ Browns ESPN 8:30 PM
Week 10 BYE
Week 11 Sunday 11/18/2012 Bills @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 12 Sunday 11/25/2012 Steelers @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 13 Sunday 12/2/2012 Browns @ Bengals CBS 1:00 PM
Week 14 Sunday 12/9/2012 Browns @ Raiders CBS 4:15 PM
Week 15 Sunday 12/16/2012 Browns @ Colts CBS 1:00 PM
Week 16 Sunday 12/23/2012 Chiefs @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 17 Sunday 12/30/2012 Browns @ Ravens CBS 1:00 PM
Predict what our record would be if we took each player. I'll start...
Browns with Richardson: 11-5
Browns with Blackmon: 8-8
Browns with Claiborn: 7-9
Browns with Tannihill: 5-11
What's your call?
Hey Brownies, let's play a little game here. I say that the Browns are gonna stay at the 4 spot and take a playmaker there. We have Trent Richardson. We have Justin Blackmon. We have Morris Claiborn and Ryan Tannihill. This is our upcoming opponents:
Week 1 Sunday 9/9/2012 Bengals @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 2 Sunday 9/16/2012 Browns @ Giants CBS 1:00 PM
Week 3 Sunday 9/23/2012 Browns @ Cowboys CBS 4:15 PM
Week 4 Thursday 9/27/2012 Ravens @ Browns NFLN 8:20 PM
Week 5 Sunday 10/7/2012 Browns @ Broncos CBS 4:15 PM
Week 6 Sunday 10/14/2012 Chargers @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 7 Sunday 10/21/2012 Redskins @ Browns FOX 1:00 PM
Week 8 Sunday 10/28/2012 Browns @ Steelers CBS 1:00 PM
Week 9 Monday 11/5/2012 Eagles @ Browns ESPN 8:30 PM
Week 10 BYE
Week 11 Sunday 11/18/2012 Bills @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 12 Sunday 11/25/2012 Steelers @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 13 Sunday 12/2/2012 Browns @ Bengals CBS 1:00 PM
Week 14 Sunday 12/9/2012 Browns @ Raiders CBS 4:15 PM
Week 15 Sunday 12/16/2012 Browns @ Colts CBS 1:00 PM
Week 16 Sunday 12/23/2012 Chiefs @ Browns CBS 1:00 PM
Week 17 Sunday 12/30/2012 Browns @ Ravens CBS 1:00 PM
Predict what our record would be if we took each player. I'll start...
Browns with Richardson: 11-5
Browns with Blackmon: 8-8
Browns with Claiborn: 7-9
Browns with Tannihill: 5-11
What's your call?
i don't see us winning more than 11 games regardless of who that first pick is. (But if it is Tannehill, i'm dropping my season tickets.)
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What offensive playmaking talent do we have?
An average QB capable of being above average with all the right pieces.
A #1 WR who didn't play his last year as a college WR (sat out a year) and was a converted Running Back.
A RB coming off of a major knee injury playing because the starting RB was a headcase (no fault to Shurmur). The other guy Ogawhatever coming from the practice squad to the starting lineup.
Two young guards
and a RT playing the year hurt and he wasn't good to begin with.
I'd say this had the makings of a 1-15 type offense.
And what conflict did Shurmur create?
You forgot to mention the lockout, which delayed the team being able to put in the work to get acclimated to the new systems that would be put in last year. A new offense, A new defense, a rookie HC with no OC. A new DC. New Special Teams coach... I expect THIS team- THIS year, to be leaps and bounds beyond what went on last year. I expected the worse and hoped for the best as I usually do but I didn't think that we'd be that bad on offense. Now I expect at least, AT LEAST 7-8 wins THIS YEAR... AT LEAST. I'm hoping however, for Trent Richardson and 11 wins...
You forgot to mention the lockout, which delayed the team being able to put in the work to get acclimated to the new systems that would be put in last year. A new offense, A new defense, a rookie HC with no OC. A new DC. New Special Teams coach... I expect THIS team- THIS year, to be leaps and bounds beyond what went on last year. I expected the worse and hoped for the best as I usually do but I didn't think that we'd be that bad on offense. Now I expect at least, AT LEAST 7-8 wins THIS YEAR... AT LEAST. I'm hoping however, for Trent Richardson and 11 wins...
The lockout didn't hurt San Francisco much did it? Sure, better talent.
I see what I see- and too many holes to field a playoff team- yet. You're also totally discounting the possibility of an injury bug hitting the Browns hard (it didn't last year). That happens, and Walter's Football 2013 Mock Draft prediction may well come to pass and Goodell announces, "With the first pick in the 2013 NFL draft the Cleveland Browns select Matt Barkley, quarterback USC."
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he's not the only one that thinks that way. if colts psyche is so fragile that he looks to fan support for confidence, then he needs a new job. if he's not mentally equipped to deal with off the field adversity/dissent, he certainly doesn't have what it takes to persevere on the field.
this isn't pop-warner....a weak minded individual like you describe has no place on the battlefield.
I don't think Colt's psyche was fragile at all. I think he dealt with adversity fine. I don't think he was weak minded at all.
I think he was obviously hurt. (or do you not believe that a concussion constitutes an 'injury"), and I think that the direction/coaching he was given was absolutely piss poor.
Never forget that.
I don't think Colt's psyche was fragile at all. I think he dealt with adversity fine. I don't think he was weak minded at all.
I think he was obviously hurt. (or do you not believe that a concussion constitutes an 'injury"), and I think that the direction/coaching he was given was absolutely piss poor.
Never forget that.
context gipper...
all those questions started with "if"....
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With all the yabbering about Colt McCoy, or Peyton Hillis, or our WRs or etc., etc., I am still of the opinion that the weakest part of the Browns organization is with their HC and their offensive coaching staff.
Its one thing to not have the talent....and in some areas the Browns are clearly talent deficient...it is another thing to depress the ability of the talent you have with poor, pathetic coaching.
And that my friends is the main concern about the Cleveland Browns in my eyes.
We can go get Richardson, or Blackmon, or any other WR/RB/RT/QB combination we want.
In the system that Shurmur ran I am not sure that Joe Montana and Jerry Rice could have performed well....
and, theoretically, its supposed to be the same system.
I completely agree with you Gipper. Coaching was/is our biggest weakness. I know we don't have loads of talent on this team but we do have some, enough for a decent coach to get us a respectable record. We went from 5-11 to 4-12 with the addition of legit talent from the 2011 draft. Sure the lock out might have affected us negatively but every team had to deal with the lock out. Look what the Bengals did with a 2nd round rookie QB.
I know our WR's didn't have a great year (did you expect them to?) but our offense was handcuffed by Shumur last year with an extremely conservative, predictable gameplan. Do you guys not remember other coaching staffs and those with actual football knowledge being able to predict the exact play we were going to run based on down and formation? Do you remember Colt not being able to call audibles at the line? Those aren't personal problems, those are coaching problems.
I hate using references to war in regards to sports but this one fits too perfectly for the point I'm trying to get across. When facing a superior force (numbers, equipment, ect.) you must rely on tactics in order to stand a chance. Many of the teams we faced last year had superior talent to our own, meaning we had no other choice but to rely on tactics. Instead of attempting to alter our strategy to give ourselves a chance (aka tactics) we stuck with a failing strategy which our opponents were easily able to decipher. That's not the player's fault, its not the front office's fault, it is the coach's fault. We'll never be able to improve if we stick with the same strategy that we used last year. Shumur better be working his ass off this offseason.
I completely agree with you Gipper. Coaching was/is our biggest weakness. I know we don't have loads of talent on this team but we do have some, enough for a decent coach to get us a respectable record. We went from 5-11 to 4-12 with the addition of legit talent from the 2011 draft. Sure the lock out might have affected us negatively but every team had to deal with the lock out. Look what the Bengals did with a 2nd round rookie QB.
I know our WR's didn't have a great year (did you expect them to?) but our offense was handcuffed by Shumur last year with an extremely conservative, predictable gameplan. Do you guys not remember other coaching staffs and those with actual football knowledge being able to predict the exact play we were going to run based on down and formation? Do you remember Colt not being able to call audibles at the line? Those aren't personal problems, those are coaching problems.
I hate using references to war in regards to sports but this one fits too perfectly for the point I'm trying to get across. When facing a superior force (numbers, equipment, ect.) you must rely on tactics in order to stand a chance. Many of the teams we faced last year had superior talent to our own, meaning we had no other choice but to rely on tactics. Instead of attempting to alter our strategy to give ourselves a chance (aka tactics) we stuck with a failing strategy which our opponents were easily able to decipher. That's not the player's fault, its not the front office's fault, it is the coach's fault. We'll never be able to improve if we stick with the same strategy that we used last year. Shumur better be working his ass off this offseason.
Standard cover for shitty talent. The same excuse that always gets a coach shipped out too early. I don't know if Shurmer is the guy but if he isn't here for at least 4 years then the FO has failed more for making another coaching change than they have for making a bad hire. We can't keep doing 2 years and done.
Ruining threads since 1897. -
I completely agree with you Gipper. Coaching was/is our biggest weakness. I know we don't have loads of talent on this team but we do have some, enough for a decent coach to get us a respectable record. We went from 5-11 to 4-12 with the addition of legit talent from the 2011 draft. Sure the lock out might have affected us negatively but every team had to deal with the lock out. Look what the Bengals did with a 2nd round rookie QB.
I know our WR's didn't have a great year (did you expect them to?) but our offense was handcuffed by Shumur last year with an extremely conservative, predictable gameplan. Do you guys not remember other coaching staffs and those with actual football knowledge being able to predict the exact play we were going to run based on down and formation? Do you remember Colt not being able to call audibles at the line? Those aren't personal problems, those are coaching problems.
I hate using references to war in regards to sports but this one fits too perfectly for the point I'm trying to get across. When facing a superior force (numbers, equipment, ect.) you must rely on tactics in order to stand a chance. Many of the teams we faced last year had superior talent to our own, meaning we had no other choice but to rely on tactics. Instead of attempting to alter our strategy to give ourselves a chance (aka tactics) we stuck with a failing strategy which our opponents were easily able to decipher. That's not the player's fault, its not the front office's fault, it is the coach's fault. We'll never be able to improve if we stick with the same strategy that we used last year. Shumur better be working his ass off this offseason.
Standard cover for shitty talent. The same excuse that always gets a coach shipped out too early. I don't know if Shurmer is the guy but if he isn't here for at least 4 years then the FO has failed more for making another coaching change than they have for making a bad hire. We can't keep doing 2 years and done.
Standard cover for shitty talent. The same excuse that always gets a coach shipped out too early. I don't know if Shurmer is the guy but if he isn't here for at least 4 years then the FO has failed more for making another coaching change than they have for making a bad hire. We can't keep doing 2 years and done.
Exactly. New Head Coach, new assistants, new players "their guys", new system, different philosophies.
We have people here that think too highly of our offensive roster. Its garbage- and it will likely be below average next season. You can compete without talent but you can't win on a consistent basis without it.
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Its not what he created that I have a problem with, it is with what he didn't create: a competent offensive.
I think the talent issue is more of a concern- but I may change my mind if we draft some offensive playmakers and we still aren't going anywhere.
You can't win with the offense that was assembled last year. I don't care who is coaching. At least he shuffled the deck with WRs gave Little a chance to develope. He had no choice at RB because of injuries and he was teaching a Qb with limitations a brand new offense.
I think the talent issue is more of a concern- but I may change my mind if we draft some offensive playmakers and we still aren't going anywhere.
You can't win with the offense that was assembled last year. I don't care who is coaching. At least he shuffled the deck with WRs gave Little a chance to develope. He had no choice at RB because of injuries and he was teaching a Qb with limitations a brand new offense.
Disagree. The primary problem with the offense was the coaching. I think the QB's limitations were the problem of coaching.
Yes, injuries and youth were problems....problems exasperated by poor coaching.
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I completely agree with you Gipper. Coaching was/is our biggest weakness. I know we don't have loads of talent on this team but we do have some, enough for a decent coach to get us a respectable record. We went from 5-11 to 4-12 with the addition of legit talent from the 2011 draft. Sure the lock out might have affected us negatively but every team had to deal with the lock out. Look what the Bengals did with a 2nd round rookie QB.
I know our WR's didn't have a great year (did you expect them to?) but our offense was handcuffed by Shumur last year with an extremely conservative, predictable gameplan. Do you guys not remember other coaching staffs and those with actual football knowledge being able to predict the exact play we were going to run based on down and formation? Do you remember Colt not being able to call audibles at the line? Those aren't personal problems, those are coaching problems.
I hate using references to war in regards to sports but this one fits too perfectly for the point I'm trying to get across. When facing a superior force (numbers, equipment, ect.) you must rely on tactics in order to stand a chance. Many of the teams we faced last year had superior talent to our own, meaning we had no other choice but to rely on tactics. Instead of attempting to alter our strategy to give ourselves a chance (aka tactics) we stuck with a failing strategy which our opponents were easily able to decipher. That's not the player's fault, its not the front office's fault, it is the coach's fault. We'll never be able to improve if we stick with the same strategy that we used last year. Shumur better be working his ass off this offseason.
Standard cover for shitty talent. The same excuse that always gets a coach shipped out too early. I don't know if Shurmer is the guy but if he isn't here for at least 4 years then the FO has failed more for making another coaching change than they have for making a bad hire. We can't keep doing 2 years and done.
Standard cover for shitty talent. The same excuse that always gets a coach shipped out too early. I don't know if Shurmer is the guy but if he isn't here for at least 4 years then the FO has failed more for making another coaching change than they have for making a bad hire. We can't keep doing 2 years and done.
I am not in favor of ditching Shurmur. But, if we were making a fantasy draft of the head coaches who do you think would be pegged in the top of the round.
Go ahead list the order you think the HCs of the NFL would be taken if a fantasy draft of them were held:
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
Rest assured P.o.S. would be down here somewhere (what is his middle name? Until that is know P.O.S. seems apt.)
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I think the talent issue is more of a concern- but I may change my mind if we draft some offensive playmakers and we still aren't going anywhere.
You can't win with the offense that was assembled last year. I don't care who is coaching. At least he shuffled the deck with WRs gave Little a chance to develope. He had no choice at RB because of injuries and he was teaching a Qb with limitations a brand new offense.
Disagree. The primary problem with the offense was the coaching. I think the QB's limitations were the problem of coaching.
Yes, injuries and youth were problems....problems exasperated by poor coaching.
Disagree. The primary problem with the offense was the coaching. I think the QB's limitations were the problem of coaching.
Yes, injuries and youth were problems....problems exasperated by poor coaching.
This was a first year head coach trying to implement a new offense with a very young 3rd round QB with a decimated RB position and a #1 rookie receiver who hadnt played in a year. Oh and btw there was an extremely shortened offseason. Not saying our coaching wasnt poor, but I do think those are all valid excuses to give them another shot. Esp since we've added an O coordinator. No one could come in and do well in that situation. More than anything we need consistency and a little patience.
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Disagree. The primary problem with the offense was the coaching. I think the QB's limitations were the problem of coaching.
Yes, injuries and youth were problems....problems exasperated by poor coaching.
This was a first year head coach trying to implement a new offense with a very young 3rd round QB with a decimated RB position and a #1 rookie receiver who hadnt played in a year. Oh and btw there was an extremely shortened offseason. Not saying our coaching wasnt poor, but I do think those are all valid excuses to give them another shot. Esp since we've added an O coordinator. No one could come in and do well in that situation. More than anything we need consistency and a little patience.
This was a first year head coach trying to implement a new offense with a very young 3rd round QB with a decimated RB position and a #1 rookie receiver who hadnt played in a year. Oh and btw there was an extremely shortened offseason. Not saying our coaching wasnt poor, but I do think those are all valid excuses to give them another shot. Esp since we've added an O coordinator. No one could come in and do well in that situation. More than anything we need consistency and a little patience.
Yes, yes, I agree. I am not in favor of moving Shurmur. I hope he is a slow starter ala Chuck Noll, Bill Walsh, Bill Belichick and others.
That doesn't mean we cannot observe how bad he has been so far.
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This was a first year head coach trying to implement a new offense with a very young 3rd round QB with a decimated RB position and a #1 rookie receiver who hadnt played in a year. Oh and btw there was an extremely shortened offseason. Not saying our coaching wasnt poor, but I do think those are all valid excuses to give them another shot. Esp since we've added an O coordinator. No one could come in and do well in that situation. More than anything we need consistency and a little patience.
Yes, yes, I agree. I am not in favor of moving Shurmur. I hope he is a slow starter ala Chuck Noll, Bill Walsh, Bill Belichick and others.
That doesn't mean we cannot observe how bad he has been so far.
Yes, yes, I agree. I am not in favor of moving Shurmur. I hope he is a slow starter ala Chuck Noll, Bill Walsh, Bill Belichick and others.
That doesn't mean we cannot observe how bad he has been so far.
Ok, agreed. I just dont want to start over AGAIN... THAT is why our team sucks (and Mangini and others are idiots with the draft and depleting any kind of roster talent we had)
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I completely agree with you Gipper. Coaching was/is our biggest weakness. I know we don't have loads of talent on this team but we do have some, enough for a decent coach to get us a respectable record. We went from 5-11 to 4-12 with the addition of legit talent from the 2011 draft. Sure the lock out might have affected us negatively but every team had to deal with the lock out. Look what the Bengals did with a 2nd round rookie QB.
I know our WR's didn't have a great year (did you expect them to?) but our offense was handcuffed by Shumur last year with an extremely conservative, predictable gameplan. Do you guys not remember other coaching staffs and those with actual football knowledge being able to predict the exact play we were going to run based on down and formation? Do you remember Colt not being able to call audibles at the line? Those aren't personal problems, those are coaching problems.
I hate using references to war in regards to sports but this one fits too perfectly for the point I'm trying to get across. When facing a superior force (numbers, equipment, ect.) you must rely on tactics in order to stand a chance. Many of the teams we faced last year had superior talent to our own, meaning we had no other choice but to rely on tactics. Instead of attempting to alter our strategy to give ourselves a chance (aka tactics) we stuck with a failing strategy which our opponents were easily able to decipher. That's not the player's fault, its not the front office's fault, it is the coach's fault. We'll never be able to improve if we stick with the same strategy that we used last year. Shumur better be working his ass off this offseason.
Standard cover for shitty talent. The same excuse that always gets a coach shipped out too early. I don't know if Shurmer is the guy but if he isn't here for at least 4 years then the FO has failed more for making another coaching change than they have for making a bad hire. We can't keep doing 2 years and done.
Standard cover for shitty talent. The same excuse that always gets a coach shipped out too early. I don't know if Shurmer is the guy but if he isn't here for at least 4 years then the FO has failed more for making another coaching change than they have for making a bad hire. We can't keep doing 2 years and done.
So doing 2 years and out with players (those calling for Colt's job) is fine but with a coach it isn't acceptable? Frankly I see Colt having a higher upside then Shumur and I view Colt as a game manager at best. A coach is supposed to get the most out of the talent he has. Can you truly say, without a shadow of doubt, that Shumur did that last season? It's difficult to run a successful play when the defense knows exactly what you're attempting to run.
If Shumur was smart he would realize that his playcalling last year was horrendous, he is unable to balance the duties of being a head coach and playcaller simultaneously and bring in an offensive coordinator with a proven track record of successful calling plays in the NFL. Chilly doesn't have that track record and Shumur is still determined to call the plays. He's in over his head and refuses to acknowledge it. I'd much rather have a coach admit fault and do what is necessary to correct it then a coach who refuses to admit fault and bring in a figurehead to attempt to placate the masses. Chilly will have as much sway over the playcalling this year as Colt did last year, being none whatsoever.
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Standard cover for shitty talent. The same excuse that always gets a coach shipped out too early. I don't know if Shurmer is the guy but if he isn't here for at least 4 years then the FO has failed more for making another coaching change than they have for making a bad hire. We can't keep doing 2 years and done.
So doing 2 years and out with players (those calling for Colt's job) is fine but with a coach it isn't acceptable? Frankly I see Colt having a higher upside then Shumur and I view Colt as a game manager at best. A coach is supposed to get the most out of the talent he has. Can you truly say, without a shadow of doubt, that Shumur did that last season? It's difficult to run a successful play when the defense knows exactly what you're attempting to run.
If Shumur was smart he would realize that his playcalling last year was horrendous, he is unable to balance the duties of being a head coach and playcaller simultaneously and bring in an offensive coordinator with a proven track record of successful calling plays in the NFL. Chilly doesn't have that track record and Shumur is still determined to call the plays. He's in over his head and refuses to acknowledge it. I'd much rather have a coach admit fault and do what is necessary to correct it then a coach who refuses to admit fault and bring in a figurehead to attempt to placate the masses. Chilly will have as much sway over the playcalling this year as Colt did last year, being none whatsoever.
So doing 2 years and out with players (those calling for Colt's job) is fine but with a coach it isn't acceptable? Frankly I see Colt having a higher upside then Shumur and I view Colt as a game manager at best. A coach is supposed to get the most out of the talent he has. Can you truly say, without a shadow of doubt, that Shumur did that last season? It's difficult to run a successful play when the defense knows exactly what you're attempting to run.
If Shumur was smart he would realize that his playcalling last year was horrendous, he is unable to balance the duties of being a head coach and playcaller simultaneously and bring in an offensive coordinator with a proven track record of successful calling plays in the NFL. Chilly doesn't have that track record and Shumur is still determined to call the plays. He's in over his head and refuses to acknowledge it. I'd much rather have a coach admit fault and do what is necessary to correct it then a coach who refuses to admit fault and bring in a figurehead to attempt to placate the masses. Chilly will have as much sway over the playcalling this year as Colt did last year, being none whatsoever.
Again, Shurmur was a first year coach and will have a lot of input from Childress on the playcalling in the planning and during the game. I agree, in terrible circumstances, that Shurmur did not thrive. But this was his FIRST YEAR as a head coach (with no offseason). Hopefully he'll get better. We really dont know what goes on behind the scenes with the playcalling and hiring of an O coordinator as well. Lets give him a shot. He didnt have a shot last year.
And I am in favor of bringing back Colt as the QB.
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