Las Vegas Not Impressed With "new" Browns
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Good Lord. Vegas picked us to suck in May, time to pack the shit up and hope for the Cavs. Can we please start suspending accounts for stupidity? I've never seen someone bitch so much before they've even opened training camp. My Vegas odds are 4/1 this is actually Ghoolie trying to sound intelligent with a new account.
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Skeptical2013 said:
One of the interesting observations I had when checking out a Las Vegas sports betting area was seeing a bet on which college team will have the next big scandal. USC was top in odds and Ohio State was #2. But this was about a year before anyone had an inkling about the Jim Tressel scandal. The facdt that OSU was #2 -- somebody must have some nside info somewhere.
I don't consider Gordon Gee shooting his stupid mouth off as a "scandal". That is just him being a goofball.
What about the Rutgers issue with their AD? What kind of odds did they give on Rutgers?
As far as a scandal, the hundreds of thousands...probably millions that are paid by SEC teams to their recruits and their families is a well known secret that, for some reason doesn't get enough run.
I don't consider Gordon Gee shooting his stupid mouth off as a "scandal". That is just him being a goofball.
What about the Rutgers issue with their AD? What kind of odds did they give on Rutgers?
As far as a scandal, the hundreds of thousands...probably millions that are paid by SEC teams to their recruits and their families is a well known secret that, for some reason doesn't get enough run.
LOL! Given all the scandals at Ohio State, Penn State and other Big Ten schools, amazing you would point the finger south.
The facts are that a lot of the best players in the nation play their high school ball in the south and decided to stay in the south and play for SEC teams. Seeing the Florida-Georgia game last fall was like attending a national college all star game, there was so much talent on the field, including about half a dozen defensive players better than Barky Mingo
Give other conferences some credit, though, including OSU, for pulling some of those kids away. Why any Florida or Georgia kid in his right mind wants to go to experience six months of dreary Ohio a year is beyond me.
However, in the national title game last year, and in those two title games where OSU played the SEC, we saw the difference between college football in the north and college football in the south.
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I'm just catching on, I guess. But are there a couple people who do nothing but shit on the Browns? On a Browns board? I've had plenty of complaints over the years but it seems like their only purpose. Seems like the wrong place.
I'm just catching on, I guess. But are there a couple people who do nothing but shit on the Browns? On a Browns board? I've had plenty of complaints over the years but it seems like their only purpose. Seems like the wrong place.
Good things about the Browns:
-- the coaching staff
-- the new offense
-- the upgraded talent at QB
-- the depth at RB
-- the OL and its depth
-- the DL and its depth
-- D'Quell Jackson
-- Joe Haden
-- the promise of of Josh Gordon
-- the improved depth at WR
-- Mike Holmgren and Pat Shurmur are history.
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I'm just catching on, I guess. But are there a couple people who do nothing but shit on the Browns? On a Browns board? I've had plenty of complaints over the years but it seems like their only purpose. Seems like the wrong place.
Good things about the Browns:
-- the coaching staff
-- the new offense
-- the upgraded talent at QB
-- the depth at RB
-- the OL and its depth
-- the DL and its depth
-- D'Quell Jackson
-- Joe Haden
-- the promise of of Josh Gordon
-- the improved depth at WR
-- Mike Holmgren and Pat Shurmur are history.
Yay!!! Nicely done.
Skeptical2013 said:
Good things about the Browns:
-- the coaching staff
-- the new offense
-- the upgraded talent at QB
-- the depth at RB
-- the OL and its depth
-- the DL and its depth
-- D'Quell Jackson
-- Joe Haden
-- the promise of of Josh Gordon
-- the improved depth at WR
-- Mike Holmgren and Pat Shurmur are history.
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I don't consider Gordon Gee shooting his stupid mouth off as a "scandal". That is just him being a goofball.
What about the Rutgers issue with their AD? What kind of odds did they give on Rutgers?
As far as a scandal, the hundreds of thousands...probably millions that are paid by SEC teams to their recruits and their families is a well known secret that, for some reason doesn't get enough run.
LOL! Given all the scandals at Ohio State, Penn State and other Big Ten schools, amazing you would point the finger south.
The facts are that a lot of the best players in the nation play their high school ball in the south and decided to stay in the south and play for SEC teams. Seeing the Florida-Georgia game last fall was like attending a national college all star game, there was so much talent on the field, including about half a dozen defensive players better than Barky Mingo
Give other conferences some credit, though, including OSU, for pulling some of those kids away. Why any Florida or Georgia kid in his right mind wants to go to experience six months of dreary Ohio a year is beyond me.
However, in the national title game last year, and in those two title games where OSU played the SEC, we saw the difference between college football in the north and college football in the south.
Skeptical2013 said:
LOL! Given all the scandals at Ohio State, Penn State and other Big Ten schools, amazing you would point the finger south.
The facts are that a lot of the best players in the nation play their high school ball in the south and decided to stay in the south and play for SEC teams. Seeing the Florida-Georgia game last fall was like attending a national college all star game, there was so much talent on the field, including about half a dozen defensive players better than Barky Mingo
Give other conferences some credit, though, including OSU, for pulling some of those kids away. Why any Florida or Georgia kid in his right mind wants to go to experience six months of dreary Ohio a year is beyond me.
However, in the national title game last year, and in those two title games where OSU played the SEC, we saw the difference between college football in the north and college football in the south.
We saw the work of money, HGH etc. at work. Are you really an ostrich about this? Clearly.
Besides, FYI, all those SEC coaches that have won titles? Ohio guys: Meyer, Miles, Saban
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Yeah, the big breakthrough teams of the past decade or so, including The Greatest Show on Turf, weren't predicted in Vegas. The positive vibes on the Browns are coming from guys like Bucky Brooks, Daniel Jeremiah, and other insider types who look at the team instead of just the draft.
A popular refrain, one Lombardi subscribes to, is, "All that matters is wins." Last I read it, it was saying that drafting corners high doesn't pay off in actual team improvement and the team showed restraint by getting their #2 corner where #2 corners SHOULD come from, round 3. Just about all this year's free agent #2 CBs, and there were a lot, were drafted in rounds 3 and 4.
To do otherwise is bad team building because it can't give you a return on investment. Corners are highly restricted by rules and dependent on pass rush, so it's already controversial to get your #1 guy in the top 10. Drafting a #2 corner in round 1 or 2 is like paying $100 for crusty sourdough because it's excellent bread. You get it home, it's still bread. Just like drafting a #2 corner.
That's what those two words -- "Team Building" -- are all about. You don't play to win the draft, you play to win games. And seen that way, this draft produced Mingo, Gordon, McFadden, Bess, Gilkey, Bryant, and 3rd and 4th picks in the 2014 draft. That's two starting WRs, a potentially elite edge rusher, a starting #2 corner, depth at guard and pass rusher, and stockpiled picks for a much better draft.
And anybody who thinks a lot of teams wouldn't have happily traded their first round pick for Josh Gordon? Wake up. Reality's calling. Josh Gordon is 23, huge, fast, and coming off an 800-yard season in the NFL. His value in April would've been mid first round at worst. Maybe higher.
The Browns are going to be a very good football team. They have star potential at all the right spots: pass rusher, #1 corner, left tackle, #1 WR... and hopefully quarterback. Weeden is truly the X-factor. If he steps up, Vegas will discover the Browns.
Yeah, the big breakthrough teams of the past decade or so, including The Greatest Show on Turf, weren't predicted in Vegas. The positive vibes on the Browns are coming from guys like Bucky Brooks, Daniel Jeremiah, and other insider types who look at the team instead of just the draft.
A popular refrain, one Lombardi subscribes to, is, "All that matters is wins." Last I read it, it was saying that drafting corners high doesn't pay off in actual team improvement and the team showed restraint by getting their #2 corner where #2 corners SHOULD come from, round 3. Just about all this year's free agent #2 CBs, and there were a lot, were drafted in rounds 3 and 4.
To do otherwise is bad team building because it can't give you a return on investment. Corners are highly restricted by rules and dependent on pass rush, so it's already controversial to get your #1 guy in the top 10. Drafting a #2 corner in round 1 or 2 is like paying $100 for crusty sourdough because it's excellent bread. You get it home, it's still bread. Just like drafting a #2 corner.
That's what those two words -- "Team Building" -- are all about. You don't play to win the draft, you play to win games. And seen that way, this draft produced Mingo, Gordon, McFadden, Bess, Gilkey, Bryant, and 3rd and 4th picks in the 2014 draft. That's two starting WRs, a potentially elite edge rusher, a starting #2 corner, depth at guard and pass rusher, and stockpiled picks for a much better draft.
And anybody who thinks a lot of teams wouldn't have happily traded their first round pick for Josh Gordon? Wake up. Reality's calling. Josh Gordon is 23, huge, fast, and coming off an 800-yard season in the NFL. His value in April would've been mid first round at worst. Maybe higher.
The Browns are going to be a very good football team. They have star potential at all the right spots: pass rusher, #1 corner, left tackle, #1 WR... and hopefully quarterback. Weeden is truly the X-factor. If he steps up, Vegas will discover the Browns.
Hey brother that is an absolute fantastic post! I like the way you think man, couldn't have said it any better myself. So goes Weeden, goes the browns!
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Good Lord. Vegas picked us to suck in May, time to pack the shit up and hope for the Cavs. Can we please start suspending accounts for stupidity? I've never seen someone bitch so much before they've even opened training camp. My Vegas odds are 4/1 this is actually Ghoolie trying to sound intelligent with a new account.
Good Lord. Vegas picked us to suck in May, time to pack the shit up and hope for the Cavs. Can we please start suspending accounts for stupidity? I've never seen someone bitch so much before they've even opened training camp. My Vegas odds are 4/1 this is actually Ghoolie trying to sound intelligent with a new account.
LMFAO!! Ghoolie trying to sound intelligent....... and FAILING HAHAHAHA
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Pre-season odds are pretty meaningless. Odds are set to try to generate equal betting on all teams. That is why odds adjust. If the number gets too heavy in one direction, they adjust to get more betting on the dog, and lower the odds on other teams to make the reward not worth the risk. It works the other way if the dog is getting the heavy money.
Odds are for betting purposes. The aren't for predicting outcome.
Any idiot can say the Patriots have a better chance of winning the Superbowl, so how do you make sure people lay money on the Browns?? You make the payout more attractive.
Remember, the book wants equal betting on both sides...they can't lose in that case. They have the losers money to pay the winners and the winners pay the vig to the book...depending on the book, it might be 6-10% .
The book doesn't want to be sitting there on Saturday or Sunday rooting for some team to cover. Their mission is to be there not really careing who covers and who doesn't. It's funny, the bookie is the only one in this whole relationship who doesn't like to gamble with their money.
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Yay!!! Nicely done.
Skeptical2013 said:
Good things about the Browns:
-- the coaching staff
-- the new offense
-- the upgraded talent at QB
-- the depth at RB
-- the OL and its depth
-- the DL and its depth
-- D'Quell Jackson
-- Joe Haden
-- the promise of of Josh Gordon
-- the improved depth at WR
-- Mike Holmgren and Pat Shurmur are history.
Yay!!! Nicely done.
Gee, maybe I'll step out and take a bow!
I am not a Browns hater. Far from it. I've been a fan of the team for decades. But I do judge the team objectively.
There is a psychological angle to all this. I think I represent many thousands of Browns fans who are so frustrated by the ineptitude that spans well over a decade now and who looked to Haslam and his new approach with great hope, only to be let down by the hiring of Lombardi, a mediocre free agency and draft, and Haslam's business problems.
We were given the impression it would be a new day for Cleveland football and the decision making so far has been questionable, to say the least.
Let's use the decision to sign cornerback Chris Owens as one example. Dimitri Patterson was horrible last year as the Browns' primary backup at DB. He was the prime guy off the bunch for the nickel defense. Now Owens has this role. While Chud says he likes Owens, the facts are the guy was a disaster in Atlanta.
Below are two views from the media about Owens in Altanta. There are other articles out there bashing Owens, too. For a team whose backup CB got burned so badly last year and really hurt the team in critical situations, you would think they would add quality depth in the secondary via free agency and draft. But, no, the best they could do was Owens, a guy so bad he was demoted from the nickel role and even struggled in dime packages. This is a disaster waiting to happen.
If I see all this, why can't Bornws management. Yes, I'm incredulous about it!
ITEM ABOUT OWENS BY A WRITER FOR THE ATLANTA CONSTIUTION
It Gets Much Worse
Even though Jerry will get all the criticism at the top, he’s at least still on the team with one more crack at it. The same can’t really be said for the rest of the draft picks. Chris Owens will definitely go down as one of TD’s worst picks as well. The Falcons GM spent a 3rd round pick on a fairly unknown cornerback who not only didn’t produce or get on the field, but is not even with the team anymore. Owens had his best year as a rookie when filled in late in the season alongside Brent Grimes to do a pretty good job. Those two were manning the outside when the Falcons needed to win 3 straight (two on the road) to break that long-dreaded back-to-back streak.
However, it only got worse from there. He (Owens) was replaced by Dunta Robinson in free agency and could never get back his rookie form. He struggled mightily in the nickel, highlighted by a dreadful performance in the “Debacle in the Dome” (even though he was unfairly solely scapegoated at times). He got beat out by Robert McClain for the nickel in 2012 and the rest is history. He was allowed to walk to Cleveland in free agency, and the draft pick is officially rendered a bust.
SB NATION ON OWENS
While he flashed brilliance at times—remember him catch Percy Harvin from behind on that kick return?—Owens saw his playing time slowly diminish in the last couple of years. In 2012, he was passed by Robert McClain on the depth chart and really only played as a part-time cornerback and ace special teamer. Certainly his speed and athleticism will be missed, but the Falcons are going to roll even younger than the 26-year-old Owens throughout the secondary this season, for better or for worse.
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Yeah, the big breakthrough teams of the past decade or so, including The Greatest Show on Turf, weren't predicted in Vegas. The positive vibes on the Browns are coming from guys like Bucky Brooks, Daniel Jeremiah, and other insider types who look at the team instead of just the draft.
A popular refrain, one Lombardi subscribes to, is, "All that matters is wins." Last I read it, it was saying that drafting corners high doesn't pay off in actual team improvement and the team showed restraint by getting their #2 corner where #2 corners SHOULD come from, round 3. Just about all this year's free agent #2 CBs, and there were a lot, were drafted in rounds 3 and 4.
To do otherwise is bad team building because it can't give you a return on investment. Corners are highly restricted by rules and dependent on pass rush, so it's already controversial to get your #1 guy in the top 10. Drafting a #2 corner in round 1 or 2 is like paying $100 for crusty sourdough because it's excellent bread. You get it home, it's still bread. Just like drafting a #2 corner.
That's what those two words -- "Team Building" -- are all about. You don't play to win the draft, you play to win games. And seen that way, this draft produced Mingo, Gordon, McFadden, Bess, Gilkey, Bryant, and 3rd and 4th picks in the 2014 draft. That's two starting WRs, a potentially elite edge rusher, a starting #2 corner, depth at guard and pass rusher, and stockpiled picks for a much better draft.
And anybody who thinks a lot of teams wouldn't have happily traded their first round pick for Josh Gordon? Wake up. Reality's calling. Josh Gordon is 23, huge, fast, and coming off an 800-yard season in the NFL. His value in April would've been mid first round at worst. Maybe higher.
The Browns are going to be a very good football team. They have star potential at all the right spots: pass rusher, #1 corner, left tackle, #1 WR... and hopefully quarterback. Weeden is truly the X-factor. If he steps up, Vegas will discover the Browns.
Yeah, the big breakthrough teams of the past decade or so, including The Greatest Show on Turf, weren't predicted in Vegas. The positive vibes on the Browns are coming from guys like Bucky Brooks, Daniel Jeremiah, and other insider types who look at the team instead of just the draft.
A popular refrain, one Lombardi subscribes to, is, "All that matters is wins." Last I read it, it was saying that drafting corners high doesn't pay off in actual team improvement and the team showed restraint by getting their #2 corner where #2 corners SHOULD come from, round 3. Just about all this year's free agent #2 CBs, and there were a lot, were drafted in rounds 3 and 4.
To do otherwise is bad team building because it can't give you a return on investment. Corners are highly restricted by rules and dependent on pass rush, so it's already controversial to get your #1 guy in the top 10. Drafting a #2 corner in round 1 or 2 is like paying $100 for crusty sourdough because it's excellent bread. You get it home, it's still bread. Just like drafting a #2 corner.
That's what those two words -- "Team Building" -- are all about. You don't play to win the draft, you play to win games. And seen that way, this draft produced Mingo, Gordon, McFadden, Bess, Gilkey, Bryant, and 3rd and 4th picks in the 2014 draft. That's two starting WRs, a potentially elite edge rusher, a starting #2 corner, depth at guard and pass rusher, and stockpiled picks for a much better draft.
And anybody who thinks a lot of teams wouldn't have happily traded their first round pick for Josh Gordon? Wake up. Reality's calling. Josh Gordon is 23, huge, fast, and coming off an 800-yard season in the NFL. His value in April would've been mid first round at worst. Maybe higher.
The Browns are going to be a very good football team. They have star potential at all the right spots: pass rusher, #1 corner, left tackle, #1 WR... and hopefully quarterback. Weeden is truly the X-factor. If he steps up, Vegas will discover the Browns.
The Browns have some promising parts of the team, but it takes a full complement of players to make a good team and the Browns are lacking in key areas. They are not going to be a very good football team in 2013 due to substantial weaknesses of depth in the secondary and at the tight end positions and lack of linebackers who are good against the run. We're also going to see that letting Phil Dawson get away was a terrible mistake -- don't be surprised if the Browns lose at least one close game due to bad field goal kicking.
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I respectfully disagree. Tony Grossi just made the point that a championship team isn't an all star team. The Pats started Troy Brown as a corner during playoff runs. They had a ton of "mid-range free agents" who became solid, game-in-game-out contributors.
The key is to have your "stars" in the positions of greatest impact. And in a passing league, most people think that's pass rushers, probably a #1 corner, left tackle, a variety of pass catchers, and miles above everything else, quarterback.
Non-rush linebackers are being devalued in this league but DQJ and Robertson are terrific tacklers who can run. I like JMJ, too. I just don't see how we have a problem at linebacker at all.
I think we have a very good chance of fielding strong units at WR (and I include Cameron/Nelson for 12 packages), RB, OL, DL, and linebacker. The defensive backfield is a little bigger question mark because we have to fill in around two excellent starters in Haden and Ward... but I think we have the athletes to do it.
If Weeden really steps up, the Browns will go into the next offseason with fewer needs than at any time in memory.
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I respectfully disagree. Tony Grossi just made the point that a championship team isn't an all star team. The Pats started Troy Brown as a corner during playoff runs. They had a ton of "mid-range free agents" who became solid, game-in-game-out contributors.
The key is to have your "stars" in the positions of greatest impact. And in a passing league, most people think that's pass rushers, probably a #1 corner, left tackle, a variety of pass catchers, and miles above everything else, quarterback.
Non-rush linebackers are being devalued in this league but DQJ and Robertson are terrific tacklers who can run. I like JMJ, too. I just don't see how we have a problem at linebacker at all.
I think we have a very good chance of fielding strong units at WR (and I include Cameron/Nelson for 12 packages), RB, OL, DL, and linebacker. The defensive backfield is a little bigger question mark because we have to fill in around two excellent starters in Haden and Ward... but I think we have the athletes to do it.
If Weeden really steps up, the Browns will go into the next offseason with fewer needs than at any time in memory.
I respectfully disagree. Tony Grossi just made the point that a championship team isn't an all star team. The Pats started Troy Brown as a corner during playoff runs. They had a ton of "mid-range free agents" who became solid, game-in-game-out contributors.
The key is to have your "stars" in the positions of greatest impact. And in a passing league, most people think that's pass rushers, probably a #1 corner, left tackle, a variety of pass catchers, and miles above everything else, quarterback.
Non-rush linebackers are being devalued in this league but DQJ and Robertson are terrific tacklers who can run. I like JMJ, too. I just don't see how we have a problem at linebacker at all.
I think we have a very good chance of fielding strong units at WR (and I include Cameron/Nelson for 12 packages), RB, OL, DL, and linebacker. The defensive backfield is a little bigger question mark because we have to fill in around two excellent starters in Haden and Ward... but I think we have the athletes to do it.
If Weeden really steps up, the Browns will go into the next offseason with fewer needs than at any time in memory.
I'm not as high on the starters at WR and TE as some are. Still in a wait and see mode there. I worry about quality depth at inside linebacker (though Fort may prove me wrong) and in the secondary.
But the most important thing to happen for the Browns is for Weeden to step up and take a leap forward in improvement. That's very possible. The guy was a pretty good QB in college and there is hope that Chud and Norv can coach him up and maximize the talent he has. It'll be interesting to watch, for sure.
I disagree about fewer needs going in to next season. Browns need to add a good tight end, can use another big receiver who can stretch the defense, and will need more help at ILB (Jackson is getting older) and in the secondary.
One thing to think about: how good will the kicking game be? That could turn into a real problem area for the Browns.
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I respectfully disagree. Tony Grossi just made the point that a championship team isn't an all star team. The Pats started Troy Brown as a corner during playoff runs. They had a ton of "mid-range free agents" who became solid, game-in-game-out contributors.
The key is to have your "stars" in the positions of greatest impact. And in a passing league, most people think that's pass rushers, probably a #1 corner, left tackle, a variety of pass catchers, and miles above everything else, quarterback.
Non-rush linebackers are being devalued in this league but DQJ and Robertson are terrific tacklers who can run. I like JMJ, too. I just don't see how we have a problem at linebacker at all.
I think we have a very good chance of fielding strong units at WR (and I include Cameron/Nelson for 12 packages), RB, OL, DL, and linebacker. The defensive backfield is a little bigger question mark because we have to fill in around two excellent starters in Haden and Ward... but I think we have the athletes to do it.
If Weeden really steps up, the Browns will go into the next offseason with fewer needs than at any time in memory.
I'm not as high on the starters at WR and TE as some are. Still in a wait and see mode there. I worry about quality depth at inside linebacker (though Fort may prove me wrong) and in the secondary.
But the most important thing to happen for the Browns is for Weeden to step up and take a leap forward in improvement. That's very possible. The guy was a pretty good QB in college and there is hope that Chud and Norv can coach him up and maximize the talent he has. It'll be interesting to watch, for sure.
I disagree about fewer needs going in to next season. Browns need to add a good tight end, can use another big receiver who can stretch the defense, and will need more help at ILB (Jackson is getting older) and in the secondary.
One thing to think about: how good will the kicking game be? That could turn into a real problem area for the Browns.
SkepticalOne said:
I'm not as high on the starters at WR and TE as some are. Still in a wait and see mode there. I worry about quality depth at inside linebacker (though Fort may prove me wrong) and in the secondary.
But the most important thing to happen for the Browns is for Weeden to step up and take a leap forward in improvement. That's very possible. The guy was a pretty good QB in college and there is hope that Chud and Norv can coach him up and maximize the talent he has. It'll be interesting to watch, for sure.
I disagree about fewer needs going in to next season. Browns need to add a good tight end, can use another big receiver who can stretch the defense, and will need more help at ILB (Jackson is getting older) and in the secondary.
One thing to think about: how good will the kicking game be? That could turn into a real problem area for the Browns.
our TEs are a huge question mark on this team. But I think out WRs are going to excel in this offense.
how can weeden not improve? I mean anyone coached by Shurmur looks like shit.
I'm worried about INTs with this attack offense. It sets us up for big gains but also provides more opportunities for big losses too.
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I respectfully disagree. Tony Grossi just made the point that a championship team isn't an all star team. The Pats started Troy Brown as a corner during playoff runs. They had a ton of "mid-range free agents" who became solid, game-in-game-out contributors.
The key is to have your "stars" in the positions of greatest impact. And in a passing league, most people think that's pass rushers, probably a #1 corner, left tackle, a variety of pass catchers, and miles above everything else, quarterback.
Non-rush linebackers are being devalued in this league but DQJ and Robertson are terrific tacklers who can run. I like JMJ, too. I just don't see how we have a problem at linebacker at all.
I think we have a very good chance of fielding strong units at WR (and I include Cameron/Nelson for 12 packages), RB, OL, DL, and linebacker. The defensive backfield is a little bigger question mark because we have to fill in around two excellent starters in Haden and Ward... but I think we have the athletes to do it.
If Weeden really steps up, the Browns will go into the next offseason with fewer needs than at any time in memory.
I respectfully disagree. Tony Grossi just made the point that a championship team isn't an all star team. The Pats started Troy Brown as a corner during playoff runs. They had a ton of "mid-range free agents" who became solid, game-in-game-out contributors.
The key is to have your "stars" in the positions of greatest impact. And in a passing league, most people think that's pass rushers, probably a #1 corner, left tackle, a variety of pass catchers, and miles above everything else, quarterback.
Non-rush linebackers are being devalued in this league but DQJ and Robertson are terrific tacklers who can run. I like JMJ, too. I just don't see how we have a problem at linebacker at all.
I think we have a very good chance of fielding strong units at WR (and I include Cameron/Nelson for 12 packages), RB, OL, DL, and linebacker. The defensive backfield is a little bigger question mark because we have to fill in around two excellent starters in Haden and Ward... but I think we have the athletes to do it.
If Weeden really steps up, the Browns will go into the next offseason with fewer needs than at any time in memory.
I agree Shep. I know many are worried about Weeden. All in all I thought he had a pretty good rookie season. Sure, he hit a wall late, but most rookies do. They have more or less gone through a 2 year football season non stop....the college season, the all the combine stuff, NFL rookie camps, then camp, then the season.
I would expect the time off has done him wonders, and while it is just guys in shorts season, all reports are Weeden is the #1 guy and he is throwing the ball well. I expect him to make that jump. He may not be a all-star, but I feel pretty good about him being pretty darn good....I'll take that considering the crap we have been playing at the position since 99.
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i guess assmunch got the hook as i don't see him bashing the browns on here anymore.
amazing how some fool starts a thread about vegas and the lines etc. but can't put up $10 for a six pack of brew for a mano a mano bet.
all talk, no action.
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SkepticalOne said:
I'm not as high on the starters at WR and TE as some are. Still in a wait and see mode there. I worry about quality depth at inside linebacker (though Fort may prove me wrong) and in the secondary.
But the most important thing to happen for the Browns is for Weeden to step up and take a leap forward in improvement. That's very possible. The guy was a pretty good QB in college and there is hope that Chud and Norv can coach him up and maximize the talent he has. It'll be interesting to watch, for sure.
I disagree about fewer needs going in to next season. Browns need to add a good tight end, can use another big receiver who can stretch the defense, and will need more help at ILB (Jackson is getting older) and in the secondary.
One thing to think about: how good will the kicking game be? That could turn into a real problem area for the Browns.
our TEs are a huge question mark on this team. But I think out WRs are going to excel in this offense.
how can weeden not improve? I mean anyone coached by Shurmur looks like shit.
I'm worried about INTs with this attack offense. It sets us up for big gains but also provides more opportunities for big losses too.
I'm worried about INTs with this attack offense. It sets us up for big gains but also provides more opportunities for big losses too.
That seems to be the offensive and defensive philosophy they're taking, high risk high reward.
Should make for some exciting football, a lot better than Shurmurs dink & dunk offense and Jaurons vanilla D.
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The casinos, naturally, give preseason odds on things like the Browns winning the Super Bowl at like 60-1.
What I wonder though is whether or not those casinos are really willing to put their money on the line.
Example, you say that one of them says the Browns will win 2 games. Are they willing to bet on that? Can I make a bet against them on that? If I were to say, bet that the Browns would win 4 or more games, will they pay up if I win?
I mean, its easy right now to say "put a dollar down and if the Browns win the Super Bowl win 60". I would certainly expect the casino to win.
But will they say "put a dollar down on the the Browns to win more than 2 games, and if they do you win 2 or 3 dollars?" Will they handle that bet?
Maybe some of you do a lot more Sports book action than I do. I have only once ever put money down on a football game at a Nevada Casino....and believe it or not, I bet on the Browns to cover a point spread, and I won.
The casinos, naturally, give preseason odds on things like the Browns winning the Super Bowl at like 60-1.
What I wonder though is whether or not those casinos are really willing to put their money on the line.
Example, you say that one of them says the Browns will win 2 games. Are they willing to bet on that? Can I make a bet against them on that? If I were to say, bet that the Browns would win 4 or more games, will they pay up if I win?
I mean, its easy right now to say "put a dollar down and if the Browns win the Super Bowl win 60". I would certainly expect the casino to win.
But will they say "put a dollar down on the the Browns to win more than 2 games, and if they do you win 2 or 3 dollars?" Will they handle that bet?
Maybe some of you do a lot more Sports book action than I do. I have only once ever put money down on a football game at a Nevada Casino....and believe it or not, I bet on the Browns to cover a point spread, and I won.
1500 Dollar bet on the browns to cover the over under at 6 would pay you 1300 and some change on sportsbook, personally the reward didn't outweigh the risk of that bet so im not touching it.
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The casinos, naturally, give preseason odds on things like the Browns winning the Super Bowl at like 60-1.
What I wonder though is whether or not those casinos are really willing to put their money on the line.
Example, you say that one of them says the Browns will win 2 games. Are they willing to bet on that? Can I make a bet against them on that? If I were to say, bet that the Browns would win 4 or more games, will they pay up if I win?
I mean, its easy right now to say "put a dollar down and if the Browns win the Super Bowl win 60". I would certainly expect the casino to win.
But will they say "put a dollar down on the the Browns to win more than 2 games, and if they do you win 2 or 3 dollars?" Will they handle that bet?
Maybe some of you do a lot more Sports book action than I do. I have only once ever put money down on a football game at a Nevada Casino....and believe it or not, I bet on the Browns to cover a point spread, and I won.
1500 Dollar bet on the browns to cover the over under at 6 would pay you 1300 and some change on sportsbook, personally the reward didn't outweigh the risk of that bet so im not touching it.
1500 Dollar bet on the browns to cover the over under at 6 would pay you 1300 and some change on sportsbook, personally the reward didn't outweigh the risk of that bet so im not touching it.
By that I assume that if you bet 1500 bucks on the over/under number of wins...and they have that number at 6.....if the Browns win 6 or less you lose your 1500....or you 10 dollars or whatever you put down. But if they win 7 or more, you get your 1500 back plus another 1300?
That sounds like a fair enough deal. I wouldn't play that kind of money, but if I put 15 dollars down and got back 28 total, that seems a decent return on that kind of a bet.
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Bummed about Gordon missing the first two games because I think Bess was the best thing to happen to our very young and extremely promising WRs (Gordon, Little, Benjamin). Sobo wrote today that the brass is "tickled pink" about Bess' effect on the youngsters. Sometimes an addition like Bess can't be measured only by his stats.
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